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What is natural death?

suttichart.denpruektham
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6/1/2013 9:23:01 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
What cause our hearth to stop beating? Is it because some mechanical malfunction of hearth muscle or it has something to do with brain signal?

Any idea?
cybertron1998
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6/1/2013 1:51:24 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/1/2013 9:23:01 AM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:
What cause our hearth to stop beating? Is it because some mechanical malfunction of hearth muscle or it has something to do with brain signal?

Any idea?

I am thinking that its because of decay and old age. like how if a machine rusts enough it will stop working. but its all kind of connected. if your heart stops your brain stops. but if your brain stops your heart doesn't no what to do.
Epsilon: There are so many stories where some brave hero decides to give their life to save the day, and because of their sacrifice, the good guys win, the survivors all cheer, and everybody lives happily ever after. But the hero... never gets to see that ending. They'll never know if their sacrifice actually made a difference. They'll never know if the day was really saved. In the end, they just have to have faith.
AlbinoBunny
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6/1/2013 2:03:49 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I've always wondered what they meant by natural causes. I think it's just a nice way to say that it wasn't something external that killed them and being vague.
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Rational_Thinker9119
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6/1/2013 6:45:50 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/1/2013 2:03:49 PM, AlbinoBunny wrote:
I've always wondered what they meant by natural causes. I think it's just a nice way to say that it wasn't something external that killed them and being vague.

It is like anything humans do is not natural in society. If we create a drug it is "not natural" and there are "natural" alternatives even though everything we know is natural lol
drhead
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6/2/2013 12:56:59 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Death would 'naturally' occur when the heart and lungs are incapable of delivering sufficient oxygen to the whole body. For a healthy, in-shape individual, this would occur at 125 years (assuming you aren't killed by disease, cancer, etc.). Therefore, 125 years is really the upper limit on our lifespan. Other 'natural cause' deaths are actually 'we really have no clue' deaths.
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Wnope
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6/2/2013 1:02:40 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/1/2013 2:03:49 PM, AlbinoBunny wrote:
I've always wondered what they meant by natural causes. I think it's just a nice way to say that it wasn't something external that killed them and being vague.

Basically, "death by natural causes" is a legal way of saying "nothing to see here, folks."
suttichart.denpruektham
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6/2/2013 10:54:15 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/1/2013 1:51:24 PM, cybertron1998 wrote:
At 6/1/2013 9:23:01 AM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:
What cause our hearth to stop beating? Is it because some mechanical malfunction of hearth muscle or it has something to do with brain signal?

Any idea?

I am thinking that its because of decay and old age. like how if a machine rusts enough it will stop working. but its all kind of connected. if your heart stops your brain stops. but if your brain stops your heart doesn't no what to do.

ah... but most of the hearth or lung doesn't seem to be damaged beyond functioning in most of the case (any medical student here?).

Look at how when people hearth stop beating, it is still possible re-ignite the process, using electric shock. Which mean the hearth must still be effective at most.
Lordknukle
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6/2/2013 11:00:36 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Metabolic waste builds up, telomeres shorten, DNA mutates, etc....
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
drhead
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6/3/2013 1:12:35 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/2/2013 11:00:36 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
Metabolic waste builds up, telomeres shorten, DNA mutates, etc....

That does influence lifespan, but VO2max is usually the limiting factor (having upper limit of 125 years)
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"For me, Evolution is a zombie theory. I mean imaginary cartoons and wishful thinking support it?" - Dragonfang
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bladerunner060
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6/3/2013 1:34:20 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/2/2013 10:54:15 PM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:

Look at how when people hearth stop beating, it is still possible re-ignite the process, using electric shock. Which mean the hearth must still be effective at most.

That's not really true. "Electric shock" is only useful for when the hearts is still actually working. If it has totally stopped electrical activity, it is not possible to "re-ignite" the process via shock. Well, I suppose it's possible, but such a rare occurrence that it's no longer in ACLS guidelines. High-quality CPR is the treatment of choice (physically MAKING the heart pump, basically), however, out-of-hospital survival rates with even that (and some drugs) are less than 2%.

Death by "natural causes" means death by failure of the body itself, through internal failure or disease process, as opposed to some external cause. A heart attack is "natural causes". Pneumonia is "natural causes". The Zombie Plague is natural causes (though it's separate from being killed by a zombie by, say, them eating you, which would be Death by Misadventure. Or possibly Vivicide?). A stroke can be "natural causes". Cancer is "natural causes". Influenza is "natural causes". Of course, for those last three to cause death, they have to be severe enough to affect the heart or the lungs in such a way as to stop the beating or significantly limit the breathing.

The general types of death are:

Natural causes (disease process, body mechanical failure, etc.)

Accident or Misadventure (often classed separate but which is, to my mind, a subclass of accident, because the only real difference is that in Misadventure, the situation is one in which the risk is, or should be known to be significant; it's a class which includes surgery)

-Cide (Suicide and Homicide, which again, seems to be related enough they should be in the same class...Execution, too...and Honestly, the -Cides shouldn't be a "cause of death" I don't think. They're the Intent of Death. But that's neither here nor there)
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suttichart.denpruektham
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6/3/2013 7:30:17 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/3/2013 1:34:20 AM, bladerunner060 wrote:
At 6/2/2013 10:54:15 PM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:

Look at how when people hearth stop beating, it is still possible re-ignite the process, using electric shock. Which mean the hearth must still be effective at most.

That's not really true. "Electric shock" is only useful for when the hearts is still actually working. If it has totally stopped electrical activity, it is not possible to "re-ignite" the process via shock. Well, I suppose it's possible, but such a rare occurrence that it's no longer in ACLS guidelines. High-quality CPR is the treatment of choice (physically MAKING the heart pump, basically), however, out-of-hospital survival rates with even that (and some drugs) are less than 2%.


Death by "natural causes" means death by failure of the body itself, through internal failure or disease process, as opposed to some external cause. A heart attack is "natural causes". Pneumonia is "natural causes". The Zombie Plague is natural causes (though it's separate from being killed by a zombie by, say, them eating you, which would be Death by Misadventure. Or possibly Vivicide?). A stroke can be "natural causes". Cancer is "natural causes". Influenza is "natural causes". Of course, for those last three to cause death, they have to be severe enough to affect the heart or the lungs in such a way as to stop the beating or significantly limit the breathing.

The general types of death are:

Natural causes (disease process, body mechanical failure, etc.)

Accident or Misadventure (often classed separate but which is, to my mind, a subclass of accident, because the only real difference is that in Misadventure, the situation is one in which the risk is, or should be known to be significant; it's a class which includes surgery)

-Cide (Suicide and Homicide, which again, seems to be related enough they should be in the same class...Execution, too...and Honestly, the -Cides shouldn't be a "cause of death" I don't think. They're the Intent of Death. But that's neither here nor there)

Err.. I am more interested to discuss the scientific nature of the natural death, not its legal definition though.

The hearth hasn't broken to piece by the time it stop functions so I assumed that it has something to do with our neural command rather than mechanical failure i.e. certain part of our hormone gland is malfunction and sending a wrong massage to the beating hearth.

That's could be a huge different medically, if we are to think about how to expand people life expectancy. A mechanical failure would require a physical fix to the hearth tissue (or replace the entire hearth with artificial one). But if the malfunction is chemical, at least I think it is theoretically possible directly inject those require chemical to forcibly gave command for the hearth to beat again.
Lordknukle
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6/3/2013 8:27:57 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/3/2013 1:12:35 AM, drhead wrote:
At 6/2/2013 11:00:36 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
Metabolic waste builds up, telomeres shorten, DNA mutates, etc....

That does influence lifespan, but VO2max is usually the limiting factor (having upper limit of 125 years)

VO2max is the symptom. I listed the causes.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
leojm
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6/3/2013 8:47:30 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/3/2013 8:27:57 AM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 6/3/2013 1:12:35 AM, drhead wrote:
At 6/2/2013 11:00:36 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
Metabolic waste builds up, telomeres shorten, DNA mutates, etc....

That does influence lifespan, but VO2max is usually the limiting factor (having upper limit of 125 years)

VO2max is the symptom. I listed the causes.

Never heard of this, interesting.
drhead
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6/3/2013 11:15:54 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/3/2013 8:27:57 AM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 6/3/2013 1:12:35 AM, drhead wrote:
At 6/2/2013 11:00:36 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
Metabolic waste builds up, telomeres shorten, DNA mutates, etc....

That does influence lifespan, but VO2max is usually the limiting factor (having upper limit of 125 years)

VO2max is the symptom. I listed the causes.

VO2max is usually determined by aging and fitness. Aging is caused by a few things, telomere shortening is one of them. Though VO2max is the point that actually causes natural death, which is fairly important since it is a good place to inject a workaround. A useful fact for those pursuing longer lives.
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"You reject religion... calling it a sickness, to what ends??? Are you a Homosexual??" - Dogknox
"For me, Evolution is a zombie theory. I mean imaginary cartoons and wishful thinking support it?" - Dragonfang
"There are no mental health benefits of atheism. It is devoid of rational thinking and mental protection." - Gabrian
leojm
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6/3/2013 11:20:49 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/3/2013 11:15:54 AM, drhead wrote:
At 6/3/2013 8:27:57 AM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 6/3/2013 1:12:35 AM, drhead wrote:
At 6/2/2013 11:00:36 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
Metabolic waste builds up, telomeres shorten, DNA mutates, etc....

That does influence lifespan, but VO2max is usually the limiting factor (having upper limit of 125 years)

VO2max is the symptom. I listed the causes.

VO2max is usually determined by aging and fitness. Aging is caused by a few things, telomere shortening is one of them. Though VO2max is the point that actually causes natural death, which is fairly important since it is a good place to inject a workaround. A useful fact for those pursuing longer lives.

Oh. :/ I'm very active in excersise. I run 5 miles each day.
Maikuru
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6/3/2013 1:09:57 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/3/2013 7:54:44 AM, leojm wrote:
Die in your sleep. I would like that.

I would like that, too.
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RyuuKyuzo
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6/3/2013 2:16:21 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/3/2013 7:54:44 AM, leojm wrote:
Die in your sleep. I would like that.

Why do you want the OP to die?
If you're reading this, you're awesome and you should feel awesome.
RyuuKyuzo
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6/3/2013 2:17:28 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/3/2013 1:09:57 PM, Maikuru wrote:
At 6/3/2013 7:54:44 AM, leojm wrote:
Die in your sleep. I would like that.

I would like that, too.

"I want to die peacefully in my sleep like my grandfather. Not screaming in terror like his passengers."
If you're reading this, you're awesome and you should feel awesome.
Lordknukle
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6/4/2013 6:12:20 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/3/2013 11:15:54 AM, drhead wrote:
At 6/3/2013 8:27:57 AM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 6/3/2013 1:12:35 AM, drhead wrote:
At 6/2/2013 11:00:36 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
Metabolic waste builds up, telomeres shorten, DNA mutates, etc....

That does influence lifespan, but VO2max is usually the limiting factor (having upper limit of 125 years)

VO2max is the symptom. I listed the causes.

VO2max is usually determined by aging and fitness. Aging is caused by a few things, telomere shortening is one of them. Though VO2max is the point that actually causes natural death, which is fairly important since it is a good place to inject a workaround. A useful fact for those pursuing longer lives.

Tell me, why does VO2max decrease as you get older?
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."