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One Thing That Evolution Can't Explain

Installgentoo
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10/17/2013 9:41:30 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
If we evolved from Simian life, how do we have reliable cognitive capacities (namely, the capacity for reasoned thought). No Simian displays such an ability. Evolutionists must have their theory all wrong here.

I think Scientists are just trying to tell us we evolved from chimpanzees to avoid the obvious conclusion that such thoughts are the result of God's will being transmitted into our brains.
ClassicRobert
Posts: 2,487
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10/17/2013 10:51:23 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/17/2013 9:41:30 AM, Installgentoo wrote:
If we evolved from Simian life, how do we have reliable cognitive capacities (namely, the capacity for reasoned thought). No Simian displays such an ability. Evolutionists must have their theory all wrong here.

They do show reasoned thought, and evolution has basically shown that we just have more of a need for it.

I think Scientists are just trying to tell us we evolved from chimpanzees to avoid the obvious conclusion that such thoughts are the result of God's will being transmitted into our brains.

We did not evolve from chimpanzees. Rather, we share a common ancestor with them.
Debate me: Economic decision theory should be adjusted to include higher-order preferences for non-normative purposes http://www.debate.org...

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Installgentoo
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10/17/2013 11:02:01 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/17/2013 10:51:23 AM, ClassicRobert wrote:
At 10/17/2013 9:41:30 AM, Installgentoo wrote:
If we evolved from Simian life, how do we have reliable cognitive capacities (namely, the capacity for reasoned thought). No Simian displays such an ability. Evolutionists must have their theory all wrong here.

They do show reasoned thought, and evolution has basically shown that we just have more of a need for it.

So if a chimp could talk you would take it's advice on something?


I think Scientists are just trying to tell us we evolved from chimpanzees to avoid the obvious conclusion that such thoughts are the result of God's will being transmitted into our brains.

We did not evolve from chimpanzees. Rather, we share a common ancestor with them.

Even if we do share a common ancestor, this common ancestor was most likely no more smart than a Neanderthal. Neanderthals really weren't that intelligent. They could make little hammers yet they never built anything. Really devoid of intelligence when compared to us.
Bullish
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10/17/2013 4:43:03 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/17/2013 11:02:01 AM, Installgentoo wrote:
At 10/17/2013 10:51:23 AM, ClassicRobert wrote:
At 10/17/2013 9:41:30 AM, Installgentoo wrote:
If we evolved from Simian life, how do we have reliable cognitive capacities (namely, the capacity for reasoned thought). No Simian displays such an ability. Evolutionists must have their theory all wrong here.

They do show reasoned thought, and evolution has basically shown that we just have more of a need for it.

So if a chimp could talk you would take it's advice on something?


Where are you making this up? It has about 0 relevance to what we're talking about here.

I think Scientists are just trying to tell us we evolved from chimpanzees to avoid the obvious conclusion that such thoughts are the result of God's will being transmitted into our brains.

How can something that has no evidence of existence physically regulate electrons and chemicals in a human's brain?

We did not evolve from chimpanzees. Rather, we share a common ancestor with them.

Even if we do share a common ancestor, this common ancestor was most likely no more smart than a Neanderthal. Neanderthals really weren't that intelligent. They could make little hammers yet they never built anything. Really devoid of intelligence when compared to us.

That's kind of the point of evolution.
0x5f3759df
Fruitytree
Posts: 2,176
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10/18/2013 7:20:25 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
There are other things they don't display, they have no Justice system, no morality, no change in the way their society is organised.
Poetaster
Posts: 587
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10/18/2013 7:36:41 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/17/2013 11:02:01 AM, Installgentoo wrote:
So if a chimp could talk you would take it's advice on something?

I likely wouldn't take your advice on something; what's your point?
"The book you are looking for hasn't been written yet. What you are looking for you are going to have to find yourself, it's not going to be in a book..." -Sidewalker
Debaterpillar
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10/18/2013 8:04:29 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/18/2013 7:20:25 AM, Fruitytree wrote:
There are other things they don't display, they have no Justice system
http://www.livescience.com...
no morality
http://www.environmentalgraffiti.com...
no change in the way their society is organised.
And this is mainly due to the fact, that there is nothing that would induce a change of their society. At least in my opinion the only reason the human society is constantly changing is because of the ongoing development of new technologies, with the latter being faster than the former. In 'primitive' cultures there is almost no change of societal structures either, and if we still lived in caves hunting mammoths all day, I doubt there would be institutions like a Congress or a debate on screening for chromosomal abnormalities.
"Me fail English? That's unpossible." Ralph Wiggum.
Magic8000
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10/18/2013 10:32:37 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/17/2013 9:41:30 AM, Installgentoo wrote:
.....of God's will being transmitted into our brains.

What frequency does God transmit at? He may cause interference, I hope he talked to the FCC about it.
404 coherent debate topic not found. Please restart the debate with clear resolution.

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yesuke
Posts: 16
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10/19/2013 11:21:26 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Pro-evolutionist:

Apparently, plastic brain structures proved to be more beneficial to our way of life than hard-wired brain structures. Mice are capable of learning, too, mind you. And certain species of crow are very intelligent! Of course, the change from hard-wired to plastic brain structures has been very gradual.

For that matter, Phenotypic plasticity in non-cognitive traits is widespread throughout the animal and plant kingdom.

As to what thoughts are: No one knows. Yet.
We cannot possibly know if we humans are the only beings that with thoughts.
Dragonfang
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10/19/2013 1:33:48 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
The theory of evolution doesn't explain. It claims to explain with bad explanations and lack of evidence.
Df0512
Posts: 966
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10/19/2013 4:52:29 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Almost every ape on the planet can reason. In fact a lot of animals can. But we lack a cranial crest which allows are brains to grow larger the other apes. And don't forget about the millions of years it took us to get here.
Sidewalker
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10/20/2013 4:36:09 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/17/2013 9:41:30 AM, Installgentoo wrote:
If we evolved from Simian life, how do we have reliable cognitive capacities (namely, the capacity for reasoned thought). No Simian displays such an ability. Evolutionists must have their theory all wrong here.

Yeah, except that all simians display such ability, its just not as evolutionarily advanced as ours.

I think Scientists are just trying to tell us we evolved from chimpanzees to avoid the obvious conclusion that such thoughts are the result of God's will being transmitted into our brains.

Are you arguing that it is God's will for us to believe a falsehood?

If you are postulating a dishonest God as an alternative to the theory of evolution, then I'm sorry, but it isn't a very convincing argument.
"It is one of the commonest of mistakes to consider that the limit of our power of perception is also the limit of all there is to perceive." " C. W. Leadbeater
themohawkninja
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10/20/2013 8:43:32 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Look up the chimp raised by Noam Chomskey, you will find that he (or she) is quite capable of making reasoned thought by typing on a computer screen (you can chat with the chimp, or at least you used to be able to online).
"Morals are simply a limit to man's potential."~Myself

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Dragonfang
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10/20/2013 11:48:53 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/20/2013 4:36:09 AM, Sidewalker wrote:
At 10/17/2013 9:41:30 AM, Installgentoo wrote:
If we evolved from Simian life, how do we have reliable cognitive capacities (namely, the capacity for reasoned thought). No Simian displays such an ability. Evolutionists must have their theory all wrong here.

Yeah, except that all simians display such ability, its just not as evolutionarily advanced as ours.

The claim is philosophical, we can never make sure animal psychology is similar to us. However, assuming it is true; how do you know it is evolutionary? He asked you about the means. So can you explain the steps an evolutionary mechanism can develop intelligence or consciousness?

I think Scientists are just trying to tell us we evolved from chimpanzees to avoid the obvious conclusion that such thoughts are the result of God's will being transmitted into our brains.

Are you arguing that it is God's will for us to believe a falsehood?

If you are postulating a dishonest God as an alternative to the theory of evolution, then I'm sorry, but it isn't a very convincing argument.

The only falsehood and deception is from evolutionists who fooled themselves into thinking they know something they don't. The assumption in that loaded question is so full of failure.
1Devilsadvocate
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10/20/2013 1:30:11 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/20/2013 8:43:32 AM, themohawkninja wrote:
Look up the chimp raised by Noam Chomskey, you will find that he (or she) is quite capable of making reasoned thought by typing on a computer screen (you can chat with the chimp, or at least you used to be able to online).

Chomsky never raised a chimp.I think you have your facts mixed up, you're probably referring to Nim chimpsky http://en.wikipedia.org....
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themohawkninja
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10/20/2013 1:35:16 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/20/2013 1:30:11 PM, 1Devilsadvocate wrote:
At 10/20/2013 8:43:32 AM, themohawkninja wrote:
Look up the chimp raised by Noam Chomskey, you will find that he (or she) is quite capable of making reasoned thought by typing on a computer screen (you can chat with the chimp, or at least you used to be able to online).

Chomsky never raised a chimp.I think you have your facts mixed up, you're probably referring to Nim chimpsky http://en.wikipedia.org....

Ah, yes that's what I was thinking of.
"Morals are simply a limit to man's potential."~Myself

Political correctness is like saying you can't have a steak, because a baby can't eat one ~Unknown
drhead
Posts: 1,475
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10/20/2013 11:42:10 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/20/2013 11:48:53 AM, Dragonfang wrote:
At 10/20/2013 4:36:09 AM, Sidewalker wrote:
At 10/17/2013 9:41:30 AM, Installgentoo wrote:
If we evolved from Simian life, how do we have reliable cognitive capacities (namely, the capacity for reasoned thought). No Simian displays such an ability. Evolutionists must have their theory all wrong here.

Yeah, except that all simians display such ability, its just not as evolutionarily advanced as ours.

The claim is philosophical, we can never make sure animal psychology is similar to us. However, assuming it is true; how do you know it is evolutionary? He asked you about the means. So can you explain the steps an evolutionary mechanism can develop intelligence or consciousness?

Better question: Where's your evidence that it was created? Seems more like you have a god of the gaps argument.

I think Scientists are just trying to tell us we evolved from chimpanzees to avoid the obvious conclusion that such thoughts are the result of God's will being transmitted into our brains.

Are you arguing that it is God's will for us to believe a falsehood?

If you are postulating a dishonest God as an alternative to the theory of evolution, then I'm sorry, but it isn't a very convincing argument.

The only falsehood and deception is from evolutionists who fooled themselves into thinking they know something they don't. The assumption in that loaded question is so full of failure.

Oh dear, I feel so put down by this. I feel like I should go cry in a corner and cut myself...

Seriously, do you have ANY responses better than this?
Wall of Fail

"You reject religion... calling it a sickness, to what ends??? Are you a Homosexual??" - Dogknox
"For me, Evolution is a zombie theory. I mean imaginary cartoons and wishful thinking support it?" - Dragonfang
"There are no mental health benefits of atheism. It is devoid of rational thinking and mental protection." - Gabrian
Dragonfang
Posts: 1,122
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10/21/2013 1:23:28 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/20/2013 11:42:10 PM, drhead wrote:
At 10/20/2013 11:48:53 AM, Dragonfang wrote:
At 10/20/2013 4:36:09 AM, Sidewalker wrote:
At 10/17/2013 9:41:30 AM, Installgentoo wrote:
If we evolved from Simian life, how do we have reliable cognitive capacities (namely, the capacity for reasoned thought). No Simian displays such an ability. Evolutionists must have their theory all wrong here.

Yeah, except that all simians display such ability, its just not as evolutionarily advanced as ours.

The claim is philosophical, we can never make sure animal psychology is similar to us. However, assuming it is true; how do you know it is evolutionary? He asked you about the means. So can you explain the steps an evolutionary mechanism can develop intelligence or consciousness?

Better question: Where's your evidence that it was created? Seems more like you have a god of the gaps argument.

Haha. So you are making some sort of "Hypothesis of the gaps"? My belief in God is for philosophical reasons. Just like there is no scientific evidence for what is before the big bang, there is no scientific evidence for how creatures appeared. Bad explanations simply need to be discarded.
I do not claim to know by what means we appeared. Believers in evolution don't know the answer either, although they pretend they do. Judging by known mechanisms, genetic variation simply cannot account for all life or explain how creatures appeared like the Theory of Evolution claims.

If you think it does, then answer the previously asked question. Can you explain the steps an evolutionary mechanism can develop intelligence or consciousness?
So do we use science or science fiction here?

I think Scientists are just trying to tell us we evolved from chimpanzees to avoid the obvious conclusion that such thoughts are the result of God's will being transmitted into our brains.

Are you arguing that it is God's will for us to believe a falsehood?

If you are postulating a dishonest God as an alternative to the theory of evolution, then I'm sorry, but it isn't a very convincing argument.

The only falsehood and deception is from evolutionists who fooled themselves into thinking they know something they don't. The assumption in that loaded question is so full of failure.

Oh dear, I feel so put down by this. I feel like I should go cry in a corner and cut myself...

Seriously, do you have ANY responses better than this?

Plz dnt cry :( It's OK. Do the Peter Panda Dance or something.
There is nothing wrong in admitting our ignorance.

I believe the response is accurate and sufficient enough. You like to assume things when you ask questions, don't you.
DanT
Posts: 5,693
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10/21/2013 5:30:07 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/17/2013 9:41:30 AM, Installgentoo wrote:
If we evolved from Simian life, how do we have reliable cognitive capacities (namely, the capacity for reasoned thought). No Simian displays such an ability. Evolutionists must have their theory all wrong here.

That explains why Simians have the mental capacity of an amoeba >.>
We have an increased cognitive capacity due to evolution. Our brains are different from other primates. Our closest biological relatives are the Chimpanzees, and even so, we are vastly different from chimps. Prior to their extinction neanderthals were our closest biological cousins, and while they had a greater mental capacity than chimps our mental capacity was superior.

The brain went through a series of stages in evolution, developing new lobes, as well as various other mutations.

I think Scientists are just trying to tell us we evolved from chimpanzees to avoid the obvious conclusion that such thoughts are the result of God's will being transmitted into our brains.

We didn't evolve from chimpanzees. Chimpanzees are our closest evolutionary relatives. We are more like evolutionary cousins. If abstract thought was the result of God's will being transmitted into our brains, than why is there so much disagreement between abstract thinkers? Is god sadistic, making sport of watching us squabble? Your claim is not logically consistent with the nature of your god.
"Chemical weapons are no different than any other types of weapons."~Lordknukle
DanT
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10/21/2013 5:37:52 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/17/2013 11:02:01 AM, Installgentoo wrote:
At 10/17/2013 10:51:23 AM, ClassicRobert wrote:
At 10/17/2013 9:41:30 AM, Installgentoo wrote:
If we evolved from Simian life, how do we have reliable cognitive capacities (namely, the capacity for reasoned thought). No Simian displays such an ability. Evolutionists must have their theory all wrong here.

They do show reasoned thought, and evolution has basically shown that we just have more of a need for it.

So if a chimp could talk you would take it's advice on something?
I would probably take the chimp's advice over many of the humans I know. Intelligence is relative; 50% of the population has an IQ of 100 or less. A chimp could do a better job than most unskilled laborers, such as fast food workers. Depending on the chimp's logic I might take his advice over the average Joe. If chimps could talk, I could definitely see a chimp getting promoted faster than the average McDonald's worker.
"Chemical weapons are no different than any other types of weapons."~Lordknukle
drhead
Posts: 1,475
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10/21/2013 9:49:43 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/21/2013 1:23:28 AM, Dragonfang wrote:
At 10/20/2013 11:42:10 PM, drhead wrote:
At 10/20/2013 11:48:53 AM, Dragonfang wrote:
At 10/20/2013 4:36:09 AM, Sidewalker wrote:
At 10/17/2013 9:41:30 AM, Installgentoo wrote:
If we evolved from Simian life, how do we have reliable cognitive capacities (namely, the capacity for reasoned thought). No Simian displays such an ability. Evolutionists must have their theory all wrong here.

Yeah, except that all simians display such ability, its just not as evolutionarily advanced as ours.

The claim is philosophical, we can never make sure animal psychology is similar to us. However, assuming it is true; how do you know it is evolutionary? He asked you about the means. So can you explain the steps an evolutionary mechanism can develop intelligence or consciousness?

Better question: Where's your evidence that it was created? Seems more like you have a god of the gaps argument.

Haha. So you are making some sort of "Hypothesis of the gaps"? My belief in God is for philosophical reasons. Just like there is no scientific evidence for what is before the big bang, there is no scientific evidence for how creatures appeared. Bad explanations simply need to be discarded.

So we can discard the idea that a magic sky fairy did it? I'd call that a pretty bad explanation - it makes the ultimate assumption that there is an unobservable being which is capable of breaking the laws of physics.

I do not claim to know by what means we appeared. Believers in evolution don't know the answer either, although they pretend they do. Judging by known mechanisms, genetic variation simply cannot account for all life or explain how creatures appeared like the Theory of Evolution claims.

First, evolution does not try to explain how life appeared (if that is what you mean by "how creatures appeared" - evolution tries to explain the origin of species, i.e. why there is variety among the creatures we see, and I could reasonably interpret what you said as that). Second, evolution can account for a LOT of the variation we see in life, and while this doesn't mean with absolute certainty that all variation is due to evolution or genetic drift, it is the best explanation we can come up with from what we currently know.

If you think it does, then answer the previously asked question. Can you explain the steps an evolutionary mechanism can develop intelligence or consciousness?

It doesn't take too much to explain it. The ability to react to stimuli is present in every living organism, by definition. Obviously the ability to react to multiple stimuli and to respond appropriately would be beneficial for survival, since potential predators would be unable to exploit simple reactions to stimuli. This accounts for an evolutionary reason for neural networks evolving into complex operations - complexity confers a clear advantage.

Now, as for consciousness evolving, knowledge becomes a bit more spotty. We know that there are unique beneficial traits that arise from consciousness, namely self awareness. We also know of certain species where specific organisms may or may not have self-awareness - this shows that the step between consciousness and no consciousness is a rather small one, one that may even be controlled by the environment of an organism. Given how this shows an evolutionary purpose for consciousness and an obvious path for the advancement of such a trait, it's pretty reasonble to state that, in all likelihood, evolution did it.

Needless to say, whether consciousness was caused by evolution or not, scientists are constantly researching how our mind works, and would eagerly adopt any new explanation, so long as it has sufficient evidence to back it up, and sufficient explanatory power to be useful. But creationism has neither of those, and I've yet to see any other theories with any evidence backing them up.

So do we use science or science fiction here?

You can use magical thinking if it suits you. You won't get any real explanatory power out of your theory, but if you want to stick your head in the sand like an ostrich, that's not my concern.

I think Scientists are just trying to tell us we evolved from chimpanzees to avoid the obvious conclusion that such thoughts are the result of God's will being transmitted into our brains.

Are you arguing that it is God's will for us to believe a falsehood?

If you are postulating a dishonest God as an alternative to the theory of evolution, then I'm sorry, but it isn't a very convincing argument.

The only falsehood and deception is from evolutionists who fooled themselves into thinking they know something they don't. The assumption in that loaded question is so full of failure.

Oh dear, I feel so put down by this. I feel like I should go cry in a corner and cut myself...

Seriously, do you have ANY responses better than this?

Plz dnt cry :( It's OK. Do the Peter Panda Dance or something.
There is nothing wrong in admitting our ignorance.

I believe the response is accurate and sufficient enough. You like to assume things when you ask questions, don't you.

More like an attack on your opponent's character in an attempt to dodge the question. If you're going to propose an alternative theory, you have to defend its implications. I have no problem defending the implications of evolution, why do you have problems defending the implications of your theory?
Wall of Fail

"You reject religion... calling it a sickness, to what ends??? Are you a Homosexual??" - Dogknox
"For me, Evolution is a zombie theory. I mean imaginary cartoons and wishful thinking support it?" - Dragonfang
"There are no mental health benefits of atheism. It is devoid of rational thinking and mental protection." - Gabrian
slo1
Posts: 4,308
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10/21/2013 12:17:58 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/19/2013 1:33:48 PM, Dragonfang wrote:
The theory of evolution doesn't explain. It claims to explain with bad explanations and lack of evidence.

You are right. Science should never have a theory until it is 100% proven.
slo1
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10/21/2013 12:22:15 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/17/2013 9:41:30 AM, Installgentoo wrote:
If we evolved from Simian life, how do we have reliable cognitive capacities (namely, the capacity for reasoned thought). No Simian displays such an ability. Evolutionists must have their theory all wrong here.

I think Scientists are just trying to tell us we evolved from chimpanzees to avoid the obvious conclusion that such thoughts are the result of God's will being transmitted into our brains.

Why do you think brain capability can't be explained by evolution? More importantly what are you defining "reasoned thought" as? If it is what I think it is, you probably don't have a leg to stand on with extreme superiority over primates other than the level complexity of tools we come up with.
Dragonfang
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10/21/2013 1:26:23 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/21/2013 9:49:43 AM, drhead wrote:
At 10/21/2013 1:23:28 AM, Dragonfang wrote:
At 10/20/2013 11:42:10 PM, drhead wrote:
At 10/20/2013 11:48:53 AM, Dragonfang wrote:
At 10/20/2013 4:36:09 AM, Sidewalker wrote:
At 10/17/2013 9:41:30 AM, Installgentoo wrote:
If we evolved from Simian life, how do we have reliable cognitive capacities (namely, the capacity for reasoned thought). No Simian displays such an ability. Evolutionists must have their theory all wrong here.

Yeah, except that all simians display such ability, its just not as evolutionarily advanced as ours.

The claim is philosophical, we can never make sure animal psychology is similar to us. However, assuming it is true; how do you know it is evolutionary? He asked you about the means. So can you explain the steps an evolutionary mechanism can develop intelligence or consciousness?

Better question: Where's your evidence that it was created? Seems more like you have a god of the gaps argument.

Haha. So you are making some sort of "Hypothesis of the gaps"? My belief in God is for philosophical reasons. Just like there is no scientific evidence for what is before the big bang, there is no scientific evidence for how creatures appeared. Bad explanations simply need to be discarded.

So we can discard the idea that a magic sky fairy did it? I'd call that a pretty bad explanation - it makes the ultimate assumption that there is an unobservable being which is capable of breaking the laws of physics.

Ugh... So original. We really don't know enough about the laws of nature to claim something breaks it. And aren't the laws of physics supposed to be created by God?
God is the efficient cause. Science studies the material cause. Lets say you ask a mountain climber why he climbs mountains, he can give you two accurate answers:

1- "I like to see the view from the top, I want to challenge myself, etc...". Which is a Teleological explanation.
2- "Since I consumed food, my body produced energy which my muscles used to start a chain of contractions after neuron signals were sent by the brain through the spinal cord after being stimulated etc..." which is the material explanation.

I do not claim to know by what means we appeared. Believers in evolution don't know the answer either, although they pretend they do. Judging by known mechanisms, genetic variation simply cannot account for all life or explain how creatures appeared like the Theory of Evolution claims.

First, evolution does not try to explain how life appeared (if that is what you mean by "how creatures appeared" - evolution tries to explain the origin of species, i.e. why there is variety among the creatures we see, and I could reasonably interpret what you said as that). Second, evolution can account for a LOT of the variation we see in life, and while this doesn't mean with absolute certainty that all variation is due to evolution or genetic drift, it is the best explanation we can come up with from what we currently know.

I was referring to the fossil records. Fossils remain recognizably the same for millions of years to disappear and be replaced by other fossils. There are species that lived for tenths of millions, and even hundreds of millions of years with virtually no change.
I am arguing that evolution have not proven to be strong or capable enough. Sure, it makes a contribution, but it is insignificant compared to multi-celluarity or organs forming. Random mutation and evolution in tiny steps is simply an unreasonable explanations. What is the evolutionary advantage of carrying randomly placed tumors that grows between generations? Do the mutations work together, and know what the other mutations evolved or something?
The problem is that the foundations of evolution needs basis. If we can't demonstrate it, then at least show how it can reasonably happen. Making our imagination run wild is not enough.

If you think it does, then answer the previously asked question. Can you explain the steps an evolutionary mechanism can develop intelligence or consciousness?

It doesn't take too much to explain it. The ability to react to stimuli is present in every living organism, by definition...
*Cut for character limit, please read above*
But creationism has neither of those, and I've yet to see any other theories with any evidence backing them up.

So we basically don't know how. I know that intelligence and consciousness are useful, but a reason implies intelligence, what matters is the mechanism. We are simply no way near knowing how atoms and chemical reactions can produce them. Evolution is not special, it lacks scientific evidence just like biblical creationism and ID.
Potential explanatory power is attractive, but it does not indicate whether a theory is true. Since it appeals to randomness, it can't be falsified by any practical means.

So do we use science or science fiction here?

You can use magical thinking if it suits you. You won't get any real explanatory power out of your theory, but if you want to stick your head in the sand like an ostrich, that's not my concern.

Again, I do not claim to have a scientific theory. I simply prefer to let the evidence lead me rather than trying to lead the evidence.

I think Scientists are just trying to tell us we evolved from chimpanzees to avoid the obvious conclusion that such thoughts are the result of God's will being transmitted into our brains.

Are you arguing that it is God's will for us to believe a falsehood?

If you are postulating a dishonest God as an alternative to the theory of evolution, then I'm sorry, but it isn't a very convincing argument.

The only falsehood and deception is from evolutionists who fooled themselves into thinking they know something they don't. The assumption in that loaded question is so full of failure.

Oh dear, I feel so put down by this. I feel like I should go cry in a corner and cut myself...

Seriously, do you have ANY responses better than this?

Plz dnt cry :( It's OK. Do the Peter Panda Dance or something.
There is nothing wrong in admitting our ignorance.

I believe the response is accurate and sufficient enough. You like to assume things when you ask questions, don't you.

More like an attack on your opponent's character in an attempt to dodge the question. If you're going to propose an alternative theory, you have to defend its implications. I have no problem defending the implications of evolution, why do you have problems defending the implications of your theory?

My attack is on the belief. I stated that I do not agree with the assumptions of the question.
Are you saying that we should maintain flawed models for the sake of needing a filler? We do not need to wait for new theories to emerge before discarding one. If anything, this is counterproductive as it hinders the emergence of new theories.
Dragonfang
Posts: 1,122
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10/21/2013 1:26:55 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/21/2013 12:17:58 PM, slo1 wrote:
At 10/19/2013 1:33:48 PM, Dragonfang wrote:
The theory of evolution doesn't explain. It claims to explain with bad explanations and lack of evidence.

You are right. Science should never have a theory until it is 100% proven.

The word "Prove" is too strong for science.
slo1
Posts: 4,308
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10/21/2013 4:14:37 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/21/2013 1:26:55 PM, Dragonfang wrote:
At 10/21/2013 12:17:58 PM, slo1 wrote:
At 10/19/2013 1:33:48 PM, Dragonfang wrote:
The theory of evolution doesn't explain. It claims to explain with bad explanations and lack of evidence.

You are right. Science should never have a theory until it is 100% proven.

The word "Prove" is too strong for science.

Yes, we still have yet to prove where all those maggots come from when one leaves a piece of meat in a jar or why one should have their appendix removed when it is swollen, red, and oozing pus. Science has never proven anything, at least definitely not like the bible has.
Idealist
Posts: 2,520
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10/22/2013 8:24:14 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/17/2013 4:43:03 PM, Bullish wrote:
At 10/17/2013 11:02:01 AM, Installgentoo wrote:
At 10/17/2013 10:51:23 AM, ClassicRobert wrote:
At 10/17/2013 9:41:30 AM, Installgentoo wrote:
If we evolved from Simian life, how do we have reliable cognitive capacities (namely, the capacity for reasoned thought). No Simian displays such an ability. Evolutionists must have their theory all wrong here.

They do show reasoned thought, and evolution has basically shown that we just have more of a need for it.

So if a chimp could talk you would take it's advice on something?


Where are you making this up? It has about 0 relevance to what we're talking about here.

I think Scientists are just trying to tell us we evolved from chimpanzees to avoid the obvious conclusion that such thoughts are the result of God's will being transmitted into our brains.

How can something that has no evidence of existence physically regulate electrons and chemicals in a human's brain?

We did not evolve from chimpanzees. Rather, we share a common ancestor with them.

Even if we do share a common ancestor, this common ancestor was most likely no more smart than a Neanderthal. Neanderthals really weren't that intelligent. They could make little hammers yet they never built anything. Really devoid of intelligence when compared to us.

That's kind of the point of evolution.

At the beginning of the 20th century scientists were still debating the existence of the atom. You ask how something we have no evidence of can regulate electrons in the human brain, but how did they do it before we even had evidence of electrons? Science has taught us one thing for sure: the material evidence we possess is but a very small fraction of what exists. Personally, I believe we all have free will, but I'm still open to all arguments.
Idealist
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10/22/2013 8:26:39 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/18/2013 7:20:25 AM, Fruitytree wrote:
There are other things they don't display, they have no Justice system, no morality, no change in the way their society is organised.

Contrary to popular belief, apes even have opposing thumbs like us, and opposing big-toes! But their fingers and thumbs aren't as dexterous, which keeps them from making or using tools efficiently.