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Is their an edge of the world?

Sky_ace25
Posts: 190
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2/18/2010 3:55:45 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
So it has been theorized that the universe is constantly expanding, so my question is, assuming I have the ability to travel all the way to the edge of the universe, what do you think I would find there?

I personally think the possibilities are a dark void of nothingness devoid of all matter,or

Maybe like a sphere I would just end up looping the edge and heading back the way I came without ever exiting the bubble.

This further begs the question that is there a land of "nothing" that exists outside our universe that we are filling in? Or are we just manifesting new space when we expand?
Seriously, Pluto is no longer a planet?
Puck
Posts: 6,457
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2/18/2010 4:13:47 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/18/2010 3:55:45 AM, Sky_ace25 wrote:

Maybe like a sphere I would just end up looping the edge and heading back the way I came without ever exiting the bubble.

Universe is flat, not closed, so no.
Sky_ace25
Posts: 190
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2/18/2010 4:15:30 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
How do you know it's flat? We know it's constantly expanding in all directions, but it could just be a bubble that is getting wider and wider?
Seriously, Pluto is no longer a planet?
Puck
Posts: 6,457
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2/18/2010 5:22:58 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/18/2010 5:18:18 AM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 2/18/2010 4:37:29 AM, Puck wrote:
The smart physics men worked it out. :)

Yeah, I heard that it was something like a shockwave resulting from the Big Bang that keeps us expanding; however, you figure that the shock would have to die down eventually.

Evidence points to the expansion is accelerating. :P
Cody_Franklin
Posts: 9,484
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2/18/2010 5:31:57 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/18/2010 5:22:58 AM, Puck wrote:
At 2/18/2010 5:18:18 AM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 2/18/2010 4:37:29 AM, Puck wrote:
The smart physics men worked it out. :)

Yeah, I heard that it was something like a shockwave resulting from the Big Bang that keeps us expanding; however, you figure that the shock would have to die down eventually.

Evidence points to the expansion is accelerating. :P

Yeah, I know - strangest thing, really. You have to wonder what's causing it to pick up speed like that.
Sky_ace25
Posts: 190
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2/18/2010 5:43:08 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
Well wouldn't the shock wave need some form of counter reaction to slow it down? In the vacuum of space I'd think it would just constantly keep going without stopping. But speeding up now that is curious.
Seriously, Pluto is no longer a planet?
TheSkeptic
Posts: 1,362
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2/18/2010 6:05:35 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/18/2010 5:31:57 AM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 2/18/2010 5:22:58 AM, Puck wrote:
At 2/18/2010 5:18:18 AM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 2/18/2010 4:37:29 AM, Puck wrote:
The smart physics men worked it out. :)

Yeah, I heard that it was something like a shockwave resulting from the Big Bang that keeps us expanding; however, you figure that the shock would have to die down eventually.

Evidence points to the expansion is accelerating. :P

Yeah, I know - strangest thing, really. You have to wonder what's causing it to pick up speed like that.

"Dark energy"
mattrodstrom
Posts: 12,028
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2/18/2010 6:17:01 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/18/2010 3:55:45 AM, Sky_ace25 wrote:
So it has been theorized that the universe is constantly expanding, so my question is, assuming I have the ability to travel all the way to the edge of the universe, what do you think I would find there?

Supposing you were nearer "the edge", as I don't think you could travel there, I doubt you'd ever be able to "see" it. I thought the Univ. was expanding faster than light can travel(though, maybe I'm wrong), so.... wouldn't that mean you wouldn't be able to see it???
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

Metaphysics:
"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
Sky_ace25
Posts: 190
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2/18/2010 6:40:43 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/18/2010 6:17:01 AM, mattrodstrom wrote:
At 2/18/2010 3:55:45 AM, Sky_ace25 wrote:
So it has been theorized that the universe is constantly expanding, so my question is, assuming I have the ability to travel all the way to the edge of the universe, what do you think I would find there?

Supposing you were nearer "the edge", as I don't think you could travel there, I doubt you'd ever be able to "see" it. I thought the Univ. was expanding faster than light can travel(though, maybe I'm wrong), so.... wouldn't that mean you wouldn't be able to see it???

Well see what I wonder, even though what you said is definitely interesting, is assuming again I have the ability, is their like a border line between the universe and then on the other side their is nothing, and we are filling up that nothing with rapid expansion. It's confusing 0.0.
Seriously, Pluto is no longer a planet?
mattrodstrom
Posts: 12,028
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2/18/2010 8:13:21 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/18/2010 6:40:43 AM, Sky_ace25 wrote:
At 2/18/2010 6:17:01 AM, mattrodstrom wrote:
At 2/18/2010 3:55:45 AM, Sky_ace25 wrote:
So it has been theorized that the universe is constantly expanding, so my question is, assuming I have the ability to travel all the way to the edge of the universe, what do you think I would find there?

Supposing you were nearer "the edge", as I don't think you could travel there, I doubt you'd ever be able to "see" it. I thought the Univ. was expanding faster than light can travel(though, maybe I'm wrong), so.... wouldn't that mean you wouldn't be able to see it???

Well see what I wonder, even though what you said is definitely interesting, is assuming again I have the ability, is their like a border line between the universe and then on the other side their is nothing, and we are filling up that nothing with rapid expansion. It's confusing 0.0.

I'd say not "nothing" as you know it; like nothing=empty space.

Rather, "nothing" like something you have no possible access to and can't say anything at all about.
Or "nothing" in the sense that the three dimensions we naturally think in don't make any sense beyond there.
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

Metaphysics:
"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
mattrodstrom
Posts: 12,028
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2/18/2010 8:15:35 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/18/2010 6:40:43 AM, Sky_ace25 wrote:
It's confusing 0.0.

Yep, In my opinion it's confusing b/c it's not understandable.
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

Metaphysics:
"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
Cody_Franklin
Posts: 9,484
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2/18/2010 1:43:36 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/18/2010 6:05:35 AM, TheSkeptic wrote:
At 2/18/2010 5:31:57 AM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 2/18/2010 5:22:58 AM, Puck wrote:
At 2/18/2010 5:18:18 AM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 2/18/2010 4:37:29 AM, Puck wrote:
The smart physics men worked it out. :)

Yeah, I heard that it was something like a shockwave resulting from the Big Bang that keeps us expanding; however, you figure that the shock would have to die down eventually.

Evidence points to the expansion is accelerating. :P

Yeah, I know - strangest thing, really. You have to wonder what's causing it to pick up speed like that.

"Dark energy"

Well, yes, but it's one of those nebulous, just-specific-enough-to-apply terms.
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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2/18/2010 1:55:44 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
For one, it is physically impossible to catch it, since it is traveling away from you at the speed of light and has a head start on you, so you'll never get there.

But what is out there? No one really knows, we can only theorize.

My personal opinion, is that there is literally nothing, a void. One might ask how does this work with the energy of nothing (matter and antimatter can spontaneously appear and as such create and destroy light that we might be able to detect). I also believe that there is an ether or medium that all the matter in the universe is in that governs the chances of quantum mechanics and so the creation of matter/antimatter. That without this ether, all quantum probabilities are zero (this ether was also released in the big bang and accelerates outward).
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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2/18/2010 2:20:14 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/18/2010 4:13:47 AM, Puck wrote:
At 2/18/2010 3:55:45 AM, Sky_ace25 wrote:

Maybe like a sphere I would just end up looping the edge and heading back the way I came without ever exiting the bubble.

Universe is flat, not closed, so no.

Are you for real? Flat Universe? That's what NASA says, but Michio Kaku, Stephen Hawking, and logic tell me otherwise.

If the Universe started out as a singularity point and expanded in ALL directions, it must be a sphere. Scientists think it's flat for two reasons. 1. Geometry requires a flat medium to allow for straight flat lines (they think it'd be otherwise curved). 2. They used a laser to measure the curvature of the Universe and it turned out to be flat.

However, you can also do the same thing to the earth. Measure the curvature of the earth and it will appear flat.

As far as "the edge of the universe," there are likely a multitude of other expanding "universes" (or singularity points) outside of our little pea sized bubble. Our bubble can't be the entire cosmos.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
Puck
Posts: 6,457
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2/18/2010 2:25:08 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/18/2010 2:20:14 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At 2/18/2010 4:13:47 AM, Puck wrote:
At 2/18/2010 3:55:45 AM, Sky_ace25 wrote:

Maybe like a sphere I would just end up looping the edge and heading back the way I came without ever exiting the bubble.

Universe is flat, not closed, so no.

Are you for real? Flat Universe? That's what NASA says, but Michio Kaku, Stephen Hawking, and logic tell me otherwise.

Kaku, lol. Show me the maths, fine. Show me the measurements they used to calculate it, fine. Show me the points they used for the calculations. As it stands now, the measurements are of a flat universe, compliant with other observations such as total energy of 0 for the Universe of which a 'bubble' universe cannot be.
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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2/18/2010 2:43:51 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/18/2010 2:25:08 PM, Puck wrote:
At 2/18/2010 2:20:14 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At 2/18/2010 4:13:47 AM, Puck wrote:
At 2/18/2010 3:55:45 AM, Sky_ace25 wrote:

Maybe like a sphere I would just end up looping the edge and heading back the way I came without ever exiting the bubble.

Universe is flat, not closed, so no.

Are you for real? Flat Universe? That's what NASA says, but Michio Kaku, Stephen Hawking, and logic tell me otherwise.

Kaku, lol.

What's the problem? He's a great scientist and he also wrote in his book Hyperspace how to create a universe.

Show me the maths, fine. Show me the measurements they used to calculate it, fine. Show me the points they used for the calculations. As it stands now, the measurements are of a flat universe,

I already explained how it's bogus. Michio Kaku debunked the flat Universe myth similar to my flat surface/round earth analogy.

compliant with other observations such as total energy of 0

The universe has a total energy of 0?! On what basis and what does that even mean?

for the Universe of which a 'bubble' universe cannot be.

Explain to me how something can expand in all directions and still be flat?

Can you blow up a balloon in the shape of a table? Or does it inevitably expand spherically.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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2/18/2010 2:49:37 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
There is still flat universe potential in m-brane theory, which also gives theories on how the big bang happened. But that is still just a theory and lacks any proof.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
Reasoning
Posts: 4,456
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2/18/2010 2:50:33 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
Of course there is an edge of the world. What did you think? It just kept going on forever? :P
"What we really ought to ask the liberal, before we even begin addressing his agenda, is this: In what kind of society would he be a conservative?" - Joseph Sobran
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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2/18/2010 3:02:14 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/18/2010 2:49:37 PM, OreEle wrote:
There is still flat universe potential in m-brane theory, which also gives theories on how the big bang happened. But that is still just a theory and lacks any proof.

M-branes aren't flat. They're donut shaped.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
Puck
Posts: 6,457
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2/18/2010 3:02:56 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/18/2010 2:43:51 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At 2/18/2010 2:25:08 PM, Puck wrote:
At 2/18/2010 2:20:14 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At 2/18/2010 4:13:47 AM, Puck wrote:
At 2/18/2010 3:55:45 AM, Sky_ace25 wrote:

Maybe like a sphere I would just end up looping the edge and heading back the way I came without ever exiting the bubble.

Universe is flat, not closed, so no.

Are you for real? Flat Universe? That's what NASA says, but Michio Kaku, Stephen Hawking, and logic tell me otherwise.

Kaku, lol.

What's the problem? He's a great scientist and he also wrote in his book Hyperspace how to create a universe.

Many people write books..

Show me the maths, fine. Show me the measurements they used to calculate it, fine. Show me the points they used for the calculations. As it stands now, the measurements are of a flat universe,

I already explained how it's bogus. Michio Kaku debunked the flat Universe myth similar to my flat surface/round earth analogy.

Nono. Show the maths. You don't prove reality by bad analogy lol. If he is right it will be writ large, so where is the maths?

compliant with other observations such as total energy of 0

The universe has a total energy of 0?! On what basis and what does that even mean?

Gravity is - energy, matter +.

Explain to me how something can expand in all directions and still be flat?

Sure. The common misconception around the big bang is the initial expansion. Where we are now is mappable (were we able to) to a point within the big bang itself. There were no dimensions of space outside it to explode 'into' - it basically means the big bang occurred *everywhere* when it occurred and the result is the expansion of space.


Can you blow up a balloon in the shape of a table? Or does it inevitably expand spherically.

Membrane, gas. :P Not analogous. Still I suspect most of your WTF comes from misunderstanding what physicists mean when they use the term 'flat' in relation to the universe. It means not like top of the table flat, simply the space is Eucledian - space doesn't wrap back around on itself.
Puck
Posts: 6,457
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2/18/2010 3:06:29 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
Should also add that the flat universe an 0 total energy is what gives us solid evidence for the 'from nothing' part of the big bang (quantum state). :)
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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2/18/2010 3:07:51 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
It probably ends somewhere, but we will never fully understand how far the universe it stretching. Things like this are very interesting. How far can we go in the open [i.e. universe]? It would be illogical to say that we can go for an unlimited distance, and at the same time it is illogical to say that it stops somewhere, because then something must be behind the end.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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2/18/2010 3:08:34 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/18/2010 3:07:51 PM, Mirza wrote:
It probably ends somewhere, but we will never fully understand how far the universe it stretching. Things like this are very interesting. How far can we go in the open [i.e. universe]? It would be illogical to say that we can go for an unlimited distance, and at the same time it is illogical to say that it stops somewhere, because then something must be behind the end.

*is
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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2/18/2010 3:11:55 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
If that's all you mean by flat (space not wrapping around on itself), then why can't it be a bubble? How can Euclidean geometry be impossible in a 3D sphere, but possible in a 3D rectangle? In other words, how does the shape of a shell affect what goes on inside?
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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2/18/2010 3:30:11 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/18/2010 3:21:36 PM, Puck wrote:
If you mean closed however, then we go back to the energy/density of the universe part, showing it's not closed. :)

Well, I suppose there isn't a literal shell or closed system, I'm just using those words to describe the outer limits of the universe. I'd say it's more like a bundle of star dust clumped together, which probably takes the form of a sphere as opposed to a flat rectangle. Have you ever seen a flat dust ball?
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat