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Boiling water conundrum?

chui
Posts: 507
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12/10/2014 10:40:56 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
The latent heat of vapourisation of water is 2260 kJ/kg. This means that each water molecule needs 6.8 x 10^-20 J to evaporate.

Water boils at 373K. At this temperature each molecule has around 5.3 x 10^-21 J which is only a thirteenth of the energy they need to evaporate.

The probability of a molecule having thirteen times the average energy is only about 2 in a million. The chances of all the molecules in 1 kg being able to evaporate is 10^-(2 x 10^26) So water cannot boil, it is impossible.

This level of improbability makes abiogenesis look like a certainty.

Conclusion: Scientists are liars :)
Envisage
Posts: 3,646
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12/11/2014 7:33:26 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/10/2014 10:40:56 AM, chui wrote:
The latent heat of vapourisation of water is 2260 kJ/kg. This means that each water molecule needs 6.8 x 10^-20 J to evaporate.

Water boils at 373K. At this temperature each molecule has around 5.3 x 10^-21 J which is only a thirteenth of the energy they need to evaporate.

The probability of a molecule having thirteen times the average energy is only about 2 in a million. The chances of all the molecules in 1 kg being able to evaporate is 10^-(2 x 10^26) So water cannot boil, it is impossible.

This level of improbability makes abiogenesis look like a certainty.

Conclusion: Scientists are liars :)

The energies of water molecules can be given according to a Boltxmann distribution (as you say), anything at temperature X will have it's molecules at a range of energies, the mean of which is directly related to the temperature. The higher the temperature the more molecules that have higher energies compares to those with lower energies.

Thus, as you say, only 2 particles in a million at 373K will have the energy to evaporate, once those 2 particles do evaporate, you are left with 999,998 particles, with a lower average energy, and lower average temperature.

What you don't factor in is that the distribution is dynamic, with the energies renormalising very rapidly, so after a split-second, the random motion of the molecules will give essentially the samee distribution again, but with another 2 particles in a million with the energy required to evaporate. This process continues over and over.

2 things will happen:

1. The overall energy (and therefore temperature) of the system will decrease to the point where hardly any particles will be above the threshold (as the temperature drops to 363K.. 353K.. etc), and this evaporation occurs slower and slower.

2. If you apply energy input into the system (such as a pan on the stove), then the temperature is maintained at a high temperature, which replenishes the energy taken away by the evaporating particles

The Boltzmann distribution also explains why water evaporates at room temperature, despite being well below it's boiling point. Since there are always some particles above the energy needed for vaporisation (albeit it's very slow compared to higher temperatures). Moreover it's why sweating keeps you cool, because vaporisation takes away heat energy in the particles with highest energies leaving the body, leaving the rest of the distribution behind.

Hope this helps!
Envisage
Posts: 3,646
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12/11/2014 7:35:00 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/10/2014 10:40:56 AM, chui wrote:
The latent heat of vapourisation of water is 2260 kJ/kg. This means that each water molecule needs 6.8 x 10^-20 J to evaporate.

Water boils at 373K. At this temperature each molecule has around 5.3 x 10^-21 J which is only a thirteenth of the energy they need to evaporate.

The probability of a molecule having thirteen times the average energy is only about 2 in a million. The chances of all the molecules in 1 kg being able to evaporate is 10^-(2 x 10^26) So water cannot boil, it is impossible.

This level of improbability makes abiogenesis look like a certainty.

Conclusion: Scientists are liars :)

By the way, IF it was the case every single particle was above 5.3 x 10^-21 J, THEN the temperature would not be 373K, lol, it would be much, much higher. Since temperature is related to the average energy of the particles.
mortsdor
Posts: 1,181
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12/11/2014 7:44:27 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/11/2014 7:35:00 AM, Envisage wrote:
IF it was the case every single particle was above 5.3 x 10^-21 J
slo1
Posts: 4,308
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12/12/2014 11:11:43 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/10/2014 10:40:56 AM, chui wrote:
The latent heat of vapourisation of water is 2260 kJ/kg. This means that each water molecule needs 6.8 x 10^-20 J to evaporate.

Water boils at 373K. At this temperature each molecule has around 5.3 x 10^-21 J which is only a thirteenth of the energy they need to evaporate.

The probability of a molecule having thirteen times the average energy is only about 2 in a million. The chances of all the molecules in 1 kg being able to evaporate is 10^-(2 x 10^26) So water cannot boil, it is impossible.

This level of improbability makes abiogenesis look like a certainty.

Conclusion: Scientists are liars :)

Every good creationist knows that boiling water breaks the second law of thermodynamic and can't possibly happen anyway.