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Proposal to make global warming denial illega

UndeniableReality
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5/18/2015 10:33:37 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/18/2015 10:16:55 PM, eagleoftheeast wrote:
I think we should make this move to help ensure the succesful survival of nature and Earth.

I'm not sure that global warming poses any threat to nature or to Earth itself. It may pose a threat to humans and our habitat, but nature and Earth can, and have, handled far more significant changes in climate without being harmed.
Ramshutu
Posts: 4,063
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5/18/2015 11:18:02 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/18/2015 10:33:37 PM, UndeniableReality wrote:
At 5/18/2015 10:16:55 PM, eagleoftheeast wrote:
I think we should make this move to help ensure the succesful survival of nature and Earth.

I'm not sure that global warming poses any threat to nature or to Earth itself. It may pose a threat to humans and our habitat, but nature and Earth can, and have, handled far more significant changes in climate without being harmed.

This reminds me of a George Carlin quote:

"The planet has been through a lot worse than us. Been through earthquakes, volcanoes, plate tectonics, continental drift, solar flares, sun spots, magnetic storms, the magnetic reversal of the poles " hundreds of thousands of years of bombardment by comets and asteroids and meteors, worldwide floods, tidal waves, worldwide fires, erosion, cosmic rays, recurring ice ages " And we think some plastic bags and some aluminum cans are going to make a difference? The planet isn"t going anywhere........ WE are!"
UndeniableReality
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5/18/2015 11:27:53 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/18/2015 11:18:02 PM, Ramshutu wrote:
At 5/18/2015 10:33:37 PM, UndeniableReality wrote:
At 5/18/2015 10:16:55 PM, eagleoftheeast wrote:
I think we should make this move to help ensure the succesful survival of nature and Earth.

I'm not sure that global warming poses any threat to nature or to Earth itself. It may pose a threat to humans and our habitat, but nature and Earth can, and have, handled far more significant changes in climate without being harmed.

This reminds me of a George Carlin quote:

"The planet has been through a lot worse than us. Been through earthquakes, volcanoes, plate tectonics, continental drift, solar flares, sun spots, magnetic storms, the magnetic reversal of the poles " hundreds of thousands of years of bombardment by comets and asteroids and meteors, worldwide floods, tidal waves, worldwide fires, erosion, cosmic rays, recurring ice ages " And we think some plastic bags and some aluminum cans are going to make a difference? The planet isn"t going anywhere........ WE are!"

That skit did cross my mind as I was writing it =D
Dragonfang
Posts: 1,122
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5/19/2015 12:45:13 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Lol, 'climate change'. Nobody is disputing that. Hello Ice age!

What I want is the demonstration of global warming: the rise in the average temperature of earth's atmosphere and oceans since the late 19th century and it's projected continuation mainly caused by human activity.

If the proposal pass, can I 'deny' or 'state' that arctic ice didn't melt in 5 years, or that 95% of climate models overforecast, or that there is some GW hiatus for 18 years, or that attempting to get rid of cow farts are a better solution to reduce 'green house' gases.
Sidewalker
Posts: 3,713
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5/19/2015 6:06:32 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/18/2015 10:16:55 PM, eagleoftheeast wrote:
I think we should make this move to help ensure the succesful survival of nature and Earth.

You want to make it illegal for people to have an opinion that differs from yours?

OK, and how about swastikas, how do you feel about swastikas?
"It is one of the commonest of mistakes to consider that the limit of our power of perception is also the limit of all there is to perceive." " C. W. Leadbeater
dee-em
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5/19/2015 6:18:48 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/18/2015 10:16:55 PM, eagleoftheeast wrote:
I think we should make this move to help ensure the succesful survival of nature and Earth.

I think the deniers should undergo a mandatory tattoo, say something like this:

https://pindanpost.files.wordpress.com...

As the effects of global warming continue to mount to the point where not even the most obstinate of deniers can continue to deny, then at least we will know who they were. They won't be able to slink away and pretend that they accepted the science all along. It should be a permanent branding to shame them for life. (Yes, I know tattoos can be removed or hidden. It could be put on their foreheads where it would be hard to disguise).
dee-em
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5/19/2015 6:26:16 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/18/2015 10:33:37 PM, UndeniableReality wrote:
At 5/18/2015 10:16:55 PM, eagleoftheeast wrote:
I think we should make this move to help ensure the succesful survival of nature and Earth.

I'm not sure that global warming poses any threat to nature or to Earth itself. It may pose a threat to humans and our habitat, but nature and Earth can, and have, handled far more significant changes in climate without being harmed.

That is true, but it is the rapid rate of change which is the issue. Species can adapt or migrate away (animals) when change is slow. They would find it much harder to adapt to a sudden increase in temperature and/or change of climate when it is over only a century or two, an eye-blink in evolutionary terms.
UndeniableReality
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5/19/2015 10:26:20 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/18/2015 10:16:55 PM, eagleoftheeast wrote:
I think we should make this move to help ensure the succesful survival of nature and Earth.

I forgot to add that my opinion is that using the law to suppress differing opinions, even if they're harmful, rather than using education and debate, makes humanity less worth saving anyway.
UndeniableReality
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5/19/2015 10:32:06 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/19/2015 6:26:16 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 5/18/2015 10:33:37 PM, UndeniableReality wrote:
At 5/18/2015 10:16:55 PM, eagleoftheeast wrote:
I think we should make this move to help ensure the succesful survival of nature and Earth.

I'm not sure that global warming poses any threat to nature or to Earth itself. It may pose a threat to humans and our habitat, but nature and Earth can, and have, handled far more significant changes in climate without being harmed.

That is true, but it is the rapid rate of change which is the issue. Species can adapt or migrate away (animals) when change is slow. They would find it much harder to adapt to a sudden increase in temperature and/or change of climate when it is over only a century or two, an eye-blink in evolutionary terms.

That is true of mammals, fish, birds, and other larger and more complex forms of life. But many of the species of bacteria and perhaps insects and plants would likely survive. I don't think there's much of a risk of life on Earth being extinguished. It might free up a lot of room for new species to emerge, though.
lannan13
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5/19/2015 5:01:07 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/18/2015 10:16:55 PM, eagleoftheeast wrote:
I think we should make this move to help ensure the succesful survival of nature and Earth.

lol, hell no. I mean France already puts these kinda of people into concentration camps, but that's besides the fact.
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If the sky's the limit then why do we have footprints on the Moon? I'm shooting my aspirations for the stars.

"If you are going through hell, keep going." "Sir Winston Churchill

"No one can make you feel inferior without your consent." "Eleanor Roosevelt

Topics I want to debate. (http://tinyurl.com...)
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lannan13
Posts: 23,111
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5/19/2015 5:02:30 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/19/2015 6:18:48 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 5/18/2015 10:16:55 PM, eagleoftheeast wrote:
I think we should make this move to help ensure the succesful survival of nature and Earth.

I think the deniers should undergo a mandatory tattoo, say something like this:

https://pindanpost.files.wordpress.com...

That's a horrible tattoo.

As the effects of global warming continue to mount to the point where not even the most obstinate of deniers can continue to deny, then at least we will know who they were. They won't be able to slink away and pretend that they accepted the science all along. It should be a permanent branding to shame them for life. (Yes, I know tattoos can be removed or hidden. It could be put on their foreheads where it would be hard to disguise).

I mean though GW is highly factual so is much of the evidence against it.
-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-Lannan13'S SIGNATURE-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-

If the sky's the limit then why do we have footprints on the Moon? I'm shooting my aspirations for the stars.

"If you are going through hell, keep going." "Sir Winston Churchill

"No one can make you feel inferior without your consent." "Eleanor Roosevelt

Topics I want to debate. (http://tinyurl.com...)
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UndeniableReality
Posts: 1,897
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5/19/2015 6:08:25 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/19/2015 5:01:07 PM, lannan13 wrote:
At 5/18/2015 10:16:55 PM, eagleoftheeast wrote:
I think we should make this move to help ensure the succesful survival of nature and Earth.

lol, hell no. I mean France already puts these kinda of people into concentration camps, but that's besides the fact.

I would be very surprised if France had concentration camps of any kind. Can you provide a source, please?
dee-em
Posts: 6,491
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5/20/2015 3:00:29 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/19/2015 10:32:06 AM, UndeniableReality wrote:
At 5/19/2015 6:26:16 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 5/18/2015 10:33:37 PM, UndeniableReality wrote:
At 5/18/2015 10:16:55 PM, eagleoftheeast wrote:
I think we should make this move to help ensure the succesful survival of nature and Earth.

I'm not sure that global warming poses any threat to nature or to Earth itself. It may pose a threat to humans and our habitat, but nature and Earth can, and have, handled far more significant changes in climate without being harmed.

That is true, but it is the rapid rate of change which is the issue. Species can adapt or migrate away (animals) when change is slow. They would find it much harder to adapt to a sudden increase in temperature and/or change of climate when it is over only a century or two, an eye-blink in evolutionary terms.

That is true of mammals, fish, birds, and other larger and more complex forms of life.

And many plants too. These are the things we really care about, surely?

But many of the species of bacteria and perhaps insects and plants would likely survive.

No argument.

I don't think there's much of a risk of life on Earth being extinguished.

Absolutely.

It might free up a lot of room for new species to emerge, though.

That's of little consolation to me. I'm kind of attached to the life we know. :-)

Don't get me wrong. Humans will survive and we'll certainly preserve those species which we find useful or pleasing. It's just that the Earth will lose a bit more biodiversity on top of the losses caused just my man's presence and conversion of land to agriculture. I find that prospect a sad one.
dee-em
Posts: 6,491
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5/20/2015 3:02:39 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/19/2015 5:02:30 PM, lannan13 wrote:
At 5/19/2015 6:18:48 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 5/18/2015 10:16:55 PM, eagleoftheeast wrote:
I think we should make this move to help ensure the succesful survival of nature and Earth.

I think the deniers should undergo a mandatory tattoo, say something like this:

https://pindanpost.files.wordpress.com...

That's a horrible tattoo.

Yeah. But do deniers deserve a really artistic tattoo?

As the effects of global warming continue to mount to the point where not even the most obstinate of deniers can continue to deny, then at least we will know who they were. They won't be able to slink away and pretend that they accepted the science all along. It should be a permanent branding to shame them for life. (Yes, I know tattoos can be removed or hidden. It could be put on their foreheads where it would be hard to disguise).

I mean though GW is highly factual so is much of the evidence against it.

Um, no.
UndeniableReality
Posts: 1,897
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5/20/2015 7:49:48 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/20/2015 3:00:29 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 5/19/2015 10:32:06 AM, UndeniableReality wrote:
At 5/19/2015 6:26:16 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 5/18/2015 10:33:37 PM, UndeniableReality wrote:
At 5/18/2015 10:16:55 PM, eagleoftheeast wrote:
I think we should make this move to help ensure the succesful survival of nature and Earth.

I'm not sure that global warming poses any threat to nature or to Earth itself. It may pose a threat to humans and our habitat, but nature and Earth can, and have, handled far more significant changes in climate without being harmed.

That is true, but it is the rapid rate of change which is the issue. Species can adapt or migrate away (animals) when change is slow. They would find it much harder to adapt to a sudden increase in temperature and/or change of climate when it is over only a century or two, an eye-blink in evolutionary terms.

That is true of mammals, fish, birds, and other larger and more complex forms of life.

And many plants too. These are the things we really care about, surely?

But many of the species of bacteria and perhaps insects and plants would likely survive.

No argument.

I don't think there's much of a risk of life on Earth being extinguished.

Absolutely.

It might free up a lot of room for new species to emerge, though.

That's of little consolation to me. I'm kind of attached to the life we know. :-)

Don't get me wrong. Humans will survive and we'll certainly preserve those species which we find useful or pleasing. It's just that the Earth will lose a bit more biodiversity on top of the losses caused just my man's presence and conversion of land to agriculture. I find that prospect a sad one.

Sad, I agree. But I just want to differentiate between the end of THE world and the end of OUR world, because they seems to get easily confused in this discussion. This isn't about saving the world so much as it is about saving our world.
lannan13
Posts: 23,111
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5/20/2015 8:08:56 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/20/2015 3:02:39 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 5/19/2015 5:02:30 PM, lannan13 wrote:
At 5/19/2015 6:18:48 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 5/18/2015 10:16:55 PM, eagleoftheeast wrote:
I think we should make this move to help ensure the succesful survival of nature and Earth.

I think the deniers should undergo a mandatory tattoo, say something like this:

https://pindanpost.files.wordpress.com...

That's a horrible tattoo.

Yeah. But do deniers deserve a really artistic tattoo?

As the effects of global warming continue to mount to the point where not even the most obstinate of deniers can continue to deny, then at least we will know who they were. They won't be able to slink away and pretend that they accepted the science all along. It should be a permanent branding to shame them for life. (Yes, I know tattoos can be removed or hidden. It could be put on their foreheads where it would be hard to disguise).

I mean though GW is highly factual so is much of the evidence against it.

Um, no.

Actually, yes, one CAN make a factual case against GW.
-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-Lannan13'S SIGNATURE-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-

If the sky's the limit then why do we have footprints on the Moon? I'm shooting my aspirations for the stars.

"If you are going through hell, keep going." "Sir Winston Churchill

"No one can make you feel inferior without your consent." "Eleanor Roosevelt

Topics I want to debate. (http://tinyurl.com...)
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dee-em
Posts: 6,491
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5/20/2015 8:17:20 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/20/2015 8:08:56 AM, lannan13 wrote:
At 5/20/2015 3:02:39 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 5/19/2015 5:02:30 PM, lannan13 wrote:
At 5/19/2015 6:18:48 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 5/18/2015 10:16:55 PM, eagleoftheeast wrote:
I think we should make this move to help ensure the succesful survival of nature and Earth.

I think the deniers should undergo a mandatory tattoo, say something like this:

https://pindanpost.files.wordpress.com...

That's a horrible tattoo.

Yeah. But do deniers deserve a really artistic tattoo?

As the effects of global warming continue to mount to the point where not even the most obstinate of deniers can continue to deny, then at least we will know who they were. They won't be able to slink away and pretend that they accepted the science all along. It should be a permanent branding to shame them for life. (Yes, I know tattoos can be removed or hidden. It could be put on their foreheads where it would be hard to disguise).

I mean though GW is highly factual so is much of the evidence against it.

Um, no.

Actually, yes, one CAN make a factual case against GW.

No, one can't. I'm well past the point of debunking denier 'facts'. We need to move on and look for solutions to limit the damage. The world is going to warm very quickly in geological terms. It's already well under way. The problem now is to limit the damage, not worry about those who are still stuck in denial. Brand them and forget them, I say.
lannan13
Posts: 23,111
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5/20/2015 8:17:26 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/19/2015 6:08:25 PM, UndeniableReality wrote:
At 5/19/2015 5:01:07 PM, lannan13 wrote:
At 5/18/2015 10:16:55 PM, eagleoftheeast wrote:
I think we should make this move to help ensure the succesful survival of nature and Earth.

lol, hell no. I mean France already puts these kinda of people into concentration camps, but that's besides the fact.

I would be very surprised if France had concentration camps of any kind. Can you provide a source, please?

http://iceagenow.info...
-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-Lannan13'S SIGNATURE-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-

If the sky's the limit then why do we have footprints on the Moon? I'm shooting my aspirations for the stars.

"If you are going through hell, keep going." "Sir Winston Churchill

"No one can make you feel inferior without your consent." "Eleanor Roosevelt

Topics I want to debate. (http://tinyurl.com...)
-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~
lannan13
Posts: 23,111
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5/20/2015 8:19:30 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/20/2015 8:17:20 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 5/20/2015 8:08:56 AM, lannan13 wrote:
At 5/20/2015 3:02:39 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 5/19/2015 5:02:30 PM, lannan13 wrote:
At 5/19/2015 6:18:48 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 5/18/2015 10:16:55 PM, eagleoftheeast wrote:
I think we should make this move to help ensure the succesful survival of nature and Earth.

I think the deniers should undergo a mandatory tattoo, say something like this:

https://pindanpost.files.wordpress.com...

That's a horrible tattoo.

Yeah. But do deniers deserve a really artistic tattoo?

As the effects of global warming continue to mount to the point where not even the most obstinate of deniers can continue to deny, then at least we will know who they were. They won't be able to slink away and pretend that they accepted the science all along. It should be a permanent branding to shame them for life. (Yes, I know tattoos can be removed or hidden. It could be put on their foreheads where it would be hard to disguise).

I mean though GW is highly factual so is much of the evidence against it.

Um, no.

Actually, yes, one CAN make a factual case against GW.

No, one can't. I'm well past the point of debunking denier 'facts'. We need to move on and look for solutions to limit the damage. The world is going to warm very quickly in geological terms. It's already well under way. The problem now is to limit the damage, not worry about those who are still stuck in denial. Brand them and forget them, I say.

The Globe is Cooling. We need to worry about the next Ice Age vs. that of a Global Melt down.
-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-Lannan13'S SIGNATURE-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-

If the sky's the limit then why do we have footprints on the Moon? I'm shooting my aspirations for the stars.

"If you are going through hell, keep going." "Sir Winston Churchill

"No one can make you feel inferior without your consent." "Eleanor Roosevelt

Topics I want to debate. (http://tinyurl.com...)
-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~
dee-em
Posts: 6,491
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5/20/2015 8:21:08 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/20/2015 8:19:30 AM, lannan13 wrote:
At 5/20/2015 8:17:20 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 5/20/2015 8:08:56 AM, lannan13 wrote:
At 5/20/2015 3:02:39 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 5/19/2015 5:02:30 PM, lannan13 wrote:
At 5/19/2015 6:18:48 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 5/18/2015 10:16:55 PM, eagleoftheeast wrote:
I think we should make this move to help ensure the succesful survival of nature and Earth.

I think the deniers should undergo a mandatory tattoo, say something like this:

https://pindanpost.files.wordpress.com...

That's a horrible tattoo.

Yeah. But do deniers deserve a really artistic tattoo?

As the effects of global warming continue to mount to the point where not even the most obstinate of deniers can continue to deny, then at least we will know who they were. They won't be able to slink away and pretend that they accepted the science all along. It should be a permanent branding to shame them for life. (Yes, I know tattoos can be removed or hidden. It could be put on their foreheads where it would be hard to disguise).

I mean though GW is highly factual so is much of the evidence against it.

Um, no.

Actually, yes, one CAN make a factual case against GW.

No, one can't. I'm well past the point of debunking denier 'facts'. We need to move on and look for solutions to limit the damage. The world is going to warm very quickly in geological terms. It's already well under way. The problem now is to limit the damage, not worry about those who are still stuck in denial. Brand them and forget them, I say.

The Globe is Cooling. We need to worry about the next Ice Age vs. that of a Global Melt down.

Ha ha ha ha. That's a good one. Lol.
lannan13
Posts: 23,111
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5/20/2015 8:25:36 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/20/2015 8:21:08 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 5/20/2015 8:19:30 AM, lannan13 wrote:
At 5/20/2015 8:17:20 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 5/20/2015 8:08:56 AM, lannan13 wrote:
At 5/20/2015 3:02:39 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 5/19/2015 5:02:30 PM, lannan13 wrote:
At 5/19/2015 6:18:48 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 5/18/2015 10:16:55 PM, eagleoftheeast wrote:
I think we should make this move to help ensure the succesful survival of nature and Earth.

I think the deniers should undergo a mandatory tattoo, say something like this:

https://pindanpost.files.wordpress.com...

That's a horrible tattoo.

Yeah. But do deniers deserve a really artistic tattoo?

As the effects of global warming continue to mount to the point where not even the most obstinate of deniers can continue to deny, then at least we will know who they were. They won't be able to slink away and pretend that they accepted the science all along. It should be a permanent branding to shame them for life. (Yes, I know tattoos can be removed or hidden. It could be put on their foreheads where it would be hard to disguise).

I mean though GW is highly factual so is much of the evidence against it.

Um, no.

Actually, yes, one CAN make a factual case against GW.

No, one can't. I'm well past the point of debunking denier 'facts'. We need to move on and look for solutions to limit the damage. The world is going to warm very quickly in geological terms. It's already well under way. The problem now is to limit the damage, not worry about those who are still stuck in denial. Brand them and forget them, I say.

The Globe is Cooling. We need to worry about the next Ice Age vs. that of a Global Melt down.

Ha ha ha ha. That's a good one. Lol.

Thank you, I like to concider myself the Al Gore of Comedy at times.
-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-Lannan13'S SIGNATURE-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-

If the sky's the limit then why do we have footprints on the Moon? I'm shooting my aspirations for the stars.

"If you are going through hell, keep going." "Sir Winston Churchill

"No one can make you feel inferior without your consent." "Eleanor Roosevelt

Topics I want to debate. (http://tinyurl.com...)
-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~
UndeniableReality
Posts: 1,897
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5/20/2015 8:27:16 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/20/2015 8:17:26 AM, lannan13 wrote:
At 5/19/2015 6:08:25 PM, UndeniableReality wrote:
At 5/19/2015 5:01:07 PM, lannan13 wrote:
At 5/18/2015 10:16:55 PM, eagleoftheeast wrote:
I think we should make this move to help ensure the succesful survival of nature and Earth.

lol, hell no. I mean France already puts these kinda of people into concentration camps, but that's besides the fact.

I would be very surprised if France had concentration camps of any kind. Can you provide a source, please?

http://iceagenow.info...

This may surprise you, but an article about a professor from Oregan stating that anti-global warming proponents are sick and need treatment is in no way a source pertaining to the claim that France has concentration camps for those same people. You can't even make that leap by gross exaggeration. Do you have a source, or not?
TruthS4yer
Posts: 55
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5/24/2015 10:17:23 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/18/2015 10:16:55 PM, eagleoftheeast wrote:
I think we should make this move to help ensure the succesful survival of nature and Earth.
Free speech must prevail. The solution to deniers is to have a central source for all compelling information supporting the reality of climate change to be compiled and maintained by experts on the topic. Ideally we should have a single source for all contentious topics (relating to objective claims), which provides the best arguments and evidence for the correct side.

I could do that for all topics related to LGBT people/heterosexism (and effectively have) but it would need a collaboration between experts on numerous topics to cover all the others. There are too many contentious topics for any one person to be an expert on all of them.

Unfortunately, in reality, propaganda typically seems to sway the mobs' mind more effectively than reason/evidence. I still aim to solely use the latter however.
Please avoid quoting all of large posts - it needlessly means we have to scroll through them to navigate a thread.