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Science Forum Proposal

DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,647
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7/7/2015 1:14:19 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
I've moderated Math, Physics, Astronomy and Cosmology forums in the past as some of you may have done yourselves. Usually, there are other forums such as Pseudoscience or Fringe Theory forums for those who wish to indulge themselves with that which is not science. And, if the crackpots, cranks, conspiracy theorists and other assorted nutjobs wind up pushing their agendas in the science forums, their threads are immediately moved to those other forums, allowing the science forums to flourish so that those who wish to learn things or discuss scientific theories can do so without the insanity.

I've requested for a Pseudoscience forum to be created, but the likeliness of that happening is probably zilch. So, that being said, we are relegated to dealing with the kooks and nutters who currently run amok here.

My proposal is that if you wish to engage threads created or other posts that are clearly not of any scientific nature, please do so until it is clear that person has no intention of presenting anything scientific to back their claims. Then, please ignore them completely if it becomes obvious they will just continue their agendas. Without the negative attention they seek, they'll soon move on to troll elsewhere.

Please do add to this proposal any other ideas you may have that will save this forum for the value of science we all would like to see. Thanks.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
Ramshutu
Posts: 4,063
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7/7/2015 1:24:56 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 1:14:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
I've moderated Math, Physics, Astronomy and Cosmology forums in the past as some of you may have done yourselves. Usually, there are other forums such as Pseudoscience or Fringe Theory forums for those who wish to indulge themselves with that which is not science. And, if the crackpots, cranks, conspiracy theorists and other assorted nutjobs wind up pushing their agendas in the science forums, their threads are immediately moved to those other forums, allowing the science forums to flourish so that those who wish to learn things or discuss scientific theories can do so without the insanity.

I've requested for a Pseudoscience forum to be created, but the likeliness of that happening is probably zilch. So, that being said, we are relegated to dealing with the kooks and nutters who currently run amok here.

My proposal is that if you wish to engage threads created or other posts that are clearly not of any scientific nature, please do so until it is clear that person has no intention of presenting anything scientific to back their claims. Then, please ignore them completely if it becomes obvious they will just continue their agendas. Without the negative attention they seek, they'll soon move on to troll elsewhere.?

Please do add to this proposal any other ideas you may have that will save this forum for the value of science we all would like to see. Thanks.

Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.

While I understand your point, the only thing I think this would acheive is to rename the forum we have here already to "Pseudo-science", and create another forum with maybe 4 posts in it that no one looks at.

To be honest, if I wanted to debate the finer points of scientific theory, I'd go onto a dedicated science forum; the whole point I'm here is all the lunatics, idiots, cranks and crackpots. Shooting fish in a barrell is pretty cathartic.
UndeniableReality
Posts: 1,897
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7/7/2015 1:33:56 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 1:14:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
I've moderated Math, Physics, Astronomy and Cosmology forums in the past as some of you may have done yourselves. Usually, there are other forums such as Pseudoscience or Fringe Theory forums for those who wish to indulge themselves with that which is not science. And, if the crackpots, cranks, conspiracy theorists and other assorted nutjobs wind up pushing their agendas in the science forums, their threads are immediately moved to those other forums, allowing the science forums to flourish so that those who wish to learn things or discuss scientific theories can do so without the insanity.

I've requested for a Pseudoscience forum to be created, but the likeliness of that happening is probably zilch. So, that being said, we are relegated to dealing with the kooks and nutters who currently run amok here.

My proposal is that if you wish to engage threads created or other posts that are clearly not of any scientific nature, please do so until it is clear that person has no intention of presenting anything scientific to back their claims. Then, please ignore them completely if it becomes obvious they will just continue their agendas. Without the negative attention they seek, they'll soon move on to troll elsewhere.

Please do add to this proposal any other ideas you may have that will save this forum for the value of science we all would like to see. Thanks.

I think a possibly easier solution which might due the trick is to have 'tags'. A few people who have sufficient backgrounds in science and who contribute to the science forum (I am not advocating myself, by the way) could have the ability to tag threads as pertaining to different areas of science, or pseudoscience. Those tags would be visible under the thread title, giving us the ability to see which threads are actual science threads right away.
UndeniableReality
Posts: 1,897
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7/7/2015 1:35:27 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 1:24:56 PM, Ramshutu wrote:
At 7/7/2015 1:14:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
I've moderated Math, Physics, Astronomy and Cosmology forums in the past as some of you may have done yourselves. Usually, there are other forums such as Pseudoscience or Fringe Theory forums for those who wish to indulge themselves with that which is not science. And, if the crackpots, cranks, conspiracy theorists and other assorted nutjobs wind up pushing their agendas in the science forums, their threads are immediately moved to those other forums, allowing the science forums to flourish so that those who wish to learn things or discuss scientific theories can do so without the insanity.

I've requested for a Pseudoscience forum to be created, but the likeliness of that happening is probably zilch. So, that being said, we are relegated to dealing with the kooks and nutters who currently run amok here.

My proposal is that if you wish to engage threads created or other posts that are clearly not of any scientific nature, please do so until it is clear that person has no intention of presenting anything scientific to back their claims. Then, please ignore them completely if it becomes obvious they will just continue their agendas. Without the negative attention they seek, they'll soon move on to troll elsewhere.?

Please do add to this proposal any other ideas you may have that will save this forum for the value of science we all would like to see. Thanks.

Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.

While I understand your point, the only thing I think this would acheive is to rename the forum we have here already to "Pseudo-science", and create another forum with maybe 4 posts in it that no one looks at.

To be honest, if I wanted to debate the finer points of scientific theory, I'd go onto a dedicated science forum; the whole point I'm here is all the lunatics, idiots, cranks and crackpots. Shooting fish in a barrell is pretty cathartic.

I think most of us are here because there are crazy people here (this obviously isn't the place to discuss science, usually). It's really interesting to see how they think
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,647
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7/7/2015 2:31:17 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 1:24:56 PM, Ramshutu wrote:
At 7/7/2015 1:14:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
I've moderated Math, Physics, Astronomy and Cosmology forums in the past as some of you may have done yourselves. Usually, there are other forums such as Pseudoscience or Fringe Theory forums for those who wish to indulge themselves with that which is not science. And, if the crackpots, cranks, conspiracy theorists and other assorted nutjobs wind up pushing their agendas in the science forums, their threads are immediately moved to those other forums, allowing the science forums to flourish so that those who wish to learn things or discuss scientific theories can do so without the insanity.

I've requested for a Pseudoscience forum to be created, but the likeliness of that happening is probably zilch. So, that being said, we are relegated to dealing with the kooks and nutters who currently run amok here.

My proposal is that if you wish to engage threads created or other posts that are clearly not of any scientific nature, please do so until it is clear that person has no intention of presenting anything scientific to back their claims. Then, please ignore them completely if it becomes obvious they will just continue their agendas. Without the negative attention they seek, they'll soon move on to troll elsewhere.?

Please do add to this proposal any other ideas you may have that will save this forum for the value of science we all would like to see. Thanks.

Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.

While I understand your point, the only thing I think this would acheive is to rename the forum we have here already to "Pseudo-science", and create another forum with maybe 4 posts in it that no one looks at.

To be honest, if I wanted to debate the finer points of scientific theory, I'd go onto a dedicated science forum; the whole point I'm here is all the lunatics, idiots, cranks and crackpots. Shooting fish in a barrell is pretty cathartic.

That's a good point and maybe you're right. There certainly are science forums that are run quite well. Perhaps, I should just relegate myself to think of this forum as Nutter Central and watch the loonies go by.

Perhaps then, if there are folks who actually do want to learn something, we can provide links to those well run forums where they won't be over run by the insane.

Thanks for that.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,647
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7/7/2015 2:34:08 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 1:33:56 PM, UndeniableReality wrote:
At 7/7/2015 1:14:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
I've moderated Math, Physics, Astronomy and Cosmology forums in the past as some of you may have done yourselves. Usually, there are other forums such as Pseudoscience or Fringe Theory forums for those who wish to indulge themselves with that which is not science. And, if the crackpots, cranks, conspiracy theorists and other assorted nutjobs wind up pushing their agendas in the science forums, their threads are immediately moved to those other forums, allowing the science forums to flourish so that those who wish to learn things or discuss scientific theories can do so without the insanity.

I've requested for a Pseudoscience forum to be created, but the likeliness of that happening is probably zilch. So, that being said, we are relegated to dealing with the kooks and nutters who currently run amok here.

My proposal is that if you wish to engage threads created or other posts that are clearly not of any scientific nature, please do so until it is clear that person has no intention of presenting anything scientific to back their claims. Then, please ignore them completely if it becomes obvious they will just continue their agendas. Without the negative attention they seek, they'll soon move on to troll elsewhere.

Please do add to this proposal any other ideas you may have that will save this forum for the value of science we all would like to see. Thanks.

I think a possibly easier solution which might due the trick is to have 'tags'. A few people who have sufficient backgrounds in science and who contribute to the science forum (I am not advocating myself, by the way) could have the ability to tag threads as pertaining to different areas of science, or pseudoscience. Those tags would be visible under the thread title, giving us the ability to see which threads are actual science threads right away.

That's a good idea, I wonder if that option is available in the forum software. I noticed the software here is not very forgiving and has few options compared with other forums. I mean, there isn't even an edit button and the html has only 3 options, not to mention the character restriction.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
UndeniableReality
Posts: 1,897
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7/7/2015 2:41:14 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 2:34:08 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/7/2015 1:33:56 PM, UndeniableReality wrote:
At 7/7/2015 1:14:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
I've moderated Math, Physics, Astronomy and Cosmology forums in the past as some of you may have done yourselves. Usually, there are other forums such as Pseudoscience or Fringe Theory forums for those who wish to indulge themselves with that which is not science. And, if the crackpots, cranks, conspiracy theorists and other assorted nutjobs wind up pushing their agendas in the science forums, their threads are immediately moved to those other forums, allowing the science forums to flourish so that those who wish to learn things or discuss scientific theories can do so without the insanity.

I've requested for a Pseudoscience forum to be created, but the likeliness of that happening is probably zilch. So, that being said, we are relegated to dealing with the kooks and nutters who currently run amok here.

My proposal is that if you wish to engage threads created or other posts that are clearly not of any scientific nature, please do so until it is clear that person has no intention of presenting anything scientific to back their claims. Then, please ignore them completely if it becomes obvious they will just continue their agendas. Without the negative attention they seek, they'll soon move on to troll elsewhere.

Please do add to this proposal any other ideas you may have that will save this forum for the value of science we all would like to see. Thanks.

I think a possibly easier solution which might due the trick is to have 'tags'. A few people who have sufficient backgrounds in science and who contribute to the science forum (I am not advocating myself, by the way) could have the ability to tag threads as pertaining to different areas of science, or pseudoscience. Those tags would be visible under the thread title, giving us the ability to see which threads are actual science threads right away.

That's a good idea, I wonder if that option is available in the forum software. I noticed the software here is not very forgiving and has few options compared with other forums. I mean, there isn't even an edit button and the html has only 3 options, not to mention the character restriction.

I've never run a forum, but it does seem like DDO is running on some ancient technology. Hopefully adding in tags is possible.
Sosoconfused
Posts: 237
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7/7/2015 2:50:14 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 1:14:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
I've moderated Math, Physics, Astronomy and Cosmology forums in the past as some of you may have done yourselves. Usually, there are other forums such as Pseudoscience or Fringe Theory forums for those who wish to indulge themselves with that which is not science. And, if the crackpots, cranks, conspiracy theorists and other assorted nutjobs wind up pushing their agendas in the science forums, their threads are immediately moved to those other forums, allowing the science forums to flourish so that those who wish to learn things or discuss scientific theories can do so without the insanity.

I've requested for a Pseudoscience forum to be created, but the likeliness of that happening is probably zilch. So, that being said, we are relegated to dealing with the kooks and nutters who currently run amok here.

My proposal is that if you wish to engage threads created or other posts that are clearly not of any scientific nature, please do so until it is clear that person has no intention of presenting anything scientific to back their claims. Then, please ignore them completely if it becomes obvious they will just continue their agendas. Without the negative attention they seek, they'll soon move on to troll elsewhere.

Please do add to this proposal any other ideas you may have that will save this forum for the value of science we all would like to see. Thanks.

As others have said, I actually don't mind the loons. Sometimes it's nice to test science against pseudo science. Most of the time you're not really trying to convince the other party in a debate. Especially when it comes to the pseudoscience stuff. I feel like when you get to a point where they are only able to make assertions because you've demolished all their "evidence" you get to pat yourself on the back and call that a win. If nothing else, you got to test your scientific knowledge in a very unconventional way.
Saint_of_Me
Posts: 2,402
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7/7/2015 3:04:07 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 1:14:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
I've moderated Math, Physics, Astronomy and Cosmology forums in the past as some of you may have done yourselves. Usually, there are other forums such as Pseudoscience or Fringe Theory forums for those who wish to indulge themselves with that which is not science. And, if the crackpots, cranks, conspiracy theorists and other assorted nutjobs wind up pushing their agendas in the science forums, their threads are immediately moved to those other forums, allowing the science forums to flourish so that those who wish to learn things or discuss scientific theories can do so without the insanity.

I've requested for a Pseudoscience forum to be created, but the likeliness of that happening is probably zilch. So, that being said, we are relegated to dealing with the kooks and nutters who currently run amok here.

My proposal is that if you wish to engage threads created or other posts that are clearly not of any scientific nature, please do so until it is clear that person has no intention of presenting anything scientific to back their claims. Then, please ignore them completely if it becomes obvious they will just continue their agendas. Without the negative attention they seek, they'll soon move on to troll elsewhere.

Please do add to this proposal any other ideas you may have that will save this forum for the value of science we all would like to see. Thanks.

I, for one, vote against this proposal. The Science Thread is fine the way it is. The bigger problem lies with some of the members here who think they are the final word of what actually constitutes science. I believe we will let the mods decide that.

Too, last I checked, the very term "psuedo-science" had the word "science" in it. Thus it is merely a sub-genre. Like, say, "Philosophy" is a sub-genre or the Humanties.

Hope this helps.

Thanks.
Science Flies Us to the Moon. Religion Flies us Into Skyscrapers.
Saint_of_Me
Posts: 2,402
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7/7/2015 3:09:36 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 1:33:56 PM, UndeniableReality wrote:
At 7/7/2015 1:14:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
I've moderated Math, Physics, Astronomy and Cosmology forums in the past as some of you may have done yourselves. Usually, there are other forums such as Pseudoscience or Fringe Theory forums for those who wish to indulge themselves with that which is not science. And, if the crackpots, cranks, conspiracy theorists and other assorted nutjobs wind up pushing their agendas in the science forums, their threads are immediately moved to those other forums, allowing the science forums to flourish so that those who wish to learn things or discuss scientific theories can do so without the insanity.

I've requested for a Pseudoscience forum to be created, but the likeliness of that happening is probably zilch. So, that being said, we are relegated to dealing with the kooks and nutters who currently run amok here.

My proposal is that if you wish to engage threads created or other posts that are clearly not of any scientific nature, please do so until it is clear that person has no intention of presenting anything scientific to back their claims. Then, please ignore them completely if it becomes obvious they will just continue their agendas. Without the negative attention they seek, they'll soon move on to troll elsewhere.

Please do add to this proposal any other ideas you may have that will save this forum for the value of science we all would like to see. Thanks.

I think a possibly easier solution which might due the trick is to have 'tags'. A few people who have sufficient backgrounds in science and who contribute to the science forum (I am not advocating myself, by the way) could have the ability to tag threads as pertaining to different areas of science, or pseudoscience. Those tags would be visible under the thread title, giving us the ability to see which threads are actual science threads right away.

I think this is a Fine idea! Much better than Ms. JeRusse's.

Good thinking, mate!
Science Flies Us to the Moon. Religion Flies us Into Skyscrapers.
Saint_of_Me
Posts: 2,402
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7/7/2015 3:11:30 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 1:24:56 PM, Ramshutu wrote:
At 7/7/2015 1:14:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
I've moderated Math, Physics, Astronomy and Cosmology forums in the past as some of you may have done yourselves. Usually, there are other forums such as Pseudoscience or Fringe Theory forums for those who wish to indulge themselves with that which is not science. And, if the crackpots, cranks, conspiracy theorists and other assorted nutjobs wind up pushing their agendas in the science forums, their threads are immediately moved to those other forums, allowing the science forums to flourish so that those who wish to learn things or discuss scientific theories can do so without the insanity.

I've requested for a Pseudoscience forum to be created, but the likeliness of that happening is probably zilch. So, that being said, we are relegated to dealing with the kooks and nutters who currently run amok here.

My proposal is that if you wish to engage threads created or other posts that are clearly not of any scientific nature, please do so until it is clear that person has no intention of presenting anything scientific to back their claims. Then, please ignore them completely if it becomes obvious they will just continue their agendas. Without the negative attention they seek, they'll soon move on to troll elsewhere.?

Please do add to this proposal any other ideas you may have that will save this forum for the value of science we all would like to see. Thanks.

Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.

While I understand your point, the only thing I think this would acheive is to rename the forum we have here already to "Pseudo-science", and create another forum with maybe 4 posts in it that no one looks at.

To be honest, if I wanted to debate the finer points of scientific theory, I'd go onto a dedicated science forum; the whole point I'm here is all the lunatics, idiots, cranks and crackpots. Shooting fish in a barrell is pretty cathartic.

Excellent idea, my friend. This is far more open-minded and fair than the OP. Which is basically just a rant saying "I don't like some of the posts on the science forum so they should be posted elsewhere, as I am under the false assumption that I am like a Mod around here."

LOL
Science Flies Us to the Moon. Religion Flies us Into Skyscrapers.
Saint_of_Me
Posts: 2,402
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7/7/2015 3:16:30 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 2:41:14 PM, UndeniableReality wrote:
At 7/7/2015 2:34:08 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/7/2015 1:33:56 PM, UndeniableReality wrote:
At 7/7/2015 1:14:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
I've moderated Math, Physics, Astronomy and Cosmology forums in the past as some of you may have done yourselves. Usually, there are other forums such as Pseudoscience or Fringe Theory forums for those who wish to indulge themselves with that which is not science. And, if the crackpots, cranks, conspiracy theorists and other assorted nutjobs wind up pushing their agendas in the science forums, their threads are immediately moved to those other forums, allowing the science forums to flourish so that those who wish to learn things or discuss scientific theories can do so without the insanity.

I've requested for a Pseudoscience forum to be created, but the likeliness of that happening is probably zilch. So, that being said, we are relegated to dealing with the kooks and nutters who currently run amok here.

My proposal is that if you wish to engage threads created or other posts that are clearly not of any scientific nature, please do so until it is clear that person has no intention of presenting anything scientific to back their claims. Then, please ignore them completely if it becomes obvious they will just continue their agendas. Without the negative attention they seek, they'll soon move on to troll elsewhere.

Please do add to this proposal any other ideas you may have that will save this forum for the value of science we all would like to see. Thanks.

I think a possibly easier solution which might due the trick is to have 'tags'. A few people who have sufficient backgrounds in science and who contribute to the science forum (I am not advocating myself, by the way) could have the ability to tag threads as pertaining to different areas of science, or pseudoscience. Those tags would be visible under the thread title, giving us the ability to see which threads are actual science threads right away.

That's a good idea, I wonder if that option is available in the forum software. I noticed the software here is not very forgiving and has few options compared with other forums. I mean, there isn't even an edit button and the html has only 3 options, not to mention the character restriction.

I've never run a forum, but it does seem like DDO is running on some ancient technology. Hopefully adding in tags is possible.

Well, perhaps not exactly "ancient" technology, but decidedly lacking in some useful user options, or "tools."

As I stated in my previous post, I feel your "tag" idea is a splendid one. I would also like to see--Please!--an "edit" button so we could, well, edit a post after it is up. Rather than having to create an entire new post in order to clarify a mistake or typo. I have been on other Science forums where members have an "edit" option on a posted thread for 1 hour.

Of course, I realize that it would be fair for somebody to respond to this proposal by saying, "Maybe you should just proof-read your post better and then use the "make changes" option before posting. That is a fair point.

But I STILL would love to see an edit button! LOL
Science Flies Us to the Moon. Religion Flies us Into Skyscrapers.
Saint_of_Me
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7/7/2015 3:21:53 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 1:14:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
I've moderated Math, Physics, Astronomy and Cosmology forums in the past as some of you may have done yourselves. Usually, there are other forums such as Pseudoscience or Fringe Theory forums for those who wish to indulge themselves with that which is not science. And, if the crackpots, cranks, conspiracy theorists and other assorted nutjobs wind up pushing their agendas in the science forums, their threads are immediately moved to those other forums, allowing the science forums to flourish so that those who wish to learn things or discuss scientific theories can do so without the insanity.

I've requested for a Pseudoscience forum to be created, but the likeliness of that happening is probably zilch. So, that being said, we are relegated to dealing with the kooks and nutters who currently run amok here.

My proposal is that if you wish to engage threads created or other posts that are clearly not of any scientific nature, please do so until it is clear that person has no intention of presenting anything scientific to back their claims. Then, please ignore them completely if it becomes obvious they will just continue their agendas. Without the negative attention they seek, they'll soon move on to troll elsewhere.

Please do add to this proposal any other ideas you may have that will save this forum for the value of science we all would like to see. Thanks.

Yeah, as I said in my OP, I am against the idea and will vote appropriately if it comes to that. Also...go to the "Science Forum" main page right now. Where all the threads are listed. On that 1st page, it sure looks to be sufficiently science-based to me. Anybody looking at the list would know the Forum it was without looking at the Title.

So, now that we agree on that, the only point you could have remaining is that you do not like the "content" of some of the posts within that Forum. but this amounts to sheer personal opinion; to a plea for censorship. Which is not your place.

Further, somebody had an idea about those who think our Science Forum to be lacking to simply surf to another Forum. As I used to say to people who would denigrate a town or city I was living in, which I liked..."There are plenty of roads leading out of town, amigo."

Hope this helps.
Science Flies Us to the Moon. Religion Flies us Into Skyscrapers.
DanneJeRusse
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7/7/2015 4:01:19 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 3:04:07 PM, Saint_of_Me wrote:
At 7/7/2015 1:14:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
I've moderated Math, Physics, Astronomy and Cosmology forums in the past as some of you may have done yourselves. Usually, there are other forums such as Pseudoscience or Fringe Theory forums for those who wish to indulge themselves with that which is not science. And, if the crackpots, cranks, conspiracy theorists and other assorted nutjobs wind up pushing their agendas in the science forums, their threads are immediately moved to those other forums, allowing the science forums to flourish so that those who wish to learn things or discuss scientific theories can do so without the insanity.

I've requested for a Pseudoscience forum to be created, but the likeliness of that happening is probably zilch. So, that being said, we are relegated to dealing with the kooks and nutters who currently run amok here.

My proposal is that if you wish to engage threads created or other posts that are clearly not of any scientific nature, please do so until it is clear that person has no intention of presenting anything scientific to back their claims. Then, please ignore them completely if it becomes obvious they will just continue their agendas. Without the negative attention they seek, they'll soon move on to troll elsewhere.

Please do add to this proposal any other ideas you may have that will save this forum for the value of science we all would like to see. Thanks.

I, for one, vote against this proposal.

Of course, you're against it, you know you're the one of the nutters being referred.

The Science Thread is fine the way it is. The bigger problem lies with some of the members here who think they are the final word of what actually constitutes science

That would be you.

. I believe we will let the mods decide that.

Too, last I checked, the very term "psuedo-science" had the word "science" in it. Thus it is merely a sub-genre. Like, say, "Philosophy" is a sub-genre or the Humanties.

LOL. "Pseudo" means sham, dummy. Hilarious.

Hope this helps.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
DanneJeRusse
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7/7/2015 4:07:50 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 3:21:53 PM, Saint_of_Me wrote:
At 7/7/2015 1:14:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
I've moderated Math, Physics, Astronomy and Cosmology forums in the past as some of you may have done yourselves. Usually, there are other forums such as Pseudoscience or Fringe Theory forums for those who wish to indulge themselves with that which is not science. And, if the crackpots, cranks, conspiracy theorists and other assorted nutjobs wind up pushing their agendas in the science forums, their threads are immediately moved to those other forums, allowing the science forums to flourish so that those who wish to learn things or discuss scientific theories can do so without the insanity.

I've requested for a Pseudoscience forum to be created, but the likeliness of that happening is probably zilch. So, that being said, we are relegated to dealing with the kooks and nutters who currently run amok here.

My proposal is that if you wish to engage threads created or other posts that are clearly not of any scientific nature, please do so until it is clear that person has no intention of presenting anything scientific to back their claims. Then, please ignore them completely if it becomes obvious they will just continue their agendas. Without the negative attention they seek, they'll soon move on to troll elsewhere.

Please do add to this proposal any other ideas you may have that will save this forum for the value of science we all would like to see. Thanks.

Yeah, as I said in my OP, I am against the idea and will vote appropriately if it comes to that. Also...go to the "Science Forum" main page right now. Where all the threads are listed. On that 1st page, it sure looks to be sufficiently science-based to me. Anybody looking at the list would know the Forum it was without looking at the Title.

Perhaps, to a nutter like yourself.

So, now that we agree on that

LOL. Sorry, your nonsense is not very agreeable.

, the only point you could have remaining is that you do not like the "content" of some of the posts within that Forum. but this amounts to sheer personal opinion; to a plea for censorship. Which is not your place.

Your lack of reading comprehension skills is showing again.

Further, somebody had an idea about those who think our Science Forum to be lacking to simply surf to another Forum. As I used to say to people who would denigrate a town or city I was living in, which I liked..."There are plenty of roads leading out of town, amigo."

In other words, if we don't like the woo you peddle in the SCIENCE forum, we should be the ones to leave.

Hope this helps.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
Saint_of_Me
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7/7/2015 4:18:17 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 4:07:50 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/7/2015 3:21:53 PM, Saint_of_Me wrote:
At 7/7/2015 1:14:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
I've moderated Math, Physics, Astronomy and Cosmology forums in the past as some of you may have done yourselves. Usually, there are other forums such as Pseudoscience or Fringe Theory forums for those who wish to indulge themselves with that which is not science. And, if the crackpots, cranks, conspiracy theorists and other assorted nutjobs wind up pushing their agendas in the science forums, their threads are immediately moved to those other forums, allowing the science forums to flourish so that those who wish to learn things or discuss scientific theories can do so without the insanity.

I've requested for a Pseudoscience forum to be created, but the likeliness of that happening is probably zilch. So, that being said, we are relegated to dealing with the kooks and nutters who currently run amok here.

My proposal is that if you wish to engage threads created or other posts that are clearly not of any scientific nature, please do so until it is clear that person has no intention of presenting anything scientific to back their claims. Then, please ignore them completely if it becomes obvious they will just continue their agendas. Without the negative attention they seek, they'll soon move on to troll elsewhere.

Please do add to this proposal any other ideas you may have that will save this forum for the value of science we all would like to see. Thanks.

Yeah, as I said in my OP, I am against the idea and will vote appropriately if it comes to that. Also...go to the "Science Forum" main page right now. Where all the threads are listed. On that 1st page, it sure looks to be sufficiently science-based to me. Anybody looking at the list would know the Forum it was without looking at the Title.

Perhaps, to a nutter like yourself.

So, now that we agree on that

LOL. Sorry, your nonsense is not very agreeable.

, the only point you could have remaining is that you do not like the "content" of some of the posts within that Forum. but this amounts to sheer personal opinion; to a plea for censorship. Which is not your place.

Your lack of reading comprehension skills is showing again.

Further, somebody had an idea about those who think our Science Forum to be lacking to simply surf to another Forum. As I used to say to people who would denigrate a town or city I was living in, which I liked..."There are plenty of roads leading out of town, amigo."

In other words, if we don't like the woo you peddle in the SCIENCE forum, we should be the ones to leave.

Hope this helps.

Plenty of road, amiga. Plenty o' roads.

You are a cowardly hypocrite. You whine like a little girl with a skinned knee about people posting stuff you do not like. About the theists coming over here and arguing Creation. (Which, as I proved to you in the Abio-Gen thread, IS science-thread worthy.)

But then you trot your girly little hypocritical asss over to Religion and unbidden, engage in ad hominem attacks on Thread authors. Calling them ignorant while ignoring the Thread topic. This is in NO way, shape or form any different--well, actually it is, it is WORSE--than what you accuse guys like BOHICA doing on the Science thread.

Like a little spoiled girl, you want it both ways. "Do what I say, not as I do."

So when you claim to embrace logic and objectivity you are actually proving that you are follow it only when it suits you.

Do this: use your Empirical Method is dissecting my claim here. If you do not indeed engage in hypocritical and self-serving tactics on DDO.

See what ya come up with then, Poindexter.
Science Flies Us to the Moon. Religion Flies us Into Skyscrapers.
DanneJeRusse
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7/7/2015 4:55:41 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 4:18:17 PM, Saint_of_Me wrote:
At 7/7/2015 4:07:50 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/7/2015 3:21:53 PM, Saint_of_Me wrote:
At 7/7/2015 1:14:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
I've moderated Math, Physics, Astronomy and Cosmology forums in the past as some of you may have done yourselves. Usually, there are other forums such as Pseudoscience or Fringe Theory forums for those who wish to indulge themselves with that which is not science. And, if the crackpots, cranks, conspiracy theorists and other assorted nutjobs wind up pushing their agendas in the science forums, their threads are immediately moved to those other forums, allowing the science forums to flourish so that those who wish to learn things or discuss scientific theories can do so without the insanity.

I've requested for a Pseudoscience forum to be created, but the likeliness of that happening is probably zilch. So, that being said, we are relegated to dealing with the kooks and nutters who currently run amok here.

My proposal is that if you wish to engage threads created or other posts that are clearly not of any scientific nature, please do so until it is clear that person has no intention of presenting anything scientific to back their claims. Then, please ignore them completely if it becomes obvious they will just continue their agendas. Without the negative attention they seek, they'll soon move on to troll elsewhere.

Please do add to this proposal any other ideas you may have that will save this forum for the value of science we all would like to see. Thanks.

Yeah, as I said in my OP, I am against the idea and will vote appropriately if it comes to that. Also...go to the "Science Forum" main page right now. Where all the threads are listed. On that 1st page, it sure looks to be sufficiently science-based to me. Anybody looking at the list would know the Forum it was without looking at the Title.

Perhaps, to a nutter like yourself.

So, now that we agree on that

LOL. Sorry, your nonsense is not very agreeable.

, the only point you could have remaining is that you do not like the "content" of some of the posts within that Forum. but this amounts to sheer personal opinion; to a plea for censorship. Which is not your place.

Your lack of reading comprehension skills is showing again.

Further, somebody had an idea about those who think our Science Forum to be lacking to simply surf to another Forum. As I used to say to people who would denigrate a town or city I was living in, which I liked..."There are plenty of roads leading out of town, amigo."

In other words, if we don't like the woo you peddle in the SCIENCE forum, we should be the ones to leave.

Hope this helps.

Plenty of road, amiga. Plenty o' roads.

You are a cowardly hypocrite. You whine like a little girl with a skinned knee about people posting stuff you do not like. About the theists coming over here and arguing Creation. (Which, as I proved to you in the Abio-Gen thread, IS science-thread worthy.)

But then you trot your girly little hypocritical asss over to Religion and unbidden, engage in ad hominem attacks on Thread authors. Calling them ignorant while ignoring the Thread topic. This is in NO way, shape or form any different--well, actually it is, it is WORSE--than what you accuse guys like BOHICA doing on the Science thread.

Like a little spoiled girl, you want it both ways. "Do what I say, not as I do."

So when you claim to embrace logic and objectivity you are actually proving that you are follow it only when it suits you.

Do this: use your Empirical Method is dissecting my claim here. If you do not indeed engage in hypocritical and self-serving tactics on DDO.

See what ya come up with then, Poindexter.

Amazing, just when you show how bad your reading comprehension skills are, you turn around and reach a new low. Do you even understand what we're talking about here? Do you have a clue?
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
RuvDraba
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7/7/2015 5:33:28 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 1:14:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
My proposal is that if you wish to engage threads created or other posts that are clearly not of any scientific nature, please do so until it is clear that person has no intention of presenting anything scientific to back their claims. Then, please ignore them completely if it becomes obvious they will just continue their agendas.

I agree that many regular pseudoscience posters have no interest in science, Danne. They're pursuing ideology without accountability, which ought to be against the rules in any scientific forum.

However, I think non-scientific conjectures themselves can be very useful. For example, how can we be sure that astrology is false? How can we be certain that all the earth's species -- including the billions of extinct species of which we've never seen even one live specimen -- had the same common ancestor? How can we be sure that the universe is not infinite -- or that it is? How can we know whether the universe is unique? How can we be certain that there is no action by metaphysical agencies?

These questions target fundamental epistemological ideas, and often it's the people who don't believe the science they read (or don't read science at all), who are best at asking them.

So while I'd also like to see more discussions of emerging science and science history, I think the real problem with pseudoscience is how it's discussed here. I've been doing this myself privately for a while now, but there ought to be a point at which members say 'If you're not going to hold your views accountable in a Science forum, then they don't deserve attention.'

I had that very conversation with an offending member earlier this week: [http://www.debate.org...] and while I don't wish to single any member out, I commend the principle at least, to the forum.
UndeniableReality
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7/7/2015 6:06:02 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 3:16:30 PM, Saint_of_Me wrote:
At 7/7/2015 2:41:14 PM, UndeniableReality wrote:
At 7/7/2015 2:34:08 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/7/2015 1:33:56 PM, UndeniableReality wrote:
At 7/7/2015 1:14:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
I've moderated Math, Physics, Astronomy and Cosmology forums in the past as some of you may have done yourselves. Usually, there are other forums such as Pseudoscience or Fringe Theory forums for those who wish to indulge themselves with that which is not science. And, if the crackpots, cranks, conspiracy theorists and other assorted nutjobs wind up pushing their agendas in the science forums, their threads are immediately moved to those other forums, allowing the science forums to flourish so that those who wish to learn things or discuss scientific theories can do so without the insanity.

I've requested for a Pseudoscience forum to be created, but the likeliness of that happening is probably zilch. So, that being said, we are relegated to dealing with the kooks and nutters who currently run amok here.

My proposal is that if you wish to engage threads created or other posts that are clearly not of any scientific nature, please do so until it is clear that person has no intention of presenting anything scientific to back their claims. Then, please ignore them completely if it becomes obvious they will just continue their agendas. Without the negative attention they seek, they'll soon move on to troll elsewhere.

Please do add to this proposal any other ideas you may have that will save this forum for the value of science we all would like to see. Thanks.

I think a possibly easier solution which might due the trick is to have 'tags'. A few people who have sufficient backgrounds in science and who contribute to the science forum (I am not advocating myself, by the way) could have the ability to tag threads as pertaining to different areas of science, or pseudoscience. Those tags would be visible under the thread title, giving us the ability to see which threads are actual science threads right away.

That's a good idea, I wonder if that option is available in the forum software. I noticed the software here is not very forgiving and has few options compared with other forums. I mean, there isn't even an edit button and the html has only 3 options, not to mention the character restriction.

I've never run a forum, but it does seem like DDO is running on some ancient technology. Hopefully adding in tags is possible.

Well, perhaps not exactly "ancient" technology, but decidedly lacking in some useful user options, or "tools."

As I stated in my previous post, I feel your "tag" idea is a splendid one. I would also like to see--Please!--an "edit" button so we could, well, edit a post after it is up. Rather than having to create an entire new post in order to clarify a mistake or typo. I have been on other Science forums where members have an "edit" option on a posted thread for 1 hour.

Of course, I realize that it would be fair for somebody to respond to this proposal by saying, "Maybe you should just proof-read your post better and then use the "make changes" option before posting. That is a fair point.

But I STILL would love to see an edit button! LOL

I think the issue with an edit button is that someone can go back and change an argument or something they said and make it seem as if they person responding to them is incorrect.

I've heard some people say that DDO is based on something that doesn't really allow for a lot of these options, but hopefully that's not the case. I just don't know if anyone is willing to put in the time right now.
DanneJeRusse
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7/7/2015 7:08:10 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 5:33:28 PM, RuvDraba wrote:
At 7/7/2015 1:14:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
My proposal is that if you wish to engage threads created or other posts that are clearly not of any scientific nature, please do so until it is clear that person has no intention of presenting anything scientific to back their claims. Then, please ignore them completely if it becomes obvious they will just continue their agendas.

I agree that many regular pseudoscience posters have no interest in science, Danne. They're pursuing ideology without accountability, which ought to be against the rules in any scientific forum.

However, I think non-scientific conjectures themselves can be very useful. For example, how can we be sure that astrology is false? How can we be certain that all the earth's species -- including the billions of extinct species of which we've never seen even one live specimen -- had the same common ancestor? How can we be sure that the universe is not infinite -- or that it is? How can we know whether the universe is unique? How can we be certain that there is no action by metaphysical agencies?

These questions target fundamental epistemological ideas, and often it's the people who don't believe the science they read (or don't read science at all), who are best at asking them.

So while I'd also like to see more discussions of emerging science and science history, I think the real problem with pseudoscience is how it's discussed here. I've been doing this myself privately for a while now, but there ought to be a point at which members say 'If you're not going to hold your views accountable in a Science forum, then they don't deserve attention.'

I had that very conversation with an offending member earlier this week: [http://www.debate.org...] and while I don't wish to single any member out, I commend the principle at least, to the forum.

Thanks for the support Ruv, some good points there.

I think I might take the advice of my esteemed colleagues here who have pointed out to me not to be overly concerned by the content here and instead, look at it as a study in human nature to see what causes these folks to embrace pseudoscience and as you say, question the fundamental epistemological ideas.

I suspect that if DDO staff here are not concerned, then there's no reason for me to be, either.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
RuvDraba
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7/7/2015 8:06:09 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 7:08:10 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/7/2015 5:33:28 PM, RuvDraba wrote:
I think the real problem with pseudoscience is how it's discussed here. I've been doing this myself privately for a while now, but there ought to be a point at which members say 'If you're not going to hold your views accountable in a Science forum, then they don't deserve attention.'
I think I might take the advice of my esteemed colleagues here who have pointed out to me not to be overly concerned by the content here and instead, look at it as a study in human nature to see what causes these folks to embrace pseudoscience and as you say, question the fundamental epistemological ideas.

Science has four qualities that pseudoscientists either don't understand or else ignore:
1) It's meticulous about falsifiable evidence -- in the sense that Popper identified [https://en.wikipedia.org...];
2) It's highly-integrated: physics works with chemistry works with biology works with neuroscience works with psychology. You can't offer even a new conjecture in science without first reconciling it with all the ideas it connects to -- which is why so many conjectures (like Intelligent design and quantum woochanics) themselves aren't scientific;
3) It's transparent: meaning, that anyone can trace through how a result was arrived at; and finally
4) It's fully accountable for errors and changes: meaning that any changes have to be explained in terms of better information, more parsimony, and/or methodological error, and any methodological errors need to be learned from.

Pseudoscience always fails on one or more criteria, so it's always possible to point these failures out in a brief note. And it's also possible (and entirely appropriate) to explain existing scientific thought against the above criteria: how is evolution falsifiable? How does neuroscience marry with our experience of love? How can anyone make inferences about an incomplete fossil record? Does epigenetics invalidate evolution?

Those are always great questions epistemologically and scientifically.

Not possible though, is to persuade the poster to acknowledge that these qualities matter. Like other ethical qualities, diligence, integrity, transparency and accountability can be explained and exemplified, but can't be enforced except (as the scientific community itself does) by ostracising those who fail to uphold it.

Since only a moderator can do the latter, I just limit my responses to posters who've demonstrated repeatedly that they don't really care -- unless I want to test an idea on them. :)
Skyangel
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7/10/2015 3:46:14 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 1:14:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
I've moderated Math, Physics, Astronomy and Cosmology forums in the past as some of you may have done yourselves. Usually, there are other forums such as Pseudoscience or Fringe Theory forums for those who wish to indulge themselves with that which is not science. And, if the crackpots, cranks, conspiracy theorists and other assorted nutjobs wind up pushing their agendas in the science forums, their threads are immediately moved to those other forums, allowing the science forums to flourish so that those who wish to learn things or discuss scientific theories can do so without the insanity.

I've requested for a Pseudoscience forum to be created, but the likeliness of that happening is probably zilch. So, that being said, we are relegated to dealing with the kooks and nutters who currently run amok here.

My proposal is that if you wish to engage threads created or other posts that are clearly not of any scientific nature, please do so until it is clear that person has no intention of presenting anything scientific to back their claims. Then, please ignore them completely if it becomes obvious they will just continue their agendas. Without the negative attention they seek, they'll soon move on to troll elsewhere.

Please do add to this proposal any other ideas you may have that will save this forum for the value of science we all would like to see. Thanks.

Take your own advice and ignore anything you don't agree with instead of bumping up threads with all your irrelevant words and ad homs.
Skyangel
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7/10/2015 3:52:13 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 3:09:36 PM, Saint_of_Me wrote:
At 7/7/2015 1:33:56 PM, UndeniableReality wrote:
At 7/7/2015 1:14:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
I've moderated Math, Physics, Astronomy and Cosmology forums in the past as some of you may have done yourselves. Usually, there are other forums such as Pseudoscience or Fringe Theory forums for those who wish to indulge themselves with that which is not science. And, if the crackpots, cranks, conspiracy theorists and other assorted nutjobs wind up pushing their agendas in the science forums, their threads are immediately moved to those other forums, allowing the science forums to flourish so that those who wish to learn things or discuss scientific theories can do so without the insanity.

I've requested for a Pseudoscience forum to be created, but the likeliness of that happening is probably zilch. So, that being said, we are relegated to dealing with the kooks and nutters who currently run amok here.

My proposal is that if you wish to engage threads created or other posts that are clearly not of any scientific nature, please do so until it is clear that person has no intention of presenting anything scientific to back their claims. Then, please ignore them completely if it becomes obvious they will just continue their agendas. Without the negative attention they seek, they'll soon move on to troll elsewhere.

Please do add to this proposal any other ideas you may have that will save this forum for the value of science we all would like to see. Thanks.

I think a possibly easier solution which might due the trick is to have 'tags'. A few people who have sufficient backgrounds in science and who contribute to the science forum (I am not advocating myself, by the way) could have the ability to tag threads as pertaining to different areas of science, or pseudoscience. Those tags would be visible under the thread title, giving us the ability to see which threads are actual science threads right away.

I think this is a Fine idea! Much better than Ms. JeRusse's.

Good thinking, mate!

If Ms JeRusse had her way there would be no one left on any forums. She seems to think everyones opinion except hers is irrelevant.

Why not create a forum just for her and all those who agree with her and they can simply avoid all other forums and become their own exclusive clique who believe the rest of the world is irrelevant.