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Dark matter, dark energy, dark flow

Rob1Billion
Posts: 1,338
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9/17/2010 2:17:52 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
So scientists have come up with yet another "dark" category called dark flow, which is an attempt to explain why distant galaxies seem to be traveling millions of miles an hour in certain directions without any explanation. They are saying the movement might even be an effect caused from outside our observable universe, i.e., other universes are causing an effect on ours and causing this movement. Hope I'm not screwing up that explanation... Google it and tell me what you think!
Master P is the end result of capitalism.
belle
Posts: 4,113
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9/17/2010 9:18:33 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
the explanation i read is that its not another universe effecting ours but rather a part of our universe that used to be much closer to us but was drawn out of our observable portion of the universe by the inflation (when the universe increased in size by a factor of 10^43)... so its thought to be a historical remnant of a state of affairs that we can no longer observe. pretty hard to distinguish between the two experimentally though :P
evidently i only come to ddo to avoid doing homework...
Rob1Billion
Posts: 1,338
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9/18/2010 1:28:33 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
sagan: "extraordinary ideas require extraordinary evidence." do you think the dark theories balance their extraordinary natures out according to sagan?
Master P is the end result of capitalism.
Ramshutu
Posts: 4,063
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9/18/2010 3:03:54 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/18/2010 1:28:33 AM, Rob1Billion wrote:
sagan: "extraordinary ideas require extraordinary evidence." do you think the dark theories balance their extraordinary natures out according to sagan?

Dark energy; Dark matter and dark flow is a placeholder explanation until we can actually work out wtf is going on. This is not to say that they are completely invalid; just that there is something that causes a particular effect that we call dark X, without much idea what dark X is. It is very important, however, noticing the effects of dark energy and matter, that it is unwise to understimate the power of the dark force that results.
Rob1Billion
Posts: 1,338
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9/18/2010 11:58:58 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
...and we will probably just find out the truth is not as exciting as these star wars titles suggest... e.g., pulsars lgm-001
Master P is the end result of capitalism.
tBoonePickens
Posts: 3,266
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10/2/2010 2:29:48 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/18/2010 3:03:54 AM, Ramshutu wrote:
At 9/18/2010 1:28:33 AM, Rob1Billion wrote:
sagan: "extraordinary ideas require extraordinary evidence." do you think the dark theories balance their extraordinary natures out according to sagan?

Dark energy; Dark matter and dark flow is a placeholder explanation until we can actually work out wtf is going on. This is not to say that they are completely invalid; just that there is something that causes a particular effect that we call dark X, without much idea what dark X is. It is very important, however, noticing the effects of dark energy and matter, that it is unwise to understimate the power of the dark force that results.

Yep. String theories are like dark-x as well, BTW.
WOS
: At 10/3/2012 4:28:52 AM, Wallstreetatheist wrote:
: Without nothing existing, you couldn't have something.
jharry
Posts: 4,984
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10/6/2010 6:58:29 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
This dark trinity. It is believed to be something, we see something happening but can't scientifically observe it?
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen
Kleptin
Posts: 5,095
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10/6/2010 7:04:48 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/6/2010 6:58:29 PM, jharry wrote:
This dark trinity. It is believed to be something, we see something happening but can't scientifically observe it?

We can scientifically observe the happening, we can't scientifically observe the cause.
: At 5/2/2010 2:43:54 PM, innomen wrote:
It isn't about finding a theory, philosophy or doctrine and thinking it's the answer, but a practical application of one's experiences that is the answer.

: At 10/28/2010 2:40:07 PM, jharry wrote: I have already been given the greatest Gift that anyone could ever hope for [Life], I would consider myself selfish if I expected anything more.
jharry
Posts: 4,984
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10/6/2010 7:08:38 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/6/2010 7:04:48 PM, Kleptin wrote:
At 10/6/2010 6:58:29 PM, jharry wrote:
This dark trinity. It is believed to be something, we see something happening but can't scientifically observe it?

We can scientifically observe the happening, we can't scientifically observe the cause.

We have no way to test, or observe why or how it is happening?
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen
tBoonePickens
Posts: 3,266
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10/13/2010 9:23:05 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/6/2010 7:08:38 PM, jharry wrote:
At 10/6/2010 7:04:48 PM, Kleptin wrote:
At 10/6/2010 6:58:29 PM, jharry wrote:
This dark trinity. It is believed to be something, we see something happening but can't scientifically observe it?

We can scientifically observe the happening, we can't scientifically observe the cause.

We have no way to test, or observe why or how it is happening?

That is correct. It's like missing links to a puzzle.
WOS
: At 10/3/2012 4:28:52 AM, Wallstreetatheist wrote:
: Without nothing existing, you couldn't have something.
Kleptin
Posts: 5,095
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10/13/2010 10:28:02 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/13/2010 9:23:05 AM, tBoonePickens wrote:
At 10/6/2010 7:08:38 PM, jharry wrote:
At 10/6/2010 7:04:48 PM, Kleptin wrote:
At 10/6/2010 6:58:29 PM, jharry wrote:
This dark trinity. It is believed to be something, we see something happening but can't scientifically observe it?

We can scientifically observe the happening, we can't scientifically observe the cause.

We have no way to test, or observe why or how it is happening?

That is correct. It's like missing links to a puzzle.

Or better yet, it's like a 1000 piece puzzle where you have the borders filled in first but you don't have the pieces in the middle yet.
: At 5/2/2010 2:43:54 PM, innomen wrote:
It isn't about finding a theory, philosophy or doctrine and thinking it's the answer, but a practical application of one's experiences that is the answer.

: At 10/28/2010 2:40:07 PM, jharry wrote: I have already been given the greatest Gift that anyone could ever hope for [Life], I would consider myself selfish if I expected anything more.
tBoonePickens
Posts: 3,266
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10/13/2010 10:35:42 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/13/2010 10:28:02 AM, Kleptin wrote:
At 10/13/2010 9:23:05 AM, tBoonePickens wrote:
At 10/6/2010 7:08:38 PM, jharry wrote:
At 10/6/2010 7:04:48 PM, Kleptin wrote:
At 10/6/2010 6:58:29 PM, jharry wrote:
This dark trinity. It is believed to be something, we see something happening but can't scientifically observe it?

We can scientifically observe the happening, we can't scientifically observe the cause.

We have no way to test, or observe why or how it is happening?

That is correct. It's like missing links to a puzzle.

Or better yet, it's like a 1000 piece puzzle where you have the borders filled in first but you don't have the pieces in the middle yet.

Yeah. Apparently the "dark-stuffs" are speculated to constitute most of the observable Universe! The more we know, the more we know we don't know!
WOS
: At 10/3/2012 4:28:52 AM, Wallstreetatheist wrote:
: Without nothing existing, you couldn't have something.
jharry
Posts: 4,984
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10/13/2010 12:22:21 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
So in this case most scientists admit they don't know and can't know because it is impossible to know for sure, at this time?
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen
tBoonePickens
Posts: 3,266
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10/13/2010 12:36:47 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/13/2010 12:22:21 PM, jharry wrote:
So in this case most scientists admit they don't know and can't know because it is impossible to know for sure, at this time?

I wouldn't go that far. I'd just say that we don't know for now. I wouldn't say that we can't know or that we can't know for now.
WOS
: At 10/3/2012 4:28:52 AM, Wallstreetatheist wrote:
: Without nothing existing, you couldn't have something.
jharry
Posts: 4,984
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10/13/2010 5:12:39 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/13/2010 12:36:47 PM, tBoonePickens wrote:
At 10/13/2010 12:22:21 PM, jharry wrote:
So in this case most scientists admit they don't know and can't know because it is impossible to know for sure, at this time?

I wouldn't go that far. I'd just say that we don't know for now. I wouldn't say that we can't know or that we can't know for now.

Well that kinda what I said, rather poorly but still. At this point in time we can't know, not to say that we will never know. But this doesn't seem to get the same attention as other "scientific" theories. Why?
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen
belle
Posts: 4,113
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10/13/2010 6:20:19 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/13/2010 5:12:39 PM, jharry wrote:
At 10/13/2010 12:36:47 PM, tBoonePickens wrote:
At 10/13/2010 12:22:21 PM, jharry wrote:
So in this case most scientists admit they don't know and can't know because it is impossible to know for sure, at this time?

I wouldn't go that far. I'd just say that we don't know for now. I wouldn't say that we can't know or that we can't know for now.

Well that kinda what I said, rather poorly but still. At this point in time we can't know, not to say that we will never know. But this doesn't seem to get the same attention as other "scientific" theories. Why?

because its not a theory. lol. its a statement- we don't know yet. we're working on it. the fact that science doesn't know something has no relevance to the things that have been discovered using the scientific method. and its really not interesting to say "eh, we dunno yet". its not like anyone is hiding it, its just not news. humans have been ignorant for millennia :P
evidently i only come to ddo to avoid doing homework...
tBoonePickens
Posts: 3,266
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10/14/2010 7:23:39 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/13/2010 6:20:19 PM, belle wrote:
At 10/13/2010 5:12:39 PM, jharry wrote:
At 10/13/2010 12:36:47 PM, tBoonePickens wrote:
At 10/13/2010 12:22:21 PM, jharry wrote:
So in this case most scientists admit they don't know and can't know because it is impossible to know for sure, at this time?

I wouldn't go that far. I'd just say that we don't know for now. I wouldn't say that we can't know or that we can't know for now.

Well that kinda what I said, rather poorly but still. At this point in time we can't know, not to say that we will never know. But this doesn't seem to get the same attention as other "scientific" theories. Why?

because its not a theory. lol. its a statement- we don't know yet. we're working on it. the fact that science doesn't know something has no relevance to the things that have been discovered using the scientific method. and its really not interesting to say "eh, we dunno yet". its not like anyone is hiding it, its just not news. humans have been ignorant for millennia :P

Belle is on the money, as usual. The only thing I would say is that I wouldn't use the phrase "we can't know." It almost seems as if you are trying to imply something, otherwise why wouldn't you use the standard phrase "we don't know"? If your wife asks you where her keys are and you don't know the answer, what would you reply: (1) I can't know or (2) I don't know? I think it's the latter.
WOS
: At 10/3/2012 4:28:52 AM, Wallstreetatheist wrote:
: Without nothing existing, you couldn't have something.