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Great article on quantum systems

slo1
Posts: 4,362
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1/27/2016 3:08:06 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
http://www.sciencedaily.com...

Quantum physics is a game of luck and randomness. Initially, the atoms in a cold atom cloud do not have a predetermined position. Much like a die whirling through the air, where the number is yet to be determined, the atoms are located at all possible positions at the same time. Only when they are measured, their positions are fixed. "We shine light on the atom cloud, which is then absorbed by the atoms," says Kaspar Sakmann. "The atoms are photographed, and this is what determines their position. The result is completely random."

There is, however, an important difference between quantum randomness and a game of dice: if different dice are thrown at the same time, they can be seen as independent from each other. Whether or not we roll a six with die number one does not influence the result of die number seven. The atoms in the atom cloud on the other hand are quantum physically connected. It does not make sense to analyse them individually, they are one big quantum object. Therefore, the result of every position measurement of any atom depends on the positions of all the other atoms in a mathematically complicated way.
slo1
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1/27/2016 3:09:46 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
Just thought it was a great article that describes how groups of small things act very different than how most of us classically think.
Dirty.Harry
Posts: 1,586
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1/27/2016 3:51:26 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/27/2016 3:09:46 AM, slo1 wrote:
Just thought it was a great article that describes how groups of small things act very different than how most of us classically think.

I'd like to strongly recommend listening to this lecture if you're interested in quantum mechanics, absolutely fascinating.

https://www.youtube.com...
Mhykiel
Posts: 5,987
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1/27/2016 4:00:53 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/27/2016 3:08:06 AM, slo1 wrote:
http://www.sciencedaily.com...


Quantum physics is a game of luck and randomness.

Games of luck still have rules that determine the outcome of the game. Randomness is the lack of pattern or predictability in events. If one adheres to a Bohmian interpretation over a Copenhagen one, the patterns appear equally random but the underlining principle is a pilot wave.

Initially, the atoms in a cold atom cloud do not have a predetermined position. Much like a die whirling through the air, where the number is yet to be determined, the atoms are located at all possible positions at the same time. Only when they are measured, their positions are fixed.

But the numbers on a die don't change position. the 1 will still be next to the 2 and opposite the 6. 6 will never touch one no matter how many times it spins in the air. The imprecision to measure the die while it is in the air is a problem with the tools running into the uncertainty principle.

"We shine light on the atom cloud, which is then absorbed by the atoms," says Kaspar Sakmann. "The atoms are photographed, and this is what determines their position. The result is completely random."

There is, however, an important difference between quantum randomness and a game of dice: if different dice are thrown at the same time, they can be seen as independent from each other. Whether or not we roll a six with die number one does not influence the result of die number seven. The atoms in the atom cloud on the other hand are quantum physically connected. It does not make sense to analyse them individually, they are one big quantum object. Therefore, the result of every position measurement of any atom depends on the positions of all the other atoms in a mathematically complicated way.

So the atoms are more like balls on the surface of a lake. Connected with each other. Whether a ball is at a peak is dependent whether the balls surrounding it are in a trough.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,648
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1/27/2016 5:17:07 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/27/2016 3:51:26 AM, Dirty.Harry wrote:
At 1/27/2016 3:09:46 AM, slo1 wrote:
Just thought it was a great article that describes how groups of small things act very different than how most of us classically think.

I'd like to strongly recommend listening to this lecture if you're interested in quantum mechanics, absolutely fascinating.

https://www.youtube.com...

Yes, and Feynman specifically talks about something relative to you, Harry, starting at 24:15.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
slo1
Posts: 4,362
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1/28/2016 1:03:41 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/27/2016 4:00:53 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 1/27/2016 3:08:06 AM, slo1 wrote:
http://www.sciencedaily.com...


Quantum physics is a game of luck and randomness.

Games of luck still have rules that determine the outcome of the game. Randomness is the lack of pattern or predictability in events. If one adheres to a Bohmian interpretation over a Copenhagen one, the patterns appear equally random but the underlining principle is a pilot wave.

It is a possibility, but hidden variable theories such as pilot wave haven't yet uncovered the "hidden variable" yet, so it is all speculative hypothesis. Pilot wave interpretation also can not explain or offer an explanation for non-locality, which is has to accept.

There were some cool analog experiments with droplets bouncing on a vibrating bed of oil I posted a couple years ago. It raised some interest in pilot wave, but nothing has progressed from there.

Initially, the atoms in a cold atom cloud do not have a predetermined position. Much like a die whirling through the air, where the number is yet to be determined, the atoms are located at all possible positions at the same time. Only when they are measured, their positions are fixed.

But the numbers on a die don't change position. the 1 will still be next to the 2 and opposite the 6. 6 will never touch one no matter how many times it spins in the air. The imprecision to measure the die while it is in the air is a problem with the tools running into the uncertainty principle.

"We shine light on the atom cloud, which is then absorbed by the atoms," says Kaspar Sakmann. "The atoms are photographed, and this is what determines their position. The result is completely random."

There is, however, an important difference between quantum randomness and a game of dice: if different dice are thrown at the same time, they can be seen as independent from each other. Whether or not we roll a six with die number one does not influence the result of die number seven. The atoms in the atom cloud on the other hand are quantum physically connected. It does not make sense to analyse them individually, they are one big quantum object. Therefore, the result of every position measurement of any atom depends on the positions of all the other atoms in a mathematically complicated way.

So the atoms are more like balls on the surface of a lake. Connected with each other. Whether a ball is at a peak is dependent whether the balls surrounding it are in a trough.
humm, I need to think about that analogy a bit more.
slo1
Posts: 4,362
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1/28/2016 1:04:38 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/27/2016 3:51:26 AM, Dirty.Harry wrote:
At 1/27/2016 3:09:46 AM, slo1 wrote:
Just thought it was a great article that describes how groups of small things act very different than how most of us classically think.

I'd like to strongly recommend listening to this lecture if you're interested in quantum mechanics, absolutely fascinating.

https://www.youtube.com...

I haven't seen that one yet. Will have to check it out.
Dirty.Harry
Posts: 1,586
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1/28/2016 3:59:19 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/27/2016 5:17:07 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 1/27/2016 3:51:26 AM, Dirty.Harry wrote:
At 1/27/2016 3:09:46 AM, slo1 wrote:
Just thought it was a great article that describes how groups of small things act very different than how most of us classically think.

I'd like to strongly recommend listening to this lecture if you're interested in quantum mechanics, absolutely fascinating.

https://www.youtube.com...

Yes, and Feynman specifically talks about something relative to you, Harry, starting at 24:15.

Like I'm gonna waste my time looking! dumbass.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,648
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1/28/2016 4:50:41 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/28/2016 3:59:19 AM, Dirty.Harry wrote:
At 1/27/2016 5:17:07 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 1/27/2016 3:51:26 AM, Dirty.Harry wrote:
At 1/27/2016 3:09:46 AM, slo1 wrote:
Just thought it was a great article that describes how groups of small things act very different than how most of us classically think.

I'd like to strongly recommend listening to this lecture if you're interested in quantum mechanics, absolutely fascinating.

https://www.youtube.com...

Yes, and Feynman specifically talks about something relative to you, Harry, starting at 24:15.

Like I'm gonna waste my time looking! dumbass.

Too bad, you could really learn something from that.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
Dirty.Harry
Posts: 1,586
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1/30/2016 7:47:28 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/28/2016 4:50:41 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 1/28/2016 3:59:19 AM, Dirty.Harry wrote:
At 1/27/2016 5:17:07 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 1/27/2016 3:51:26 AM, Dirty.Harry wrote:
At 1/27/2016 3:09:46 AM, slo1 wrote:
Just thought it was a great article that describes how groups of small things act very different than how most of us classically think.

I'd like to strongly recommend listening to this lecture if you're interested in quantum mechanics, absolutely fascinating.

https://www.youtube.com...

Yes, and Feynman specifically talks about something relative to you, Harry, starting at 24:15.

Like I'm gonna waste my time looking! dumbass.

Too bad, you could really learn something from that.

Don't assume that I'm as dumb as you are Dummel.

Harry.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,648
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1/30/2016 8:35:04 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/30/2016 7:47:28 PM, Dirty.Harry wrote:
At 1/28/2016 4:50:41 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 1/28/2016 3:59:19 AM, Dirty.Harry wrote:
At 1/27/2016 5:17:07 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 1/27/2016 3:51:26 AM, Dirty.Harry wrote:
At 1/27/2016 3:09:46 AM, slo1 wrote:
Just thought it was a great article that describes how groups of small things act very different than how most of us classically think.

I'd like to strongly recommend listening to this lecture if you're interested in quantum mechanics, absolutely fascinating.

https://www.youtube.com...

Yes, and Feynman specifically talks about something relative to you, Harry, starting at 24:15.

Like I'm gonna waste my time looking! dumbass.

Too bad, you could really learn something from that.

Don't assume that I'm as dumb as you are Dummel.

I need not assume that which you provide as ample evidence.

Harry.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth