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# Stupid question?

 Posts: 284 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 3/13/2016 6:42:38 PMPosted: 10 months agoOK. Here's a question. I'm guessing no one can answer this, but I'll ask anyway. If the big bang theory is true, it presents a problem in logic. If it did happen, where and when did it happen. Unless I'm mistaken, time and space did not exist before the universe. So it would have no when or where for it to happen. Would it?I would agree with you, but then we'd BOTH be wrong.
 Posts: 432 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 3/13/2016 6:52:20 PMPosted: 10 months agoYes.
 Posts: 5,987 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 3/13/2016 6:58:15 PMPosted: 10 months agoAt 3/13/2016 6:42:38 PM, LittleBallofHATE wrote:OK. Here's a question. I'm guessing no one can answer this, but I'll ask anyway. If the big bang theory is true, it presents a problem in logic. If it did happen, where and when did it happen. Unless I'm mistaken, time and space did not exist before the universe. So it would have no when or where for it to happen. Would it?The Big Bang theory only goes back to where the math still works. technically you can say the Big Bang theory states that at an early moment in the universe, where time is greater than 0, a universal and exponential inflation of space occurred.
 Posts: 284 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 3/13/2016 7:27:55 PMPosted: 10 months agoAt 3/13/2016 6:58:15 PM, Mhykiel wrote:At 3/13/2016 6:42:38 PM, LittleBallofHATE wrote:OK. Here's a question. I'm guessing no one can answer this, but I'll ask anyway. If the big bang theory is true, it presents a problem in logic. If it did happen, where and when did it happen. Unless I'm mistaken, time and space did not exist before the universe. So it would have no when or where for it to happen. Would it?The Big Bang theory only goes back to where the math still works. technically you can say the Big Bang theory states that at an early moment in the universe, where time is greater than 0, a universal and exponential inflation of space occurred.That still doesn't tell me where, when, or even why it happened.I would agree with you, but then we'd BOTH be wrong.
 Posts: 983 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 3/13/2016 8:14:16 PMPosted: 10 months agoAt 3/13/2016 7:27:55 PM, LittleBallofHATE wrote:At 3/13/2016 6:58:15 PM, Mhykiel wrote:At 3/13/2016 6:42:38 PM, LittleBallofHATE wrote:OK. Here's a question. I'm guessing no one can answer this, but I'll ask anyway. If the big bang theory is true, it presents a problem in logic. If it did happen, where and when did it happen. Unless I'm mistaken, time and space did not exist before the universe. So it would have no when or where for it to happen. Would it?The Big Bang theory only goes back to where the math still works. technically you can say the Big Bang theory states that at an early moment in the universe, where time is greater than 0, a universal and exponential inflation of space occurred.That still doesn't tell me where, when, or even why it happened. :"Look, it HAPPENED OK! It is stupid IMHO to ask what is beyond (where, when, why) the universe. The universe is it!" - Lawrence KraussNext question from the audience? Oh, and can someone throw this guy out of here, .. don't we have security in here? - ASU Auditorium Tempe AZ.There are a thousand hacking at the branches of evil to one who is striking at the root. - Henry David Thoreau
 Posts: 284 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 3/13/2016 8:16:20 PMPosted: 10 months agoAt 3/13/2016 8:14:16 PM, Evidence wrote:At 3/13/2016 7:27:55 PM, LittleBallofHATE wrote:At 3/13/2016 6:58:15 PM, Mhykiel wrote:At 3/13/2016 6:42:38 PM, LittleBallofHATE wrote:OK. Here's a question. I'm guessing no one can answer this, but I'll ask anyway. If the big bang theory is true, it presents a problem in logic. If it did happen, where and when did it happen. Unless I'm mistaken, time and space did not exist before the universe. So it would have no when or where for it to happen. Would it?The Big Bang theory only goes back to where the math still works. technically you can say the Big Bang theory states that at an early moment in the universe, where time is greater than 0, a universal and exponential inflation of space occurred.That still doesn't tell me where, when, or even why it happened. :"Look, it HAPPENED OK! It is stupid IMHO to ask what is beyond (where, when, why) the universe. The universe is it!" - Lawrence KraussNext question from the audience? Oh, and can someone throw this guy out of here, .. don't we have security in here? - ASU Auditorium Tempe AZ.Sounds like someone throwing a tantrum because he really doesn't have any answers.I would agree with you, but then we'd BOTH be wrong.
 Posts: 284 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 3/13/2016 8:19:14 PMPosted: 10 months agoAt 3/13/2016 8:16:20 PM, LittleBallofHATE wrote:At 3/13/2016 8:14:16 PM, Evidence wrote:At 3/13/2016 7:27:55 PM, LittleBallofHATE wrote:At 3/13/2016 6:58:15 PM, Mhykiel wrote:At 3/13/2016 6:42:38 PM, LittleBallofHATE wrote:OK. Here's a question. I'm guessing no one can answer this, but I'll ask anyway. If the big bang theory is true, it presents a problem in logic. If it did happen, where and when did it happen. Unless I'm mistaken, time and space did not exist before the universe. So it would have no when or where for it to happen. Would it?The Big Bang theory only goes back to where the math still works. technically you can say the Big Bang theory states that at an early moment in the universe, where time is greater than 0, a universal and exponential inflation of space occurred.That still doesn't tell me where, when, or even why it happened. :"Look, it HAPPENED OK! It is stupid IMHO to ask what is beyond (where, when, why) the universe. The universe is it!" - Lawrence KraussNext question from the audience? Oh, and can someone throw this guy out of here, .. don't we have security in here? - ASU Auditorium Tempe AZ.Sounds like someone throwing a tantrum because he really doesn't have any answers.Besides. The universe can't be "it". That would make it infinite. And as we all know, infinity does not exist in nature.I would agree with you, but then we'd BOTH be wrong.
 Posts: 5,987 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 3/13/2016 8:52:18 PMPosted: 10 months agoAt 3/13/2016 7:27:55 PM, LittleBallofHATE wrote:At 3/13/2016 6:58:15 PM, Mhykiel wrote:At 3/13/2016 6:42:38 PM, LittleBallofHATE wrote:OK. Here's a question. I'm guessing no one can answer this, but I'll ask anyway. If the big bang theory is true, it presents a problem in logic. If it did happen, where and when did it happen. Unless I'm mistaken, time and space did not exist before the universe. So it would have no when or where for it to happen. Would it?The Big Bang theory only goes back to where the math still works. technically you can say the Big Bang theory states that at an early moment in the universe, where time is greater than 0, a universal and exponential inflation of space occurred.That still doesn't tell me where, when, or even why it happened.Well where is the whole universe, when is :"at an early moment in the universe when time greater than 0, why: no it doesn't.
 Posts: 284 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 3/13/2016 9:14:25 PMPosted: 10 months agoAt 3/13/2016 8:52:18 PM, Mhykiel wrote:At 3/13/2016 7:27:55 PM, LittleBallofHATE wrote:At 3/13/2016 6:58:15 PM, Mhykiel wrote:At 3/13/2016 6:42:38 PM, LittleBallofHATE wrote:OK. Here's a question. I'm guessing no one can answer this, but I'll ask anyway. If the big bang theory is true, it presents a problem in logic. If it did happen, where and when did it happen. Unless I'm mistaken, time and space did not exist before the universe. So it would have no when or where for it to happen. Would it?The Big Bang theory only goes back to where the math still works. technically you can say the Big Bang theory states that at an early moment in the universe, where time is greater than 0, a universal and exponential inflation of space occurred.That still doesn't tell me where, when, or even why it happened.Well where is the whole universe, when is :"at an early moment in the universe when time greater than 0, why: no it doesn't.It sounds like you're saying that time was created at the same time the universe was, or slightly before. Is this correct? If so, it makes no sense at all, since time is part of the very fabric of the space time continuum. How can something create something that it owes its very existence too?I would agree with you, but then we'd BOTH be wrong.
 Posts: 9,991 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 3/13/2016 9:36:08 PMPosted: 10 months agoAt 3/13/2016 6:42:38 PM, LittleBallofHATE wrote:OK. Here's a question. I'm guessing no one can answer this, but I'll ask anyway. If the big bang theory is true, it presents a problem in logic. If it did happen, where and when did it happen. Unless I'm mistaken, time and space did not exist before the universe. So it would have no when or where for it to happen. Would it?Look. It is not going to satisfy you in any real way, but...Where? Everywhere.When? About 13.5byaAsking what happened before is logical, and obviously difficult. It is possible we will never have a good answer for this, but being dismissive of what we DO know is just being silly and argumentative. I can debate with religion, but I don't pretend to have no idea what they are talking about.
 Posts: 284 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 3/13/2016 9:53:39 PMPosted: 10 months agoAt 3/13/2016 9:36:08 PM, TBR wrote:At 3/13/2016 6:42:38 PM, LittleBallofHATE wrote:OK. Here's a question. I'm guessing no one can answer this, but I'll ask anyway. If the big bang theory is true, it presents a problem in logic. If it did happen, where and when did it happen. Unless I'm mistaken, time and space did not exist before the universe. So it would have no when or where for it to happen. Would it?Look. It is not going to satisfy you in any real way, but...Where? Everywhere.When? About 13.5byaAsking what happened before is logical, and obviously difficult. It is possible we will never have a good answer for this, but being dismissive of what we DO know is just being silly and argumentative. I can debate with religion, but I don't pretend to have no idea what they are talking about.Look. In order for something to happen, it requires a place and a time to do so. This is what we observe. There are no exceptions. So it is natural to be curious about where the universe, which is finite, exists; and where and when it came into existence. And I don't know why you mentioned religion. I asked a straightforward question. Nothing more.I would agree with you, but then we'd BOTH be wrong.
 Posts: 4,089 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 3/13/2016 11:03:05 PMPosted: 10 months agoAt 3/13/2016 6:42:38 PM, LittleBallofHATE wrote:OK. Here's a question. I'm guessing no one can answer this, but I'll ask anyway. If the big bang theory is true, it presents a problem in logic. If it did happen, where and when did it happen. Unless I'm mistaken, time and space did not exist before the universe. So it would have no when or where for it to happen. Would it?When: 13.8bn years ago.What was before that point? Not sure; it isn't clear that the question makes any more sense than what's north of the north pole.Where did it happen? Everywhere.The universe expanded from a single point; the space itself expanded, rather than expanding into something. This means, for example, if you placed two markers that never moved in space next to each other at the moment of the big bang, they could be the other side of the universe from each other now; because the space between them has changed.Another example, lets say you have a balloon that inflates. When the balloon is completely deflated, you can draw two dots on it that are practically touching, but as the balloon expands, those points get further and further and further apart.
 Posts: 284 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 3/13/2016 11:25:28 PMPosted: 10 months agoAt 3/13/2016 11:03:05 PM, Ramshutu wrote:At 3/13/2016 6:42:38 PM, LittleBallofHATE wrote:OK. Here's a question. I'm guessing no one can answer this, but I'll ask anyway. If the big bang theory is true, it presents a problem in logic. If it did happen, where and when did it happen. Unless I'm mistaken, time and space did not exist before the universe. So it would have no when or where for it to happen. Would it?When: 13.8bn years ago.What was before that point? Not sure; it isn't clear that the question makes any more sense than what's north of the north pole.Where did it happen? Everywhere.The universe expanded from a single point; the space itself expanded, rather than expanding into something. This means, for example, if you placed two markers that never moved in space next to each other at the moment of the big bang, they could be the other side of the universe from each other now; because the space between them has changed.Another example, lets say you have a balloon that inflates. When the balloon is completely deflated, you can draw two dots on it that are practically touching, but as the balloon expands, those points get further and further and further apart.Interesting. But don't scientists believe that the universe is actually flat? Here is the first in a series of articles that show just how strange our universe is. http://blogs.scientificamerican.com...I would agree with you, but then we'd BOTH be wrong.
 Posts: 4,089 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 3/13/2016 11:40:39 PMPosted: 10 months agoAt 3/13/2016 11:25:28 PM, LittleBallofHATE wrote:At 3/13/2016 11:03:05 PM, Ramshutu wrote:At 3/13/2016 6:42:38 PM, LittleBallofHATE wrote:OK. Here's a question. I'm guessing no one can answer this, but I'll ask anyway. If the big bang theory is true, it presents a problem in logic. If it did happen, where and when did it happen. Unless I'm mistaken, time and space did not exist before the universe. So it would have no when or where for it to happen. Would it?When: 13.8bn years ago.What was before that point? Not sure; it isn't clear that the question makes any more sense than what's north of the north pole.Where did it happen? Everywhere.The universe expanded from a single point; the space itself expanded, rather than expanding into something. This means, for example, if you placed two markers that never moved in space next to each other at the moment of the big bang, they could be the other side of the universe from each other now; because the space between them has changed.Another example, lets say you have a balloon that inflates. When the balloon is completely deflated, you can draw two dots on it that are practically touching, but as the balloon expands, those points get further and further and further apart.Interesting. But don't scientists believe that the universe is actually flat? Here is the first in a series of articles that show just how strange our universe is. http://blogs.scientificamerican.com...And? Do you know what that means?
 Posts: 9,991 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 3/14/2016 12:13:40 AMPosted: 10 months agoAt 3/13/2016 11:40:39 PM, Ramshutu wrote:At 3/13/2016 11:25:28 PM, LittleBallofHATE wrote:At 3/13/2016 11:03:05 PM, Ramshutu wrote:At 3/13/2016 6:42:38 PM, LittleBallofHATE wrote:OK. Here's a question. I'm guessing no one can answer this, but I'll ask anyway. If the big bang theory is true, it presents a problem in logic. If it did happen, where and when did it happen. Unless I'm mistaken, time and space did not exist before the universe. So it would have no when or where for it to happen. Would it?When: 13.8bn years ago.What was before that point? Not sure; it isn't clear that the question makes any more sense than what's north of the north pole.Where did it happen? Everywhere.The universe expanded from a single point; the space itself expanded, rather than expanding into something. This means, for example, if you placed two markers that never moved in space next to each other at the moment of the big bang, they could be the other side of the universe from each other now; because the space between them has changed.Another example, lets say you have a balloon that inflates. When the balloon is completely deflated, you can draw two dots on it that are practically touching, but as the balloon expands, those points get further and further and further apart.Interesting. But don't scientists believe that the universe is actually flat? Here is the first in a series of articles that show just how strange our universe is. http://blogs.scientificamerican.com...And? Do you know what that means?I went round on this one with a guy in real life. Trying to talk about the curvature of space gets lost very quickly with many. I admit, I was lacking in the resources to explain, but it was clear that he was thinking along the lines of "flat earth".Almost impossible to cross that bridge.