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New State of Water?

slo1
Posts: 4,342
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4/25/2016 4:33:32 PM
Posted: 7 months ago
https://www.sciencedaily.com...

"This discovery represents a new fundamental understanding of the behavior of water and the way water utilizes energy," Anovitz said. "It's also interesting to think that those water molecules in your aquamarine or emerald ring -- blue and green varieties of beryl -- are undergoing the same quantum tunneling we've seen in our experiments."

While previous studies have observed tunneling of atomic hydrogen in other systems, the ORNL discovery that water exhibits such tunneling behavior is unprecedented. The neutron scattering and computational chemistry experiments showed that, in the tunneling state, the water molecules are delocalized around a ring so the water molecule assumes an unusual double top-like shape
slo1
Posts: 4,342
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4/25/2016 4:34:18 PM
Posted: 7 months ago
Quantum Tunneling Def

Quantum tunnelling or tunneling (see spelling differences) refers to the quantum mechanical phenomenon where a particle tunnels through a barrier that it classically could not surmount.

https://en.wikipedia.org...
slo1
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4/25/2016 4:47:37 PM
Posted: 7 months ago
I find this article interesting for a number of reasons.

- The Spallation Neutron Source is very interesting. https://neutrons.ornl.gov...

- This state of water that was observed is obviously very interesting as it involves, highly confined water locked in a crystal structure. Water, more accurately its constituents can tunnel to locations where classical physics can not explain.

The controversy, obviously, is how one interprets a superposition of being in all six locations at once. That leads to whether one can really call this a new phase state of water.

From a practical standpoint these observations are important as it t explains a difference between current models and actual energy of the water protons. With all the high tech materials design these days, it is always good to get models up to date and accurate. See below excerpt:

"The average kinetic energy of the water protons directly obtained from the neutron experiment is a measure of their motion at almost absolute zero temperature and is about 30 percent less than it is in bulk liquid or solid water," Kolesnikov said. "This is in complete disagreement with accepted models based on the energies of its vibrational modes."
musicalone
Posts: 163
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4/25/2016 6:38:13 PM
Posted: 7 months ago
At 4/25/2016 4:33:32 PM, slo1 wrote:
https://www.sciencedaily.com...

"This discovery represents a new fundamental understanding of the behavior of water and the way water utilizes energy," Anovitz said. "It's also interesting to think that those water molecules in your aquamarine or emerald ring -- blue and green varieties of beryl -- are undergoing the same quantum tunneling we've seen in our experiments."

While previous studies have observed tunneling of atomic hydrogen in other systems, the ORNL discovery that water exhibits such tunneling behavior is unprecedented. The neutron scattering and computational chemistry experiments showed that, in the tunneling state, the water molecules are delocalized around a ring so the water molecule assumes an unusual double top-like shape
: :

It's interesting how quantum has deceived more scientists than it has enlightened them. Once they get passed quantum, they will learn about our origin.
slo1
Posts: 4,342
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4/27/2016 1:25:28 PM
Posted: 7 months ago
At 4/25/2016 6:38:13 PM, musicalone wrote:
At 4/25/2016 4:33:32 PM, slo1 wrote:
https://www.sciencedaily.com...

"This discovery represents a new fundamental understanding of the behavior of water and the way water utilizes energy," Anovitz said. "It's also interesting to think that those water molecules in your aquamarine or emerald ring -- blue and green varieties of beryl -- are undergoing the same quantum tunneling we've seen in our experiments."

While previous studies have observed tunneling of atomic hydrogen in other systems, the ORNL discovery that water exhibits such tunneling behavior is unprecedented. The neutron scattering and computational chemistry experiments showed that, in the tunneling state, the water molecules are delocalized around a ring so the water molecule assumes an unusual double top-like shape
: :

It's interesting how quantum has deceived more scientists than it has enlightened them. Once they get passed quantum, they will learn about our origin.

That is nice, guru. Please tell more.
Axonly
Posts: 1,802
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6/6/2016 8:16:18 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 4/25/2016 4:33:32 PM, slo1 wrote:
https://www.sciencedaily.com...

"This discovery represents a new fundamental understanding of the behavior of water and the way water utilizes energy," Anovitz said. "It's also interesting to think that those water molecules in your aquamarine or emerald ring -- blue and green varieties of beryl -- are undergoing the same quantum tunneling we've seen in our experiments."

While previous studies have observed tunneling of atomic hydrogen in other systems, the ORNL discovery that water exhibits such tunneling behavior is unprecedented. The neutron scattering and computational chemistry experiments showed that, in the tunneling state, the water molecules are delocalized around a ring so the water molecule assumes an unusual double top-like shape


Worth a bump
Meh!
Axonly
Posts: 1,802
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6/11/2016 6:22:30 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 4/25/2016 4:33:32 PM, slo1 wrote:
https://www.sciencedaily.com...

"This discovery represents a new fundamental understanding of the behavior of water and the way water utilizes energy," Anovitz said. "It's also interesting to think that those water molecules in your aquamarine or emerald ring -- blue and green varieties of beryl -- are undergoing the same quantum tunneling we've seen in our experiments."

While previous studies have observed tunneling of atomic hydrogen in other systems, the ORNL discovery that water exhibits such tunneling behavior is unprecedented. The neutron scattering and computational chemistry experiments showed that, in the tunneling state, the water molecules are delocalized around a ring so the water molecule assumes an unusual double top-like shape


This is interesting to hear.
Meh!
Skepsikyma
Posts: 8,280
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6/11/2016 3:09:53 PM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 4/27/2016 2:08:44 PM, keithprosser wrote:
Hmmm.. Why can't I help thinking of ice-9 in cats cradle...

Lol, that was my first thought as well.
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
Axonly
Posts: 1,802
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6/13/2016 10:28:22 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 4/25/2016 4:33:32 PM, slo1 wrote:
https://www.sciencedaily.com...

"This discovery represents a new fundamental understanding of the behavior of water and the way water utilizes energy," Anovitz said. "It's also interesting to think that those water molecules in your aquamarine or emerald ring -- blue and green varieties of beryl -- are undergoing the same quantum tunneling we've seen in our experiments."

While previous studies have observed tunneling of atomic hydrogen in other systems, the ORNL discovery that water exhibits such tunneling behavior is unprecedented. The neutron scattering and computational chemistry experiments showed that, in the tunneling state, the water molecules are delocalized around a ring so the water molecule assumes an unusual double top-like shape


On a somewhat related topic, you may be interested in this graph of ice phases: http://www.science.uwaterloo.ca...
Meh!
slo1
Posts: 4,342
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6/13/2016 1:13:18 PM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/13/2016 10:28:22 AM, Axonly wrote:
At 4/25/2016 4:33:32 PM, slo1 wrote:
https://www.sciencedaily.com...

"This discovery represents a new fundamental understanding of the behavior of water and the way water utilizes energy," Anovitz said. "It's also interesting to think that those water molecules in your aquamarine or emerald ring -- blue and green varieties of beryl -- are undergoing the same quantum tunneling we've seen in our experiments."

While previous studies have observed tunneling of atomic hydrogen in other systems, the ORNL discovery that water exhibits such tunneling behavior is unprecedented. The neutron scattering and computational chemistry experiments showed that, in the tunneling state, the water molecules are delocalized around a ring so the water molecule assumes an unusual double top-like shape


On a somewhat related topic, you may be interested in this graph of ice phases: http://www.science.uwaterloo.ca...

Thanks Axonly. Will check these out later.

On this tunneling effect of water in a crystalline structure it got me wondering how the pilot wave school of quantum mechanics would explain. I can see own the wave can move through the structure, but how would the particle move with it through barriers?

I know that interpretation is a deterministic but keeps non-locality. I would imagine this is why it is not taken seriously. It may have a mechanical explanation for the double slit, but it does not seem to when it comes to tunneling or even entanglement for that matter.