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Hitler was a Genius.

CrazyPerson
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4/15/2012 7:52:21 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Hitler once said, "I do not see why man should not be just as cruel as nature."

I am not a cruel person as depicted by American society, nor do I have the desire to be cruel. However the desire to be hostile and animalistic may lie dormant in everybody. Perhaps my desire to fit into society is just a product of social-moral conditioning. If i hadn't learned within the western world's inherently christianized educational system, hostility would come more naturally and acceptable to me. So why do you think it is wrong to be cruel?
But we try to pretend, you see, that the external world exists altogether independently of us.
- - - Watts
The moralist is the person who tells people that they ought to be unselfish, when they still feel like egos, and his efforts are always and invariably futile.
- - - Watts
imabench
Posts: 21,216
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4/15/2012 8:31:48 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/15/2012 7:52:21 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
Hitler once said, "I do not see why man should not be just as cruel as nature."

I am not a cruel person as depicted by American society, nor do I have the desire to be cruel. However the desire to be hostile and animalistic may lie dormant in everybody. Perhaps my desire to fit into society is just a product of social-moral conditioning. If i hadn't learned within the western world's inherently christianized educational system, hostility would come more naturally and acceptable to me. So why do you think it is wrong to be cruel?

Well for starters anything that Hitler endorses is something that is probably evil, and being cruel towards people who have done nothing to deserve such actions is immoral and wrong.....
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CrazyPerson
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4/15/2012 8:39:29 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/15/2012 8:31:48 PM, imabench wrote:
At 4/15/2012 7:52:21 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
Hitler once said, "I do not see why man should not be just as cruel as nature."

I am not a cruel person as depicted by American society, nor do I have the desire to be cruel. However the desire to be hostile and animalistic may lie dormant in everybody. Perhaps my desire to fit into society is just a product of social-moral conditioning. If i hadn't learned within the western world's inherently christianized educational system, hostility would come more naturally and acceptable to me. So why do you think it is wrong to be cruel?

Well for starters anything that Hitler endorses is something that is probably evil, and being cruel towards people who have done nothing to deserve such actions is immoral and wrong.....

What are your ideas of 'evil, immoral, and wrong' and where do they stem from?
But we try to pretend, you see, that the external world exists altogether independently of us.
- - - Watts
The moralist is the person who tells people that they ought to be unselfish, when they still feel like egos, and his efforts are always and invariably futile.
- - - Watts
CrazyPerson
Posts: 1,114
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4/15/2012 8:59:08 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/15/2012 8:52:31 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
What are your ideas of 'evil, immoral, and wrong' and where do they stem from?

The Social Contract.

Mine come from Mein Kampf, what makes your said doctrine more valid?
But we try to pretend, you see, that the external world exists altogether independently of us.
- - - Watts
The moralist is the person who tells people that they ought to be unselfish, when they still feel like egos, and his efforts are always and invariably futile.
- - - Watts
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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4/15/2012 9:19:24 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/15/2012 8:59:08 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
At 4/15/2012 8:52:31 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
What are your ideas of 'evil, immoral, and wrong' and where do they stem from?

The Social Contract.


Mine come from Mein Kampf, what makes your said doctrine more valid?

Adhering to the social contract is less likely to inspire the rest of the world to go to war with me. So, there's that.
CrazyPerson
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4/15/2012 9:20:44 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
If you step outside of your moral guidelines, war sounds fun does it not? Ever have an apple war, sword fight, pillow fight, tug o war, or any other type of war as a kid?
But we try to pretend, you see, that the external world exists altogether independently of us.
- - - Watts
The moralist is the person who tells people that they ought to be unselfish, when they still feel like egos, and his efforts are always and invariably futile.
- - - Watts
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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4/15/2012 9:23:46 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/15/2012 7:52:21 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
Hitler once said, "I do not see why man should not be just as cruel as nature."

I am not a cruel person as depicted by American society, nor do I have the desire to be cruel. However the desire to be hostile and animalistic may lie dormant in everybody. Perhaps my desire to fit into society is just a product of social-moral conditioning. If i hadn't learned within the western world's inherently christianized educational system, hostility would come more naturally and acceptable to me. So why do you think it is wrong to be cruel?

Because cruelty begets cruelty, and if you naturally acted hostile, others would act hostile back, a scenario that no individual would like. It isn't objectively wrong to be cruel. But for human civilization it only falls naturally that cruelty be made unacceptable simply through mutual fear of reciprocity.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
darkkermit
Posts: 11,204
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4/15/2012 9:29:59 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/15/2012 9:23:46 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 4/15/2012 7:52:21 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
Hitler once said, "I do not see why man should not be just as cruel as nature."

I am not a cruel person as depicted by American society, nor do I have the desire to be cruel. However the desire to be hostile and animalistic may lie dormant in everybody. Perhaps my desire to fit into society is just a product of social-moral conditioning. If i hadn't learned within the western world's inherently christianized educational system, hostility would come more naturally and acceptable to me. So why do you think it is wrong to be cruel?

Because cruelty begets cruelty, and if you naturally acted hostile, others would act hostile back, a scenario that no individual would like. It isn't objectively wrong to be cruel. But for human civilization it only falls naturally that cruelty be made unacceptable simply through mutual fear of reciprocity.

First off, opening topic guy is a complete @sshole.

Second, no. If I put a gun to your head while your unarmed you won't act hostile at all. People will only act hostility back If they are on a somewhat equal playing field.
Open borders debate:
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000ike
Posts: 11,196
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4/15/2012 9:35:23 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/15/2012 9:29:59 PM, darkkermit wrote:
At 4/15/2012 9:23:46 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 4/15/2012 7:52:21 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
Hitler once said, "I do not see why man should not be just as cruel as nature."

I am not a cruel person as depicted by American society, nor do I have the desire to be cruel. However the desire to be hostile and animalistic may lie dormant in everybody. Perhaps my desire to fit into society is just a product of social-moral conditioning. If i hadn't learned within the western world's inherently christianized educational system, hostility would come more naturally and acceptable to me. So why do you think it is wrong to be cruel?

Because cruelty begets cruelty, and if you naturally acted hostile, others would act hostile back, a scenario that no individual would like. It isn't objectively wrong to be cruel. But for human civilization it only falls naturally that cruelty be made unacceptable simply through mutual fear of reciprocity.

First off, opening topic guy is a complete @sshole.

Are you talking about CrazyPerson?

Second, no. If I put a gun to your head while your unarmed you won't act hostile at all. People will only act hostility back If they are on a somewhat equal playing field.

I'm not talking about its practice I'm talking about the principle. No one would like cruelty therefore we make it law that cruelty is to be abolished. This doesn't mean that people won't still act cruel if they don't feel any threat of reciprocal cruelty.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Chrysippus
Posts: 2,173
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4/15/2012 9:38:06 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/15/2012 7:52:21 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
Hitler once said...

I invoke the Inverse Godwin's Law:

"As an internet discussion about Hitler grows longer, the probability that Godwin's Law will be invoked approaches one."
Cavete mea inexorabilis legiones mimus!
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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4/15/2012 9:40:59 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/15/2012 9:20:44 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
If you step outside of your moral guidelines, war sounds fun does it not?

No.

Ever have an apple war, sword fight, pillow fight, tug o war, or any other type of war as a kid?

I've played those GAMES, sure. BTW, you're not very convincing.
CrazyPerson
Posts: 1,114
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4/15/2012 9:45:06 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
First, how am i an @sshole?

Secondly, I assert that if one we're to grow up in a household ran by Hitler, they would share the same ideology without any choice in the matter. This says what about human nature? That it is malleable and elastic, and that its moral substance is at the mercy of conditioning.
But we try to pretend, you see, that the external world exists altogether independently of us.
- - - Watts
The moralist is the person who tells people that they ought to be unselfish, when they still feel like egos, and his efforts are always and invariably futile.
- - - Watts
THEBOMB
Posts: 2,872
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4/15/2012 9:47:02 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/15/2012 8:59:08 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
At 4/15/2012 8:52:31 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
What are your ideas of 'evil, immoral, and wrong' and where do they stem from?

The Social Contract.


Mine come from Mein Kampf, what makes your said doctrine more valid?

Because the Social Contract explains why governments and societies form. Can Mein Kampf say the same?
CrazyPerson
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4/15/2012 9:49:07 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/15/2012 9:29:59 PM, darkkermit wrote:
At 4/15/2012 9:23:46 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 4/15/2012 7:52:21 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
Hitler once said, "I do not see why man should not be just as cruel as nature."

I am not a cruel person as depicted by American society, nor do I have the desire to be cruel. However the desire to be hostile and animalistic may lie dormant in everybody. Perhaps my desire to fit into society is just a product of social-moral conditioning. If i hadn't learned within the western world's inherently christianized educational system, hostility would come more naturally and acceptable to me. So why do you think it is wrong to be cruel?

Because cruelty begets cruelty, and if you naturally acted hostile, others would act hostile back, a scenario that no individual would like. It isn't objectively wrong to be cruel. But for human civilization it only falls naturally that cruelty be made unacceptable simply through mutual fear of reciprocity.

First off, opening topic guy is a complete @sshole.

Second, no. If I put a gun to your head while your unarmed you won't act hostile at all. People will only act hostility back If they are on a somewhat equal playing field.

Yeah, so they would either come back with a gun later, or dissolve into the theory of survival of the fittest.
But we try to pretend, you see, that the external world exists altogether independently of us.
- - - Watts
The moralist is the person who tells people that they ought to be unselfish, when they still feel like egos, and his efforts are always and invariably futile.
- - - Watts
CrazyPerson
Posts: 1,114
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4/15/2012 9:50:01 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/15/2012 9:47:02 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
At 4/15/2012 8:59:08 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
At 4/15/2012 8:52:31 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
What are your ideas of 'evil, immoral, and wrong' and where do they stem from?

The Social Contract.


Mine come from Mein Kampf, what makes your said doctrine more valid?

Because the Social Contract explains why governments and societies form. Can Mein Kampf say the same?

No, Mein Kampf does not employ such futile ideas.
But we try to pretend, you see, that the external world exists altogether independently of us.
- - - Watts
The moralist is the person who tells people that they ought to be unselfish, when they still feel like egos, and his efforts are always and invariably futile.
- - - Watts
THEBOMB
Posts: 2,872
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4/15/2012 9:50:21 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/15/2012 9:45:06 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
First, how am i an @sshole?

Your not.

Secondly, I assert that if one we're to grow up in a household ran by Hitler, they would share the same ideology without any choice in the matter. This says what about human nature? That it is malleable and elastic, and that its moral substance is at the mercy of conditioning.

No, not at all. As people mature they develop their own beliefs. I mean Hitler did the same. His beliefs were radically different from most people. People develop their own views. I mean my views are radically different from my parents.
THEBOMB
Posts: 2,872
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4/15/2012 9:51:03 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/15/2012 9:50:01 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
At 4/15/2012 9:47:02 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
At 4/15/2012 8:59:08 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
At 4/15/2012 8:52:31 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
What are your ideas of 'evil, immoral, and wrong' and where do they stem from?

The Social Contract.


Mine come from Mein Kampf, what makes your said doctrine more valid?

Because the Social Contract explains why governments and societies form. Can Mein Kampf say the same?

No, Mein Kampf does not employ such futile ideas.

How is futile to explain why society and civilization formed?
CrazyPerson
Posts: 1,114
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4/15/2012 9:52:56 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/15/2012 9:50:21 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
At 4/15/2012 9:45:06 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
First, how am i an @sshole?

Your not.

Secondly, I assert that if one we're to grow up in a household ran by Hitler, they would share the same ideology without any choice in the matter. This says what about human nature? That it is malleable and elastic, and that its moral substance is at the mercy of conditioning.

No, not at all. As people mature they develop their own beliefs. I mean Hitler did the same. His beliefs were radically different from most people. People develop their own views. I mean my views are radically different from my parents.

Your views and your beliefs are very different. See, while your external views may be different, internally you share with your parents the same basic principles of morality. That is not to cheat, not to steal, not to murder.. etc. This derived from what they taught you while you were too young to develop your own ideas and these things manifest into a deep level of consciousness.
But we try to pretend, you see, that the external world exists altogether independently of us.
- - - Watts
The moralist is the person who tells people that they ought to be unselfish, when they still feel like egos, and his efforts are always and invariably futile.
- - - Watts
CrazyPerson
Posts: 1,114
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4/15/2012 9:53:15 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Views are always changing, beliefs are generally static.
But we try to pretend, you see, that the external world exists altogether independently of us.
- - - Watts
The moralist is the person who tells people that they ought to be unselfish, when they still feel like egos, and his efforts are always and invariably futile.
- - - Watts
darkkermit
Posts: 11,204
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4/15/2012 9:53:55 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/15/2012 9:45:06 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
First, how am i an @sshole?

Secondly, I assert that if one we're to grow up in a household ran by Hitler, they would share the same ideology without any choice in the matter. This says what about human nature? That it is malleable and elastic, and that its moral substance is at the mercy of conditioning.

Come on hitler was a genius because you found his quote of his amusing? Please, your trolling.

Hitler is hardly deserving of the title of genius. He was an average intelligent person w/ charisma.
Open borders debate:
http://www.debate.org...
CrazyPerson
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4/15/2012 9:56:58 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/15/2012 9:53:55 PM, darkkermit wrote:
At 4/15/2012 9:45:06 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
First, how am i an @sshole?

Secondly, I assert that if one we're to grow up in a household ran by Hitler, they would share the same ideology without any choice in the matter. This says what about human nature? That it is malleable and elastic, and that its moral substance is at the mercy of conditioning.

Come on hitler was a genius because you found his quote of his amusing? Please, your trolling.

Hitler is hardly deserving of the title of genius. He was an average intelligent person w/ charisma.

If there is something unconventional about this post, do tell. I am new.
But we try to pretend, you see, that the external world exists altogether independently of us.
- - - Watts
The moralist is the person who tells people that they ought to be unselfish, when they still feel like egos, and his efforts are always and invariably futile.
- - - Watts
THEBOMB
Posts: 2,872
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4/15/2012 9:58:00 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/15/2012 9:56:58 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
At 4/15/2012 9:53:55 PM, darkkermit wrote:
At 4/15/2012 9:45:06 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
First, how am i an @sshole?

Secondly, I assert that if one we're to grow up in a household ran by Hitler, they would share the same ideology without any choice in the matter. This says what about human nature? That it is malleable and elastic, and that its moral substance is at the mercy of conditioning.

Come on hitler was a genius because you found his quote of his amusing? Please, your trolling.

Hitler is hardly deserving of the title of genius. He was an average intelligent person w/ charisma.

If there is something unconventional about this post, do tell. I am new.

There's nothing wrong with this post. They just don't err agree with you. Or like your (rather Hitler's) ideas.
CrazyPerson
Posts: 1,114
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4/15/2012 10:00:29 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/15/2012 9:58:00 PM, THEBOMB wrote:
At 4/15/2012 9:56:58 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
At 4/15/2012 9:53:55 PM, darkkermit wrote:
At 4/15/2012 9:45:06 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
First, how am i an @sshole?

Secondly, I assert that if one we're to grow up in a household ran by Hitler, they would share the same ideology without any choice in the matter. This says what about human nature? That it is malleable and elastic, and that its moral substance is at the mercy of conditioning.

Come on hitler was a genius because you found his quote of his amusing? Please, your trolling.

Hitler is hardly deserving of the title of genius. He was an average intelligent person w/ charisma.

If there is something unconventional about this post, do tell. I am new.

There's nothing wrong with this post. They just don't err agree with you. Or like your (rather Hitler's) ideas.

I don't really like his ideas either... regardless, wondering why i'm labelled a troll.
But we try to pretend, you see, that the external world exists altogether independently of us.
- - - Watts
The moralist is the person who tells people that they ought to be unselfish, when they still feel like egos, and his efforts are always and invariably futile.
- - - Watts
PeacefulChaos
Posts: 2,610
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4/15/2012 10:02:26 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/15/2012 7:52:21 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
Hitler once said, "I do not see why man should not be just as cruel as nature."

I am not a cruel person as depicted by American society, nor do I have the desire to be cruel. However the desire to be hostile and animalistic may lie dormant in everybody. Perhaps my desire to fit into society is just a product of social-moral conditioning. If i hadn't learned within the western world's inherently christianized educational system, hostility would come more naturally and acceptable to me. So why do you think it is wrong to be cruel?

At 4/15/2012 8:52:31 PM, THEBOMB wrote:

What are your ideas of 'evil, immoral, and wrong' and where do they stem from?

The Social Contract.

Mine come from Mein Kampf, what makes your said doctrine more valid?


Well my dad said that cruelty is wrong.

What makes Hitler's word more valid than my dad's?
CrazyPerson
Posts: 1,114
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4/15/2012 10:04:51 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Hitler's thoughts and statements were always final. He held his beliefs strongly and had the ability to manipulate and control over a million people. To me, that's a display of intellect. His understanding of the inner workings of militaristic, governmental, social, political, and psychological studies was far beyond the understanding of most people during that time and probably even to this day, and that's is why the Nazis succeeded for so long. It has nothing to do with what i personally feel is right or wrong-but rather how conditioning can lead one to an alternate set of moral behaviors.
But we try to pretend, you see, that the external world exists altogether independently of us.
- - - Watts
The moralist is the person who tells people that they ought to be unselfish, when they still feel like egos, and his efforts are always and invariably futile.
- - - Watts
CrazyPerson
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4/15/2012 10:05:31 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/15/2012 10:02:26 PM, PeacefulChaos wrote:
At 4/15/2012 7:52:21 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
Hitler once said, "I do not see why man should not be just as cruel as nature."

I am not a cruel person as depicted by American society, nor do I have the desire to be cruel. However the desire to be hostile and animalistic may lie dormant in everybody. Perhaps my desire to fit into society is just a product of social-moral conditioning. If i hadn't learned within the western world's inherently christianized educational system, hostility would come more naturally and acceptable to me. So why do you think it is wrong to be cruel?

At 4/15/2012 8:52:31 PM, THEBOMB wrote:

What are your ideas of 'evil, immoral, and wrong' and where do they stem from?


The Social Contract.


Mine come from Mein Kampf, what makes your said doctrine more valid?


Well my dad said that cruelty is wrong.

What makes Hitler's word more valid than my dad's?

It isn't more valid.
But we try to pretend, you see, that the external world exists altogether independently of us.
- - - Watts
The moralist is the person who tells people that they ought to be unselfish, when they still feel like egos, and his efforts are always and invariably futile.
- - - Watts
CrazyPerson
Posts: 1,114
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4/15/2012 10:09:28 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/15/2012 10:05:31 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
At 4/15/2012 10:02:26 PM, PeacefulChaos wrote:
At 4/15/2012 7:52:21 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
Hitler once said, "I do not see why man should not be just as cruel as nature."

I am not a cruel person as depicted by American society, nor do I have the desire to be cruel. However the desire to be hostile and animalistic may lie dormant in everybody. Perhaps my desire to fit into society is just a product of social-moral conditioning. If i hadn't learned within the western world's inherently christianized educational system, hostility would come more naturally and acceptable to me. So why do you think it is wrong to be cruel?

At 4/15/2012 8:52:31 PM, THEBOMB wrote:

What are your ideas of 'evil, immoral, and wrong' and where do they stem from?


The Social Contract.


Mine come from Mein Kampf, what makes your said doctrine more valid?


Well my dad said that cruelty is wrong.

What makes Hitler's word more valid than my dad's?

It isn't more valid.

That's the point.
But we try to pretend, you see, that the external world exists altogether independently of us.
- - - Watts
The moralist is the person who tells people that they ought to be unselfish, when they still feel like egos, and his efforts are always and invariably futile.
- - - Watts
PeacefulChaos
Posts: 2,610
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4/16/2012 3:04:48 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/15/2012 10:09:28 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
At 4/15/2012 10:05:31 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
At 4/15/2012 10:02:26 PM, PeacefulChaos wrote:
At 4/15/2012 7:52:21 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
Hitler once said, "I do not see why man should not be just as cruel as nature."

I am not a cruel person as depicted by American society, nor do I have the desire to be cruel. However the desire to be hostile and animalistic may lie dormant in everybody. Perhaps my desire to fit into society is just a product of social-moral conditioning. If i hadn't learned within the western world's inherently christianized educational system, hostility would come more naturally and acceptable to me. So why do you think it is wrong to be cruel?

At 4/15/2012 8:52:31 PM, THEBOMB wrote:

What are your ideas of 'evil, immoral, and wrong' and where do they stem from?


The Social Contract.


Mine come from Mein Kampf, what makes your said doctrine more valid?


Well my dad said that cruelty is wrong.

What makes Hitler's word more valid than my dad's?

It isn't more valid.

That's the point.

I was just joking :P
Wnope
Posts: 6,924
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4/16/2012 3:25:21 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/15/2012 10:04:51 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
Hitler's thoughts and statements were always final. He held his beliefs strongly and had the ability to manipulate and control over a million people. To me, that's a display of intellect. His understanding of the inner workings of militaristic, governmental, social, political, and psychological studies was far beyond the understanding of most people during that time and probably even to this day, and that's is why the Nazis succeeded for so long. It has nothing to do with what i personally feel is right or wrong-but rather how conditioning can lead one to an alternate set of moral behaviors.

Eh...I wouldn't overestimate his planning abilities. He only had germany half-militarized at the time of the blitzkrieg.