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Changing attitudes on homosexuality

Republican95
Posts: 111
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10/19/2009 4:00:44 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
As the 2000s nears a close, it has been a decade like none other.

Besides escalation of social issues (terrorism, economic inequality) and environment issues (global warming) the 2000s, I think, has been a record decade for how the outside world perceives homosexuals, particularly lesbians.

In 1994, only 14% of American teenage girls identified as lesbian or bisexual, however, a poll taken in 2008 reports that now 31% of American teenage girls identify as lesbian or bisexual.

Compared with their male counterparts, in which 13% identified as bi or gay in 1993. However, in 2007, the figure actually declined to 10%.

Why has this happened?

I can think of society's ever-changing attitudes on homosexuality, especially since the turn of the millennium.

Here are a few

1) The generation of teenagers right now has no recollection of the AIDS epidemic of the 1980s and 1990s.
2) Hollywood and the music industry. Lesbians (and homosexual men to a lesser extent) have been portrayed more favorably in recent years. The stereotypical "butch" lesbian persona has largely been abandoned by mass media and replaced with the young, sexy, and feminine lesbian idea. Do "If you seek Amy" and "I Kissed a Girl" ring a bell?
3) Perceptions of homosexual women by men. A recent poll conducted my men who view pornography on "a regular basis", found that as much as 80% of them enjoy watching "scenes with more than one woman and no men". This has also happened at high schools across the nation. Young teenage girls are being pressured into homosexual situations by their male peers, even surprisingly, their own boyfriends.
4) The leniency of religious institutions. Since 2000, I belief, religious people and churches have become more accepting of homosexuals.

I am not bashing homosexuals.

I just it is interesting to see the trends in our society and comment on them.

What do you think?
Ragnar_Rahl
Posts: 19,297
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10/19/2009 5:48:49 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
In 1994, only 14% of American teenage girls identified as lesbian or bisexual, however, a poll taken in 2008 reports that now 31% of American teenage girls identify as lesbian or bisexual.

I call bull**** on whoever made such a poll. If such a poll exists and got such results, it obviously had a very biased sample, if it wasn't just data faked out of wishful thinking by one of those boyfriends you were talking about.
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
Volkov
Posts: 9,765
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10/19/2009 7:06:36 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 10/19/2009 5:48:49 PM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:
I call bull**** on whoever made such a poll. If such a poll exists and got such results, it obviously had a very biased sample, if it wasn't just data faked out of wishful thinking by one of those boyfriends you were talking about.

You know, I'd usually agree with you, but I am a little reserved about this case...

The simple fact that it is now perceived as 'good' to identify yourself as at least bisexual in most circles. It is a popularity boost, as well as a turn on. They may not actually be bisexual or whatever, but that doesn't stop them.
wjmelements
Posts: 8,206
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10/19/2009 7:08:33 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
This club was started at my school called the "Gay-Straight Alliance". This is cool and all, but it's kind of stupid. What do they do at this club? I mean, are they just supposed to sit there and be accepting? Do they do charity?
in the blink of an eye you finally see the light
Ragnar_Rahl
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10/19/2009 7:15:20 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 10/19/2009 7:06:36 PM, Volkov wrote:
At 10/19/2009 5:48:49 PM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:
I call bull**** on whoever made such a poll. If such a poll exists and got such results, it obviously had a very biased sample, if it wasn't just data faked out of wishful thinking by one of those boyfriends you were talking about.

You know, I'd usually agree with you, but I am a little reserved about this case...

The simple fact that it is now perceived as 'good' to identify yourself as at least bisexual in most circles. It is a popularity boost, as well as a turn on. They may not actually be bisexual or whatever, but that doesn't stop them.

Polls are supposed to be anonymous. Lying to gain cred like that, especially when it's not your peers you're talking to, but a pollster, is highly implausible with any well-constructed poll.
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
Volkov
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10/19/2009 7:16:09 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 10/19/2009 7:08:33 PM, wjmelements wrote:
This club was started at my school called the "Gay-Straight Alliance". This is cool and all, but it's kind of stupid. What do they do at this club? I mean, are they just supposed to sit there and be accepting? Do they do charity?

From what I know, they try and promote tolerance for gay rights. Maybe they do charity, maybe they're just a group dedicated to spreading a positive attitude about gays. I don't know, but I bet you they don't do much.
studentathletechristian8
Posts: 5,810
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10/19/2009 7:17:28 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 10/19/2009 7:08:33 PM, wjmelements wrote:
This club was started at my school called the "Gay-Straight Alliance". This is cool and all, but it's kind of stupid. What do they do at this club? I mean, are they just supposed to sit there and be accepting? Do they do charity?

I believe there should not be gay-straight alliance clubs. Essentially, they usually lead to more violence, prejudice, and hatred between the two groups. I could not imagine having one at my school. I tolerate homosexuals, but I will not go around in public and be supportive of a lifestyle I do not appreciate.
Volkov
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10/19/2009 7:22:51 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 10/19/2009 7:17:28 PM, studentathletechristian8 wrote:
I believe there should not be gay-straight alliance clubs. Essentially, they usually lead to more violence, prejudice, and hatred between the two groups. I could not imagine having one at my school. I tolerate homosexuals, but I will not go around in public and be supportive of a lifestyle I do not appreciate.

Some people do appreciate it, hence why they're in the Gay-Straight Alliance. I mean, its hard to have more violence and prejudice if they're tolerate and appreciative of homosexuality. Just because you don't like it, doesn't mean others are the same.
studentathletechristian8
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10/19/2009 7:29:04 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 10/19/2009 7:22:51 PM, Volkov wrote:
At 10/19/2009 7:17:28 PM, studentathletechristian8 wrote:
I believe there should not be gay-straight alliance clubs. Essentially, they usually lead to more violence, prejudice, and hatred between the two groups. I could not imagine having one at my school. I tolerate homosexuals, but I will not go around in public and be supportive of a lifestyle I do not appreciate.

Some people do appreciate it, hence why they're in the Gay-Straight Alliance. I mean, its hard to have more violence and prejudice if they're tolerate and appreciative of homosexuality. Just because you don't like it, doesn't mean others are the same.

I don't think you understand. From what I have noticed, various schools that have established Gay-Straight Alliances create more violence by non-members who are personally against gays. These tend to be the jocks, bullies, etc., and the whail on the gay kids in the club and the other members involved. I have seen tables and complete club stands destroyed by anti-gay kids in school not part of the club. In retaliation, other pupils not involved in the club (but support homosexuals) do something sneaky to get back at the anti's, and the fight goes on. Most people in high school are against homosexuals. I don't think you understood the indirect effects. I was not going for literal, but more in common grounds.
Volkov
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10/19/2009 7:32:26 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 10/19/2009 7:29:04 PM, studentathletechristian8 wrote:
I don't think you understand. From what I have noticed, various schools that have established Gay-Straight Alliances create more violence by non-members who are personally against gays. These tend to be the jocks, bullies, etc., and the whail on the gay kids in the club and the other members involved. I have seen tables and complete club stands destroyed by anti-gay kids in school not part of the club. In retaliation, other pupils not involved in the club (but support homosexuals) do something sneaky to get back at the anti's, and the fight goes on. Most people in high school are against homosexuals. I don't think you understood the indirect effects. I was not going for literal, but more in common grounds.

So, just because some idiots are against homosexual, you feel the need to deny gays the right to attempt to reconcile with them, and promote tolerance with those that are willing to?

"Violence" aside, it is a struggle. And if it is a struggle that they're willing to take on, then there should be no reason why the 'Alliance' can't exist.
mongoose
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10/19/2009 7:34:09 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 10/19/2009 7:08:33 PM, wjmelements wrote:
This club was started at my school called the "Gay-Straight Alliance". This is cool and all, but it's kind of stupid. What do they do at this club? I mean, are they just supposed to sit there and be accepting? Do they do charity?

Please tell me you're joking.
It is odd when one's capacity for compassion is measured not in what he is willing to do by his own time, effort, and property, but what he will force others to do with their own property instead.
wjmelements
Posts: 8,206
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10/19/2009 7:34:52 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
Using the violence of a ban would only show the populace that the State is against acceptance of homosexuals. It also wouldn't reduce violence. Enforcement of current laws would probably be sufficient.
in the blink of an eye you finally see the light
wjmelements
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10/19/2009 7:36:04 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 10/19/2009 7:34:09 PM, mongoose wrote:
At 10/19/2009 7:08:33 PM, wjmelements wrote:
This club was started at my school called the "Gay-Straight Alliance". This is cool and all, but it's kind of stupid. What do they do at this club? I mean, are they just supposed to sit there and be accepting? Do they do charity?

Please tell me you're joking.

No. On the way to the Math/language/fine-arts side of the school from the Commons, there is a poster hanging from the crosswalk advertising it.
in the blink of an eye you finally see the light
studentathletechristian8
Posts: 5,810
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10/19/2009 7:41:13 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 10/19/2009 7:32:26 PM, Volkov wrote:
At 10/19/2009 7:29:04 PM, studentathletechristian8 wrote:
I don't think you understand. From what I have noticed, various schools that have established Gay-Straight Alliances create more violence by non-members who are personally against gays. These tend to be the jocks, bullies, etc., and the whail on the gay kids in the club and the other members involved. I have seen tables and complete club stands destroyed by anti-gay kids in school not part of the club. In retaliation, other pupils not involved in the club (but support homosexuals) do something sneaky to get back at the anti's, and the fight goes on. Most people in high school are against homosexuals. I don't think you understood the indirect effects. I was not going for literal, but more in common grounds.

So, just because some idiots are against homosexual, you feel the need to deny gays the right to attempt to reconcile with them, and promote tolerance with those that are willing to?

"Violence" aside, it is a struggle. And if it is a struggle that they're willing to take on, then there should be no reason why the 'Alliance' can't exist.

When the issue presents a danger to the general well-being of the student body, then you must take the action of the violence, prejudice, and discrimination into account. The Gay-Straight Alliance can meet off school grounds; that may serve a purpose in creating more tolerance and less violence in school.

If you were to start a club for becoming gangster, that would cause violence throughout the school. When it becomes harmful to the student body, faculty, and administration, the situation needs to be handled and the club needs to be rescheduled, compromised, or take place in a more neutral environment. I heavily oppose the Gay-Straight Alliance club.
Volkov
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10/19/2009 7:57:46 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 10/19/2009 7:41:13 PM, studentathletechristian8 wrote:
When the issue presents a danger to the general well-being of the student body, then you must take the action of the violence, prejudice, and discrimination into account.

But it doesn't. Unless they're rioting and killing off students everywhere, there is no justifiable concern for the "general well-being of the student body." The administration is there to dish out punishment to those that break school rules, not to take it upon themselves to cancel out rights in order to protect students from something that may, may not, happen.

If you were to start a club for becoming gangster, that would cause violence throughout the school.

The difference is that creating a club for becoming violent gangsters is an active promotion of violence, for which there is cause for concern. The Gay-Straight Alliance does not create an active promotion of violence - if anything, it does the exact opposite. Or is this the militant homosexual movement I hear so much about?

When it becomes harmful to the student body, faculty, and administration, the situation needs to be handled and the club needs to be rescheduled, compromised, or take place in a more neutral environment.

There is no active threat to the student body, faculty or administration. Just because some things happen in some schools, doesn't mean that there will be justification to "compromise" it. Its like saying because there may be school shootings, the school should be closed down.

I heavily oppose the Gay-Straight Alliance club.

I have a hard time believing you oppose it on anything other than hatred towards homosexuality in general.
LeafRod
Posts: 1,548
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10/20/2009 3:30:08 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 10/19/2009 7:08:33 PM, wjmelements wrote:
This club was started at my school called the "Gay-Straight Alliance". This is cool and all, but it's kind of stupid. What do they do at this club? I mean, are they just supposed to sit there and be accepting? Do they do charity?

LOL. Why don't you go and find out? Sorry, but this is such an idiotic question.
LeafRod
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10/20/2009 3:31:27 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 10/19/2009 7:17:28 PM, studentathletechristian8 wrote:
I believe there should not be gay-straight alliance clubs. Essentially, they usually lead to more violence, prejudice, and hatred between the two groups. I could not imagine having one at my school. I tolerate homosexuals, but I will not go around in public and be supportive of a lifestyle I do not appreciate.

You have no good reason not to appreciate it.

Not to mention that under that logic we should shut down everything.
LeafRod
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10/20/2009 3:33:53 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 10/19/2009 7:29:04 PM, studentathletechristian8 wrote:
I don't think you understand. From what I have noticed, various schools that have established Gay-Straight Alliances create more violence by non-members who are personally against gays. These tend to be the jocks, bullies, etc., and the whail on the gay kids in the club and the other members involved. I have seen tables and complete club stands destroyed by anti-gay kids in school not part of the club. In retaliation, other pupils not involved in the club (but support homosexuals) do something sneaky to get back at the anti's, and the fight goes on. Most people in high school are against homosexuals. I don't think you understood the indirect effects. I was not going for literal, but more in common grounds.

On the contrary, I think most white Christian high school students are racists who go around insulting and deriding black people and Mexican people. I've seen it happen. I've also seen a fight in which one side fought, then the other side fought back, and so on. Hence, a fight. I think schools shouldn't accept white Christians.
mongeese
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10/20/2009 3:43:49 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 10/20/2009 3:33:53 PM, LeafRod wrote:
On the contrary, I think most white Christian high school students are racists who go around insulting and deriding black people and Mexican people. I've seen it happen. I've also seen a fight in which one side fought, then the other side fought back, and so on. Hence, a fight. I think schools shouldn't accept white Christians.

You've seen a white Christian insult and deride black people and Mexican people. Therefore, you think most white Christian high school students are racists.

...
Inductive reasoning FTL.
LeafRod
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10/20/2009 4:23:38 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
Well, to use your own terms, selective pointing out of horrible reasoning FTL. I basically said what studentathletechristian said.
mongeese
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10/20/2009 4:39:29 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
Ah, but his reasoning was that most people who spoke out were black. Your reasoning is that most white Christians are racist. You could have easily said that most racists are white Christians, as long as you noted multiple racists, most of whom were white Christians.
LeafRod
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10/20/2009 6:31:34 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
What?

He said that his (extremely limited) experiences have led him to conclude that the clubs have led to violence and tension and therefore should not be allowed. So, I was basically just parodying his completely lack of any sort of foundation and saying that my own (fake by hypothetically limited) experiences have led me to believe that Christians are racist and evil and therefore should not be allowed.
Danielle
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10/20/2009 9:39:18 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 10/19/2009 7:08:33 PM, wjmelements wrote:
This club was started at my school called the "Gay-Straight Alliance". This is cool and all, but it's kind of stupid. What do they do at this club? I mean, are they just supposed to sit there and be accepting? Do they do charity?

These clubs are supposed to offer a safe and comfortable environment for gay teens who are typically shunned (or fear being shunned). The straight people are there to demonstrate acceptance and support, and together they promote tolerance by discussing gay rights, promoting truth and trying to eliminate ignorance (such as only gay men get AIDS), they do charity work in some cases as well as political avocation (say writing letters to congress, organizing or contributing to activist causes in favor of gay rights, etc.). The group can also be therapeutic for some, and allow them to "come out," discuss their experiences, make friends, see that they're not alone, etc. They mostly do a lot of talking and listening and bring up issues in the media or of concern, such as specific cases of school bullying, etc.
President of DDO
Danielle
Posts: 21,330
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10/20/2009 9:45:18 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 10/19/2009 7:06:36 PM, Volkov wrote:

The simple fact that it is now perceived as 'good' to identify yourself as at least bisexual in most circles. It is a popularity boost, as well as a turn on. They may not actually be bisexual or whatever, but that doesn't stop them.

Oh, is that the simple fact? Or is that your OPINION? I can personally say that I've never met someone who pretended to be a lesbian or bisexual to be "cool." In reality, despite the fact that some guys might get turned on by lesbian action in porn, in real life guys are actually VERY threatened by having a bisexual (or formerly lesbian) girlfriend! This is based on real life experience and observation, as well as a typical analysis of the male psyche and a little common sense.

I mean, the idea that being bi is cool is generally false. Girls who kiss other girls HARDLY receive a popularity boost; a lot of are actually made fun of for (called sluts or attention whores). Although I do admit that girls kiss other girls to get a reaction from guys a lot of the time; however, that's not them pretending to be bi -- They're very obvious and up front about them just kidding around.

I'd consider a girl to be bisexual if she not only hooks up with girls, but could see herself falling in love with one or actually DATING one. That's entirely different then kissing a girl for a few hoots and hollars.
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Alex
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10/20/2009 10:13:20 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 10/19/2009 7:36:04 PM, wjmelements wrote:
At 10/19/2009 7:34:09 PM, mongoose wrote:
At 10/19/2009 7:08:33 PM, wjmelements wrote:
This club was started at my school called the "Gay-Straight Alliance". This is cool and all, but it's kind of stupid. What do they do at this club? I mean, are they just supposed to sit there and be accepting? Do they do charity?

Please tell me you're joking.

No. On the way to the Math/language/fine-arts side of the school from the Commons, there is a poster hanging from the crosswalk advertising it.

Dude my school has the same club. Exact same name and everything, maybe its a national thing?
Why kill people who kill people to show that killing people is wrong?
Volkov
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10/20/2009 10:32:27 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 10/20/2009 9:45:18 PM, theLwerd wrote:
I'd consider a girl to be bisexual if she not only hooks up with girls, but could see herself falling in love with one or actually DATING one. That's entirely different then kissing a girl for a few hoots and hollars.

That is what I am talking about, Lwerd. Many girls call themselves bisexual even if they don't see themselves in any serious relationship with someone of the same sex. And it isn't just my opinion; I can't tell you how many times I've come across it in my daily life, and its something I've seen occurring all the time. And yes, they'll call themselves bisexual outright, even if they haven't a single thought stemming in that direction outside of getting attention for it.

I've had this argument many, many times; I know what I'm talking about. I doubt its anywhere close to something like 31%, but it is pretty prevelant.
feverish
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10/21/2009 9:54:14 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 10/20/2009 9:45:18 PM, theLwerd wrote:

I can personally say that I've never met someone who pretended to be a lesbian or bisexual to be "cool." In reality, despite the fact that some guys might get turned on by lesbian action in porn, in real life guys are actually VERY threatened by having a bisexual (or formerly lesbian) girlfriend! This is based on real life experience and observation, as well as a typical analysis of the male psyche and a little common sense.


I went out with a bisexual girl for several months in my early twenties and it was great.

I think women are generally more open than men to the idea of experimenting with the same sex but couldn't say if that's biological or because it's more acceptable in a male dominated society.