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Vegetarianism is stupid.

LatentDebater
Posts: 136
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1/27/2013 2:38:11 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
I think so because it is the way we are naturally to be.
I don't suffer from insanity; I enjoy every minute of it.

People who think they know everything are extremely irritating to those of us who do.

"If you believe in a god, just tell me why you don't believe in all the other gods. The reasons you give will be why I don't believe in yours." - Ricky THEGENIUS Gervais
Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
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1/27/2013 4:01:21 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/27/2013 2:38:11 AM, LatentDebater wrote:
I think so because it is the way we are naturally to be.

You think vegetarianism is stupid because we are naturally supposed to be vegetarians?
My work here is, finally, done.
LatentDebater
Posts: 136
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1/27/2013 4:45:16 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
No to eat meat.
I don't suffer from insanity; I enjoy every minute of it.

People who think they know everything are extremely irritating to those of us who do.

"If you believe in a god, just tell me why you don't believe in all the other gods. The reasons you give will be why I don't believe in yours." - Ricky THEGENIUS Gervais
royalpaladin
Posts: 22,357
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1/27/2013 6:00:06 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Since when was what we are naturally inclined to do proper or just? You're naturally inclined to murder. That doesn't mean that not murdering is a bad thing.
tmar19652
Posts: 727
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1/27/2013 6:05:36 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
There was an old native american proverb about a great vegetarian. I'm pretty sure his name was badshot
"Politics is supposed to be the second-oldest profession. I have come to realize that it bears a very close resemblance to the first." -Ronald Reagan

"The notion of political correctness declares certain topics, certain ex<x>pressions even certain gestures off-limits. What began as a crusade for civility has soured into a cause of conflict and even censorship." -George H.W. Bush
vbaculum
Posts: 1,274
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1/27/2013 9:58:28 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/27/2013 2:38:11 AM, LatentDebater wrote:
I think so because it is the way we are naturally to be.

It's an appeal to nature.

http://www.fallacyfiles.org...
"If you claim to value nonviolence and you consume animal products, you need to rethink your position on nonviolence." - Gary Francione

THE WORLD IS VEGAN! If you want it
johnnyboy54
Posts: 6,362
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1/27/2013 12:06:29 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/27/2013 11:54:08 AM, darkkermit wrote:
We're also natural rapist and killers, so not doing so would be stupid.

Agreed. I'll see you all in prison.
I didn't order assholes with my whiskey.
Kinesis
Posts: 3,667
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1/27/2013 1:02:52 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/27/2013 10:44:42 AM, Mirza wrote:
"I'm not a vegetarian because I love animals. I'm a vegetarian because I hate plants." - Alan Brown

Eating meat ultimately kills more plants.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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1/27/2013 1:06:24 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/27/2013 1:02:52 PM, Kinesis wrote:
At 1/27/2013 10:44:42 AM, Mirza wrote:
"I'm not a vegetarian because I love animals. I'm a vegetarian because I hate plants." - Alan Brown

Eating meat ultimately kills more plants.
It's the animals getting the pleasure though!
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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1/27/2013 1:15:37 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Vegetarianism, as a dietary choice, isn't stupid. It's just that, it's a dietary choice no more significant than me deciding between ham and cheese or turkey and cheese for lunch.

Just keep the ill-grounded pseudoethical nonsense to yourself.

"How can you tell if someone is a vegetarian?

Don't worry, they'll tell you."
Kinesis
Posts: 3,667
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1/27/2013 1:24:56 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/27/2013 1:15:37 PM, drafterman wrote:
Vegetarianism, as a dietary choice, isn't stupid. It's just that, it's a dietary choice no more significant than me deciding between ham and cheese or turkey and cheese for lunch.

Just keep the ill-grounded pseudoethical nonsense to yourself.

"How can you tell if someone is a vegetarian?

Don't worry, they'll tell you."


In my experience the people complaining about militant vegetarian are more vocal and annoying than vegetarians themselves. And there are plenty of good ethical arguments in vegetarianism's favour.
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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1/27/2013 1:36:17 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/27/2013 1:24:56 PM, Kinesis wrote:
At 1/27/2013 1:15:37 PM, drafterman wrote:
Vegetarianism, as a dietary choice, isn't stupid. It's just that, it's a dietary choice no more significant than me deciding between ham and cheese or turkey and cheese for lunch.

Just keep the ill-grounded pseudoethical nonsense to yourself.

"How can you tell if someone is a vegetarian?

Don't worry, they'll tell you."


In my experience the people complaining about militant vegetarian are more vocal and annoying than vegetarians themselves.

In mainstream media, I'll agree to that. In my personal, direct, experience? I'd have to say no.

And there are plenty of good ethical arguments in vegetarianism's favour.

Care to share one?
Kinesis
Posts: 3,667
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1/27/2013 2:13:25 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/27/2013 1:36:17 PM, drafterman wrote:
In my experience the people complaining about militant vegetarian are more vocal and annoying than vegetarians themselves.

In mainstream media, I'll agree to that. In my personal, direct, experience? I'd have to say no.

Well then, I guess we cancel each other out.

And there are plenty of good ethical arguments in vegetarianism's favour.

Care to share one?

A significant number of animals sold to us for consumption undergo extreme avoidable suffering via their rearing and slaughtering processes. There is no easy way to distinguish between meat products which do and do not cause this suffering. So, assuming some kind of moral imperative to avoid causing large amounts of unavoidable suffering, meat products should be avoided so as to reduce the economics demand for such products.
wrichcirw
Posts: 11,196
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1/27/2013 2:25:16 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/27/2013 1:15:37 PM, drafterman wrote:
Vegetarianism, as a dietary choice, isn't stupid. It's just that, it's a dietary choice no more significant than me deciding between ham and cheese or turkey and cheese for lunch.

Just keep the ill-grounded pseudoethical nonsense to yourself.

"How can you tell if someone is a vegetarian?

Don't worry, they'll tell you."


It takes about 7 grams of vegetable protein to raise one gram of animal protein.

In this sense, vegetarianism, or at least a preference for vegetable proteins, is an economical and efficient dietary choice. In this sense, it is significant.
At 8/9/2013 9:41:24 AM, wrichcirw wrote:
If you are civil with me, I will be civil to you. If you decide to bring unreasonable animosity to bear in a reasonable discussion, then what would you expect other than to get flustered?
popculturepooka
Posts: 7,924
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1/27/2013 2:26:10 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I dare anyone who thinks vegeterianism or veganism is stupid to read Gary Francione's work.

I'm sure vbaculum could lay those arguments out better than I can.
At 10/3/2016 11:49:13 PM, thett3 wrote:
BLACK LIVES MATTER!
tmar19652
Posts: 727
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1/27/2013 2:35:41 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/27/2013 2:25:16 PM, wrichcirw wrote:
At 1/27/2013 1:15:37 PM, drafterman wrote:
Vegetarianism, as a dietary choice, isn't stupid. It's just that, it's a dietary choice no more significant than me deciding between ham and cheese or turkey and cheese for lunch.

Just keep the ill-grounded pseudoethical nonsense to yourself.

"How can you tell if someone is a vegetarian?

Don't worry, they'll tell you."


It takes about 7 grams of vegetable protein to raise one gram of animal protein.

In this sense, vegetarianism, or at least a preference for vegetable proteins, is an economical and efficient dietary choice. In this sense, it is significant.

Athletes still need the creatine from meat or a supplement.
"Politics is supposed to be the second-oldest profession. I have come to realize that it bears a very close resemblance to the first." -Ronald Reagan

"The notion of political correctness declares certain topics, certain ex<x>pressions even certain gestures off-limits. What began as a crusade for civility has soured into a cause of conflict and even censorship." -George H.W. Bush
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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1/27/2013 2:36:28 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/27/2013 2:13:25 PM, Kinesis wrote:
At 1/27/2013 1:36:17 PM, drafterman wrote:
In my experience the people complaining about militant vegetarian are more vocal and annoying than vegetarians themselves.

In mainstream media, I'll agree to that. In my personal, direct, experience? I'd have to say no.

Well then, I guess we cancel each other out.

And there are plenty of good ethical arguments in vegetarianism's favour.

Care to share one?

A significant number of animals sold to us for consumption undergo extreme avoidable suffering via their rearing and slaughtering processes. There is no easy way to distinguish between meat products which do and do not cause this suffering. So, assuming some kind of moral imperative to avoid causing large amounts of unavoidable suffering, meat products should be avoided so as to reduce the economics demand for such products.

1. I don't agree with a moral imperative to avoid causing large amounts of suffering to animals in general.

2. If I did, the degree to which I'm directly causing that suffering (or even indirectly causing it) is minuscule. If we were going with some sort of quantitative moral calculus, and I concluded that my increase in happiness outweighs the increase in suffering (that I am personally responsible for), then I could still adhere to that premise and continue to eat meat.

3. Non-meat food still has to be grown, harvested, and processed in such a fashion. What of the work conditions of the humans that do that? If we judge that they suffer in providing us produce, should we stop eating altogether?

4. The issue you highlighted are practical issues, not theoretical ones. It requires no restriction against eating meat where the source didn't suffer (died of natural causes, for example) so it seems to me that it is a problem that can be avoided while still allowing me to eat meat and, thus, hardly necessitates vegetarianism. Certainly adhering to vegetarianism is a solution (albeit an overkill one), but so would fasting to death, but I'd be hard pressed to call this an argument for doing that.
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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1/27/2013 2:40:44 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/27/2013 2:25:16 PM, wrichcirw wrote:
At 1/27/2013 1:15:37 PM, drafterman wrote:
Vegetarianism, as a dietary choice, isn't stupid. It's just that, it's a dietary choice no more significant than me deciding between ham and cheese or turkey and cheese for lunch.

Just keep the ill-grounded pseudoethical nonsense to yourself.

"How can you tell if someone is a vegetarian?

Don't worry, they'll tell you."


It takes about 7 grams of vegetable protein to raise one gram of animal protein.

In this sense, vegetarianism, or at least a preference for vegetable proteins, is an economical and efficient dietary choice. In this sense, it is significant.

I don't doubt the statistic, though, if this were all there was to it, then shouldn't poorer areas, where food is at a premium, rely primarily on vegetable crops, and eschew hunting or pastoralism?
wrichcirw
Posts: 11,196
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1/27/2013 3:06:55 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/27/2013 2:40:44 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 1/27/2013 2:25:16 PM, wrichcirw wrote:
At 1/27/2013 1:15:37 PM, drafterman wrote:
Vegetarianism, as a dietary choice, isn't stupid. It's just that, it's a dietary choice no more significant than me deciding between ham and cheese or turkey and cheese for lunch.

Just keep the ill-grounded pseudoethical nonsense to yourself.

"How can you tell if someone is a vegetarian?

Don't worry, they'll tell you."


It takes about 7 grams of vegetable protein to raise one gram of animal protein.

In this sense, vegetarianism, or at least a preference for vegetable proteins, is an economical and efficient dietary choice. In this sense, it is significant.

I don't doubt the statistic, though, if this were all there was to it, then shouldn't poorer areas, where food is at a premium, rely primarily on vegetable crops, and eschew hunting or pastoralism?

They do. India is exhibit #A of this.
At 8/9/2013 9:41:24 AM, wrichcirw wrote:
If you are civil with me, I will be civil to you. If you decide to bring unreasonable animosity to bear in a reasonable discussion, then what would you expect other than to get flustered?
wrichcirw
Posts: 11,196
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1/27/2013 3:08:11 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/27/2013 2:35:41 PM, tmar19652 wrote:
At 1/27/2013 2:25:16 PM, wrichcirw wrote:
At 1/27/2013 1:15:37 PM, drafterman wrote:
Vegetarianism, as a dietary choice, isn't stupid. It's just that, it's a dietary choice no more significant than me deciding between ham and cheese or turkey and cheese for lunch.

Just keep the ill-grounded pseudoethical nonsense to yourself.

"How can you tell if someone is a vegetarian?

Don't worry, they'll tell you."


It takes about 7 grams of vegetable protein to raise one gram of animal protein.

In this sense, vegetarianism, or at least a preference for vegetable proteins, is an economical and efficient dietary choice. In this sense, it is significant.

Athletes still need the creatine from meat or a supplement.

I've heard there are complete combinations of protein available from just vegetables. I'm not exactly sure of creatine, but beans and rice ostensibly provide a full combination of proteins, for example.
At 8/9/2013 9:41:24 AM, wrichcirw wrote:
If you are civil with me, I will be civil to you. If you decide to bring unreasonable animosity to bear in a reasonable discussion, then what would you expect other than to get flustered?
wrichcirw
Posts: 11,196
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1/27/2013 3:09:28 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/27/2013 3:06:55 PM, wrichcirw wrote:
At 1/27/2013 2:40:44 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 1/27/2013 2:25:16 PM, wrichcirw wrote:
At 1/27/2013 1:15:37 PM, drafterman wrote:
Vegetarianism, as a dietary choice, isn't stupid. It's just that, it's a dietary choice no more significant than me deciding between ham and cheese or turkey and cheese for lunch.

Just keep the ill-grounded pseudoethical nonsense to yourself.

"How can you tell if someone is a vegetarian?

Don't worry, they'll tell you."


It takes about 7 grams of vegetable protein to raise one gram of animal protein.

In this sense, vegetarianism, or at least a preference for vegetable proteins, is an economical and efficient dietary choice. In this sense, it is significant.

I don't doubt the statistic, though, if this were all there was to it, then shouldn't poorer areas, where food is at a premium, rely primarily on vegetable crops, and eschew hunting or pastoralism?

They do. India is exhibit #A of this.

China is buying international farmland at an ungodly rate. Why? Because of their country's increase consumption of pork. They need more soybeans to feed to pigs.
At 8/9/2013 9:41:24 AM, wrichcirw wrote:
If you are civil with me, I will be civil to you. If you decide to bring unreasonable animosity to bear in a reasonable discussion, then what would you expect other than to get flustered?
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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1/27/2013 3:09:35 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/27/2013 3:06:55 PM, wrichcirw wrote:
At 1/27/2013 2:40:44 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 1/27/2013 2:25:16 PM, wrichcirw wrote:
At 1/27/2013 1:15:37 PM, drafterman wrote:
Vegetarianism, as a dietary choice, isn't stupid. It's just that, it's a dietary choice no more significant than me deciding between ham and cheese or turkey and cheese for lunch.

Just keep the ill-grounded pseudoethical nonsense to yourself.

"How can you tell if someone is a vegetarian?

Don't worry, they'll tell you."


It takes about 7 grams of vegetable protein to raise one gram of animal protein.

In this sense, vegetarianism, or at least a preference for vegetable proteins, is an economical and efficient dietary choice. In this sense, it is significant.

I don't doubt the statistic, though, if this were all there was to it, then shouldn't poorer areas, where food is at a premium, rely primarily on vegetable crops, and eschew hunting or pastoralism?

They do. India is exhibit #A of this.

Yeah...

But...

Curry?!
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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1/27/2013 3:10:15 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
BTW, I don't contest that it is more economical. I'm not universally opposed to vegetarianism (my first statement was to disagree that it is, on the whole, stupid).
tmar19652
Posts: 727
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1/27/2013 3:11:29 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/27/2013 3:08:11 PM, wrichcirw wrote:
At 1/27/2013 2:35:41 PM, tmar19652 wrote:
At 1/27/2013 2:25:16 PM, wrichcirw wrote:
At 1/27/2013 1:15:37 PM, drafterman wrote:
Vegetarianism, as a dietary choice, isn't stupid. It's just that, it's a dietary choice no more significant than me deciding between ham and cheese or turkey and cheese for lunch.

Just keep the ill-grounded pseudoethical nonsense to yourself.

"How can you tell if someone is a vegetarian?

Don't worry, they'll tell you."


It takes about 7 grams of vegetable protein to raise one gram of animal protein.

In this sense, vegetarianism, or at least a preference for vegetable proteins, is an economical and efficient dietary choice. In this sense, it is significant.

Athletes still need the creatine from meat or a supplement.

I've heard there are complete combinations of protein available from just vegetables. I'm not exactly sure of creatine, but beans and rice ostensibly provide a full combination of proteins, for example.
Creatine is soley from animal meats
"Politics is supposed to be the second-oldest profession. I have come to realize that it bears a very close resemblance to the first." -Ronald Reagan

"The notion of political correctness declares certain topics, certain ex<x>pressions even certain gestures off-limits. What began as a crusade for civility has soured into a cause of conflict and even censorship." -George H.W. Bush
wrichcirw
Posts: 11,196
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1/27/2013 3:19:49 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/27/2013 3:10:15 PM, drafterman wrote:
BTW, I don't contest that it is more economical. I'm not universally opposed to vegetarianism (my first statement was to disagree that it is, on the whole, stupid).

Yeah, agree with you here, lol
At 8/9/2013 9:41:24 AM, wrichcirw wrote:
If you are civil with me, I will be civil to you. If you decide to bring unreasonable animosity to bear in a reasonable discussion, then what would you expect other than to get flustered?
wrichcirw
Posts: 11,196
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1/27/2013 3:21:09 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/27/2013 3:11:29 PM, tmar19652 wrote:
At 1/27/2013 3:08:11 PM, wrichcirw wrote:
At 1/27/2013 2:35:41 PM, tmar19652 wrote:
At 1/27/2013 2:25:16 PM, wrichcirw wrote:
At 1/27/2013 1:15:37 PM, drafterman wrote:
Vegetarianism, as a dietary choice, isn't stupid. It's just that, it's a dietary choice no more significant than me deciding between ham and cheese or turkey and cheese for lunch.

Just keep the ill-grounded pseudoethical nonsense to yourself.

"How can you tell if someone is a vegetarian?

Don't worry, they'll tell you."


It takes about 7 grams of vegetable protein to raise one gram of animal protein.

In this sense, vegetarianism, or at least a preference for vegetable proteins, is an economical and efficient dietary choice. In this sense, it is significant.

Athletes still need the creatine from meat or a supplement.

I've heard there are complete combinations of protein available from just vegetables. I'm not exactly sure of creatine, but beans and rice ostensibly provide a full combination of proteins, for example.
Creatine is soley from animal meats

"Creatine is naturally produced in the human body from amino acids primarily in the kidney and liver. It is transported in the blood for use by muscles. Approximately 95% of the human body's total creatine is located in skeletal muscle.[4]
Creatine is not an essential nutrient, as it is manufactured in the human body from L-arginine, glycine, and L-methionine."

http://en.wikipedia.org...
At 8/9/2013 9:41:24 AM, wrichcirw wrote:
If you are civil with me, I will be civil to you. If you decide to bring unreasonable animosity to bear in a reasonable discussion, then what would you expect other than to get flustered?
wrichcirw
Posts: 11,196
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1/27/2013 3:21:27 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/27/2013 3:17:20 PM, ishallannoyyo wrote:
Have any of you had a good steak?

That's why I'm not vegetarian.

Me neither, lol
At 8/9/2013 9:41:24 AM, wrichcirw wrote:
If you are civil with me, I will be civil to you. If you decide to bring unreasonable animosity to bear in a reasonable discussion, then what would you expect other than to get flustered?