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The Unofficial Christopher Dorner Thread

wrichcirw
Posts: 11,196
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2/14/2013 4:45:43 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
What event could have possibly taken precedence over the State of the Union of a second-term black POTUS? A manhunt for a black cop that had apparently taken vigilante action against perceived racial injustice by the very department where he used to work.

http://www.latimes.com...
http://www.cnn.com...
http://www.cnn.com...
https://sites.google.com...

The LAPD is no stranger to racial violence. I'm old enough to remember the Rodney King riots. I still remember Reginald Denny. I still remember the Korean business owners doing their own police work, arming themselves with shotguns against the Mexican looters.

And now, we have Christopher Dorner. Was this latest perpetrator of a mass shooting insane? If you read his manifesto, he certainly acknowledged that he suffered from clinical depression:

If possible, I want my brain preserved for science/research to study the effects of severe depression on an individual"s brain. Since 6/26/08 when I was relieved of duty and 1/2/09 when I was terminated I have been afflicted with severe depression.

---

Background:

In February 2013, a series of shootings occurred in Orange and Riverside counties in California, United States, in which the victims were law enforcement officers, their families, or civilians misidentified as the suspect. Christopher Dorner, 33, an ex-Navy Reservist and former Los Angeles police officer, was named as a suspect wanted in connection to a series of shootings that occurred throughout Southern California that killed four people and wounded three others.

A manifesto posted[1][2][3] on Facebook,[4] which police say was written by Dorner,[5] declared "unconventional and asymmetric warfare" upon the Los Angeles Police Department, their families, and their associates, until the LAPD admitted publicly he was fired in retaliation for reporting excessive force.

In two separate incidents during the manhunt, police shot at three civilians unrelated to Dorner, mistaking their pickup trucks for the vehicle being driven by Dorner. One of the civilians was hit by the police gunfire, another was wounded by shattered glass, and a third individual was injured when police rammed his vehicle and opened fire.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

Dorner was born in 1979 in New York; he grew up in Los Angeles County. He attended elementary school at Norwalk Christian School from first to seventh grade. He stated in a published manifesto that he was the only African American student at Norwalk Christian School, where he encountered many racial issues with his peers, and was raised in neighborhoods with scant black populations. He said he was frequently disciplined for being involved with fights with other students in response to the racist name-calling.
http://en.wikipedia.org...

---

Some are lauding him as a hero:

The sympathizers have garnered 18,336 supporters on a Facebook page entitled "We Stand With Christopher Dorner." The online group has posted Dorner's manifesto against corrupt police, a document that was "scrubbed by mainstream media outlets," the webpage charges.

Another Facebook page, "We Are All Chris Dorner," had 3,819 "likes," or followers, with 6,620 people talking about the page devoted to how the 6-foot, 270-pound Dorner was "the victim of a manhunt and smear campaign. 5 years ago he was fired from the LAPD for seeking to expose corruption within it."


Were his actions right? Were they at all justified?

---

From his manifesto, published shortly after his killing spree:

I know most of you who personally know me are in disbelief to hear from media reports that I am suspected of committing such horrendous murders and have taken drastic and shocking actions in the last couple of days. You are saying to yourself that this is completely out of character of the man you knew who always wore a smile wherever he was seen. I know I will be villified by the LAPD and the media.

I have exhausted all available means at obtaining my name back. I have attempted all legal court efforts within appeals at the Superior Courts and California Appellate courts. This is my last resort. The LAPD has suppressed the truth and it has now lead to deadly consequences.

I lost my position as a Commanding Officer of a Naval Security Forces reserve unit at NAS Fallon because of the LAPD. I"ve lost a relationship with my mother and sister because of the LAPD. I"ve lost a relationship with close friends because of the LAPD. In essence, I"ve lost everything because the LAPD took my name and new I was INNOCENT!!! Capt Phil Tingirides, Justin Eisenberg, Martella, Randy Quan, and Sgt. Anderson all new I was innocent but decided to terminate me so they could continue Ofcr. Teresa Evans career. I know about the meeting between all of you where Evans attorney, Rico, confessed that she kicked Christopher Gettler (excessive force). Your day has come.


Christopher Gettler is diagnosed with schizophrenia and dementia, and is the only witness that corroborated Dorner's claims. The LAPD declared he was not a competent witness, and that Dorner fabricated the claims against Evans. Dorner claims this led to his termination of employment at the LAPD.

---

Apparently Dorner had anarchist leanings:

Anonymous, you are hated, vilified, and considered an enemy to the state. I personally view you as a culture and a necessity that brings truth to a cloaked world. Forge ahead!

---

What are your thoughts on this matter?
At 8/9/2013 9:41:24 AM, wrichcirw wrote:
If you are civil with me, I will be civil to you. If you decide to bring unreasonable animosity to bear in a reasonable discussion, then what would you expect other than to get flustered?
Wnope
Posts: 6,924
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2/14/2013 10:34:15 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I read the manifesto and one detail popped out at me that, assuming its true, probably indicates this guy did not have a happy childhood.

Again, I'm assuming what he says happened to himself is true.

The guy says his first encounter with racism was in first grade, when another student called him the n word. In return, Dorner punched him in the face. The teacher came up, learned about the situation, whacked the kid, and then whacked Dorner for making trouble.

What sticks out to me is his reaction.

Nearly all black Americans encounter racism at a young age. But how many seven year olds, upon first exposure to racism, physically lash out at a stranger?

When we're young and don't have any real social experience, we tend to internalize the reactions of our parents to events as general guidelines.

Now, it could be that Dorner saw his dad beat up a white guy who called him cracker.

Except Dorner claims his fight was his FIRST encounter with racism.

If that's true (and that's a HUGE if) then this guy has grown up with the expectation that violence is an appropriate reaction to threats. And considering the amount of moves he's gone through, it's less likely due to a particular environment.

This doesn't mean Dorner was anything but nice and sweet, but where other people might curse and shout, it seems Dorner was more likely to be violent.

In a way, you can see though how Dorners situation was the perfect storm for everything that drove him psychologically towards violence. Racism, helplessness, losing face/honor/identity.

But place a vast majority of people in Dorner's role at the police force, and you won't get someone who resorts to shooting people.
Volkov
Posts: 9,765
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2/14/2013 11:09:09 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Reading Dorner's manifesto and some of his background, plus his actions in this specific case, the man was clearly not a rational actor. I think that is something that people need to remember, especially some of those that have, incredibly, defended the guy. There's no way you can rationally get from "I've been wronged by the LAPD" to "I'm going to murder the families of LAPD officers," which Dorner did and threatened to continue to do, even for those officers that weren't involved in his case. The entirety LAPD, or it seems any police force, were open targets - you just can't get to there if you have a sane, rational mindset.

That's my piece, anyways. Its a shame he ended up dead, but what could you have really expected to happen? I seriously doubt he was going to willingly go into custody.
YYW
Posts: 36,256
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2/14/2013 11:21:20 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I obviously don't know if his claims are true or not. What I do know is that organizations with strong institutional fraternal bonds (like the police, military, etc.) tend to protect their own, even and especially from attacks that originate from within. However, whether Dorner's claims are true or not, that does not justify the psychotic rampage he led California on.
Tsar of DDO
OberHerr
Posts: 13,062
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2/14/2013 11:36:06 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
While he may be right about the LAPD, which we have NO proof that he was I might add, even if he was right about everything....that in no way justifies his actions, or even makes them a plausible response. Like Wope said, while most people would be really pissed, and hold a grudge of life perhaps, maybe even go on a personal crusade of trying to bring the organizations rep down......99% of people wouldn't do what he did.

What bugs me even more, is that he not only killed innocent family members, cause that makes sense, but he killed cops simply because they were cops. The most ironical sad part about his killing spree is that no one he killed wad a LAPD cop.
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"Cases are anti-town." - FourTrouble

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wrichcirw
Posts: 11,196
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2/15/2013 12:11:11 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/14/2013 10:34:15 PM, Wnope wrote:
I read the manifesto and one detail popped out at me that, assuming its true, probably indicates this guy did not have a happy childhood.

Again, I'm assuming what he says happened to himself is true.

The guy says his first encounter with racism was in first grade, when another student called him the n word. In return, Dorner punched him in the face. The teacher came up, learned about the situation, whacked the kid, and then whacked Dorner for making trouble.

What sticks out to me is his reaction.

Nearly all black Americans encounter racism at a young age. But how many seven year olds, upon first exposure to racism, physically lash out at a stranger?

When we're young and don't have any real social experience, we tend to internalize the reactions of our parents to events as general guidelines.

Now, it could be that Dorner saw his dad beat up a white guy who called him cracker.

Except Dorner claims his fight was his FIRST encounter with racism.

If that's true (and that's a HUGE if) then this guy has grown up with the expectation that violence is an appropriate reaction to threats. And considering the amount of moves he's gone through, it's less likely due to a particular environment.

This doesn't mean Dorner was anything but nice and sweet, but where other people might curse and shout, it seems Dorner was more likely to be violent.

In a way, you can see though how Dorners situation was the perfect storm for everything that drove him psychologically towards violence. Racism, helplessness, losing face/honor/identity.

But place a vast majority of people in Dorner's role at the police force, and you won't get someone who resorts to shooting people.

I fully agree with this statement. My name is wrichcirw, and I approve this message. :D
At 8/9/2013 9:41:24 AM, wrichcirw wrote:
If you are civil with me, I will be civil to you. If you decide to bring unreasonable animosity to bear in a reasonable discussion, then what would you expect other than to get flustered?
wrichcirw
Posts: 11,196
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2/15/2013 12:14:50 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/14/2013 11:36:06 PM, OberHerr wrote:
While he may be right about the LAPD, which we have NO proof that he was I might add, even if he was right about everything....that in no way justifies his actions, or even makes them a plausible response. Like Wope said, while most people would be really pissed, and hold a grudge of life perhaps, maybe even go on a personal crusade of trying to bring the organizations rep down......99% of people wouldn't do what he did.

What bugs me even more, is that he not only killed innocent family members, cause that makes sense, but he killed cops simply because they were cops. The most ironical sad part about his killing spree is that no one he killed wad a LAPD cop.

Wow, didn't know that. That makes the case even more bizarre. Why are people lauding him as a hero?
At 8/9/2013 9:41:24 AM, wrichcirw wrote:
If you are civil with me, I will be civil to you. If you decide to bring unreasonable animosity to bear in a reasonable discussion, then what would you expect other than to get flustered?
Agent_Orange
Posts: 2,252
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2/15/2013 12:20:59 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/15/2013 12:14:50 AM, wrichcirw wrote:
At 2/14/2013 11:36:06 PM, OberHerr wrote:
While he may be right about the LAPD, which we have NO proof that he was I might add, even if he was right about everything....that in no way justifies his actions, or even makes them a plausible response. Like Wope said, while most people would be really pissed, and hold a grudge of life perhaps, maybe even go on a personal crusade of trying to bring the organizations rep down......99% of people wouldn't do what he did.

What bugs me even more, is that he not only killed innocent family members, cause that makes sense, but he killed cops simply because they were cops. The most ironical sad part about his killing spree is that no one he killed wad a LAPD cop.

Wow, didn't know that. That makes the case even more bizarre. Why are people lauding him as a hero?

Because people are idiots. For some reason we see the cops as oppressors, regardless of how many good cops they are or how many lives have been saved by police intervention. Doesn't matter how many rapist and murders are behind bars, we have to believe that they're all villains.
#BlackLivesMatter
OberHerr
Posts: 13,062
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2/15/2013 1:05:20 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Ugh, SOOO many spelling errors. I wish we could have an edit post thing.....*sigh*

But, on topic. Most of the time his defenders basically say he was driven to do it, LAPD is obviously corrupt because....their cops. I mean cop = crook right(sarcasm)?

Now, I'm willing to believe the LAPD has some racist mentally-disabled people kickers.....but somehow, even though they won't openly admit this, they always imply that this would justify him killing them. And then, and I find this hilarious, they cite the epidsode were some LAPD cops ACCIDENTALLY(keyword) shot some Asian woman that were in a truck that vaguely matched the description of his truck. This was a big, huge mistake. They should have at least identified the person inside. They should be in staged, and if necessary, punished. But how the fvck does that prove that the LAPD is corrupt, racist, evil mental people kickers? And how does it justify his actions?

Answer: it doesn't.

But, if you want to know the full extent of his victims, what I know from the news is he killed one of the LAPD cops daughter, I think, and her fianc"e. He also killed two cops that weren't LAPD. He may have killed another somewhere in there. And, he killed another cop during he firefight between him and the cops that took place somewhere around the cabin, who also was a cop from a different county.

He may have killed one LAPD as far as I know, though I think that cop also wasnt LAPD.
-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-OBERHERR'S SIGNATURE-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-

Official Enforcer for the DDO Elite(if they existed).

"Cases are anti-town." - FourTrouble

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Oryus
Posts: 8,280
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2/15/2013 11:47:38 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
You forgot the report from America's finest news source:
http://www.theonion.com...
: : :Tulle: The fool, I purposely don't engage with you because you don't have proper command of the English language.
: :
: : The Fool: It's my English writing. Either way It's okay have a larger vocabulary then you, and a better grasp of language, and you're a woman.
:
: I'm just going to leave this precious struggle nugget right here.