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Genetic differences between races?

dylancatlow
Posts: 12,254
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2/16/2013 1:12:56 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
What is your opinion on genetics factors playing a role in the difference of performance between races in intellectual pursuits? I myself think genetics does play a factor.
GarretKadeDupre
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2/16/2013 1:18:27 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I don't understand how this can even be studied. I mean, blacks overall in the U.S. might score lower than average, but that's probably because they are more likely to be uneducated and thus caused by society and not genetics.

That's just a bunch of my own assumptions, though.
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dylancatlow
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2/16/2013 1:25:02 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/16/2013 1:18:27 PM, GarretKadeDupre wrote:
I don't understand how this can even be studied. I mean, blacks overall in the U.S. might score lower than average, but that's probably because they are more likely to be uneducated and thus caused by society and not genetics.

That's just a bunch of my own assumptions, though.

I understand your point. However, I think it may be a self-fulfilling prophecy. People who, on average, are less intelligent, are not going to complete school as often.
dylancatlow
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2/16/2013 1:27:49 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Some concrete evidence in my opinion is the fact that Brain size and intelligence are correlated to about .4-.5 (about the same as siblings), and the brain size between races is different, and appropriated as one would expect if intelligence and brain size were correlated.
dylancatlow
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2/16/2013 1:28:43 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/16/2013 1:27:49 PM, dylancatlow wrote:
Some concrete evidence in my opinion is the fact that Brain size and intelligence are correlated to about .4-.5 (about the same as siblings), and the brain size between races is different, and appropriated as one would expect if intelligence and brain size were correlated.

Appropriated isn't the right word. I meant proportioned -- or is that even right? If you know the word I'm trying to say here please tell me.
dylancatlow
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2/16/2013 1:29:47 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/16/2013 1:26:15 PM, GarretKadeDupre wrote:
Exactly.

You misunderstand me. I'm saying low intelligence CAUSES poor permanence at school, and in return, poor performance in school causes increased mental deficits.
GarretKadeDupre
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2/16/2013 1:30:30 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Yeah, its proportioned.

Are you saying that brain size is correlated with intelligence?
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dylancatlow
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2/16/2013 1:31:12 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/16/2013 1:30:30 PM, GarretKadeDupre wrote:
Yeah, its proportioned.

Are you saying that brain size is correlated with intelligence?

Yes.
GarretKadeDupre
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2/16/2013 1:31:18 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Wait, how can it be possible to perform a study that differentiates between potential intelligence and intelligence?
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dylancatlow
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2/16/2013 1:33:30 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/16/2013 1:31:18 PM, GarretKadeDupre wrote:
Wait, how can it be possible to perform a study that differentiates between potential intelligence and intelligence?

I don't think environment factors play as big of a role as most think. Reared-apart win studies show genetics plays a larger role than environment.
dylancatlow
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2/16/2013 1:33:49 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/16/2013 1:33:30 PM, dylancatlow wrote:
At 2/16/2013 1:31:18 PM, GarretKadeDupre wrote:
Wait, how can it be possible to perform a study that differentiates between potential intelligence and intelligence?

I don't think environment factors play as big of a role as most think. Reared-apart win studies show genetics plays a larger role than environment.

in intelligence *
dylancatlow
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2/16/2013 1:35:10 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Essentially, if there are differences between intelligence between races, nothing contrasts with it. Not education, nor racism.
dylancatlow
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2/16/2013 1:36:56 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
While I don't think ALL the differences between races is because of genetic differences, I do think ALL the factors that play a role can be traced back to genetics, and genetics can be traced back to differences in environment.
16kadams
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2/16/2013 1:44:17 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
The differences are mostly environmental.
https://www.youtube.com...
https://rekonomics.wordpress.com...
"A trend is a trend, but the question is, will it bend? Will it alter its course through some unforeseen force and come to a premature end?" -- Alec Cairncross
16kadams
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2/16/2013 2:16:57 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/16/2013 1:59:59 PM, dylancatlow wrote:
At 2/16/2013 1:44:17 PM, 16kadams wrote:
The differences are mostly environmental.

Evidence?

Education accounts for most of this difference, since blacks are less likely to be forced by their parents to attend school and reside in poor schooling areas most often.
http://journals.cambridge.org...
https://www.youtube.com...
https://rekonomics.wordpress.com...
"A trend is a trend, but the question is, will it bend? Will it alter its course through some unforeseen force and come to a premature end?" -- Alec Cairncross
dylancatlow
Posts: 12,254
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2/16/2013 2:20:32 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/16/2013 2:16:57 PM, 16kadams wrote:
At 2/16/2013 1:59:59 PM, dylancatlow wrote:
At 2/16/2013 1:44:17 PM, 16kadams wrote:
The differences are mostly environmental.

Evidence?

Education accounts for most of this difference, since blacks are less likely to be forced by their parents to attend school and reside in poor schooling areas most often.
http://journals.cambridge.org...

While education does play a role in functional intelligence, I don't think this issue is in a vacuum. If one race is less intelligent than another, of course school won't be as big of a priority, and of course that race is going to be less affluent. I think the situation is best described as a self-fulfilling prophecy.
darkkermit
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2/16/2013 2:42:35 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/16/2013 2:16:57 PM, 16kadams wrote:
At 2/16/2013 1:59:59 PM, dylancatlow wrote:
At 2/16/2013 1:44:17 PM, 16kadams wrote:
The differences are mostly environmental.

Evidence?

Education accounts for most of this difference, since blacks are less likely to be forced by their parents to attend school and reside in poor schooling areas most often.
http://journals.cambridge.org...

Education doesn't do much to raise your IQ. I believe it increases it somewhat increased it, but not by a whole lot.
Open borders debate:
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Skepsikyma
Posts: 8,286
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2/16/2013 5:08:48 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/16/2013 1:36:56 PM, dylancatlow wrote:
While I don't think ALL the differences between races is because of genetic differences, I do think ALL the factors that play a role can be traced back to genetics, and genetics can be traced back to differences in environment.

Please explain this further. Genetics doesn't control every aspect of an individual's life, especially a human being. Do you understand how genes affect people? Can you explain the processes involved? I'm just trying figure out how much of genetics and neurology I'm going to have to clarify.
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
tulle
Posts: 4,445
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2/16/2013 5:21:35 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/16/2013 2:42:35 PM, darkkermit wrote:
At 2/16/2013 2:16:57 PM, 16kadams wrote:
At 2/16/2013 1:59:59 PM, dylancatlow wrote:
At 2/16/2013 1:44:17 PM, 16kadams wrote:
The differences are mostly environmental.

Evidence?

Education accounts for most of this difference, since blacks are less likely to be forced by their parents to attend school and reside in poor schooling areas most often.
http://journals.cambridge.org...

Education doesn't do much to raise your IQ. I believe it increases it somewhat increased it, but not by a whole lot.

Oh man. I just spent the last hour or so reading the Intelligence and Psychological Testing chapter of my intro psych book. I cant wait to get to a laptop and dispell this ridiculousness once and for all.
yang.
malcolmxy
Posts: 2,855
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2/16/2013 5:50:16 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/16/2013 1:12:56 PM, dylancatlow wrote:
What is your opinion on genetics factors playing a role in the difference of performance between races in intellectual pursuits? I myself think genetics does play a factor.

Mongoloids have larger skulls, so this explains the "Asians are smart" thing. I'm not supposed to call them that anymore, but since not all of these people come from Asia (North American Indians fall in this class, as do a few other, non-asian groups), whatever...it's strictly an anthropological term (which also means retard, but whatever).

I haven't looked into the Negroid and Caucasoid groups as much, so I don't know as much there, but I do know that we bred American Black Men to be stronger and have greater endurance, as well as American Black Women to be plump and fertile.

I know this, by the way, because I read Frederick Douglass and he clued me into it.
War is over, if you want it.

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Logic_on_rails
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2/16/2013 5:50:27 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I'm going to recommend 2 very useful sources on this matter:

Intelligence A Very Short Introduction by Ian J. Deary ; and
Intelligence: knowns and unknowns by the American Psychological Associations Task Force (you ought to be able to google this influential report and read it)

Those 2 ought to dispel false conceptions and provide authoritative facts. The APA's report was a milestone in the field that removed many false conceptions.
"Tis not in mortals to command success
But we"ll do more, Sempronius, we"ll deserve it
malcolmxy
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2/16/2013 5:53:08 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/16/2013 5:50:27 PM, Logic_on_rails wrote:
I'm going to recommend 2 very useful sources on this matter:

Intelligence A Very Short Introduction by Ian J. Deary ; and
Intelligence: knowns and unknowns by the American Psychological Associations Task Force (you ought to be able to google this influential report and read it)

Those 2 ought to dispel false conceptions and provide authoritative facts. The APA's report was a milestone in the field that removed many false conceptions.

Larger skulls containing more brain matter does still equate to higher intelligence, though, right?
War is over, if you want it.

Meet Dr. Stupid and his assistants - http://www.debate.org...
Skepsikyma
Posts: 8,286
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2/16/2013 6:23:31 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/16/2013 5:53:08 PM, malcolmxy wrote:
At 2/16/2013 5:50:27 PM, Logic_on_rails wrote:
I'm going to recommend 2 very useful sources on this matter:

Intelligence A Very Short Introduction by Ian J. Deary ; and
Intelligence: knowns and unknowns by the American Psychological Associations Task Force (you ought to be able to google this influential report and read it)

Those 2 ought to dispel false conceptions and provide authoritative facts. The APA's report was a milestone in the field that removed many false conceptions.

Larger skulls containing more brain matter does still equate to higher intelligence, though, right?

No. Intelligence, which is a very loose and difficult to measure attribute to begin with, is much more strongly correlated with minute structural differences and information flow.

http://www.science20.com...

"Reviewing studies from functional (i.e., functional magnetic resonance imaging, positron emission tomography) and structural (i.e., magnetic resonance spectroscopy, diffusion tensor imaging, voxel-based morphometry) neuroimaging paradigms, we report a striking consensus suggesting that variations in a distributed network predict individual differences found on intelligence and reasoning tasks. We describe this network as the Parieto-Frontal Integration Theory (P-FIT). The P-FIT model includes, by Brodmann areas (BAs): the dorsolateral prefrontal cortex (BAs 6, 9, 10, 45, 46, 47), the inferior (BAs 39, 40) and superior (BA 7) parietal lobule, the anterior cingulate (BA 32), and regions within the temporal (BAs 21, 37) and occipital (BAs 18, 19) lobes. White matter regions (i.e., arcuate fasciculus) are also implicated."

http://journals.cambridge.org...
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
bossyburrito
Posts: 14,075
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2/16/2013 6:29:41 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Define "race".
#UnbanTheMadman

"Some will sell their dreams for small desires
Or lose the race to rats
Get caught in ticking traps
And start to dream of somewhere
To relax their restless flight
Somewhere out of a memory of lighted streets on quiet nights..."

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bossyburrito
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2/16/2013 6:32:48 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
You should watch this.
#UnbanTheMadman

"Some will sell their dreams for small desires
Or lose the race to rats
Get caught in ticking traps
And start to dream of somewhere
To relax their restless flight
Somewhere out of a memory of lighted streets on quiet nights..."

~ Rush