Total Posts:74|Showing Posts:1-30|Last Page
Jump to topic:

Aborting gay people...

TheUnapologeticTruth
Posts: 40
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 12:19:36 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Here's my thinking... I truly believe (and theres scientific/common sense evidence for it) that homosexuality/transgender is a birth defect/mental illness. I believe that we can find the genetic/chemical markers for "homosexuality". Now, if we were to identify this marker in unborn fetuses, then the parents would know if their child will be gay, straight, or transgendered.

The question is: since virtually all liberals and homos support abortion, would a parents decision to abort based on the fact that their child will be gay be allowed? Would that be a "hate crime"? Would the parents be labeled intolerant homophobes and bigots? Just wondering what any liberals and gay people think. Would a women still have the right to abort an unborn gay fetus?
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 12:24:24 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Ignoring the hateful undertone of the post. Likely. Aborting a baby because it is gay would be socially unacceptable. It would be like aborting a baby because the genetic tests revealed that it would not have blue eyes and blond hair. Or because it was a girl or a boy. Abortions for such reasons are never accepted (though they may be allowed).

Logically they can't call it a hate crime, since that would require an acknowledgement that the baby is a "person" with rights. Though a small minority may take matters into their own hands with harassment or even violence. However, that is not an indicator of the entire political group. Just like a small minority of conservatives harass, assault and even bomb people that provide abortions, they are not an indicator of the whole group.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
donald.keller
Posts: 3,709
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 12:26:22 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/14/2013 12:19:36 AM, TheUnapologeticTruth wrote:
Here's my thinking... I truly believe (and theres scientific/common sense evidence for it) that homosexuality/transgender is a birth defect/mental illness. I believe that we can find the genetic/chemical markers for "homosexuality". Now, if we were to identify this marker in unborn fetuses, then the parents would know if their child will be gay, straight, or transgendered.

The question is: since virtually all liberals and homos support abortion, would a parents decision to abort based on the fact that their child will be gay be allowed? Would that be a "hate crime"? Would the parents be labeled intolerant homophobes and bigots? Just wondering what any liberals and gay people think. Would a women still have the right to abort an unborn gay fetus?

Well... Even people with disorders have Bodily Autonomy.

And you know how liberals are...
"You can abort anyone you don't want because they aren't people..."
"You aborted a baby because you didn't want a gay son? You monster, that fetus was a special human!"
-- Don't forget to submit your unvoted debates to the Voter's Union --

OFFICIAL DK/TUF 2016 Platform: http://www.debate.org...

My Facebook Page: https://www.facebook.com...
#SaveThePresidency
#SaveTheSite

-- DK/TUF 2016 --
TheUnapologeticTruth
Posts: 40
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 12:34:50 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
"You aborted a baby because you didn't want a gay son? You monster, that fetus was a special human!"

exactly my thinking.. I wonder if posing this question on a very personal/emotional level that they might react that way. This in turn would prove to them that the fetus is a human and has rights. Or just once again point out their hypocrisy...?
donald.keller
Posts: 3,709
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 12:40:25 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/14/2013 12:34:50 AM, TheUnapologeticTruth wrote:
"You aborted a baby because you didn't want a gay son? You monster, that fetus was a special human!"

exactly my thinking.. I wonder if posing this question on a very personal/emotional level that they might react that way. This in turn would prove to them that the fetus is a human and has rights. Or just once again point out their hypocrisy...?

Lol both... Whichever one benefits them most at that moment.. You know how they get.

They will probably use it as a way to get more welfare weed money, and a gun ban XD
-- Don't forget to submit your unvoted debates to the Voter's Union --

OFFICIAL DK/TUF 2016 Platform: http://www.debate.org...

My Facebook Page: https://www.facebook.com...
#SaveThePresidency
#SaveTheSite

-- DK/TUF 2016 --
donald.keller
Posts: 3,709
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 12:41:35 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
They will probably use it as a way to get more welfare weed money, and a gun ban XD

Sorry.. I have to be PC for them...
Low-Income Medical Marijuana Assistance.
-- Don't forget to submit your unvoted debates to the Voter's Union --

OFFICIAL DK/TUF 2016 Platform: http://www.debate.org...

My Facebook Page: https://www.facebook.com...
#SaveThePresidency
#SaveTheSite

-- DK/TUF 2016 --
Jack212
Posts: 572
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 1:20:20 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
There is no evidence for a "gay gene", and scientific consensus says nothing whatsoever about whether homosexuality is "normal". Thus, this thread is pointless.
TheUnapologeticTruth
Posts: 40
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 10:09:59 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
There is no evidence for a "gay gene", and scientific consensus says nothing whatsoever about whether homosexuality is "normal". Thus, this thread is pointless.

obviously you know nothing of science.. but answer the question... Homosexuality is obviously not normal and does not follow the natural order for which we were designed... answer is to reproduce..
TheUnapologeticTruth
Posts: 40
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 11:02:05 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/14/2013 10:17:18 AM, drafterman wrote:
Fetuses have no sexuality and are neither homosexual nor heterosexual.

apparently you missed the genetic marker comment... and this is a hypothetical question for thought provoking reasons.. do try and play along.. answer the question
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 11:19:18 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/14/2013 11:02:05 AM, TheUnapologeticTruth wrote:
At 8/14/2013 10:17:18 AM, drafterman wrote:
Fetuses have no sexuality and are neither homosexual nor heterosexual.

apparently you missed the genetic marker comment... and this is a hypothetical question for thought provoking reasons.. do try and play along.. answer the question

No, I didn't miss it.

First, genes aren't purely deterministic.
Second, from what I've read, a lot has to do with conditions in the womb.
Third, my point still stands.

A more apropos scenario would involve something for which the genetic markers are more deterministic, such as Down syndrome. But I understand you wouldn't get to vent your frustration against homosexuals and "liberals."
Homosapien
Posts: 114
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 11:24:36 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/14/2013 12:19:36 AM, TheUnapologeticTruth wrote:
Here's my thinking... I truly believe (and theres scientific/common sense evidence for it) that homosexuality/transgender is a birth defect/mental illness. I believe that we can find the genetic/chemical markers for "homosexuality". Now, if we were to identify this marker in unborn fetuses, then the parents would know if their child will be gay, straight, or transgendered.

The question is: since virtually all liberals and homos support abortion, would a parents decision to abort based on the fact that their child will be gay be allowed? Would that be a "hate crime"? Would the parents be labeled intolerant homophobes and bigots? Just wondering what any liberals and gay people think. Would a women still have the right to abort an unborn gay fetus?

Sir,

As a bisexual I resent you reffering to me in such derogotary terms, you are entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts, there is no evidence to back up your belief, please provide some.

Anyway, aside from the blatent homophobia, I believe that each abortion of a foetus is such a controversial topic that each one must be taken on a case by case basis, and it is absolutely worth all of the court of human rights time to hear such cases, I honestly haven't yet come to my own conclusions as the arguments on both sides are wirth respect and understanding, especially while the evidence is still being bought to bear.

A case that a parent does not wish to have a gay son/daughter I submit would not stand, in comparison to, for example, a case in which birth represents a significant risk to the life of a mother.

Additionally, if you do wish to debate me, being as inferior to you as I am, I would welcome the opportunity to attempt to raise myself from the lower slopes of my mental capacity to your own tolerant and enlightened world view.

Yours faithfully,
Mentally handicapped/birth defect ridden human being.
royalpaladin describing me in all my majestic glory -

"He has a cabal of votebombers behind him."
"I'll be informing airmax about you."
"It reveals that you want to look like you are intelligent, but actually are not."
"Stupid because you didn't warrant or impact your moronic arguments. That's all you will ever be good for."
"You're making stupid assumptions, as usual. "
"You really are an arrogant buffoon, aren't you?"
"You're just coming off as extremely arrogant and condescending."
ConservativeAmerican
Posts: 1,676
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 12:15:37 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/14/2013 12:24:24 AM, Ore_Ele wrote:
Ignoring the hateful undertone of the post. Likely. Aborting a baby because it is gay would be socially unacceptable. It would be like aborting a baby because the genetic tests revealed that it would not have blue eyes and blond hair. Or because it was a girl or a boy. Abortions for such reasons are never accepted (though they may be allowed).

Logically they can't call it a hate crime, since that would require an acknowledgement that the baby is a "person" with rights. Though a small minority may take matters into their own hands with harassment or even violence. However, that is not an indicator of the entire political group. Just like a small minority of conservatives harass, assault and even bomb people that provide abortions, they are not an indicator of the whole group.

A large group of people who support abortion support aborting fetuses who will have down syndrome, I don't see why homosexuality is any different.

Logic for aborting a baby with down syndrome- It will live a hard life and not truly be able to ever find true happiness.

Can't that be said for homosexuals in certain areas too?
ConservativeAmerican
Posts: 1,676
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 12:19:09 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I am bisexual myself, and still Conservative-Libertarian and against abortion. I am just pointing out the logic of people who claim women should be able to abort based on the status of their child as having a mental or physical disability that would prevent them from experiencing life with true happiness. In certain areas, like the south, where racism and homophobia is still prevalent, would a homosexual ever truly be able to express themselves without persecution?
Buddamoose
Posts: 19,450
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 12:50:35 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/14/2013 12:19:09 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
In certain areas, like the south, where racism and homophobia is still prevalent, would a homosexual ever truly be able to express themselves without persecution?

sure, as long as they didn't express themselves, ya kno, in public
"Reality is an illusion created due to a lack of alcohol"
-Airmax1227

"You were the moon all this time, and he was always there to make you shine."

"Was he the sun?"

"No honey, he was the darkness"

-Kazekirion
YYW
Posts: 36,391
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 3:06:57 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/14/2013 12:19:36 AM, TheUnapologeticTruth wrote:
Here's my thinking... I truly believe (and theres scientific/common sense evidence for it) that homosexuality/transgender is a birth defect/mental illness. I believe that we can find the genetic/chemical markers for "homosexuality". Now, if we were to identify this marker in unborn fetuses, then the parents would know if their child will be gay, straight, or transgendered.

The question is: since virtually all liberals and homos support abortion, would a parents decision to abort based on the fact that their child will be gay be allowed? Would that be a "hate crime"? Would the parents be labeled intolerant homophobes and bigots? Just wondering what any liberals and gay people think. Would a women still have the right to abort an unborn gay fetus?

Wow... what an astonishing proposal. Astonishingly bigoted... Astonishingly homophobic... astonishingly myopic...

Even still: until the point of viability, the mother has the right to abort her fetus for any reason... and that is how it should be.

Should we morally condemn a mother who aborts her fetus that, if left to develop, may become a gay child? Yes.

Should we morally condemn a mother who aborts her fetus because it is of a different sex than she wanted? Yes.

Should we morally condemn a mother who aborts her fetus that in all likelihood would have developmental problems? It depends.

That aside, homosexuality is not a mental defect, regardless of what you believe or how firmly you believe it. You can believe as much bullsh!t as you like, it makes no difference to the rest of the world (that is, the world that does not live with their head perpetually lodged so far up their asses that they would not even recognize the light of day even if they were disemboweled).
Tsar of DDO
YYW
Posts: 36,391
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 3:10:05 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/14/2013 12:19:09 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
I am bisexual myself,

Wait... really?

and still Conservative-Libertarian and against abortion.

So, are you against abortion in principle only or do you think it should be made illegal?

In certain areas, like the south, where racism and homophobia is still prevalent, would a homosexual ever truly be able to express themselves without persecution?

In some parts (like Savannah, Atlanta, Charlotte, Richmond, Dallas, etc.) there are vibrant gay communities, but that's beside the point. People can, if they find their surroundings not conducive to how they want to live their lives, leave.
Tsar of DDO
ConservativeAmerican
Posts: 1,676
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 3:13:25 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/14/2013 3:10:05 PM, YYW wrote:
At 8/14/2013 12:19:09 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
I am bisexual myself,

Wait... really?

Mhm.

and still Conservative-Libertarian and against abortion.

So, are you against abortion in principle only or do you think it should be made illegal?

I am against it both morally and on anatomical grounds (after 6 weeks a 'fetus' has a heart beat).

In certain areas, like the south, where racism and homophobia is still prevalent, would a homosexual ever truly be able to express themselves without persecution?

In some parts (like Savannah, Atlanta, Charlotte, Richmond, Dallas, etc.) there are vibrant gay communities, but that's beside the point. People can, if they find their surroundings not conducive to how they want to live their lives, leave.

Not when they are children, if they are homosexual themselves but brought up to believe homosexuality is the epithet of immorality, wouldn't they be brought up to despise themselves?
YYW
Posts: 36,391
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 3:20:06 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/14/2013 3:13:25 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/14/2013 3:10:05 PM, YYW wrote:
At 8/14/2013 12:19:09 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
I am bisexual myself,

Wait... really?

Mhm.

That kind of surprises me... but hey, no worries.


and still Conservative-Libertarian and against abortion.

So, are you against abortion in principle only or do you think it should be made illegal?

I am against it both morally and on anatomical grounds (after 6 weeks a 'fetus' has a heart beat).

Actually, it's between 12-15 weeks, but my question is, do you, because of your position on abortion, think that abortion should be made illegal?

In certain areas, like the south, where racism and homophobia is still prevalent, would a homosexual ever truly be able to express themselves without persecution?

In some parts (like Savannah, Atlanta, Charlotte, Richmond, Dallas, etc.) there are vibrant gay communities, but that's beside the point. People can, if they find their surroundings not conducive to how they want to live their lives, leave.

Not when they are children, if they are homosexual themselves but brought up to believe homosexuality is the epithet of immorality, wouldn't they be brought up to despise themselves?

It's a hard life growing up gay in the South, or in any conservative area, but college is where doors start to open to a free and independent life of one's choosing. I have known my fair share of self-hating gay guys (especially those who were raised in the Catholic church), but part of becoming a mature adult is accepting ones self for who one is.

I can't say that everyone who is attracted to the same sex will be able to reconcile their identity with whatever values/moral principles they are taught -but I can say that for those I know who were raised in conservative environments (myself included), it does get better and usually immediately after high school.
Tsar of DDO
ConservativeAmerican
Posts: 1,676
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 3:25:42 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/14/2013 3:20:06 PM, YYW wrote:
At 8/14/2013 3:13:25 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/14/2013 3:10:05 PM, YYW wrote:
At 8/14/2013 12:19:09 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
I am bisexual myself,

Wait... really?

Mhm.

That kind of surprises me... but hey, no worries.


and still Conservative-Libertarian and against abortion.

So, are you against abortion in principle only or do you think it should be made illegal?

I am against it both morally and on anatomical grounds (after 6 weeks a 'fetus' has a heart beat).

Actually, it's between 12-15 weeks, but my question is, do you, because of your position on abortion, think that abortion should be made illegal?

In certain areas, like the south, where racism and homophobia is still prevalent, would a homosexual ever truly be able to express themselves without persecution?

In some parts (like Savannah, Atlanta, Charlotte, Richmond, Dallas, etc.) there are vibrant gay communities, but that's beside the point. People can, if they find their surroundings not conducive to how they want to live their lives, leave.

Not when they are children, if they are homosexual themselves but brought up to believe homosexuality is the epithet of immorality, wouldn't they be brought up to despise themselves?

It's a hard life growing up gay in the South, or in any conservative area, but college is where doors start to open to a free and independent life of one's choosing. I have known my fair share of self-hating gay guys (especially those who were raised in the Catholic church), but part of becoming a mature adult is accepting ones self for who one is.

I can't say that everyone who is attracted to the same sex will be able to reconcile their identity with whatever values/moral principles they are taught -but I can say that for those I know who were raised in conservative environments (myself included), it does get better and usually immediately after high school.

Oh, I was not raised in a conservative area. I was raised more in a union-liberal area (Northern Ohio). I was just pointing out that for those that are persecuted. I tend to agree with you, but high school was the most self-conscious phase of my life, I was self conscious just because I had a few pimples on my face, think about someone who is raised in a society where they are basically brought up to hate who they are. Especially in high school when your insecurities are already high, depression is probably very common for LGBT people in that phase.
ConservativeAmerican
Posts: 1,676
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 3:33:58 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Even in more liberal areas, the youth are still unintentionally hurtful sometimes towards homosexuals. People still use 'homo 'f*g' 'gaywad' etc. as everyday insults to hurl at people online or even to someone's face.
YYW
Posts: 36,391
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 3:36:34 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/14/2013 3:25:42 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/14/2013 3:20:06 PM, YYW wrote:
At 8/14/2013 3:13:25 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/14/2013 3:10:05 PM, YYW wrote:
At 8/14/2013 12:19:09 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
I am bisexual myself,

Wait... really?

Mhm.

That kind of surprises me... but hey, no worries.


and still Conservative-Libertarian and against abortion.

So, are you against abortion in principle only or do you think it should be made illegal?

I am against it both morally and on anatomical grounds (after 6 weeks a 'fetus' has a heart beat).

Actually, it's between 12-15 weeks, but my question is, do you, because of your position on abortion, think that abortion should be made illegal?

In certain areas, like the south, where racism and homophobia is still prevalent, would a homosexual ever truly be able to express themselves without persecution?

In some parts (like Savannah, Atlanta, Charlotte, Richmond, Dallas, etc.) there are vibrant gay communities, but that's beside the point. People can, if they find their surroundings not conducive to how they want to live their lives, leave.

Not when they are children, if they are homosexual themselves but brought up to believe homosexuality is the epithet of immorality, wouldn't they be brought up to despise themselves?

It's a hard life growing up gay in the South, or in any conservative area, but college is where doors start to open to a free and independent life of one's choosing. I have known my fair share of self-hating gay guys (especially those who were raised in the Catholic church), but part of becoming a mature adult is accepting ones self for who one is.

I can't say that everyone who is attracted to the same sex will be able to reconcile their identity with whatever values/moral principles they are taught -but I can say that for those I know who were raised in conservative environments (myself included), it does get better and usually immediately after high school.

Oh, I was not raised in a conservative area. I was raised more in a union-liberal area (Northern Ohio). I was just pointing out that for those that are persecuted. I tend to agree with you, but high school was the most self-conscious phase of my life, I was self conscious just because I had a few pimples on my face, think about someone who is raised in a society where they are basically brought up to hate who they are. Especially in high school when your insecurities are already high, depression is probably very common for LGBT people in that phase.

High school is a precarious time for everyone, and especially if you're different (in virtually any way), then it can be an especially trying period in one's life. But it does get better...

For me, high school was actually pretty good, though. I was never bullied, had a some really close friends (several of whom I still keep in close contact with), and I was pretty involved, generally... even in some things that I probably shouldn't have been involved in... lol. But all in all, I was lucky... and some aren't, and it's unfortunate, but our lives improve, and that's what counts.
Tsar of DDO
ConservativeAmerican
Posts: 1,676
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 3:48:12 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/14/2013 3:36:34 PM, YYW wrote:
At 8/14/2013 3:25:42 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/14/2013 3:20:06 PM, YYW wrote:
At 8/14/2013 3:13:25 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/14/2013 3:10:05 PM, YYW wrote:
At 8/14/2013 12:19:09 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
I am bisexual myself,

Wait... really?

Mhm.

That kind of surprises me... but hey, no worries.


and still Conservative-Libertarian and against abortion.

So, are you against abortion in principle only or do you think it should be made illegal?

I am against it both morally and on anatomical grounds (after 6 weeks a 'fetus' has a heart beat).

Actually, it's between 12-15 weeks, but my question is, do you, because of your position on abortion, think that abortion should be made illegal?

In certain areas, like the south, where racism and homophobia is still prevalent, would a homosexual ever truly be able to express themselves without persecution?

In some parts (like Savannah, Atlanta, Charlotte, Richmond, Dallas, etc.) there are vibrant gay communities, but that's beside the point. People can, if they find their surroundings not conducive to how they want to live their lives, leave.

Not when they are children, if they are homosexual themselves but brought up to believe homosexuality is the epithet of immorality, wouldn't they be brought up to despise themselves?

It's a hard life growing up gay in the South, or in any conservative area, but college is where doors start to open to a free and independent life of one's choosing. I have known my fair share of self-hating gay guys (especially those who were raised in the Catholic church), but part of becoming a mature adult is accepting ones self for who one is.

I can't say that everyone who is attracted to the same sex will be able to reconcile their identity with whatever values/moral principles they are taught -but I can say that for those I know who were raised in conservative environments (myself included), it does get better and usually immediately after high school.

Oh, I was not raised in a conservative area. I was raised more in a union-liberal area (Northern Ohio). I was just pointing out that for those that are persecuted. I tend to agree with you, but high school was the most self-conscious phase of my life, I was self conscious just because I had a few pimples on my face, think about someone who is raised in a society where they are basically brought up to hate who they are. Especially in high school when your insecurities are already high, depression is probably very common for LGBT people in that phase.

High school is a precarious time for everyone, and especially if you're different (in virtually any way), then it can be an especially trying period in one's life. But it does get better...

For me, high school was actually pretty good, though. I was never bullied, had a some really close friends (several of whom I still keep in close contact with), and I was pretty involved, generally... even in some things that I probably shouldn't have been involved in... lol. But all in all, I was lucky... and some aren't, and it's unfortunate, but our lives improve, and that's what counts.

I agree, I have a lot of things I am proud of academically in high school, but I should have put myself out there more on the dating scene and had a wider circle of friends. I went steady and got trapped in a tumultuous relationship junior year and a large portion of senior year that kept me from meeting someone I was truly compatible with. Plus I mainly stuck with the same group of people through my Sophmore-Senior years.
YYW
Posts: 36,391
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 3:49:44 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/14/2013 3:48:12 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/14/2013 3:36:34 PM, YYW wrote:
At 8/14/2013 3:25:42 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/14/2013 3:20:06 PM, YYW wrote:
At 8/14/2013 3:13:25 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/14/2013 3:10:05 PM, YYW wrote:
At 8/14/2013 12:19:09 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
I am bisexual myself,

Wait... really?

Mhm.

That kind of surprises me... but hey, no worries.


and still Conservative-Libertarian and against abortion.

So, are you against abortion in principle only or do you think it should be made illegal?

I am against it both morally and on anatomical grounds (after 6 weeks a 'fetus' has a heart beat).

Actually, it's between 12-15 weeks, but my question is, do you, because of your position on abortion, think that abortion should be made illegal?

In certain areas, like the south, where racism and homophobia is still prevalent, would a homosexual ever truly be able to express themselves without persecution?

In some parts (like Savannah, Atlanta, Charlotte, Richmond, Dallas, etc.) there are vibrant gay communities, but that's beside the point. People can, if they find their surroundings not conducive to how they want to live their lives, leave.

Not when they are children, if they are homosexual themselves but brought up to believe homosexuality is the epithet of immorality, wouldn't they be brought up to despise themselves?

It's a hard life growing up gay in the South, or in any conservative area, but college is where doors start to open to a free and independent life of one's choosing. I have known my fair share of self-hating gay guys (especially those who were raised in the Catholic church), but part of becoming a mature adult is accepting ones self for who one is.

I can't say that everyone who is attracted to the same sex will be able to reconcile their identity with whatever values/moral principles they are taught -but I can say that for those I know who were raised in conservative environments (myself included), it does get better and usually immediately after high school.

Oh, I was not raised in a conservative area. I was raised more in a union-liberal area (Northern Ohio). I was just pointing out that for those that are persecuted. I tend to agree with you, but high school was the most self-conscious phase of my life, I was self conscious just because I had a few pimples on my face, think about someone who is raised in a society where they are basically brought up to hate who they are. Especially in high school when your insecurities are already high, depression is probably very common for LGBT people in that phase.

High school is a precarious time for everyone, and especially if you're different (in virtually any way), then it can be an especially trying period in one's life. But it does get better...

For me, high school was actually pretty good, though. I was never bullied, had a some really close friends (several of whom I still keep in close contact with), and I was pretty involved, generally... even in some things that I probably shouldn't have been involved in... lol. But all in all, I was lucky... and some aren't, and it's unfortunate, but our lives improve, and that's what counts.

I agree, I have a lot of things I am proud of academically in high school, but I should have put myself out there more on the dating scene and had a wider circle of friends. I went steady and got trapped in a tumultuous relationship junior year and a large portion of senior year that kept me from meeting someone I was truly compatible with.

Trapped?

Plus I mainly stuck with the same group of people through my Sophmore-Senior years.

I don't think that's a bad thing, though...
Tsar of DDO
Df0512
Posts: 966
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 4:01:34 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/14/2013 12:15:37 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/14/2013 12:24:24 AM, Ore_Ele wrote:
Ignoring the hateful undertone of the post. Likely. Aborting a baby because it is gay would be socially unacceptable. It would be like aborting a baby because the genetic tests revealed that it would not have blue eyes and blond hair. Or because it was a girl or a boy. Abortions for such reasons are never accepted (though they may be allowed).

Logically they can't call it a hate crime, since that would require an acknowledgement that the baby is a "person" with rights. Though a small minority may take matters into their own hands with harassment or even violence. However, that is not an indicator of the entire political group. Just like a small minority of conservatives harass, assault and even bomb people that provide abortions, they are not an indicator of the whole group.

A large group of people who support abortion support aborting fetuses who will have down syndrome, I don't see why homosexuality is any different.

Logic for aborting a baby with down syndrome- It will live a hard life and not truly be able to ever find true happiness.

But the reality is that those parents just don't want a child with down syndrome. Some people just don't have a heathy appreciation for life.
ConservativeAmerican
Posts: 1,676
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 4:08:07 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/14/2013 3:49:44 PM, YYW wrote:
At 8/14/2013 3:48:12 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/14/2013 3:36:34 PM, YYW wrote:
At 8/14/2013 3:25:42 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/14/2013 3:20:06 PM, YYW wrote:
At 8/14/2013 3:13:25 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/14/2013 3:10:05 PM, YYW wrote:
At 8/14/2013 12:19:09 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
I am bisexual myself,

Wait... really?

Mhm.

That kind of surprises me... but hey, no worries.


and still Conservative-Libertarian and against abortion.

So, are you against abortion in principle only or do you think it should be made illegal?

I am against it both morally and on anatomical grounds (after 6 weeks a 'fetus' has a heart beat).

Actually, it's between 12-15 weeks, but my question is, do you, because of your position on abortion, think that abortion should be made illegal?

In certain areas, like the south, where racism and homophobia is still prevalent, would a homosexual ever truly be able to express themselves without persecution?

In some parts (like Savannah, Atlanta, Charlotte, Richmond, Dallas, etc.) there are vibrant gay communities, but that's beside the point. People can, if they find their surroundings not conducive to how they want to live their lives, leave.

Not when they are children, if they are homosexual themselves but brought up to believe homosexuality is the epithet of immorality, wouldn't they be brought up to despise themselves?

It's a hard life growing up gay in the South, or in any conservative area, but college is where doors start to open to a free and independent life of one's choosing. I have known my fair share of self-hating gay guys (especially those who were raised in the Catholic church), but part of becoming a mature adult is accepting ones self for who one is.

I can't say that everyone who is attracted to the same sex will be able to reconcile their identity with whatever values/moral principles they are taught -but I can say that for those I know who were raised in conservative environments (myself included), it does get better and usually immediately after high school.

Oh, I was not raised in a conservative area. I was raised more in a union-liberal area (Northern Ohio). I was just pointing out that for those that are persecuted. I tend to agree with you, but high school was the most self-conscious phase of my life, I was self conscious just because I had a few pimples on my face, think about someone who is raised in a society where they are basically brought up to hate who they are. Especially in high school when your insecurities are already high, depression is probably very common for LGBT people in that phase.

High school is a precarious time for everyone, and especially if you're different (in virtually any way), then it can be an especially trying period in one's life. But it does get better...

For me, high school was actually pretty good, though. I was never bullied, had a some really close friends (several of whom I still keep in close contact with), and I was pretty involved, generally... even in some things that I probably shouldn't have been involved in... lol. But all in all, I was lucky... and some aren't, and it's unfortunate, but our lives improve, and that's what counts.

I agree, I have a lot of things I am proud of academically in high school, but I should have put myself out there more on the dating scene and had a wider circle of friends. I went steady and got trapped in a tumultuous relationship junior year and a large portion of senior year that kept me from meeting someone I was truly compatible with.

Trapped?

It was an on and off relationship where I really never knew where we stood. Even when we were 'separated' I never was confident enough for a while after we officially broke it off to put myself back on the dating scene. I didn't start dating again until my 2nd year in college.

Plus I mainly stuck with the same group of people through my Sophmore-Senior years.

I don't think that's a bad thing, though...
Dragonfang
Posts: 1,122
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 5:03:59 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Homosexuality is NOT innate. Period.

There is zero proof that it is biological, and even if it was, it wouldn't matter. There is no way to recognize someone as homosexual until he act on that behavior or claim to act on that behavior. Homosexuality is behavior-based not a body characteristic you can identify.

Although from a "Survival of the fittest" fascist society, that would be the right thing. As well as encouraging disabled people to suicide and abandoning human rights. In other words become mere thinking animals rather than humans.
YYW
Posts: 36,391
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 7:22:51 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/14/2013 5:03:59 PM, Dragonfang wrote:
Homosexuality is NOT innate. Period.

There is zero proof that it is biological, and even if it was, it wouldn't matter. There is no way to recognize someone as homosexual until he act on that behavior or claim to act on that behavior. Homosexuality is behavior-based not a body characteristic you can identify.


Although from a "Survival of the fittest" fascist society, that would be the right thing. As well as encouraging disabled people to suicide and abandoning human rights. In other words become mere thinking animals rather than humans.

lol

I want you to know that the reason I find that response, in truth, nothing less than hilarious is because of the level of both intellectual and personal maturity that is inherent within it.
Tsar of DDO
DetectableNinja
Posts: 6,043
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/14/2013 7:54:17 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/14/2013 12:19:09 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
I am bisexual myself, and still Conservative-Libertarian and against abortion. I am just pointing out the logic of people who claim women should be able to abort based on the status of their child as having a mental or physical disability that would prevent them from experiencing life with true happiness. In certain areas, like the south, where racism and homophobia is still prevalent, would a homosexual ever truly be able to express themselves without persecution?

Seriously though. That threw me for a curveball.
Think'st thou heaven is such a glorious thing?
I tell thee, 'tis not half so fair as thou
Or any man that breathes on earth.

- Christopher Marlowe, Doctor Faustus