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Celiac Disease On the Rise

R0b1Billion
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8/27/2013 10:40:52 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
http://www.mayo.edu...

Celiac disease is the impetus behind the new surge of gluten-free products. I work in a restaurant, and there are so many gluten-free people coming in to us nowadays that we are strongly considering restructuring our menu. Celiac was once a rare and unheard of condition, but it is becoming much more prevalent now.

People with Celiak cannot consume wheat. No breads, pastas, or most carbs (potatoes are OK). Why exactly this condition is on the rise nobody knows; some people talk about hybridization of the plants we're using, GMOs, or even our increased sanitization (and subsequent lack of bacteria for our immune system to fight). I would say that one thing is clear, however: whatever the cause may be, it's probably going to come down to something we are doing now that we didn't do before because of our technological "progress" and lack of respect for ourselves and our environment.

As we develop technologically, we fail to apprehend all of the effects it has on us. As we use new chemicals, change our environment and our society, and generally assume that we can do whatever we want without repercussions, we introduce new problems that we often don't see until it is too late. There's nothing that can be done to stop our "progress" because it's too cumbersome to accumulate the scientific data to prove a lot of these things, and even when we do, there's too much money invested in them (i.e., society is simply addicted to using the products and services it offers) to make any headway into changing. President Carter went on national television in the 70s wearing a sweater, imploring Americans to cut their heating-usage to help the environment and the economy. What happened? It became a huge political debacle. In political science, this event is used as a classic example of the fact that society can and will not be told to give up their stuff (Reagan came in soon after and gave Americans exactly what we wanted). We will never give up our cars, our cell phones, or any god-given luxury that we have. It doesn't matter if people are starving, the environment is dying, or new diseases are starting to manifest themselves. They can pry our goods out of our cold dead hands after we die.

There will be more diseases. There will be more loss of biodiversity. There will be more pollution. There will be more social degeneration. And it's not "their" fault, it is mine and yours for ignoring these things in order to keep using the luxuries we are addicted to every day.
Beliefs in a nutshell:
- The Ends never justify the Means.
- Objectivity is secondary to subjectivity.
- The War on Drugs is the worst policy in the U.S.
- Most people worship technology as a religion.
- Computers will never become sentient.
bladerunner060
Posts: 7,126
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8/27/2013 10:57:03 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/27/2013 10:40:52 PM, R0b1Billion wrote:
http://www.mayo.edu...

Celiac disease is the impetus behind the new surge of gluten-free products. I work in a restaurant, and there are so many gluten-free people coming in to us nowadays that we are strongly considering restructuring our menu. Celiac was once a rare and unheard of condition, but it is becoming much more prevalent now.

People with Celiak cannot consume wheat. No breads, pastas, or most carbs (potatoes are OK). Why exactly this condition is on the rise nobody knows; some people talk about hybridization of the plants we're using, GMOs, or even our increased sanitization (and subsequent lack of bacteria for our immune system to fight). I would say that one thing is clear, however: whatever the cause may be, it's probably going to come down to something we are doing now that we didn't do before because of our technological "progress" and lack of respect for ourselves and our environment.

As we develop technologically, we fail to apprehend all of the effects it has on us. As we use new chemicals, change our environment and our society, and generally assume that we can do whatever we want without repercussions, we introduce new problems that we often don't see until it is too late. There's nothing that can be done to stop our "progress" because it's too cumbersome to accumulate the scientific data to prove a lot of these things, and even when we do, there's too much money invested in them (i.e., society is simply addicted to using the products and services it offers) to make any headway into changing. President Carter went on national television in the 70s wearing a sweater, imploring Americans to cut their heating-usage to help the environment and the economy. What happened? It became a huge political debacle. In political science, this event is used as a classic example of the fact that society can and will not be told to give up their stuff (Reagan came in soon after and gave Americans exactly what we wanted). We will never give up our cars, our cell phones, or any god-given luxury that we have. It doesn't matter if people are starving, the environment is dying, or new diseases are starting to manifest themselves. They can pry our goods out of our cold dead hands after we die.

There will be more diseases. There will be more loss of biodiversity. There will be more pollution. There will be more social degeneration. And it's not "their" fault, it is mine and yours for ignoring these things in order to keep using the luxuries we are addicted to every day.

I miss bread. And beer. And lots of other things. But I do like going to the bathroom only as often as a normal person. So there's that...
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drhead
Posts: 1,475
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8/27/2013 11:24:58 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/27/2013 10:40:52 PM, R0b1Billion wrote:
http://www.mayo.edu...

Celiac disease is the impetus behind the new surge of gluten-free products. I work in a restaurant, and there are so many gluten-free people coming in to us nowadays that we are strongly considering restructuring our menu. Celiac was once a rare and unheard of condition, but it is becoming much more prevalent now.

It is most likely due to changes in diagnostic practices:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...

Basically, people who have the marker but don't have the symptoms are being diagnosed. You CAN diagnose it based on gluten antibodies, but you can ALSO look for the gene that constructs said antibodies. Obviously one is mutually inclusive to the other, but not vice-versa, so of course one method will turn up positive results more often.

People with Celiak cannot consume wheat. No breads, pastas, or most carbs (potatoes are OK). Why exactly this condition is on the rise nobody knows; some people talk about hybridization of the plants we're using, GMOs, or even our increased sanitization (and subsequent lack of bacteria for our immune system to fight).

It's a disorder which comes with a genetic predisposition. It is possible that it is spread more often because it prevents people from reproducing less often, but that's as far as it goes.

I would say that one thing is clear, however: whatever the cause may be, it's probably going to come down to something we are doing now that we didn't do before because of our technological "progress" and lack of respect for ourselves and our environment.

Yes. We have a lack of respect for our genome, so we diagnose diseases with genetic markers more often and inflate the statistic with asymptotic cases. Seriously, this is a non-sequitur. I've shot down your premises, so I see no point in replying to anything else in this post.

As we develop technologically, we fail to apprehend all of the effects it has on us. As we use new chemicals, change our environment and our society, and generally assume that we can do whatever we want without repercussions, we introduce new problems that we often don't see until it is too late. There's nothing that can be done to stop our "progress" because it's too cumbersome to accumulate the scientific data to prove a lot of these things, and even when we do, there's too much money invested in them (i.e., society is simply addicted to using the products and services it offers) to make any headway into changing. President Carter went on national television in the 70s wearing a sweater, imploring Americans to cut their heating-usage to help the environment and the economy. What happened? It became a huge political debacle. In political science, this event is used as a classic example of the fact that society can and will not be told to give up their stuff (Reagan came in soon after and gave Americans exactly what we wanted). We will never give up our cars, our cell phones, or any god-given luxury that we have. It doesn't matter if people are starving, the environment is dying, or new diseases are starting to manifest themselves. They can pry our goods out of our cold dead hands after we die.

There will be more diseases. There will be more loss of biodiversity. There will be more pollution. There will be more social degeneration. And it's not "their" fault, it is mine and yours for ignoring these things in order to keep using the luxuries we are addicted to every day.
Wall of Fail

"You reject religion... calling it a sickness, to what ends??? Are you a Homosexual??" - Dogknox
"For me, Evolution is a zombie theory. I mean imaginary cartoons and wishful thinking support it?" - Dragonfang
"There are no mental health benefits of atheism. It is devoid of rational thinking and mental protection." - Gabrian
R0b1Billion
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8/28/2013 8:13:06 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/27/2013 10:57:03 PM, bladerunner060 wrote:

I miss bread. And beer. And lots of other things. But I do like going to the bathroom only as often as a normal person. So there's that...

That sucks... the way things are going, you are going to have lots of company soon!
Beliefs in a nutshell:
- The Ends never justify the Means.
- Objectivity is secondary to subjectivity.
- The War on Drugs is the worst policy in the U.S.
- Most people worship technology as a religion.
- Computers will never become sentient.
R0b1Billion
Posts: 3,733
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8/28/2013 8:35:30 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/27/2013 11:24:58 PM, drhead wrote:
At 8/27/2013 10:40:52 PM, R0b1Billion wrote:
http://www.mayo.edu...

Celiac disease is the impetus behind the new surge of gluten-free products. I work in a restaurant, and there are so many gluten-free people coming in to us nowadays that we are strongly considering restructuring our menu. Celiac was once a rare and unheard of condition, but it is becoming much more prevalent now.

It is most likely due to changes in diagnostic practices:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...

LOL so the people at the Mayo Clinic are so naive that they couldn't put that together, but some guy on a website that read an abstract has figured it out. Suuuuure. Ever heard of the term "ethos?" I'll take the people at the clinic over yours any day -_-

The way I interpret your abstract is that there's actually even MORE people who have celiac that we don't even know about yet.

Now, if you'd actually read the article I'd presented before trying to google some abstract just to shoot me down as fast as possible (DDO style, I know), you'd see there is compelling evidence to show that it's not attributable to simply underdiagnosis. They found a cache of blood samples from the military, taken 50 years ago during an outbreak of strep:

"Dr. Murray's team tested the 50-year-old blood for gluten antibodies, assuming that 1 percent would be positive " the same as today's rate of celiac disease. But the number of positive results was far smaller, indicating that celiac disease was extremely rare among those young airmen. Surprised, the researchers compared those results with two recently collected sets from Olmsted County, Minn. One blood-sample set matched the birth years of the airmen. Those elderly men were four times likelier to have celiac disease than their contemporaries tested 50 years earlier. The second set matched the ages of the airmen at the time their blood was drawn. Today's young men were 4.5 times likelier to have celiac disease than the 1950s recruits."

Anybody else want to "shoot down my premises?" If you do, make sure to read the article so you don't make yourself an a55 lol :)
Beliefs in a nutshell:
- The Ends never justify the Means.
- Objectivity is secondary to subjectivity.
- The War on Drugs is the worst policy in the U.S.
- Most people worship technology as a religion.
- Computers will never become sentient.
Lordknukle
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8/28/2013 10:50:25 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
All of the benefits that technology has provided far outweigh the unfortunate occurrences of relatively harmless afflictions.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
bladerunner060
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8/28/2013 11:08:30 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/28/2013 10:50:25 AM, Lordknukle wrote:
All of the benefits that technology has provided far outweigh the unfortunate occurrences of relatively harmless afflictions.

While I'm not, per se, disagreeing with your overall point...I'm not sure I'd call it a "relatively harmless affliction".

In other words: Yeah? Well, it must be nice to be able to eat bread you jerk.
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Lordknukle
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8/28/2013 11:32:51 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/28/2013 11:08:30 AM, bladerunner060 wrote:
At 8/28/2013 10:50:25 AM, Lordknukle wrote:
All of the benefits that technology has provided far outweigh the unfortunate occurrences of relatively harmless afflictions.

While I'm not, per se, disagreeing with your overall point...I'm not sure I'd call it a "relatively harmless affliction".

In other words: Yeah? Well, it must be nice to be able to eat bread you jerk.

Lol. Note the "relatively." When somebody mentions the word "disease," lots of nasty things pop up in your head. While I'm not saying that it's completely harmless, it's not relatively awful.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
000ike
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8/28/2013 11:47:10 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
I don't understand your antagonism toward technology. On the one hand, additives and artificial modifications pose a health threat by introducing unfamiliar substances into the body. On the other hand, those very modifications and additives have allowed us an abundance of food that can feed more people than were ever possible.

Instead of shunning modification in favor of organic foods, we should focus on making those modifications more benign.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
tulle
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8/28/2013 11:54:38 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/28/2013 8:35:30 AM, R0b1Billion wrote:
At 8/27/2013 11:24:58 PM, drhead wrote:
At 8/27/2013 10:40:52 PM, R0b1Billion wrote:
http://www.mayo.edu...

Celiac disease is the impetus behind the new surge of gluten-free products. I work in a restaurant, and there are so many gluten-free people coming in to us nowadays that we are strongly considering restructuring our menu. Celiac was once a rare and unheard of condition, but it is becoming much more prevalent now.

It is most likely due to changes in diagnostic practices:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...

LOL so the people at the Mayo Clinic are so naive that they couldn't put that together, but some guy on a website that read an abstract has figured it out. Suuuuure. Ever heard of the term "ethos?" I'll take the people at the clinic over yours any day -_-

The way I interpret your abstract is that there's actually even MORE people who have celiac that we don't even know about yet.

Now, if you'd actually read the article I'd presented before trying to google some abstract just to shoot me down as fast as possible (DDO style, I know), you'd see there is compelling evidence to show that it's not attributable to simply underdiagnosis. They found a cache of blood samples from the military, taken 50 years ago during an outbreak of strep:

"Dr. Murray's team tested the 50-year-old blood for gluten antibodies, assuming that 1 percent would be positive " the same as today's rate of celiac disease. But the number of positive results was far smaller, indicating that celiac disease was extremely rare among those young airmen. Surprised, the researchers compared those results with two recently collected sets from Olmsted County, Minn. One blood-sample set matched the birth years of the airmen. Those elderly men were four times likelier to have celiac disease than their contemporaries tested 50 years earlier. The second set matched the ages of the airmen at the time their blood was drawn. Today's young men were 4.5 times likelier to have celiac disease than the 1950s recruits."


4x vs 4.5x hardly seems statistically significant.

Anybody else want to "shoot down my premises?" If you do, make sure to read the article so you don't make yourself an a55 lol :)
yang.
R0b1Billion
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8/28/2013 2:09:36 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/28/2013 11:54:38 AM, tulle wrote:
At 8/28/2013 8:35:30 AM, R0b1Billion wrote:
At 8/27/2013 11:24:58 PM, drhead wrote:
At 8/27/2013 10:40:52 PM, R0b1Billion wrote:
http://www.mayo.edu...

Celiac disease is the impetus behind the new surge of gluten-free products. I work in a restaurant, and there are so many gluten-free people coming in to us nowadays that we are strongly considering restructuring our menu. Celiac was once a rare and unheard of condition, but it is becoming much more prevalent now.

It is most likely due to changes in diagnostic practices:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...

LOL so the people at the Mayo Clinic are so naive that they couldn't put that together, but some guy on a website that read an abstract has figured it out. Suuuuure. Ever heard of the term "ethos?" I'll take the people at the clinic over yours any day -_-

The way I interpret your abstract is that there's actually even MORE people who have celiac that we don't even know about yet.

Now, if you'd actually read the article I'd presented before trying to google some abstract just to shoot me down as fast as possible (DDO style, I know), you'd see there is compelling evidence to show that it's not attributable to simply underdiagnosis. They found a cache of blood samples from the military, taken 50 years ago during an outbreak of strep:

"Dr. Murray's team tested the 50-year-old blood for gluten antibodies, assuming that 1 percent would be positive " the same as today's rate of celiac disease. But the number of positive results was far smaller, indicating that celiac disease was extremely rare among those young airmen. Surprised, the researchers compared those results with two recently collected sets from Olmsted County, Minn. One blood-sample set matched the birth years of the airmen. Those elderly men were four times likelier to have celiac disease than their contemporaries tested 50 years earlier. The second set matched the ages of the airmen at the time their blood was drawn. Today's young men were 4.5 times likelier to have celiac disease than the 1950s recruits."


4x vs 4.5x hardly seems statistically significant.

*facepalm*

Just re-read the paragraph.

Anybody else want to "shoot down my premises?" If you do, make sure to read the article so you don't make yourself an a55 lol :)
Beliefs in a nutshell:
- The Ends never justify the Means.
- Objectivity is secondary to subjectivity.
- The War on Drugs is the worst policy in the U.S.
- Most people worship technology as a religion.
- Computers will never become sentient.
tulle
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8/28/2013 2:49:04 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/28/2013 2:09:36 PM, R0b1Billion wrote:

"Dr. Murray's team tested the 50-year-old blood for gluten antibodies, assuming that 1 percent would be positive " the same as today's rate of celiac disease. But the number of positive results was far smaller, indicating that celiac disease was extremely rare among those young airmen. Surprised, the researchers compared those results with two recently collected sets from Olmsted County, Minn. One blood-sample set matched the birth years of the airmen. Those elderly men were four times likelier to have celiac disease than their contemporaries tested 50 years earlier. The second set matched the ages of the airmen at the time their blood was drawn. Today's young men were 4.5 times likelier to have celiac disease than the 1950s recruits."


4x vs 4.5x hardly seems statistically significant.

*facepalm*

Just re-read the paragraph.

You're right, I misread the paragraph.

However, it says that they compared samples of airmen in the 50s to 1) elderly men today who are the same age the 50s airmen would be today and 2) young men today who matched the age of the 50s airmen then.

There is no way of knowing if 1) the elderly men today would have had the same instance of this disease for a variety of other reasons (eg. age) and 2) if, had they taken blood samples from today's airmen, they would have gotten the same result (as qualifying to be an airman makes you a special population).
yang.
drhead
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8/28/2013 2:52:36 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/28/2013 8:35:30 AM, R0b1Billion wrote:
At 8/27/2013 11:24:58 PM, drhead wrote:
At 8/27/2013 10:40:52 PM, R0b1Billion wrote:
http://www.mayo.edu...

Celiac disease is the impetus behind the new surge of gluten-free products. I work in a restaurant, and there are so many gluten-free people coming in to us nowadays that we are strongly considering restructuring our menu. Celiac was once a rare and unheard of condition, but it is becoming much more prevalent now.

It is most likely due to changes in diagnostic practices:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...

LOL so the people at the Mayo Clinic are so naive that they couldn't put that together, but some guy on a website that read an abstract has figured it out. Suuuuure. Ever heard of the term "ethos?" I'll take the people at the clinic over yours any day -_-

The way I interpret your abstract is that there's actually even MORE people who have celiac that we don't even know about yet.

Now, if you'd actually read the article I'd presented before trying to google some abstract just to shoot me down as fast as possible (DDO style, I know), you'd see there is compelling evidence to show that it's not attributable to simply underdiagnosis. They found a cache of blood samples from the military, taken 50 years ago during an outbreak of strep:

"Dr. Murray's team tested the 50-year-old blood for gluten antibodies, assuming that 1 percent would be positive " the same as today's rate of celiac disease. But the number of positive results was far smaller, indicating that celiac disease was extremely rare among those young airmen. Surprised, the researchers compared those results with two recently collected sets from Olmsted County, Minn. One blood-sample set matched the birth years of the airmen. Those elderly men were four times likelier to have celiac disease than their contemporaries tested 50 years earlier. The second set matched the ages of the airmen at the time their blood was drawn. Today's young men were 4.5 times likelier to have celiac disease than the 1950s recruits."

Anybody else want to "shoot down my premises?" If you do, make sure to read the article so you don't make yourself an a55 lol :)

The real question is "Did you read my post?". If you looked closely at my post, you'd see:

Basically, people who have the marker but don't have the symptoms are being diagnosed. You CAN diagnose it based on gluten antibodies, but you can ALSO look for the gene that constructs said antibodies. Obviously one is mutually inclusive to the other, but not vice-versa, so of course one method will turn up positive results more often.

Why would I be referring to the antibodies in this way if I never read the article? If you have the genetic marker, you have the genetic marker. If you have gluten antibodies, you have the genetic marker, AND it is being expressed. You can have the genetic marker and not have the antibodies, therefore not having the disease, but you CAN'T have the antibodies without having the genetic marker. While they did do the same test for two different sample sets, it's still not the best metric, or at least the only one that should be relied on. Antibodies do break down about 4 months after the last exposure to whatever they target, so of course a fresh sample will contain more gluten antibodies. It would be much better to take blood samples from living people of different ages in order to test them for celiac disease, and to test for the genetic marker as well. This methodology would be much more useful in testing the "clean" theory, since it would show the trend of the rate of the genetic marker occurring as well as the trend of the antibodies being found. While this would have the caveat that people who died of celiac would not be included in the sample (a longer-term study where samples are taken from the same age group would be needed for getting around this), it would be the only way to see if it is an increase in the gene being there (meaning it is caused by our greater ability to manage the disease), or an increase in the gene being expressed (meaning that an external cause is responsible). If it is the former, then there is no real problem - it's there because we understand it and we can deal with it much better than we could before. If it is the latter, then it's still nothing that is beyond solving. Anyone who doesn't want to pass it down can undergo selective invitrofertilization. Making screenings more widely available, combined with making selective IVF more widely available, would eventually lead to the eradication of celiac disease.
Wall of Fail

"You reject religion... calling it a sickness, to what ends??? Are you a Homosexual??" - Dogknox
"For me, Evolution is a zombie theory. I mean imaginary cartoons and wishful thinking support it?" - Dragonfang
"There are no mental health benefits of atheism. It is devoid of rational thinking and mental protection." - Gabrian