Total Posts:11|Showing Posts:1-11
Jump to topic:

Concept of disability

luvx
Posts: 53
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/7/2013 4:01:25 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
The concept of disability is a category where we group persons who are in some way defective. The concept of disability is unnecessary and stigmatizing. We are not good at everything and were all disabled, so should we abolish the concept of disability?
Jack212
Posts: 572
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/7/2013 4:52:56 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/7/2013 4:01:25 PM, luvx wrote:
The concept of disability is a category where we group persons who are in some way defective. The concept of disability is unnecessary and stigmatizing. We are not good at everything and were all disabled, so should we abolish the concept of disability?

It's not unnecessary. The idea of being "disabled" is that you lack a basic ability (e.g. walking or seeing) that everybody else has and takes for granted. Take as much offense as you like.
luvx
Posts: 53
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/7/2013 4:55:39 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/7/2013 4:52:56 PM, Jack212 wrote:
At 10/7/2013 4:01:25 PM, luvx wrote:
The concept of disability is a category where we group persons who are in some way defective. The concept of disability is unnecessary and stigmatizing. We are not good at everything and were all disabled, so should we abolish the concept of disability?

It's not unnecessary. The idea of being "disabled" is that you lack a basic ability (e.g. walking or seeing) that everybody else has and takes for granted. Take as much offense as you like.

Then why is autism and down syndrome classified as a disability?
Jack212
Posts: 572
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/7/2013 5:00:59 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/7/2013 4:55:39 PM, luvx wrote:
At 10/7/2013 4:52:56 PM, Jack212 wrote:
At 10/7/2013 4:01:25 PM, luvx wrote:
The concept of disability is a category where we group persons who are in some way defective. The concept of disability is unnecessary and stigmatizing. We are not good at everything and were all disabled, so should we abolish the concept of disability?

It's not unnecessary. The idea of being "disabled" is that you lack a basic ability (e.g. walking or seeing) that everybody else has and takes for granted. Take as much offense as you like.

Then why is autism and down syndrome classified as a disability?

Developmental and intellectual impairment, respectively.
luvx
Posts: 53
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/7/2013 5:10:36 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/7/2013 5:00:59 PM, Jack212 wrote:
At 10/7/2013 4:55:39 PM, luvx wrote:
At 10/7/2013 4:52:56 PM, Jack212 wrote:
At 10/7/2013 4:01:25 PM, luvx wrote:
The concept of disability is a category where we group persons who are in some way defective. The concept of disability is unnecessary and stigmatizing. We are not good at everything and were all disabled, so should we abolish the concept of disability?

It's not unnecessary. The idea of being "disabled" is that you lack a basic ability (e.g. walking or seeing) that everybody else has and takes for granted. Take as much offense as you like.

Then why is autism and down syndrome classified as a disability?

Developmental and intellectual impairment, respectively.

Some people just take longer then others. For others, vice versa. We should not put them in a separate category of "impaired" as that is stigmatizing. Those who can't work because of a medical condition can be classified as having a disability (for the purposes of receiving benefits), those who are mentally incapacitated by a medical condition are incompetent. Persons with down syndrome and autism should not be classified as having a disability solely because they have down syndrome or autism. And most special education students are not disabled.
bladerunner060
Posts: 7,126
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/7/2013 5:24:55 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/7/2013 5:10:36 PM, luvx wrote:
At 10/7/2013 5:00:59 PM, Jack212 wrote:
At 10/7/2013 4:55:39 PM, luvx wrote:
At 10/7/2013 4:52:56 PM, Jack212 wrote:
At 10/7/2013 4:01:25 PM, luvx wrote:
The concept of disability is a category where we group persons who are in some way defective. The concept of disability is unnecessary and stigmatizing. We are not good at everything and were all disabled, so should we abolish the concept of disability?

It's not unnecessary. The idea of being "disabled" is that you lack a basic ability (e.g. walking or seeing) that everybody else has and takes for granted. Take as much offense as you like.

Then why is autism and down syndrome classified as a disability?

Developmental and intellectual impairment, respectively.

Some people just take longer then others. For others, vice versa. We should not put them in a separate category of "impaired" as that is stigmatizing. Those who can't work because of a medical condition can be classified as having a disability (for the purposes of receiving benefits), those who are mentally incapacitated by a medical condition are incompetent. Persons with down syndrome and autism should not be classified as having a disability solely because they have down syndrome or autism. And most special education students are not disabled.

Having autism does not necessarily make one "disabled" (depending on where on the spectrum one is)--but somewhere around 50% of autistic folks have severe communication problems. And downs syndrome results in mental impairment in pretty much 100% of cases.

Disabled just means unable to function like a "normal" person. If you can--you aren't disabled. If you can't--you are. That some conditions almost always result in disability doesn't really change the criteria. If you can't walk because you have no legs, you're disabled. If you can't talk because you can't develop speech, you're disabled. There is a "normal" baseline. We can all agree that there's nothing inherently "better" about being normal, but at the same time, disabled indicates abilities below that baseline and, consequently, a more-difficult life. You can't handwave a disability away by saying that "some people just take longer than others". A kid with Downs syndrome will never reach "normal" levels of cognition. That doesn't make them "less" of a person, but is a point regarding functionality, which is all that "disabled" is supposed to indicate.
Assistant moderator to airmax1227. PM me with any questions or concerns!
luvx
Posts: 53
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/7/2013 5:34:26 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/7/2013 5:24:55 PM, bladerunner060 wrote:
At 10/7/2013 5:10:36 PM, luvx wrote:
At 10/7/2013 5:00:59 PM, Jack212 wrote:
At 10/7/2013 4:55:39 PM, luvx wrote:
At 10/7/2013 4:52:56 PM, Jack212 wrote:
At 10/7/2013 4:01:25 PM, luvx wrote:
The concept of disability is a category where we group persons who are in some way defective. The concept of disability is unnecessary and stigmatizing. We are not good at everything and were all disabled, so should we abolish the concept of disability?

It's not unnecessary. The idea of being "disabled" is that you lack a basic ability (e.g. walking or seeing) that everybody else has and takes for granted. Take as much offense as you like.

Then why is autism and down syndrome classified as a disability?

Developmental and intellectual impairment, respectively.

Some people just take longer then others. For others, vice versa. We should not put them in a separate category of "impaired" as that is stigmatizing. Those who can't work because of a medical condition can be classified as having a disability (for the purposes of receiving benefits), those who are mentally incapacitated by a medical condition are incompetent. Persons with down syndrome and autism should not be classified as having a disability solely because they have down syndrome or autism. And most special education students are not disabled.

Having autism does not necessarily make one "disabled" (depending on where on the spectrum one is)--but somewhere around 50% of autistic folks have severe communication problems. And downs syndrome results in mental impairment in pretty much 100% of cases.

Disabled just means unable to function like a "normal" person. If you can--you aren't disabled. If you can't--you are. That some conditions almost always result in disability doesn't really change the criteria. If you can't walk because you have no legs, you're disabled. If you can't talk because you can't develop speech, you're disabled. There is a "normal" baseline. We can all agree that there's nothing inherently "better" about being normal, but at the same time, disabled indicates abilities below that baseline and, consequently, a more-difficult life. You can't handwave a disability away by saying that "some people just take longer than others". A kid with Downs syndrome will never reach "normal" levels of cognition. That doesn't make them "less" of a person, but is a point regarding functionality, which is all that "disabled" is supposed to indicate.

A kid with down syndrome can reach normal levels of cognition.

Andrea Fay Friedman (born June 1, 1970) is an American film and television actress with down syndrome. A 48 minute documentary about her life, A Possible Dream: The Andrea Friedman Story with narration by Joanne Woodward premiered in 2009. As of 2010, Friedman had been working at a law firm, in the accounting department, for 20 years. She also occasionally works as an assistant teacher for the Pathway program in UCLA, where she helps teach students how to live independently. She has traveled to India and Japan, and speaks some Japanese. She also enjoys bowling and skiing.

The average person, with or without down syndrome, does not accomplish this.

She was the voice of Ellen, a character with Down syndrome, in the "Extra Large Medium" episode of Family Guy, her first role as a voice actress. In the episode, Friedman's character stated "My father is an accountant, and my mother is governor of Alaska", referencing Sarah Palin's daughter, Bristol. However, per Friedman, "Sarah Palin said that was insensitive and cruel" and Friedman felt "it was only a joke." In an email concerning Sarah Palin's criticism of the episode, she said, "I guess former Governor Palin does not have a sense of humor." She concluded, "In my family we think laughing is good. My parents raised me to have a sense of humor and to live a normal life."
bladerunner060
Posts: 7,126
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/7/2013 5:44:56 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/7/2013 5:34:26 PM, luvx wrote:
At 10/7/2013 5:24:55 PM, bladerunner060 wrote:
At 10/7/2013 5:10:36 PM, luvx wrote:
At 10/7/2013 5:00:59 PM, Jack212 wrote:
At 10/7/2013 4:55:39 PM, luvx wrote:
At 10/7/2013 4:52:56 PM, Jack212 wrote:
At 10/7/2013 4:01:25 PM, luvx wrote:
The concept of disability is a category where we group persons who are in some way defective. The concept of disability is unnecessary and stigmatizing. We are not good at everything and were all disabled, so should we abolish the concept of disability?

It's not unnecessary. The idea of being "disabled" is that you lack a basic ability (e.g. walking or seeing) that everybody else has and takes for granted. Take as much offense as you like.

Then why is autism and down syndrome classified as a disability?

Developmental and intellectual impairment, respectively.

Some people just take longer then others. For others, vice versa. We should not put them in a separate category of "impaired" as that is stigmatizing. Those who can't work because of a medical condition can be classified as having a disability (for the purposes of receiving benefits), those who are mentally incapacitated by a medical condition are incompetent. Persons with down syndrome and autism should not be classified as having a disability solely because they have down syndrome or autism. And most special education students are not disabled.

Having autism does not necessarily make one "disabled" (depending on where on the spectrum one is)--but somewhere around 50% of autistic folks have severe communication problems. And downs syndrome results in mental impairment in pretty much 100% of cases.

Disabled just means unable to function like a "normal" person. If you can--you aren't disabled. If you can't--you are. That some conditions almost always result in disability doesn't really change the criteria. If you can't walk because you have no legs, you're disabled. If you can't talk because you can't develop speech, you're disabled. There is a "normal" baseline. We can all agree that there's nothing inherently "better" about being normal, but at the same time, disabled indicates abilities below that baseline and, consequently, a more-difficult life. You can't handwave a disability away by saying that "some people just take longer than others". A kid with Downs syndrome will never reach "normal" levels of cognition. That doesn't make them "less" of a person, but is a point regarding functionality, which is all that "disabled" is supposed to indicate.

A kid with down syndrome can reach normal levels of cognition.

Andrea Fay Friedman (born June 1, 1970) is an American film and television actress with down syndrome. A 48 minute documentary about her life, A Possible Dream: The Andrea Friedman Story with narration by Joanne Woodward premiered in 2009. As of 2010, Friedman had been working at a law firm, in the accounting department, for 20 years. She also occasionally works as an assistant teacher for the Pathway program in UCLA, where she helps teach students how to live independently. She has traveled to India and Japan, and speaks some Japanese. She also enjoys bowling and skiing.

The average person, with or without down syndrome, does not accomplish this.

She was the voice of Ellen, a character with Down syndrome, in the "Extra Large Medium" episode of Family Guy, her first role as a voice actress. In the episode, Friedman's character stated "My father is an accountant, and my mother is governor of Alaska", referencing Sarah Palin's daughter, Bristol. However, per Friedman, "Sarah Palin said that was insensitive and cruel" and Friedman felt "it was only a joke." In an email concerning Sarah Palin's criticism of the episode, she said, "I guess former Governor Palin does not have a sense of humor." She concluded, "In my family we think laughing is good. My parents raised me to have a sense of humor and to live a normal life."

A single anecdote is not a general trend.

I said "pretty much" 100% farther up, though I acknowledge I made a more general statement near the bottom. It's 99.8% of kids who have mental handicaps. Pretending that they're fine because one person doesn't (and I don't know a lot about Friedman) is not fair to them.
Assistant moderator to airmax1227. PM me with any questions or concerns!
psychout
Posts: 9
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/7/2013 6:05:35 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/7/2013 5:24:55 PM, bladerunner060 wrote:
At 10/7/2013 5:10:36 PM, luvx wrote:
At 10/7/2013 5:00:59 PM, Jack212 wrote:
At 10/7/2013 4:55:39 PM, luvx wrote:
At 10/7/2013 4:52:56 PM, Jack212 wrote:
At 10/7/2013 4:01:25 PM, luvx wrote:
The concept of disability is a category where we group persons who are in some way defective. The concept of disability is unnecessary and stigmatizing. We are not good at everything and were all disabled, so should we abolish the concept of disability?

It's not unnecessary. The idea of being "disabled" is that you lack a basic ability (e.g. walking or seeing) that everybody else has and takes for granted. Take as much offense as you like.

Then why is autism and down syndrome classified as a disability?

Developmental and intellectual impairment, respectively.

Some people just take longer then others. For others, vice versa. We should not put them in a separate category of "impaired" as that is stigmatizing. Those who can't work because of a medical condition can be classified as having a disability (for the purposes of receiving benefits), those who are mentally incapacitated by a medical condition are incompetent. Persons with down syndrome and autism should not be classified as having a disability solely because they have down syndrome or autism. And most special education students are not disabled.

Having autism does not necessarily make one "disabled" (depending on where on the spectrum one is)--but somewhere around 50% of autistic folks have severe communication problems. And downs syndrome results in mental impairment in pretty much 100% of cases.

Disabled just means unable to function like a "normal" person. If you can--you aren't disabled. If you can't--you are. That some conditions almost always result in disability doesn't really change the criteria. If you can't walk because you have no legs, you're disabled. If you can't talk because you can't develop speech, you're disabled. There is a "normal" baseline. We can all agree that there's nothing inherently "better" about being normal, but at the same time, disabled indicates abilities below that baseline and, consequently, a more-difficult life. You can't handwave a disability away by saying that "some people just take longer than others". A kid with Downs syndrome will never reach "normal" levels of cognition. That doesn't make them "less" of a person, but is a point regarding functionality, which is all that "disabled" is supposed to indicate.

The world is simply designed generally for able individuals (those who make up the norm). This is just how it is, and by labeling a person as disabled causes them to be able to receive the help they need in order to be as "normal" as possible. I personally do not like using to the word normal to describe anything, because everyone is different, and there really is no normal way to act or live life. However, in order to live, we all need to be able to do basic functions on our own, and if we can't we NEED to have help somehow. If someone cannot feed themselves, they cannot function as a person on their own. If you cannot eat, then you die, plain and simple. The problem does not necessarily come when we label a person as disabled, as much as when we look at the stigma of the concept of being disabled. We need to realize that these people are no different than us, the simply require some extra help here and there. If a student did not get checked out and labeled for learning disabilities, and they in fact had such disabilities, then how can they receive the help they need in order to function at a similar level to children their age?
Jack212
Posts: 572
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/7/2013 8:05:00 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
If you feel stigmatized for being disabled, then harden the f*ck up. Sugar-coating the issue to make it nice and PC won't stop you from being a cripple.
bladerunner060
Posts: 7,126
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/7/2013 11:49:41 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/7/2013 8:05:00 PM, Jack212 wrote:
If you feel stigmatized for being disabled, then harden the f*ck up. Sugar-coating the issue to make it nice and PC won't stop you from being a cripple.

Being a jerk about it doesn't help, either, though.
Assistant moderator to airmax1227. PM me with any questions or concerns!