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Is Christianity an efficient religion?

Adam2
Posts: 1,024
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10/14/2013 4:18:22 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
For me, "Pay onto Caesar what is of Caesar, and pay onto God what is of God" works perfectly. Islam doesn't have this.
bladerunner060
Posts: 7,126
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10/14/2013 4:38:07 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/14/2013 4:18:22 PM, Adam2 wrote:
For me, "Pay onto Caesar what is of Caesar, and pay onto God what is of God" works perfectly. Islam doesn't have this.

That's because in Islam there' usually the idea that "Islam is religion and state" which, technically, could be argued to be more efficient--nothing to do with veracity, of course.
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drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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10/14/2013 4:40:59 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/14/2013 4:18:22 PM, Adam2 wrote:
For me, "Pay onto Caesar what is of Caesar, and pay onto God what is of God" works perfectly. Islam doesn't have this.

Then explain the gov't shutdown.
Adam2
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10/14/2013 4:41:08 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/14/2013 4:38:07 PM, bladerunner060 wrote:
At 10/14/2013 4:18:22 PM, Adam2 wrote:
For me, "Pay onto Caesar what is of Caesar, and pay onto God what is of God" works perfectly. Islam doesn't have this.

That's because in Islam there' usually the idea that "Islam is religion and state" which, technically, could be argued to be more efficient--nothing to do with veracity, of course.

"Pay onto Caesar" is more democratic though. You won't find that in Islam, which pretty much believe that leaders can't be corrupt.
Adam2
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10/14/2013 4:41:41 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/14/2013 4:40:59 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 10/14/2013 4:18:22 PM, Adam2 wrote:
For me, "Pay onto Caesar what is of Caesar, and pay onto God what is of God" works perfectly. Islam doesn't have this.

Then explain the gov't shutdown.

Is anyone persecuting us or repressing our rights in this shutdown? No.
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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10/14/2013 4:43:14 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/14/2013 4:41:41 PM, Adam2 wrote:
At 10/14/2013 4:40:59 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 10/14/2013 4:18:22 PM, Adam2 wrote:
For me, "Pay onto Caesar what is of Caesar, and pay onto God what is of God" works perfectly. Islam doesn't have this.

Then explain the gov't shutdown.

Is anyone persecuting us or repressing our rights in this shutdown? No.

They aren't paying unto Caesar
Adam2
Posts: 1,024
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10/14/2013 4:44:13 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/14/2013 4:43:14 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 10/14/2013 4:41:41 PM, Adam2 wrote:
At 10/14/2013 4:40:59 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 10/14/2013 4:18:22 PM, Adam2 wrote:
For me, "Pay onto Caesar what is of Caesar, and pay onto God what is of God" works perfectly. Islam doesn't have this.

Then explain the gov't shutdown.

Is anyone persecuting us or repressing our rights in this shutdown? No.

They aren't paying unto Caesar

It's not just literal, it's figurative. It advocates separating the two -- government and religion, because one ruler can have too much power.
bladerunner060
Posts: 7,126
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10/14/2013 4:45:27 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/14/2013 4:41:08 PM, Adam2 wrote:
At 10/14/2013 4:38:07 PM, bladerunner060 wrote:
At 10/14/2013 4:18:22 PM, Adam2 wrote:
For me, "Pay onto Caesar what is of Caesar, and pay onto God what is of God" works perfectly. Islam doesn't have this.

That's because in Islam there' usually the idea that "Islam is religion and state" which, technically, could be argued to be more efficient--nothing to do with veracity, of course.

"Pay onto Caesar" is more democratic though. You won't find that in Islam, which pretty much believe that leaders can't be corrupt.

Actually, no, it isn't...Caesars were emperors, which is kinda the opposite of democracy...

The Christian quote, therefore, implies the exact same level of mindless obedience as Islam (Which is to say, both could be argued).
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Buddamoose
Posts: 19,450
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10/14/2013 5:04:09 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Through my study of the bible when I was a Christian, it became painfully obvious that Jesus rarely ever outright declared what he meant, but rather left the interpretation open for others to figure for themselves. This statement is no different, in that, when handed a coin, he asks,

"And whose face, and whose name, is on the coin?"

to which the pharisees responded, "Caesars"

and Jesus then spoke,

"Then render back unto Caesar, that which is Caesars, and render back unto God, that which is God's."

First off, we must take within this the context of the conversation. Those questioning Jesus were attempting to catch him in a contradiction. If he said that it was ok to pay taxes, then he would be accused of betraying his own supporters. If he were to say it was not ok to pay taxes, he would have been turned over to Roman authorities, before the time that he intended to be. Therefore he had to be purposefully ambiguous in his statement, so neither of these could occur.

Now this could be taken as meaning that it is ok to pay taxes, and should be subservient to the government that you so happen to live under/within. However, did Jesus, and by extension the Christian religion, not hold that everything belongs ultimately to God? So then what exactly then is owed to Caesar? Nothing! Because it belongs to God anyways.
"Reality is an illusion created due to a lack of alcohol"
-Airmax1227

"You were the moon all this time, and he was always there to make you shine."

"Was he the sun?"

"No honey, he was the darkness"

-Kazekirion
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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10/14/2013 5:16:47 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/14/2013 4:44:13 PM, Adam2 wrote:
At 10/14/2013 4:43:14 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 10/14/2013 4:41:41 PM, Adam2 wrote:
At 10/14/2013 4:40:59 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 10/14/2013 4:18:22 PM, Adam2 wrote:
For me, "Pay onto Caesar what is of Caesar, and pay onto God what is of God" works perfectly. Islam doesn't have this.

Then explain the gov't shutdown.

Is anyone persecuting us or repressing our rights in this shutdown? No.

They aren't paying unto Caesar

It's not just literal, it's figurative. It advocates separating the two -- government and religion, because one ruler can have too much power.

I wasn't being literal, unless you're suggesting you though I meant people actually giving money to a corpse.
AlbinoBunny
Posts: 3,781
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10/14/2013 5:27:08 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Is a Bugatti Veyron efficient?
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Adam2
Posts: 1,024
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10/14/2013 6:06:31 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/14/2013 5:04:09 PM, Buddamoose wrote:
Through my study of the bible when I was a Christian, it became painfully obvious that Jesus rarely ever outright declared what he meant, but rather left the interpretation open for others to figure for themselves. This statement is no different, in that, when handed a coin, he asks,

"And whose face, and whose name, is on the coin?"

to which the pharisees responded, "Caesars"

and Jesus then spoke,

"Then render back unto Caesar, that which is Caesars, and render back unto God, that which is God's."

First off, we must take within this the context of the conversation. Those questioning Jesus were attempting to catch him in a contradiction. If he said that it was ok to pay taxes, then he would be accused of betraying his own supporters. If he were to say it was not ok to pay taxes, he would have been turned over to Roman authorities, before the time that he intended to be. Therefore he had to be purposefully ambiguous in his statement, so neither of these could occur.

Now this could be taken as meaning that it is ok to pay taxes, and should be subservient to the government that you so happen to live under/within. However, did Jesus, and by extension the Christian religion, not hold that everything belongs ultimately to God? So then what exactly then is owed to Caesar? Nothing! Because it belongs to God anyways.

But what he means is that we are to obey the law, unless the law goes becomes antiChrist.
Buddamoose
Posts: 19,450
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10/14/2013 6:13:34 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/14/2013 6:06:31 PM, Adam2 wrote:

But what he means is that we are to obey the law, unless the law goes becomes antiChrist.

untrue, a christian is supposed to obey gods laws. A government a christian would be justified in following would be one that bears in mind and supports the commandments and lessons within the Bible. It is still not the government in this case that the person is supposed to follow, but rather, God. The government is simply acting in extension to God's will.
"Reality is an illusion created due to a lack of alcohol"
-Airmax1227

"You were the moon all this time, and he was always there to make you shine."

"Was he the sun?"

"No honey, he was the darkness"

-Kazekirion
Adam2
Posts: 1,024
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10/14/2013 6:14:41 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/14/2013 6:13:34 PM, Buddamoose wrote:
At 10/14/2013 6:06:31 PM, Adam2 wrote:

But what he means is that we are to obey the law, unless the law goes becomes antiChrist.

untrue, a christian is supposed to obey gods laws. A government a christian would be justified in following would be one that bears in mind and supports the commandments and lessons within the Bible. It is still not the government in this case that the person is supposed to follow, but rather, God. The government is simply acting in extension to God's will.

RIght, but man inheriently evil, that's why did law was made. Islam doesn't have that which Christianity. That's why nations that have subscribed to this have always been successful.
NotReallySmart
Posts: 212
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10/16/2013 6:41:35 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/14/2013 6:14:41 PM, Adam2 wrote:
At 10/14/2013 6:13:34 PM, Buddamoose wrote:
At 10/14/2013 6:06:31 PM, Adam2 wrote:

But what he means is that we are to obey the law, unless the law goes becomes antiChrist.

untrue, a christian is supposed to obey gods laws. A government a christian would be justified in following would be one that bears in mind and supports the commandments and lessons within the Bible. It is still not the government in this case that the person is supposed to follow, but rather, God. The government is simply acting in extension to God's will.

RIght, but man inheriently evil, that's why did law was made. Islam doesn't have that which Christianity. That's why nations that have subscribed to this have always been successful.

So the whole point of this thread is for people to assure you that Christianity is a more efficient religion then Islam, right?
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There are those who seek knowledge to be known by others; that is Vanity.

There are those who seek knowledge in order to serve; that is Love."

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