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Women behaving like men.

Thanatos1983
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1/4/2014 6:39:56 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
It"s generally assumed that men are the only ones who force women to submit to sex. Modern news articles, both in the papers and interviews on TV indicate that women can do the same to men. On youtube, I found a short film of two women cornering a man in a studio that was supposed to portray the setting of Auschwitz, knocking him down and then one them holding him down while the other violates him.

Now, this hints at a new, creative movement that wants to make the statement that women, as an unnatural as the concept seems to me, can resort to sexual abuse as well. The proof is they do, but what has prompted this new development?
KingDebater
Posts: 687
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1/4/2014 6:49:17 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
On a similar topic, here is an advert that's still airing over here in England. The part of the advert I'm talking about is near the end, when the woman pinches the butts of two men. I can't help but think that if it were the other way round, a man pinching the bums of two women, it wouldn't pass the censors.
InvictusManeo
Posts: 384
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1/4/2014 7:33:30 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/4/2014 6:39:56 AM, Thanatos1983 wrote:
It"s generally assumed that men are the only ones who force women to submit to sex. Modern news articles, both in the papers and interviews on TV indicate that women can do the same to men. On youtube, I found a short film of two women cornering a man in a studio that was supposed to portray the setting of Auschwitz, knocking him down and then one them holding him down while the other violates him.

Now, this hints at a new, creative movement that wants to make the statement that women, as an unnatural as the concept seems to me, can resort to sexual abuse as well. The proof is they do, but what has prompted this new development?

What youtube video?

Also, women acting like men is not a new movement. They do this to be considered equally as powerful and influential as them, because feminine qualities are viewed as being inferior or weaker.
Thanatos1983
Posts: 23
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1/4/2014 8:04:13 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/4/2014 7:33:30 AM, InvictusManeo wrote:
At 1/4/2014 6:39:56 AM, Thanatos1983 wrote:
It"s generally assumed that men are the only ones who force women to submit to sex. Modern news articles, both in the papers and interviews on TV indicate that women can do the same to men. On youtube, I found a short film of two women cornering a man in a studio that was supposed to portray the setting of Auschwitz, knocking him down and then one them holding him down while the other violates him.

Now, this hints at a new, creative movement that wants to make the statement that women, as an unnatural as the concept seems to me, can resort to sexual abuse as well. The proof is they do, but what has prompted this new development?

What youtube video?

Also, women acting like men is not a new movement. They do this to be considered equally as powerful and influential as them, because feminine qualities are viewed as being inferior or weaker.

Interesting. Anything done out of belief is admirable, although it can be mired by thing like excess or resentment.

Here is the video I was referring to...

https://www.youtube.com...
Thanatos1983
Posts: 23
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1/5/2014 4:15:33 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/4/2014 5:03:02 PM, AnDoctuir wrote:
Are you someone I know?

Curious question, AnDoctuir. We might have crossed paths. I went to London Metropolitan University. I did a major degree in Creative Writing and a minor in Film Studies. I live in Gerona, Spain. Does any of this sound familiar to you?
de.france
Posts: 9
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1/5/2014 9:39:23 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
Now, this hints at a new, creative movement that wants to make the statement that women, as an unnatural as the concept seems to me, can resort to sexual abuse as well. The proof is they do, but what has prompted this new development?

Interesting subject. Do you base this question on this type of videos alone or do you have other situations backing up this theory? To me there is no proof that women resort to sexual abuse. Of course there are deviations by minorities of women with "alternative" sexual practices but that is not the discussion here. I believe that sexual abuse is rooted in a confused grey zone of arousal and dominance, the latter of which is less native in the female sexuality. This "development" (if there were to be such a development in the first place) is simply based on the industry and society needing to find new ways to stand out from the rest.
Thanatos1983
Posts: 23
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1/5/2014 1:15:33 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/5/2014 12:51:10 PM, AnDoctuir wrote:
At 1/5/2014 4:15:33 AM, Thanatos1983 wrote:
At 1/4/2014 5:03:02 PM, AnDoctuir wrote:
Are you someone I know?

Curious question, AnDoctuir. We might have crossed paths. I went to London Metropolitan University. I did a major degree in Creative Writing and a minor in Film Studies. I live in Gerona, Spain. Does any of this sound familiar to you?

F*ck off mate

What"s this? I didn"t mean to insult you. Why do you take such an attitude towards me?
Thanatos1983
Posts: 23
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1/5/2014 1:19:12 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/5/2014 9:39:23 AM, de.france wrote:
Now, this hints at a new, creative movement that wants to make the statement that women, as an unnatural as the concept seems to me, can resort to sexual abuse as well. The proof is they do, but what has prompted this new development?

Interesting subject. Do you base this question on this type of videos alone or do you have other situations backing up this theory? To me there is no proof that women resort to sexual abuse. Of course there are deviations by minorities of women with "alternative" sexual practices but that is not the discussion here. I believe that sexual abuse is rooted in a confused grey zone of arousal and dominance, the latter of which is less native in the female sexuality. This "development" (if there were to be such a development in the first place) is simply based on the industry and society needing to find new ways to stand out from the rest.

I think the gulf between men and women is becoming bridged. Women work in an equal capacity to men in many lines of work. It might be the case that gender differences are becoming a difference of the past, save for woman"s more sensual approach and man"s more visual orientation towards sex.
de.france
Posts: 9
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1/5/2014 2:48:38 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
I think the gulf between men and women is becoming bridged. Women work in an equal capacity to men in many lines of work. It might be the case that gender differences are becoming a difference of the past, save for woman"s more sensual approach and man"s more visual orientation towards sex.

That would insinuate that mens way of being is the only one, the final and ultimate one, if the mere fact that women taking up more space in the work sector would make them become like, "evolve" into, men once theyve gotten into the same circumstances as men. Perhaps its not the true nature of women that you are seeing in these tendencies. The women that do copy mens way could also be due to the fact that women are stepping into an arena of men. it is the mens game, men have set the rules and to join the game some women think that you need to adapt and go with the written rules instead of expanding and changing them. "If you cant beat them, join them". Thats whats happening.

That being said, women's sexuality is not evolving but its less stigmatized by society and thus women are able to explore their sexuality more freely. But i guess that is a different subject.
1810929
Posts: 11
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1/6/2014 5:39:23 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/5/2014 2:48:38 PM, de.france wrote:
I think the gulf between men and women is becoming bridged. Women work in an equal capacity to men in many lines of work. It might be the case that gender differences are becoming a difference of the past, save for woman"s more sensual approach and man"s more visual orientation towards sex.

That would insinuate that mens way of being is the only one, the final and ultimate one, if the mere fact that women taking up more space in the work sector would make them become like, "evolve" into, men once theyve gotten into the same circumstances as men. Perhaps its not the true nature of women that you are seeing in these tendencies. The women that do copy mens way could also be due to the fact that women are stepping into an arena of men. it is the mens game, men have set the rules and to join the game some women think that you need to adapt and go with the written rules instead of expanding and changing them. "If you cant beat them, join them". Thats whats happening.

That being said, women's sexuality is not evolving but its less stigmatized by society and thus women are able to explore their sexuality more freely. But i guess that is a different subject.

Games? Games of life? The fact that you already see the rules as male-oriented things prior points out that you believe women cannot be as physically, mentally, emotionally and psychologically strong as men. (It's an assumption, please correct me if I am wrong).

I somewhat believe some roles are better played by each gender and I appreciate this very much; because to live in a society, you must be able to trust (but not demand and rely on) the people around you. It is about equity, where opportunities are created to meet the persons' demand, whether it is a taller ladder for short people, and shorter ladder for tall people. It is the same with gender equity; some women may be able to "follow" men's footsteps better than others, maybe better than some men. Why not individualise the rule of Games of Life instead of saying one rule for men and one rule for women?

plus, i agree that women should also be harshly prosecuted against sexual abuse; any abuse should be taken seriously and not given the benefit of the doubt because the abuser is a "weak" gendered female.
Thanatos1983
Posts: 23
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1/7/2014 6:18:52 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/6/2014 5:39:23 PM, 1810929 wrote:
At 1/5/2014 2:48:38 PM, de.france wrote:
I think the gulf between men and women is becoming bridged. Women work in an equal capacity to men in many lines of work. It might be the case that gender differences are becoming a difference of the past, save for woman"s more sensual approach and man"s more visual orientation towards sex.

That would insinuate that mens way of being is the only one, the final and ultimate one, if the mere fact that women taking up more space in the work sector would make them become like, "evolve" into, men once theyve gotten into the same circumstances as men. Perhaps its not the true nature of women that you are seeing in these tendencies. The women that do copy mens way could also be due to the fact that women are stepping into an arena of men. it is the mens game, men have set the rules and to join the game some women think that you need to adapt and go with the written rules instead of expanding and changing them. "If you cant beat them, join them". Thats whats happening.

That being said, women's sexuality is not evolving but its less stigmatized by society and thus women are able to explore their sexuality more freely. But i guess that is a different subject.

Games? Games of life? The fact that you already see the rules as male-oriented things prior points out that you believe women cannot be as physically, mentally, emotionally and psychologically strong as men. (It's an assumption, please correct me if I am wrong).

I somewhat believe some roles are better played by each gender and I appreciate this very much; because to live in a society, you must be able to trust (but not demand and rely on) the people around you. It is about equity, where opportunities are created to meet the persons' demand, whether it is a taller ladder for short people, and shorter ladder for tall people. It is the same with gender equity; some women may be able to "follow" men's footsteps better than others, maybe better than some men. Why not individualise the rule of Games of Life instead of saying one rule for men and one rule for women?

plus, i agree that women should also be harshly prosecuted against sexual abuse; any abuse should be taken seriously and not given the benefit of the doubt because the abuser is a "weak" gendered female.

I am with you. Let women decide what is best for themselves and praise them for their convictions. What works for one might not for another, so yes, by all means, let there be some who are proactive and those who are more domestic. After all, anything done for reasons of the heart and the mind combined, are worthy of praise.

Only, we must make sure the killer instinct of women is preserved.
de.france
Posts: 9
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1/7/2014 4:46:08 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Games? Games of life? The fact that you already see the rules as male-oriented things prior points out that you believe women cannot be as physically, mentally, emotionally and psychologically strong as men. (It's an assumption, please correct me if I am wrong).

I somewhat believe some roles are better played by each gender and I appreciate this very much; because to live in a society, you must be able to trust (but not demand and rely on) the people around you. It is about equity, where opportunities are created to meet the persons' demand, whether it is a taller ladder for short people, and shorter ladder for tall people. It is the same with gender equity; some women may be able to "follow" men's footsteps better than others, maybe better than some men. Why not individualise the rule of Games of Life instead of saying one rule for men and one rule for women?

plus, I agree that women should also be harshly prosecuted against sexual abuse; any abuse should be taken seriously and not given the benefit of the doubt because the abuser is a "weak" gendered female.

That assumption is not what I meant. The "games" are referring to the sociological rules in the work sector that the initial question pointed out (insinuating that women are "evolving" into men thanks to the fact that the social climate allows them the same place/rights/circumstances as men). In the cases where that is true (that women are behaving like men) I simply tried to point out that it is perhaps not the fact that women are getting to the same level and power as men which "turns them" to the male behaviour, but more a question of those women choosing to adapt to the "male way of being" in order to best fit to the game (the unwritten rules of how to behave in order to succeed). I do not at all believe that women are weaker than men (other than for the, in most cases, physical inferiority), on the contrary. I do believe though that men had the power first and thus they set the sociological rules of which behaviour equals success (on the work sector argument for example).

I agree that the rules should not necessarily be adapted to fit each and every one, some it fits and some it wont, no matter how the rules may look like. However, whether you mark them as rules for men or women or not, the fact is that the rulebook was written by men and thus it is currently more suited to male behaviour (I'm generalizing of course). Either women go along with the game and adapt to these rules or they try to change the game, the latter of course is harder and thus a battle not many choose to take on.

in no way did I mean that the female gender would be the weaker one, I do believe the opposite actually. Look at all sht they're able to put up with.
1810929
Posts: 11
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1/7/2014 8:40:31 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
That assumption is not what I meant. The "games" are referring to the sociological rules in the work sector that the initial question pointed out (insinuating that women are "evolving" into men thanks to the fact that the social climate allows them the same place/rights/circumstances as men). In the cases where that is true (that women are behaving like men) I simply tried to point out that it is perhaps not the fact that women are getting to the same level and power as men which "turns them" to the male behaviour, but more a question of those women choosing to adapt to the "male way of being" in order to best fit to the game (the unwritten rules of how to behave in order to succeed). I do not at all believe that women are weaker than men (other than for the, in most cases, physical inferiority), on the contrary. I do believe though that men had the power first and thus they set the sociological rules of which behaviour equals success (on the work sector argument for example).

I agree that the rules should not necessarily be adapted to fit each and every one, some it fits and some it wont, no matter how the rules may look like. However, whether you mark them as rules for men or women or not, the fact is that the rulebook was written by men and thus it is currently more suited to male behaviour (I'm generalizing of course). Either women go along with the game and adapt to these rules or they try to change the game, the latter of course is harder and thus a battle not many choose to take on.


Are you willing to change the "rule of the game"? It is not only up to women to change the game. Men may have "created" the rule, however, men can also make changes to it as well. Again, we live among each other, so why not try to make the rule seem more fit for everyone, instead of just one gender? This may also be a whole another topic, but why not go even further and try to change it for all race, age and sexual preferences?

in no way did I mean that the female gender would be the weaker one, I do believe the opposite actually. Look at all sht they're able to put up with.

As a woman, I found this very... sad. I'm guessing the "sht" we put up with are from male? Sad to think that women around you have to go through these "sht"s. But then again, women can be just as cruel (stereotyping at its best).
de.france
Posts: 9
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1/8/2014 4:01:37 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Are you willing to change the "rule of the game"? It is not only up to women to change the game. Men may have "created" the rule, however, men can also make changes to it as well. Again, we live among each other, so why not try to make the rule seem more fit for everyone, instead of just one gender? This may also be a whole another topic, but why not go even further and try to change it for all race, age and sexual preferences?

in no way did I mean that the female gender would be the weaker one, I do believe the opposite actually. Look at all sht they're able to put up with.

As a woman, I found this very... sad. I'm guessing the "sht" we put up with are from male? Sad to think that women around you have to go through these "sht"s. But then again, women can be just as cruel (stereotyping at its best).

Yes, the sht referred to how women are treated by men. And yes, it is highly sad. but look at society even the western one, look at any magazine, anywhere you turn a women is valued first for her looks. and women accept this. have you seen a magazine lately with a clothed woman on the cover ? or a man baring skin (except for male gay mags of course :)) Look at what happens to teenage girls in USA today, committing suicide after having been ridiculed and objectified. A way of life that today's society has given birth to and that women are just accepting and men laughing away as non issues. Or look at what is happening in Spain, where in 2014 the decide to restrict abortion. No matter the subject, women ( I am generalizing yes but only to prove my point) are martyrs, they just suck it in and take it. I don't only blame men for the way things are today between the sexes. A lot of women are as you point out just as cruel as these men, some women are the worst chauvinistic creatures I've come across. Some women would do anything to get the respect and impression to be one of the guys. Its pathetic to see. Luckily there are some stronger souls out there. I just hope it will be enough. Well, I'm slipping away from the subject.

Men created the rules. The majority of the human race is lazy egoists that wont try to better a situation if they don't get part in the profit of the change. so no, I would not count on men to change the game. Its up to women to turn it around. which they can, but I feel that a lot of women don't realize it. They seem to think they need to behave like men (I refer to those who act like men as the topic describes). I mean look at the pop industry highly influences by porn, the strip clubs tendencies where women (even straight women) are becoming a growing part of a new client base . I highly doubt that these women enjoy this, but they've convinced themselves that they do so hard that they believe it. Just so they can be one of the guys. Well, its another subject but the core is the same. Women need to make the game change, or continue and play as the boys. But playing like the boys doesn't mean that its their true nature. No matter how much more space women take in the workplace, its not the "equality" or "evolving" nature of women what gives birth to videos like the on in the initial post. women will never become like men, but they might pretend to be.
1810929
Posts: 11
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1/8/2014 5:00:50 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/8/2014 4:01:37 PM, de.france wrote:
Are you willing to change the "rule of the game"? It is not only up to women to change the game. Men may have "created" the rule, however, men can also make changes to it as well. Again, we live among each other, so why not try to make the rule seem more fit for everyone, instead of just one gender? This may also be a whole another topic, but why not go even further and try to change it for all race, age and sexual preferences?

in no way did I mean that the female gender would be the weaker one, I do believe the opposite actually. Look at all sht they're able to put up with.

As a woman, I found this very... sad. I'm guessing the "sht" we put up with are from male? Sad to think that women around you have to go through these "sht"s. But then again, women can be just as cruel (stereotyping at its best).

Yes, the sht referred to how women are treated by men. And yes, it is highly sad. but look at society even the western one, look at any magazine, anywhere you turn a women is valued first for her looks. and women accept this. have you seen a magazine lately with a clothed woman on the cover ? or a man baring skin (except for male gay mags of course :)) Look at what happens to teenage girls in USA today, committing suicide after having been ridiculed and objectified. A way of life that today's society has given birth to and that women are just accepting and men laughing away as non issues.

I don't live in the USA or know what is like to be bullied (sure, I have been picked on, but doesn't mean I didn't stand up for myself). However, to say it is only girls who are bullied and ridiculed is wrong; statistically, women are more likely to talk about these issues than men; despite their age. So sure, you hear about it; but that doesn't necessarily mean girls are more bullied than boys.

Or look at what is happening in Spain, where in 2014 the decide to restrict abortion. No matter the subject, women ( I am generalizing yes but only to prove my point) are martyrs, they just suck it in and take it. I don't only blame men for the way things are today between the sexes. A lot of women are as you point out just as cruel as these men, some women are the worst chauvinistic creatures I've come across. Some women would do anything to get the respect and impression to be one of the guys. Its pathetic to see. Luckily there are some stronger souls out there. I just hope it will be enough. Well, I'm slipping away from the subject.

Men are just as pathetic as women; you are on your side of the fence on the dating/defending world, and as a straight woman, I am on my side, hence you may say some of us are pathetic, but so are you boys.

Men created the rules. The majority of the human race is lazy egoists that wont try to better a situation if they don't get part in the profit of the change. so no, I would not count on men to change the game.

hahahaha I agree so much with you on this one.

Its up to women to turn it around. which they can, but I feel that a lot of women don't realize it. They seem to think they need to behave like men (I refer to those who act like men as the topic describes). I mean look at the pop industry highly influences by porn, the strip clubs tendencies where women (even straight women) are becoming a growing part of a new client base . I highly doubt that these women enjoy this, but they've convinced themselves that they do so hard that they believe it. Just so they can be one of the guys. Well, its another subject but the core is the same. Women need to make the game change, or continue and play as the boys. But playing like the boys doesn't mean that its their true nature. No matter how much more space women take in the workplace, its not the "equality" or "evolving" nature of women what gives birth to videos like the on in the initial post. women will never become like men, but they might pretend to be.

I have been to a strip club, and I didn't enjoy it; but (again with the cruelty, dang!) my girlfriends do, because they often compare their own body to the strippers; and I'll tell you this much, the strippers aren't worthy most of the time. Moving away from why women actually goes to strip clubs; in my opinion (which is a strong one at that), is that strip clubs are exploitations. From both side of the sex. women exploit men for their money through their bodies; and men exploit women because they can't get any other way at that particular time. In that case, both are at fault. But to see strip club is only about women being sexualised and that women is the only one who is part of this scheme is sadly bias.

Tell me; what is is like to be a man? AND, how does a man behave? This should have been my first question; but only just thought of it. And where do you actually stand on this matter (I may have skipped a few entries above), because I feel like you are saying you feel for women but the way you try to convince me is by saying women are weak.
1810929
Posts: 11
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1/8/2014 5:10:48 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
another question for de.france; if a female figure close to your heart is being hated upon due to their gender, would you stand up for them?
de.france
Posts: 9
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1/9/2014 12:48:23 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
I don't live in the USA or know what is like to be bullied (sure, I have been picked on, but doesn't mean I didn't stand up for myself). However, to say it is only girls who are bullied and ridiculed is wrong; statistically, women are more likely to talk about these issues than men; despite their age. So sure, you hear about it; but that doesn't necessarily mean girls are more bullied than boys.

I didnt mean that only women were bullied, I just took that as an example of how women are treated in terms of sexual harassment, which men do not in the same length. and a lot of this harassment is considered as "normal", being judged and appreciated merely from looks. bullying is another topic. look at young girls today how they dress, not all of course but there is a frightening tendency of how the objectification is becoming one normal thing in our society. makes one wonder if the Muslims dint get it right in the end with their burka. is it worse to hide than to exploit? Well anyway that too is a different matter. So back to the young girls dressing to show as much skin as possible cos that what society is telling them they should do to be appreciated. they accept it, their mothers, cousins, grandmothers and friends al accept it and no one opposes to it (or the situation would look differently). then some are being treated as sl*ts and tossed around with pictures and what not ob FB or what not. Have lost count on how many stories like this happens in the US (living in france where thank god its not yet at this level). Anyway, this is not bullying but its a kind of harassment. A harassment that no one is opposing to, hence, continuing to play by the rules as they've been handed over instead of changing them.

Men are just as pathetic as women; you are on your side of the fence on the dating/defending world, and as a straight woman, I am on my side, hence you may say some of us are pathetic, but so are you boys.

I meant that a little bit as an exaggeration. men do just as horrid things as women but what I find astonishing is that women (some not all) are prepared to spit on their own to get the respect of a man. men would not do the same.

Its up to women to turn it around. which they can, but I feel that a lot of women don't realize it. They seem to think they need to behave like men (I refer to those who act like men as the topic describes). I mean look at the pop industry highly influences by porn, the strip clubs tendencies where women (even straight women) are becoming a growing part of a new client base . I highly doubt that these women enjoy this, but they've convinced themselves that they do so hard that they believe it. Just so they can be one of the guys. Well, its another subject but the core is the same. Women need to make the game change, or continue and play as the boys. But playing like the boys doesn't mean that its their true nature. No matter how much more space women take in the workplace, its not the "equality" or "evolving" nature of women what gives birth to videos like the on in the initial post. women will never become like men, but they might pretend to be.

I have been to a strip club, and I didn't enjoy it; but (again with the cruelty, dang!) my girlfriends do, because they often compare their own body to the strippers; and I'll tell you this much, the strippers aren't worthy most of the time. Moving away from why women actually goes to strip clubs; in my opinion (which is a strong one at that), is that strip clubs are exploitations. From both side of the sex. women exploit men for their money through their bodies; and men exploit women because they can't get any other way at that particular time. In that case, both are at fault. But to see strip club is only about women being sexualised and that women is the only one who is part of this scheme is sadly bias.

men don't only go because they have nothing else. a married man would go, someone in a happy relationship would go. stripping and porn is not about compensating for what they don't have, its just to consume in pleasure. I honestly don't get women that go to strip clubs, its pathetic to see how women would be prepared to exploit other women just to get accepted by the men's world. but moving away from that. women exploit men (money) who exploit them (pleasure) ? ok, but it is not a 1:1 gain. the men pays and gets what they want women (not all but many) get scarred and they really don't get that much out of it (a part from the high end). Would these strippers stay in the business if they could make the same living doing something else ? anyway, that would de another post.

Tell me; what is is like to be a man? AND, how does a man behave? This should have been my first question; but only just thought of it. And where do you actually stand on this matter (I may have skipped a few entries above), because I feel like you are saying you feel for women but the way you try to convince me is by saying women are weak.

I don't think women are weak. I think women are strong, stronger than men even. But they don't seem to realize their strength. In stead of standing up for what they want they want (oh I so generalize here but its only to make my point, and I don't at all speak for all women, I speak ONLY for those who chose to behave like men as the topic stated) they accept the way the society is asking them to behave.
de.france
Posts: 9
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1/9/2014 12:53:13 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/8/2014 5:10:48 PM, 1810929 wrote:
another question for de.france; if a female figure close to your heart is being hated upon due to their gender, would you stand up for them?

well hated upon due to her gender I dont think I've seen that happen, but women disrespected due to her gender yes I do. and it is a constant battle. and it is lonely out there. I'm quite surprised how men and women dont seem to see the effects of their actions sometimes, and the effects of their passiveness
1810929
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1/12/2014 4:54:29 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/9/2014 12:53:13 PM, de.france wrote:
At 1/8/2014 5:10:48 PM, 1810929 wrote:
another question for de.france; if a female figure close to your heart is being hated upon due to their gender, would you stand up for them?

well hated upon due to her gender I dont think I've seen that happen, but women disrespected due to her gender yes I do. and it is a constant battle. and it is lonely out there. I'm quite surprised how men and women dont seem to see the effects of their actions sometimes, and the effects of their passiveness

The question was supposed to be answered in a personal manner, so you can get a personal view of what these women is experiencing; yet you failed to answer it in a personal manner. I feel like your answer is yet again not consistent with the message you are trying to get across. The whole burka idea is not produced by females; it was produced and often reinforced by male through beating; now-a-days, mothers and grandmothers reinforce this to prevent their daughters from being beaten by random strangers on the street. It is not the best way of supporting their daughters, but I'm sure no person with the right mindset would want to see their family be beaten by strangers.

You keep saying it is sad to see people act this way, however I feel like it is all talk and no proper action. This is just passive opinions that doesn't help the girls; yet you say above that men would not support women and that it is women's fight alone. Ever heard of "if you have nothing nice to say, don't say anything at all"? Passive aggression is nothing but words floating in the air that will rather offend than support; I actively support women through education that may or may not help them; but for you to be there and judge women is sexist; especially if it is not factual and not helping in the process of gender equity (yes, I said equity, and not equality for a good reason; if you knew what equity means, I'm sure you understand).

This generation of women may be bad; however remember, it was always men's choice to bring about war and kill thousands of your own sex for financial gains. Now THAT, is upsetting to see; not women who dresses to "impress". What other men and women do with their life is none of our business; whether it is their job description or what they do to gain pleasure; unless they come to look for help within yourself.

You keep saying some women, but not all, behave like men; I will keep saying some men, but not all, ALSO behave like women. I understand that the topic is about women; however that on its own is sexist and have a negative implication on women.
de.france
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1/15/2014 3:14:02 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
The question was supposed to be answered in a personal manner, so you can get a personal view of what these women is experiencing; yet you failed to answer it in a personal manner. I feel like your answer is yet again not consistent with the message you are trying to get across. The whole burka idea is not produced by females; it was produced and often reinforced by male through beating; now-a-days, mothers and grandmothers reinforce this to prevent their daughters from being beaten by random strangers on the street. It is not the best way of supporting their daughters, but I'm sure no person with the right mindset would want to see their family be beaten by strangers.

You keep saying it is sad to see people act this way, however I feel like it is all talk and no proper action. This is just passive opinions that doesn't help the girls; yet you say above that men would not support women and that it is women's fight alone. Ever heard of "if you have nothing nice to say, don't say anything at all"? Passive aggression is nothing but words floating in the air that will rather offend than support; I actively support women through education that may or may not help them; but for you to be there and judge women is sexist; especially if it is not factual and not helping in the process of gender equity (yes, I said equity, and not equality for a good reason; if you knew what equity means, I'm sure you understand).

This generation of women may be bad; however remember, it was always men's choice to bring about war and kill thousands of your own sex for financial gains. Now THAT, is upsetting to see; not women who dresses to "impress". What other men and women do with their life is none of our business; whether it is their job description or what they do to gain pleasure; unless they come to look for help within yourself.

You keep saying some women, but not all, behave like men; I will keep saying some men, but not all, ALSO behave like women. I understand that the topic is about women; however that on its own is sexist and have a negative implication on women.

Wow, where to begin...? "If you have nothing nice to say then say nothing at all". Well, that's constructive if your trying to change what's wrong in the world...

Its my impression that you're selecting only some parts of what I say to an already made up mindset and then to construct your reply accordingly. I'd ask for someone Else's opinion on this but I don't think anyone is following at this stage.

To sum up what I have been trying to get across:
1. I don't believe that women are acting like men because they are getting to "the same" level professionally as men (as the initial post suggested) . I think that what might be perceived as women behaving like men actually is women adapting to play according to the pre-set rules, rules laid out by men.
2. This is a little sad because instead of adapting to men's way of being, the rules could be changed, evolved, if women sat their foot down and did things their own way (which thankfully many already do).
3. Its sad also, terribly sad, to see how low some women are willing to go just to "play along" with these rulers. For example: going to strip clubs to be like the guys and to be able to pass as a cool girl instead of a weak girly girl... This to me is the "easy" option, in stead of doing like the feminists in the 60s and protest they go along. "if you cant beat them (or if you don't want to make the effort to fight) - join them."
4. Women are strong, so much stronger than society today give them credit for and stronger than what they seem to be aware of. I in many ways actually believe women are (mentally) stronger than men.

Optimism is good yes for motivation, but I don't see only harm in trying to hide negativism if it means pointing out flaws. And, I haven't laid out examples so yes there have been no factual references, but I could give o so many examples of women being being counter productive to the gender solidarity just to get up the latter. Which of course men also are able to do, but the impact of women doing the same is so much greater than when men does it (because men already have a superior position and they don't need solidarity amongst themselves to improve the gender equality in society).

I am curious, which message do you think I am trying to get across?

I don't know where I went off to be inconsistent... In the case of the burka I know very well that its made and maintained by a male society to control women (sorry for any muslim out there that this might offend but this is my belief, create a new post and we'll discuss this topic there). The statement of the burka was to make an exaggerated point that women in the west did non necessarily draw the longest straw considering the objectification that she has come to accept as normal. I of course did not defend the burka, it was just to make a point. apparently it failed.

for the personal question I did give a personal answer; I have not seen women being hated upon so I have not been able to intervene but I have had MANY occasions where women are disrespected (perhaps that is what you meant) in which I do step in and give my opinion and try to stand up against. Though it is a lonely battle and the battle is constant if you start to look.

As mentioned above of course there are women that are doing GREAT things to try even out the game. But since these women are not a part of the answer to the initial question (women behaving like men) I did not find that relevant here. I don't go about throwing negativism about women, I do the opposite actually, but I do think women has a looong way left to go (not all women once again, but women who, for example, rather go to strip clubs than stand up for themselves and other women and to say that its sexist and exploiting).

If men behave like women ? of course (the subject needs further defining though but its not the subject). The women behaving like men part that I have been referring to is based on the dominance tendency that the initial post related to, questioning why women are "turning into" men. which I don't think they are, I think they are playing by the laid out rules.