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Duke university porn star slash freshman

Cermank
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2/22/2014 6:24:32 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
http://www.xojane.com...

"The prevailing societal brainwashing dictates that sexuality and sex "reduce" women, whereas men are merely innocent actors on the receiving end. By extension, our virginity or abstinence has a bearing on who we are as people -- as good people or bad people, as nice women or bad women.

Women's ability to be moral actors is wholly dependent on their sexuality. It is, honestly, insane.

The virgin-whore dichotomy is an insidious standard that we have unfairly placed upon women. Women are supposed to be outwardly pure and modest, while at the same time being sexually alluring and available. If a woman does not have sex after a date, she will be labeled as a prude. If she does have sex, she will be referred to later as a ho or a slut.

Society thus sets up a norm in which women simply cannot win.

We must question in this equation why sex workers are so brutally stigmatized. Why do we exclude them for jobs, education, and from mainstream society?
Why do we scorn, threaten and harass them?

Why do we deny them of their personhood?

Why does the thought of a woman having sexual experiences scare us so much?

The answer is simple.

Patriarchy fears female sexuality.

It terrifies us to even fathom that a woman could take ownership of her body. We deem to keep women in a place where they are subjected to male sexuality. We seek to rob them of their choice and of their autonomy. We want to oppress them and keep them dependent on the patriarchy. A woman who transgresses the norm and takes ownership of her body -- because that's exactly what porn is, no matter how rough the sex is -- ostensibly poses a threat to the deeply ingrained gender norms that polarize our society."
Cermank
Posts: 3,773
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2/22/2014 6:29:38 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
From her Duke interview:

"I worked as a waitress as a job for a year in high school and not only did it interfere with my school where I was barely sleeping and wasn"t doing my work, but also I was making $400 a month after taxes. I felt like I was being degraded and treated like s--t. My boss was horrible to me," Lauren said. "For people to tell me that doing porn and having sex, which I love, is more degrading than being a waitress and being somebody"s servant and picking up after somebody and being treated like a lesser, second-class citizen, that literally makes no sense. To be perfectly honest, I felt more degraded in a minimum wage, blue-collar, low paying, service job than I ever did doing porn."
Cermank
Posts: 3,773
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2/22/2014 6:41:08 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 2/22/2014 6:38:36 AM, AnDoctuir wrote:
The Big Brother thing in 1984 just clicked for me, lol. Man, that book owns.

I have no idea what you're going on about. Or what this has to do with feminism.
AnDoctuir
Posts: 11,060
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2/22/2014 6:42:13 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 2/22/2014 6:41:08 AM, Cermank wrote:
At 2/22/2014 6:38:36 AM, AnDoctuir wrote:
The Big Brother thing in 1984 just clicked for me, lol. Man, that book owns.

I have no idea what you're going on about. Or what this has to do with feminism.

My bad. Down with sex!
Oryus
Posts: 8,280
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2/22/2014 12:53:46 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 2/22/2014 6:41:08 AM, Cermank wrote:
At 2/22/2014 6:38:36 AM, AnDoctuir wrote:
The Big Brother thing in 1984 just clicked for me, lol. Man, that book owns.

I have no idea what you're going on about. Or what this has to do with feminism.

He is a moronic troll.

Anyway, that last bit is pretty interesting- that someone would feel more degraded by being a wage-slave than doing porn. lolz

If I made tons of money and had control over who I had sex with, when, and how while doing it- yeah, I'd feel more degraded being a wage-slave too.
: : :Tulle: The fool, I purposely don't engage with you because you don't have proper command of the English language.
: :
: : The Fool: It's my English writing. Either way It's okay have a larger vocabulary then you, and a better grasp of language, and you're a woman.
:
: I'm just going to leave this precious struggle nugget right here.
AnDoctuir
Posts: 11,060
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2/22/2014 1:50:29 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 2/22/2014 12:53:46 PM, Oryus wrote:
At 2/22/2014 6:41:08 AM, Cermank wrote:
At 2/22/2014 6:38:36 AM, AnDoctuir wrote:
The Big Brother thing in 1984 just clicked for me, lol. Man, that book owns.

I have no idea what you're going on about. Or what this has to do with feminism.

He is a moronic troll.

Wow Oryus, that wasn't very nice.

Anyway, that last bit is pretty interesting- that someone would feel more degraded by being a wage-slave than doing porn. lolz

If I made tons of money and had control over who I had sex with, when, and how while doing it- yeah, I'd feel more degraded being a wage-slave too.
AnDoctuir
Posts: 11,060
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2/22/2014 2:56:00 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
I suppose I should take this seriously, then. My apologies, but it's one of those areas where I've never quite trusted myself, and so I make jokes. There's a lesson for you in that, though: how a person will retreat to places more comfortable for them when confronted with something that isn't. It might be mental or physical. I find that sort of stuff interesting anyway. I have really got to get a hold of myself, lol.

Taking this thread seriously, then, the psychology is interesting. I'm not going to say there's any fear or conspiracy involved, though, which OP seems to suggest; rather, it's just a whole load of f*cked up people with f*cked up ideas. It's women as objects and other men as something dirty.

The reasons for this are pretty deep, in my opinion; bringing it back to the primordial being and what people are exposed to from there. Of course some people would say otherwise, that it's down to instinct, but I think this is largely nonsense. It's that people are influenced by the power structure currently in place - the father as the breadwinner, the king of his estate, and his wife his prize, and the little kiddies look to this as control and come to want it for themselves.

Now, evolution certainly seems to have been what brought about the whole monogamy/polygamy, patriarchal household - as a progression from the alpha male dominating his tribe, humanity having expanded - but that isn't to say that this structure is set in stone. Indeed, in just opening your eyes you will see that different structures produce individuals motivated in different ways. And again, people will cry inherency, but it's just nonsense. The trends paint an extremely clear picture. Homosexuality, this treatment of women - none of this is inherent, and it's obvious just from talking to people on this very site. I would reference a few, but it would get quite personal; I'm sure they know who they are, though, and they at the least might be the better for reading this. It's also common knowledge, however, that paedophilia is a sexuality that's passed on in such a manner, the paedophile always having been abused, and that should get you thinking.

As regards reform, then, scientific advancement and the refined economy to go with it certainly seem to be playing a large part in toppling this power structure of old. As we become more and more redundant as regards our own survival, this structure will degrade more and more. It's just a waiting game, really; though I guess there are still certain obstacles yet to be traversed. Religion, basically, which was a manipulation of that ape of a man who would be alpha and have power. What more is there to say? Oh, we should all be communists and put a real end to the ape, put some real meaning to the word "human".
AnDoctuir
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2/22/2014 3:47:23 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
I guess it just takes the obscene for us to take notice (as regards the whole inherency/conditioning bit).
slo1
Posts: 4,361
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2/22/2014 4:06:24 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
It is terrible what this girl has gone through. I think all the points are well taken. I also think this entire issue goes extremely deep into human behavior as a whole.

Men and women are subjected to manifestations of individuals opinions upon them all the time. The non productive expectations we put upon each other I think stifles much happiness in this world.

She seems very well adjusted, reasonable, happy (until all the opinionated freaks came out of the woodwork). I would be willing to bet many of them are users of porn and are struggling with religious based guilt about it and need something or someone to project upon.
Cermank
Posts: 3,773
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2/23/2014 12:18:24 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 2/22/2014 12:53:46 PM, Oryus wrote:
At 2/22/2014 6:41:08 AM, Cermank wrote:
At 2/22/2014 6:38:36 AM, AnDoctuir wrote:
The Big Brother thing in 1984 just clicked for me, lol. Man, that book owns.

I have no idea what you're going on about. Or what this has to do with feminism.

He is a moronic troll.

Anyway, that last bit is pretty interesting- that someone would feel more degraded by being a wage-slave than doing porn. lolz

If I made tons of money and had control over who I had sex with, when, and how while doing it- yeah, I'd feel more degraded being a wage-slave too.

It is, isn't it? I found her prude-whore dichotomy pretty interesting.
Oryus
Posts: 8,280
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2/23/2014 11:32:14 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 2/22/2014 2:56:00 PM, AnDoctuir wrote:
I suppose I should take this seriously, then. My apologies, but it's one of those areas where I've never quite trusted myself, and so I make jokes. There's a lesson for you in that, though: how a person will retreat to places more comfortable for them when confronted with something that isn't. It might be mental or physical. I find that sort of stuff interesting anyway. I have really got to get a hold of myself, lol.

Honestly, I hope you didn't take my comment TOO seriously. If the exchange had happened in real life, you would have merely gotten an eye-roll. Unfortunately I can't really translate that to text.
: : :Tulle: The fool, I purposely don't engage with you because you don't have proper command of the English language.
: :
: : The Fool: It's my English writing. Either way It's okay have a larger vocabulary then you, and a better grasp of language, and you're a woman.
:
: I'm just going to leave this precious struggle nugget right here.
Oryus
Posts: 8,280
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2/23/2014 11:33:31 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 2/23/2014 12:18:24 AM, Cermank wrote:
At 2/22/2014 12:53:46 PM, Oryus wrote:
At 2/22/2014 6:41:08 AM, Cermank wrote:
At 2/22/2014 6:38:36 AM, AnDoctuir wrote:
The Big Brother thing in 1984 just clicked for me, lol. Man, that book owns.

I have no idea what you're going on about. Or what this has to do with feminism.

He is a moronic troll.

Anyway, that last bit is pretty interesting- that someone would feel more degraded by being a wage-slave than doing porn. lolz

If I made tons of money and had control over who I had sex with, when, and how while doing it- yeah, I'd feel more degraded being a wage-slave too.

It is, isn't it? I found her prude-whore dichotomy pretty interesting.

Yeah, honestly, that dichotomy is old news for me here. But it was really her personal experiences with it... I mean, you hear bits and pieces of this kind of mentality here and there... but to see it thrusted so aggressively and explicitly in the direction of one person. It's maddening. o.O
: : :Tulle: The fool, I purposely don't engage with you because you don't have proper command of the English language.
: :
: : The Fool: It's my English writing. Either way It's okay have a larger vocabulary then you, and a better grasp of language, and you're a woman.
:
: I'm just going to leave this precious struggle nugget right here.
Juan_Pablo
Posts: 2,052
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2/23/2014 11:59:53 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
Cermank, men can be sad little whores too.

Men in our culture and elsewhere need to better learn to control their sexual appetites!

Celibacy or monogamy are what's required!
Juan_Pablo
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2/23/2014 12:17:47 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
The issue of porn is complicated for me.

How should I handle this issue as a person who's had God thrust back into his life?

I'm not quite sure. It's my opinion that porn stars should take all the precautions necessary to keep themselves protected from STDs and any mental trauma while on the job. However, there are risks in being a porn star, much like there is risks in being a marine biologists or a combat soldier.

My view is that a porn star career should be temporary anyway. I hope the girl discovers other talents soon, because the good times aren't going to last if she sticks to that career.
themohawkninja
Posts: 816
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2/27/2014 3:42:06 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 2/22/2014 6:24:32 AM, Cermank wrote:
The answer is simple.

Patriarchy fears female sexuality.

Well, that would be a valid explanation, but unfortunately, we don't live in a feminist patriarchy.

The real reason why sex is still taboo, is because of religion. Religion has turned sex into some 'holy' and 'amazing' thing between a man and a women (God forbid it's two males or two females). The less power religion has over our society, the more people can be free to explore their sexuality the way they want.

Also, the sheer magnitude of the consequences of breaking a porn-related law in America scares the s**t out of anyone who knows what happens.

So yeah... it's not a mythical patriarchy, it's religion and harsh punishments, at least in America.
"Morals are simply a limit to man's potential."~Myself

Political correctness is like saying you can't have a steak, because a baby can't eat one ~Unknown
ConservativePolitico
Posts: 8,210
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2/27/2014 3:46:58 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Why would patriarchy fear female sexuality?

Men love sex... the reason these women are in porn in the first place is for men.

And the reason why people in the sex industry are "harassed" isn't because of patriarchy it's because there are a lot of people, men and women, who still hold sex to a high standard and find the thought of having sex for money distasteful.
ADreamOfLiberty
Posts: 1,570
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2/27/2014 5:47:31 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 2/22/2014 6:24:32 AM, Cermank wrote:
Women's ability to be moral actors is wholly dependent on their sexuality.

Not in my book. If one can have sex where no evil comes of it, that is by definition nothing but good.

It is, honestly, insane.

Total agreement.

We must question in this equation why sex workers are so brutally stigmatized. Why do we exclude them for jobs, education, and from mainstream society?

"We" hold onto the inane notion that promiscuous sex cheapens sex and undermines its use to express deep love. I also suspect men are jealous because supply and demand gives them comparatively small chance of making it as a prostitute or porn star.

A woman who transgresses the norm and takes ownership of her body -- because that's exactly what porn is, no matter how rough the sex is -- ostensibly poses a threat to the deeply ingrained gender norms that polarize our society."

That would imply that the only socially acceptable sex for a woman would be if her body was owned by someone (other than herself). Is that how people see being married or a girlfriend?
LOL, yeah, it's pretty amazing how they think they can "reason" with you. - Sidewalker, speaking of advocates for sexual deviancy.

So, my advice, Liberty, is to go somewhere else. Leave, and never come back. - YYW

And that's what I did. Contact me at http://www.edeb8.com... by the same user name if you have anything you'd like to say.
rross
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2/28/2014 1:27:38 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Oh c'mon. She's a porn star who's recognized on campus, fearless and proudly speaking out yet she writes that article anonymously? She doesn't even link to her porn identity online?

Spare me.
darkkermit
Posts: 11,204
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2/28/2014 1:39:54 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
"
Patriarchy fears female sexuality.

It terrifies us to even fathom that a woman could take ownership of her body. We deem to keep women in a place where they are subjected to male sexuality. We seek to rob them of their choice and of their autonomy. We want to oppress them and keep them dependent on the patriarchy. A woman who transgresses the norm and takes ownership of her body -- because that's exactly what porn is, no matter how rough the sex is -- ostensibly poses a threat to the deeply ingrained gender norms that polarize our society.""

#1) As if women aren't the biggest slut shamers, and its men that perpetuate this.
#2) There are actually evolutionary reasons why people engage in slut-shaming. And no, its not the "natural fallacy". This paper is seeking an explanation of why slut-shaming occurs, and its clearly wrong.
Open borders debate:
http://www.debate.org...
wrichcirw
Posts: 11,196
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3/2/2014 10:32:51 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 2/27/2014 3:42:06 PM, themohawkninja wrote:
At 2/22/2014 6:24:32 AM, Cermank wrote:
The answer is simple.

Patriarchy fears female sexuality.

Well, that would be a valid explanation, but unfortunately, we don't live in a feminist patriarchy.

This statement doesn't make any sense. A patriarchy is masculine, almost by definition. A feminist patriarchy is an oxymoron.

The real reason why sex is still taboo, is because of religion. Religion has turned sex into some 'holy' and 'amazing' thing between a man and a women (God forbid it's two males or two females). The less power religion has over our society, the more people can be free to explore their sexuality the way they want.

Also, the sheer magnitude of the consequences of breaking a porn-related law in America scares the s**t out of anyone who knows what happens.

So yeah... it's not a mythical patriarchy, it's religion and harsh punishments, at least in America.
At 8/9/2013 9:41:24 AM, wrichcirw wrote:
If you are civil with me, I will be civil to you. If you decide to bring unreasonable animosity to bear in a reasonable discussion, then what would you expect other than to get flustered?
wrichcirw
Posts: 11,196
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3/2/2014 10:33:08 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 2/28/2014 1:27:38 PM, rross wrote:
Oh c'mon. She's a porn star who's recognized on campus, fearless and proudly speaking out yet she writes that article anonymously? She doesn't even link to her porn identity online?

Spare me.
At 8/9/2013 9:41:24 AM, wrichcirw wrote:
If you are civil with me, I will be civil to you. If you decide to bring unreasonable animosity to bear in a reasonable discussion, then what would you expect other than to get flustered?
wrichcirw
Posts: 11,196
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3/2/2014 10:34:58 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 2/27/2014 3:46:58 PM, ConservativePolitico wrote:
Why would patriarchy fear female sexuality?

Men love sex... the reason these women are in porn in the first place is for men.

Many men love sex because they equate sex with power. Think of the kinds of analogies that are made about the penis.

For women to like sex would mean that women would begin to grasp this power. Some men fear that.

And the reason why people in the sex industry are "harassed" isn't because of patriarchy it's because there are a lot of people, men and women, who still hold sex to a high standard and find the thought of having sex for money distasteful.
At 8/9/2013 9:41:24 AM, wrichcirw wrote:
If you are civil with me, I will be civil to you. If you decide to bring unreasonable animosity to bear in a reasonable discussion, then what would you expect other than to get flustered?
wrichcirw
Posts: 11,196
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3/2/2014 10:39:09 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 2/22/2014 6:24:32 AM, Cermank wrote:
http://www.xojane.com...

"The prevailing societal brainwashing dictates that sexuality and sex "reduce" women, whereas men are merely innocent actors on the receiving end...."

This statement I find to be extremely problematic.

Men are never on the "receiving end" of sex. If a man does not get an erection, natural sex does not occur. Men always instigate, and if a man does not desire it, it does not happen.

In this sense, society finds it proper, given gender roles that stem from gender differences, to assume that the man initiates, and the woman historically copes with whatever stems from such. If the man's action is good, then it is good for the woman. If it is bad, it is rape. This extends far beyond the act of sex and permeates many societies in how they view men and women in all manners of business.
At 8/9/2013 9:41:24 AM, wrichcirw wrote:
If you are civil with me, I will be civil to you. If you decide to bring unreasonable animosity to bear in a reasonable discussion, then what would you expect other than to get flustered?
Cermank
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3/2/2014 11:44:11 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 2/27/2014 3:42:06 PM, themohawkninja wrote:
At 2/22/2014 6:24:32 AM, Cermank wrote:
The answer is simple.

Patriarchy fears female sexuality.

Well, that would be a valid explanation, but unfortunately, we don't live in a feminist patriarchy.

The real reason why sex is still taboo, is because of religion. Religion has turned sex into some 'holy' and 'amazing' thing between a man and a women (God forbid it's two males or two females). The less power religion has over our society, the more people can be free to explore their sexuality the way they want.

Also, the sheer magnitude of the consequences of breaking a porn-related law in America scares the s**t out of anyone who knows what happens.

So yeah... it's not a mythical patriarchy, it's religion and harsh punishments, at least in America.

I don't see the dichotomy. The inherent patriarchal structure is perpetrated and solidified through religious banters and brainwashing, but doing away with the religion doesn't really break the structure. Most of the 'concerns' by the people were about how the girl was going to have problems getting a job- which was due to her breaking out of her good girl image. It wasn't about her burning in hell.
Cermank
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3/2/2014 11:56:30 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 2/27/2014 3:46:58 PM, ConservativePolitico wrote:
Why would patriarchy fear female sexuality?

Men love sex... the reason these women are in porn in the first place is for men.

And the reason why people in the sex industry are "harassed" isn't because of patriarchy it's because there are a lot of people, men and women, who still hold sex to a high standard and find the thought of having sex for money distasteful.

That's the problem. Women are assumed to be working for men, rather than merely working. Even though men do watch them, and sometimes Pay to watch them, the women working there are assumed to be giving away a part of their honour.

And about the sex for money part- people watch them. The distaste does not extend to the privacy of their own homes/ dorms. If sex is held to such a high standard, why is there sucha huge market for porn? The men in the industry do not go through nearly the same level of degradation as the women. Men are considered alpha for banging a lot of women, women are not.