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A New Language

WilliamsP
Posts: 52
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6/27/2014 8:32:57 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
I am currently in the process of developing a sincere, new, fresh language. It will actually be used to communicate, not to simply play around with. I will not provide many details, for I wish for it to remain secret until I release it to the world. The alphabet utilizes Cyrillic and Latin symbols. The grammar is rather unique, but it can resemble English at times. Pronunciation resembles Russian, German, and Dutch, but it is also quite unique.

I do not need help. I already have a beautiful vision for my language. However, if you wish to provide a few suggestions, raise concerns, or write comments, you may proceed.
WilliamsP - Multilingual Liberal Atheist
skuu
Posts: 9
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6/29/2014 9:23:40 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
Do you mean to use it with a select few people or do you also wish for it to become popular? Esperanto is the most successful artificial language and it ended up with limited scope. If you want your language to get big, you have to answer why Esperanto didn't get far, and why yours would.
Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
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6/29/2014 9:59:03 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/29/2014 9:23:40 AM, skuu wrote:
Do you mean to use it with a select few people or do you also wish for it to become popular? Esperanto is the most successful artificial language and it ended up with limited scope. If you want your language to get big, you have to answer why Esperanto didn't get far, and why yours would.

What about Klingon?
My work here is, finally, done.
skuu
Posts: 9
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6/29/2014 1:48:38 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/29/2014 9:59:03 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
What about Klingon?

What do you mean? If you mean number of users, there's only a handful of fluent Klingon speakers apparently.
ChosenWolff
Posts: 3,361
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6/29/2014 2:13:33 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/27/2014 8:32:57 AM, WilliamsP wrote:
I am currently in the process of developing a sincere, new, fresh language. It will actually be used to communicate, not to simply play around with. I will not provide many details, for I wish for it to remain secret until I release it to the world. The alphabet utilizes Cyrillic and Latin symbols. The grammar is rather unique, but it can resemble English at times. Pronunciation resembles Russian, German, and Dutch, but it is also quite unique.

I do not need help. I already have a beautiful vision for my language. However, if you wish to provide a few suggestions, raise concerns, or write comments, you may proceed.

Lol, I already got a language. Just make vowels and letter sounds, then bam. Based on realist characteristics, or in layman's terms, spells how it sounds. The benefit of using Phoenician as a common tongue.

Saki Iheha Skapeah Naohwa
How about NO elections?

#onlyonedeb8
CJKAllstar
Posts: 408
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6/29/2014 2:36:39 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Making a new language...hm.

I mean, I hope you realise that a whole language could take hundreds of years to perfect. After all, everything from dative cases, to suffixes, to weird niche words like the German, "backpfeifengesicht" to gender rules...

Every single word which is commonly used, rules for each of them, conjugations for each and every word...

Pronouns, punctuation use, dialects, pronunciation...

The dictionaries you'd need...

Wow, this is a huge initiative. Language has taken 1000s of years to form. Esperanto, at the latest (1887) is only existent because it is a simplified version of a popular language.

Kudos to you if it successful, but you might have to spend a lot of your life working on this, or else...it is going to end up like those high school kids who make a language for fun just so they can bypass their teachers. And that would just be embarrassing now that you have told us all.

The stakes are high my friend, the stakes are high.
"Political language... is designed to make lies sound truthful and murder respectable, and to give an appearance of solidity to pure wind." - George Orwell
ChosenWolff
Posts: 3,361
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6/29/2014 2:45:38 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/29/2014 2:36:39 PM, CJKAllstar wrote:
Making a new language...hm.

I mean, I hope you realise that a whole language could take hundreds of years to perfect. After all, everything from dative cases, to suffixes, to weird niche words like the German, "backpfeifengesicht" to gender rules...

Every single word which is commonly used, rules for each of them, conjugations for each and every word...

Pronouns, punctuation use, dialects, pronunciation...

The dictionaries you'd need...

Wow, this is a huge initiative. Language has taken 1000s of years to form. Esperanto, at the latest (1887) is only existent because it is a simplified version of a popular language.

Kudos to you if it successful, but you might have to spend a lot of your life working on this, or else...it is going to end up like those high school kids who make a language for fun just so they can bypass their teachers. And that would just be embarrassing now that you have told us all.

The stakes are high my friend, the stakes are high.

There are millions of languages. They're not hard to create. Just a little pointless. All western and Arabic languages derive off of Phoenician. All words in western and Arabic are taken from the roots of the later language, Latin. One who knows Latin or phonecian can easily create a language, or even out of later derivatives like American or German. Simply change the letters, and apply them as you would with English. For example, I'm going to change the vowel and letter structure of the following sentence, and you'll still be able to read it.

Theh OP Stuipid ihse Vary!

The OP is very stupid
How about NO elections?

#onlyonedeb8
CJKAllstar
Posts: 408
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6/29/2014 2:48:06 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/29/2014 2:45:38 PM, ChosenWolff wrote:
At 6/29/2014 2:36:39 PM, CJKAllstar wrote:
Making a new language...hm.

I mean, I hope you realise that a whole language could take hundreds of years to perfect. After all, everything from dative cases, to suffixes, to weird niche words like the German, "backpfeifengesicht" to gender rules...

Every single word which is commonly used, rules for each of them, conjugations for each and every word...

Pronouns, punctuation use, dialects, pronunciation...

The dictionaries you'd need...

Wow, this is a huge initiative. Language has taken 1000s of years to form. Esperanto, at the latest (1887) is only existent because it is a simplified version of a popular language.

Kudos to you if it successful, but you might have to spend a lot of your life working on this, or else...it is going to end up like those high school kids who make a language for fun just so they can bypass their teachers. And that would just be embarrassing now that you have told us all.

The stakes are high my friend, the stakes are high.

There are millions of languages. They're not hard to create. Just a little pointless. All western and Arabic languages derive off of Phoenician. All words in western and Arabic are taken from the roots of the later language, Latin. One who knows Latin or phonecian can easily create a language, or even out of later derivatives like American or German. Simply change the letters, and apply them as you would with English. For example, I'm going to change the vowel and letter structure of the following sentence, and you'll still be able to read it.

Theh OP Stuipid ihse Vary!

The OP is very stupid

Well, it isn't hard to take a language and say for your own language, it is said language + an 'e' on the end, fine.

But I'm talking about creating your own language + rules and the things I said above. If you really want it to be YOUR language, it is a painstaking process. Other than that, then you are right, but it doesn't sound like that is what WilliamsP is doing here.
"Political language... is designed to make lies sound truthful and murder respectable, and to give an appearance of solidity to pure wind." - George Orwell
ChosenWolff
Posts: 3,361
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6/29/2014 2:53:25 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/29/2014 2:48:06 PM, CJKAllstar wrote:
At 6/29/2014 2:45:38 PM, ChosenWolff wrote:
At 6/29/2014 2:36:39 PM, CJKAllstar wrote:
Making a new language...hm.

I mean, I hope you realise that a whole language could take hundreds of years to perfect. After all, everything from dative cases, to suffixes, to weird niche words like the German, "backpfeifengesicht" to gender rules...

Every single word which is commonly used, rules for each of them, conjugations for each and every word...

Pronouns, punctuation use, dialects, pronunciation...

The dictionaries you'd need...

Wow, this is a huge initiative. Language has taken 1000s of years to form. Esperanto, at the latest (1887) is only existent because it is a simplified version of a popular language.

Kudos to you if it successful, but you might have to spend a lot of your life working on this, or else...it is going to end up like those high school kids who make a language for fun just so they can bypass their teachers. And that would just be embarrassing now that you have told us all.

The stakes are high my friend, the stakes are high.

There are millions of languages. They're not hard to create. Just a little pointless. All western and Arabic languages derive off of Phoenician. All words in western and Arabic are taken from the roots of the later language, Latin. One who knows Latin or phonecian can easily create a language, or even out of later derivatives like American or German. Simply change the letters, and apply them as you would with English. For example, I'm going to change the vowel and letter structure of the following sentence, and you'll still be able to read it.

Theh OP Stuipid ihse Vary!

The OP is very stupid

Well, it isn't hard to take a language and say for your own language, it is said language + an 'e' on the end, fine.

But I'm talking about creating your own language + rules and the things I said above. If you really want it to be YOUR language, it is a painstaking process. Other than that, then you are right, but it doesn't sound like that is what WilliamsP is doing here.

As I said, it was just as easy for those following latin. Languages were artificially created for Holy Roman feudal states, that could be implemented quickly. For example, the Germans and French spoke different languages at one point, known as old french and old english. They were still able to communicate, because the rules of latin still applied cross border. All current languages are just taking the original dialect and changing the rules. He can do it just as easily. Just as my language built off of English, his can build off Assyrian tongue.
How about NO elections?

#onlyonedeb8
Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
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6/29/2014 3:05:59 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/29/2014 1:48:38 PM, skuu wrote:
At 6/29/2014 9:59:03 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
What about Klingon?

What do you mean? If you mean number of users, there's only a handful of fluent Klingon speakers apparently.

You said a complete language.
Isn't Klingon a full language?
My work here is, finally, done.
skuu
Posts: 9
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6/29/2014 3:31:14 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/29/2014 3:05:59 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
You said a complete language.
Isn't Klingon a full language?

Sorry what do you mean? I don't see why you're bringing up this as an example. What point are you trying to make?
Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
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6/29/2014 3:34:19 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/29/2014 3:31:14 PM, skuu wrote:
At 6/29/2014 3:05:59 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
You said a complete language.
Isn't Klingon a full language?

Sorry what do you mean? I don't see why you're bringing up this as an example. What point are you trying to make?

I referenced your post when I made the comment. It is post 2 that I referenced.
You said Esperanto was the most successful, but it was limited.
My response: What about Klingon?

I've been told it was a complete language. Have I been misinformed?
My work here is, finally, done.
Loveshismom
Posts: 238
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6/29/2014 3:43:08 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/27/2014 8:32:57 AM, WilliamsP wrote:
I am currently in the process of developing a sincere, new, fresh language. It will actually be used to communicate, not to simply play around with. I will not provide many details, for I wish for it to remain secret until I release it to the world. The alphabet utilizes Cyrillic and Latin symbols. The grammar is rather unique, but it can resemble English at times. Pronunciation resembles Russian, German, and Dutch, but it is also quite unique.

I do not need help. I already have a beautiful vision for my language. However, if you wish to provide a few suggestions, raise concerns, or write comments, you may proceed.

Hmmm... interesting. I'd like to know moar.
Enji
Posts: 1,022
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6/29/2014 6:43:01 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/29/2014 3:34:19 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 6/29/2014 3:31:14 PM, skuu wrote:
At 6/29/2014 3:05:59 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
You said a complete language.
Isn't Klingon a full language?

Sorry what do you mean? I don't see why you're bringing up this as an example. What point are you trying to make?

I referenced your post when I made the comment. It is post 2 that I referenced.
You said Esperanto was the most successful, but it was limited.
My response: What about Klingon?

I've been told it was a complete language. Have I been misinformed?

Klingon is less successful than Esperanto, and it's presumably less useful too considering it was created for fictional use whereas Esperanto was created specifically for international communication and for easy learning. The problem that Esperanto faces is that something like half the world speaks at least one of a few established, natural languages (Arabic, English, Mandarin, and Russian I believe) and the other half of the world isn't involved in international business, and these few languages are perfectly fine for international communication, whereas Esperanto's speaker base is too small for Esperanto to be useful. The incentive for creating an artificial language like Esperanto for international communication is that natural languages are associated with the cultural dominance of the countries which made them popular.
vbaculum
Posts: 1,274
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6/30/2014 6:37:01 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/27/2014 8:32:57 AM, WilliamsP wrote:
I am currently in the process of developing a sincere, new, fresh language. It will actually be used to communicate, not to simply play around with. I will not provide many details, for I wish for it to remain secret until I release it to the world. The alphabet utilizes Cyrillic and Latin symbols. The grammar is rather unique, but it can resemble English at times. Pronunciation resembles Russian, German, and Dutch, but it is also quite unique.

I do not need help. I already have a beautiful vision for my language. However, if you wish to provide a few suggestions, raise concerns, or write comments, you may proceed.

Languages get their utility from a long, complicated process of evolution that is hard to understand. Imagine having a discussion about a modern subject like politics or science in Latin or Ancient Greek for example. It can be done, but I would imagine it would be very difficult to formulate sentences on the spot, even for an experienced user without having to revert back to a modren language to express modern words and concepts. I'm not an expert but I think that's a major reason why no constructed language succeeded; because they just don't work well in a modern context.

I would stick strictly with the Latin alphebet since there are many situations where non-Latinate characters are corrupted by software. If you want your language to work well on computers, be as simple as possible.
"If you claim to value nonviolence and you consume animal products, you need to rethink your position on nonviolence." - Gary Francione

THE WORLD IS VEGAN! If you want it
Enji
Posts: 1,022
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6/30/2014 8:24:03 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/30/2014 6:37:01 PM, vbaculum wrote:

Languages get their utility from a long, complicated process of evolution that is hard to understand. Imagine having a discussion about a modern subject like politics or science in Latin or Ancient Greek for example. It can be done, but I would imagine it would be very difficult to formulate sentences on the spot, even for an experienced user without having to revert back to a modren language to express modern words and concepts. I'm not an expert but I think that's a major reason why no constructed language succeeded; because they just don't work well in a modern context.

Languages get their utility from enabling communication with others. The problem with constructed languages isn't that they are artificial; even constructed languages can adapt to new concepts with the development of new words. Rather, they lack the speaker base which natural languages have developed through their evolution, so they do little to ease communication over natural languages. It's kind of like trying to communicate in French with your friends when each of you is a native English speaker -- why communicate in French?

But constructed languages like Esperanto could be just as useful as established, natural languages if enough people were sufficiently fluent with them for them to be useful in enabling communication. In fact, artificial languages are often easier to learn than natural languages for non-native speakers because they are designed to avoid peculiar grammatical exceptions which are common in evolved languages.
SemperVI
Posts: 294
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7/6/2014 2:00:47 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/27/2014 8:32:57 AM, WilliamsP wrote:
I do not need help. I already have a beautiful vision for my language. However, if you wish to provide a few suggestions, raise concerns, or write comments, you may proceed.

Accordingly - your effort will fail. What is the point in creating a language that only you speak. More to the point, who would be interested in being your first student? How can you possibly perfect this language if your the only one who speaks it?

Mr. Multilingual Liberal Atheist - I would strongly encourage you to consider collaboration. Perhaps turn it into an open source initiative. The only way you can even consider being popular is to have support. Even if and that is a big IF you create the perfect language. Why should I learn it? What purpose would it serve. As others said above - I might as well learn Klingon...

You need help, language is the exchange of ideas from one person to another. Keeping it secret sort of defeats that purpose.
WilliamsP
Posts: 52
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7/6/2014 2:38:36 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
I am making great progress on my own, but I concede that I do need some assistance. I have some close friends who I told about my project. They are rather interested. I can ask them for assistance.
WilliamsP - Multilingual Liberal Atheist
Envisage
Posts: 3,646
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7/6/2014 3:23:53 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Languages are seldom created... They are evolved over generations.

English Spanish french German etc were never 'created', they all evolved from Latin and other dialects.