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Training Optimism

Kleptin
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7/30/2010 10:54:06 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
I've decided that whether or not an afterlife exists, the here and now is worth too much. Since I also have decided that meaning of existence is arbitrary, I should strive for whatever it is that seems most natural. That is, my happiness. I seek to be happy in the most efficient way.

I am unhappy when I desire things and do not get them. I am happy when I desire things and I do get them. What I desire seems to be something greater than what I already have, and I desire more than what I have because I take what I have for granted.

A starving ethiope who finds an apple is far happier than the rich housewife with a cheating husband. It's all the same neurotransmitters sending happy signals, but two different people.

Since this is the case, I find that I can set the bar low and be happy with all the simple things in life. Stifle ambition and desire by being content with what I have, and not taking things for granted. All that matters at the end is happiness, not really how you obtain it.

Curiously, this is the definition of Optimism.

Sidenote: Why not take drugs? Answer: Because natural happiness does not have a negative return. Drugs do, and the net result is a loss of happiness.

Do any of you believe that this is possible/necessary? All comments welcome.
: At 5/2/2010 2:43:54 PM, innomen wrote:
It isn't about finding a theory, philosophy or doctrine and thinking it's the answer, but a practical application of one's experiences that is the answer.

: At 10/28/2010 2:40:07 PM, jharry wrote: I have already been given the greatest Gift that anyone could ever hope for [Life], I would consider myself selfish if I expected anything more.
PoeJoe
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7/30/2010 11:09:54 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
Setting the bar low doesn't necessarily make you happy... it just makes you content. At the end of the day, you'll know you haven't accomplished much, and that will make you feel bad. For most people anyway, a sense of pride in one's life can't be changed by some arbitrary will of thought... the fact that you recognize you're setting the bar too high means that you also recognize the fact that you feel great when you finally do surpass that bar.

Besides, it all seems anti-human, trying to kill your ambitions. Some of the best literature is about trying to find goals and meanings and fulfilling those goals and meanings.
Television Rot: http://tvrot.com...
Kleptin
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7/30/2010 11:27:19 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/30/2010 11:09:54 PM, PoeJoe wrote:
Setting the bar low doesn't necessarily make you happy... it just makes you content. At the end of the day, you'll know you haven't accomplished much, and that will make you feel bad. For most people anyway, a sense of pride in one's life can't be changed by some arbitrary will of thought... the fact that you recognize you're setting the bar too high means that you also recognize the fact that you feel great when you finally do surpass that bar.

I find long-lived contentment more worth it than short-lived happiness. Setting the bar low doesn't negate those spurts of happy though, since you'd have to be dead in order to not have any accomplishments during the day. The goal here is not to stop being ambitious, but to set the bar low enough such that you get enough happiness from something small as from something big.

What is the objective difference between a starving ethiope finding an apple and a billionaire finding a dollar? If it's all in the mind, then the billionaire can theoretically be as happy as the ethiope if he just changes his mindset.

Besides, it all seems anti-human, trying to kill your ambitions. Some of the best literature is about trying to find goals and meanings and fulfilling those goals and meanings.

What makes for the best literature does not make for humanity nor for a happier life. Setting the bar high makes for some nice drama and excitement, but all it does is limit your ability to be content with what you already have. What's the point?
: At 5/2/2010 2:43:54 PM, innomen wrote:
It isn't about finding a theory, philosophy or doctrine and thinking it's the answer, but a practical application of one's experiences that is the answer.

: At 10/28/2010 2:40:07 PM, jharry wrote: I have already been given the greatest Gift that anyone could ever hope for [Life], I would consider myself selfish if I expected anything more.
PoeJoe
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7/30/2010 11:32:18 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/30/2010 11:27:19 PM, Kleptin wrote:
At 7/30/2010 11:09:54 PM, PoeJoe wrote:
Setting the bar low doesn't necessarily make you happy... it just makes you content. At the end of the day, you'll know you haven't accomplished much, and that will make you feel bad. For most people anyway, a sense of pride in one's life can't be changed by some arbitrary will of thought... the fact that you recognize you're setting the bar too high means that you also recognize the fact that you feel great when you finally do surpass that bar.

I find long-lived contentment more worth it than short-lived happiness. Setting the bar low doesn't negate those spurts of happy though, since you'd have to be dead in order to not have any accomplishments during the day. The goal here is not to stop being ambitious, but to set the bar low enough such that you get enough happiness from something small as from something big.

I'd argue that setting the bar low does hinder your ambitiousness, because you don't have to work as hard--you don't have to have the same motivation to accomplish great things--to be content. So, content =/= happy.
Television Rot: http://tvrot.com...
lovelife
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7/30/2010 11:45:07 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
I think everyone should strive for the happiest life they can and be happy for the good things that happen. Sure there can be bad times in life, I personally know I get depressed sometimes for no reason at all. The key to happiness is not avoiding those times, but helping yourself get out of them when they happen by thinking whats gone good for you.

It does not help to say "well someone's got it worse, just get over it" that makes it far worse, instead just think about whats gone right.

For me animals are something I deeply love. Thinking about them dying, and all the ones I have brought to death, the ones I held while dying, that hurts me. But thinking of the ones I HAVE saved, and the ones that could be saved later by me or someone else, makes me happy.

I also get depressed because pretty much everyone that has ever loved me has died. I think positively tho by thinking that kitty isn't dead, and I wont let him die. My best friend Sierra has been there for years and I wont let her die either, even though I don't think she cares all that much.

There are so many other things that are depressing that you can get over. I've been using this technique for years, and barely learned it in therapy a few weeks ago. (therapy is a waste of time, energy and money cause they always tell you what you already know or could find easily on your own)

Setting the bar low does not make you happier. Realizing that you are truely living life to its fullest to fulfil your dreams and happiness does.
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
Kleptin
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7/30/2010 11:50:10 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/30/2010 11:30:38 PM, badger wrote:
so you're not trying to convince yourself that you don't want to make a fortune?

That's a good thing. What would I do with a fortune besides want more things? I want to have a good amount of money to deal with necessities and have a little fun now and then, for myself and my entire family. But more money just means more waste.
: At 5/2/2010 2:43:54 PM, innomen wrote:
It isn't about finding a theory, philosophy or doctrine and thinking it's the answer, but a practical application of one's experiences that is the answer.

: At 10/28/2010 2:40:07 PM, jharry wrote: I have already been given the greatest Gift that anyone could ever hope for [Life], I would consider myself selfish if I expected anything more.
Kleptin
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7/30/2010 11:51:28 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/30/2010 11:32:18 PM, PoeJoe wrote:
I'd argue that setting the bar low does hinder your ambitiousness, because you don't have to work as hard--you don't have to have the same motivation to accomplish great things--to be content. So, content =/= happy.

Less ambition isn't the goal, but it will happen. Accomplishing great things =/= happiness. It's something that can earn it, but you'll just want to accomplish more great things. Good for society, bad for you. You could have been just as happy accomplishing things requiring less work and less time.
: At 5/2/2010 2:43:54 PM, innomen wrote:
It isn't about finding a theory, philosophy or doctrine and thinking it's the answer, but a practical application of one's experiences that is the answer.

: At 10/28/2010 2:40:07 PM, jharry wrote: I have already been given the greatest Gift that anyone could ever hope for [Life], I would consider myself selfish if I expected anything more.
Kleptin
Posts: 5,095
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7/30/2010 11:54:20 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/30/2010 11:45:07 PM, lovelife wrote:
Setting the bar low does not make you happier. Realizing that you are truely living life to its fullest to fulfil your dreams and happiness does.

Setting the bar lower is actually the same as appreciating what you have. You are in control of your life and your dreams. What you call "fulfilling your dreams" is the same as "getting what you desire", and you can choose to desire what is easily reachable rather than what is not. It's all about changing your mindset to be happier with what is closer at hand.
: At 5/2/2010 2:43:54 PM, innomen wrote:
It isn't about finding a theory, philosophy or doctrine and thinking it's the answer, but a practical application of one's experiences that is the answer.

: At 10/28/2010 2:40:07 PM, jharry wrote: I have already been given the greatest Gift that anyone could ever hope for [Life], I would consider myself selfish if I expected anything more.
lovelife
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7/30/2010 11:55:33 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/30/2010 11:51:28 PM, Kleptin wrote:
At 7/30/2010 11:32:18 PM, PoeJoe wrote:
I'd argue that setting the bar low does hinder your ambitiousness, because you don't have to work as hard--you don't have to have the same motivation to accomplish great things--to be content. So, content =/= happy.

Less ambition isn't the goal, but it will happen. Accomplishing great things =/= happiness. It's something that can earn it, but you'll just want to accomplish more great things. Good for society, bad for you. You could have been just as happy accomplishing things requiring less work and less time.

Find something you really care about. Maybe you love kids? Family? Women? Men? Animals? Food? Helping others? Going places? Doing things? Its all up to you and what you like and waht you want to do.

Perhaps you don't like money. Maybe you don't like kids, but there is something that you care about. Just find out what gives meaning to your life and live and strive for it. (just don't hurt anyone in the process and your good to go)
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
PoeJoe
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7/30/2010 11:56:19 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/30/2010 11:51:28 PM, Kleptin wrote:
At 7/30/2010 11:32:18 PM, PoeJoe wrote:
I'd argue that setting the bar low does hinder your ambitiousness, because you don't have to work as hard--you don't have to have the same motivation to accomplish great things--to be content. So, content =/= happy.

Less ambition isn't the goal, but it will happen. Accomplishing great things =/= happiness.

Someone has low self-esteem issues. >_>

It's something that can earn it, but you'll just want to accomplish more great things. Good for society, bad for you. You could have been just as happy accomplishing things requiring less work and less time.

Part of being human is teh struggle... deal with it, dude. :P

Besides, putting yourself out there greatly increases your chances of unpredictable but beneficial opportunities coming your way. ;D
Television Rot: http://tvrot.com...
lovelife
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7/30/2010 11:58:18 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/30/2010 11:54:20 PM, Kleptin wrote:
At 7/30/2010 11:45:07 PM, lovelife wrote:
Setting the bar low does not make you happier. Realizing that you are truely living life to its fullest to fulfil your dreams and happiness does.

Setting the bar lower is actually the same as appreciating what you have. You are in control of your life and your dreams. What you call "fulfilling your dreams" is the same as "getting what you desire", and you can choose to desire what is easily reachable rather than what is not. It's all about changing your mindset to be happier with what is closer at hand.

My large goal is to save the animals from testing and all that other junk (not from food because they'd be food in nature anyway)
I'm happy when I find a cat with no home, take her home give her a bath some food, and let her become part of the family.
Same with dogs or any other animal.

Its like my Sims analogy again, you find a big goal that gives lots of happiness but there are also many little goals that give you happiness too.
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
Kleptin
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7/31/2010 12:12:34 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/30/2010 11:55:33 PM, lovelife wrote:
At 7/30/2010 11:51:28 PM, Kleptin wrote:
At 7/30/2010 11:32:18 PM, PoeJoe wrote:
I'd argue that setting the bar low does hinder your ambitiousness, because you don't have to work as hard--you don't have to have the same motivation to accomplish great things--to be content. So, content =/= happy.

Less ambition isn't the goal, but it will happen. Accomplishing great things =/= happiness. It's something that can earn it, but you'll just want to accomplish more great things. Good for society, bad for you. You could have been just as happy accomplishing things requiring less work and less time.

Find something you really care about. Maybe you love kids? Family? Women? Men? Animals? Food? Helping others? Going places? Doing things? Its all up to you and what you like and waht you want to do.

Perhaps you don't like money. Maybe you don't like kids, but there is something that you care about. Just find out what gives meaning to your life and live and strive for it. (just don't hurt anyone in the process and your good to go)

See, the thing is, I have plenty of things that I love. I love my family, and my girlfriend and I are seriously considering engagement. It's come to the stage where so many aspects of my life are coming together. I'm on my way to a great career with excellent pay, the dynamics I have with my friends are starting to change because we're all getting employed now. Everyone I know is happy and healthy, and I'm just getting bombarded by how happy I am just with all of these simple things.

I used to seek happiness through all of these massive and idealistic things, but something as simple as a solid career, thinking about marriage, and having good relationships with my family and friends, these things give me so much more happiness than I can think of. What's a fortune when you have all of this stability?
: At 5/2/2010 2:43:54 PM, innomen wrote:
It isn't about finding a theory, philosophy or doctrine and thinking it's the answer, but a practical application of one's experiences that is the answer.

: At 10/28/2010 2:40:07 PM, jharry wrote: I have already been given the greatest Gift that anyone could ever hope for [Life], I would consider myself selfish if I expected anything more.
lovelife
Posts: 14,629
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7/31/2010 12:16:00 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/31/2010 12:12:34 AM, Kleptin wrote:
At 7/30/2010 11:55:33 PM, lovelife wrote:
At 7/30/2010 11:51:28 PM, Kleptin wrote:
At 7/30/2010 11:32:18 PM, PoeJoe wrote:
I'd argue that setting the bar low does hinder your ambitiousness, because you don't have to work as hard--you don't have to have the same motivation to accomplish great things--to be content. So, content =/= happy.

Less ambition isn't the goal, but it will happen. Accomplishing great things =/= happiness. It's something that can earn it, but you'll just want to accomplish more great things. Good for society, bad for you. You could have been just as happy accomplishing things requiring less work and less time.

Find something you really care about. Maybe you love kids? Family? Women? Men? Animals? Food? Helping others? Going places? Doing things? Its all up to you and what you like and waht you want to do.

Perhaps you don't like money. Maybe you don't like kids, but there is something that you care about. Just find out what gives meaning to your life and live and strive for it. (just don't hurt anyone in the process and your good to go)

See, the thing is, I have plenty of things that I love. I love my family, and my girlfriend and I are seriously considering engagement. It's come to the stage where so many aspects of my life are coming together. I'm on my way to a great career with excellent pay, the dynamics I have with my friends are starting to change because we're all getting employed now. Everyone I know is happy and healthy, and I'm just getting bombarded by how happy I am just with all of these simple things. :

And that's a bad thing?

I used to seek happiness through all of these massive and idealistic things, but something as simple as a solid career, thinking about marriage, and having good relationships with my family and friends, these things give me so much more happiness than I can think of. What's a fortune when you have all of this stability?

I never said you can't be happy with the basics and having good relationships with nice good healthy people that you care about. In fact thats a good thing. Just don't try and run from ever feeling depressed by setting the bar too low. Be happy with what you have, but still try and achieve the best.
Kinda like that quote can't remember the guys name but my stepsis is obsessed "Dream as if you'll live forever; live as if you'll die tomorrow" Thats a good life quote for you.
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
Kleptin
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7/31/2010 12:17:25 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/30/2010 11:56:19 PM, PoeJoe wrote:
Less ambition isn't the goal, but it will happen. Accomplishing great things =/= happiness.

Someone has low self-esteem issues. >_>

Awww, I see how that can sound kind of bad...That's not what I meant. You don't need to strive to be president or cure cancer to be happy, PoeJoe. Just you wait. When you start experiencing the more common things, you'll discover that. The first thing for you will probably be falling in love. It's so unbelievably simple, but you can't really find more happiness than that.

Part of being human is teh struggle... deal with it, dude. :P

Well, not really. There will always be struggles, but it isn't the human choice to keep seeking bigger ones.

Besides, putting yourself out there greatly increases your chances of unpredictable but beneficial opportunities coming your way. ;D

Opportunities beneficial to what? More opportunities? Which open the way to what?

If what I have can make me profoundly happy, why is that any worse than wanting more and more and more for no apparent reason to perpetuate a never-ending cycle?
: At 5/2/2010 2:43:54 PM, innomen wrote:
It isn't about finding a theory, philosophy or doctrine and thinking it's the answer, but a practical application of one's experiences that is the answer.

: At 10/28/2010 2:40:07 PM, jharry wrote: I have already been given the greatest Gift that anyone could ever hope for [Life], I would consider myself selfish if I expected anything more.
badger
Posts: 11,793
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7/31/2010 12:20:10 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/30/2010 11:50:10 PM, Kleptin wrote:
At 7/30/2010 11:30:38 PM, badger wrote:
so you're not trying to convince yourself that you don't want to make a fortune?

That's a good thing. What would I do with a fortune besides want more things? I want to have a good amount of money to deal with necessities and have a little fun now and then, for myself and my entire family. But more money just means more waste.

yes it is a good thing. i'm already thinking that way myself.
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lovelife
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7/31/2010 12:20:39 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/31/2010 12:17:25 AM, Kleptin wrote:
At 7/30/2010 11:56:19 PM, PoeJoe wrote:
Less ambition isn't the goal, but it will happen. Accomplishing great things =/= happiness.

Someone has low self-esteem issues. >_>

Awww, I see how that can sound kind of bad...That's not what I meant. You don't need to strive to be president or cure cancer to be happy, PoeJoe. Just you wait. When you start experiencing the more common things, you'll discover that. The first thing for you will probably be falling in love. It's so unbelievably simple, but you can't really find more happiness than that.:

Gotta agree with that.

Part of being human is teh struggle... deal with it, dude. :P

Well, not really. There will always be struggles, but it isn't the human choice to keep seeking bigger ones.

Besides, putting yourself out there greatly increases your chances of unpredictable but beneficial opportunities coming your way. ;D

Opportunities beneficial to what? More opportunities? Which open the way to what?


Can lead you to more happiness or ways of being happy. All you gotta do is try.

If what I have can make me profoundly happy, why is that any worse than wanting more and more and more for no apparent reason to perpetuate a never-ending cycle?

If it makes you happier there is a reason.
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
Kleptin
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7/31/2010 12:25:31 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/31/2010 12:16:00 AM, lovelife wrote:
And that's a bad thing?

Absolutely not, but it goes to show that one doesn't need to really STRIVE for happiness. Happiness is always within arm's reach, it's just that we have a tendency to be selfish and reach for more when we don't need to.

I never said you can't be happy with the basics and having good relationships with nice good healthy people that you care about. In fact thats a good thing. Just don't try and run from ever feeling depressed by setting the bar too low. Be happy with what you have, but still try and achieve the best.

But, why? If the reward is just as good with a lesser challenge, why pursue the greater one?

Kinda like that quote can't remember the guys name but my stepsis is obsessed "Dream as if you'll live forever; live as if you'll die tomorrow" Thats a good life quote for you.

That is a good quote. I can see how it balances the two. But...what does the dreaming part add?
: At 5/2/2010 2:43:54 PM, innomen wrote:
It isn't about finding a theory, philosophy or doctrine and thinking it's the answer, but a practical application of one's experiences that is the answer.

: At 10/28/2010 2:40:07 PM, jharry wrote: I have already been given the greatest Gift that anyone could ever hope for [Life], I would consider myself selfish if I expected anything more.
FREEDO
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7/31/2010 12:33:54 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/30/2010 10:54:06 PM, Kleptin wrote:
I've decided that whether or not an afterlife exists, the here and now is worth too much. Since I also have decided that meaning of existence is arbitrary, I should strive for whatever it is that seems most natural. That is, my happiness. I seek to be happy in the most efficient way.

I am unhappy when I desire things and do not get them. I am happy when I desire things and I do get them. What I desire seems to be something greater than what I already have, and I desire more than what I have because I take what I have for granted.

A starving ethiope who finds an apple is far happier than the rich housewife with a cheating husband. It's all the same neurotransmitters sending happy signals, but two different people.

Since this is the case, I find that I can set the bar low and be happy with all the simple things in life. Stifle ambition and desire by being content with what I have, and not taking things for granted. All that matters at the end is happiness, not really how you obtain it.

Curiously, this is the definition of Optimism.

Sidenote: Why not take drugs? Answer: Because natural happiness does not have a negative return. Drugs do, and the net result is a loss of happiness.

Do any of you believe that this is possible/necessary? All comments welcome.

Finally! Someone who agrees that optimism is rational. This is really a welcomed break from the usual attitude on this site. I couldn't agree with you more.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
lovelife
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7/31/2010 12:34:44 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/31/2010 12:25:31 AM, Kleptin wrote:
At 7/31/2010 12:16:00 AM, lovelife wrote:
And that's a bad thing?

Absolutely not, but it goes to show that one doesn't need to really STRIVE for happiness. Happiness is always within arm's reach, it's just that we have a tendency to be selfish and reach for more when we don't need to.


Its better to have more happiness then just some. I agree that you should be happy with what you get, but you should strive to get more. Not so much that you ignore other important things in your life, but just enough to be happier.

I never said you can't be happy with the basics and having good relationships with nice good healthy people that you care about. In fact thats a good thing. Just don't try and run from ever feeling depressed by setting the bar too low. Be happy with what you have, but still try and achieve the best.

But, why? If the reward is just as good with a lesser challenge, why pursue the greater one?


It wouldn't be just as much, the more you strive and accomplish the happier you'll be.

Kinda like that quote can't remember the guys name but my stepsis is obsessed "Dream as if you'll live forever; live as if you'll die tomorrow" Thats a good life quote for you.

That is a good quote. I can see how it balances the two. But...what does the dreaming part add?

Hope and meaning to life. Whatever you want done in your life, you better make steps, even if their small ones, to achieve it. Even if the main goal happens after your death if you do it right, more will follow your lead.

Its like someone said to make me undepressed a few days ago(not sure if the quote is 100% accurate, just what I remember and the impression it gave that stuck with me) "Life isn't meaningless, if you follow what you believe in and make a stand for it, it will influence others later, and with a collective effort it WILL make a difference"
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
FREEDO
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7/31/2010 12:41:57 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
By the way, setting the bar low doesn't necessarily equal contentment. High-achievement works well with optimism.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
Kleptin
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7/31/2010 12:47:40 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/31/2010 12:34:44 AM, lovelife wrote:
Its better to have more happiness then just some. I agree that you should be happy with what you get, but you should strive to get more. Not so much that you ignore other important things in your life, but just enough to be happier.

Striving for happiness doesn't make you happier. It just makes you more resistant. It takes more for you to be just as happy. Kind of like drugs.

It wouldn't be just as much, the more you strive and accomplish the happier you'll be.

You keep saying that, but you don't explain why. Is the rich man with a mansion who finds an apple any happier than the starving man who finds an apple?

Hope and meaning to life. Whatever you want done in your life, you better make steps, even if their small ones, to achieve it. Even if the main goal happens after your death if you do it right, more will follow your lead.

You make your own meaning in life. So long as you achieve that meaning, what does it matter whether you strive to be president or a garbage collector?

Its like someone said to make me undepressed a few days ago(not sure if the quote is 100% accurate, just what I remember and the impression it gave that stuck with me) "Life isn't meaningless, if you follow what you believe in and make a stand for it, it will influence others later, and with a collective effort it WILL make a difference"

That depends on what your meaning is. My meaning in life is simply to be happy, regardless of how.
: At 5/2/2010 2:43:54 PM, innomen wrote:
It isn't about finding a theory, philosophy or doctrine and thinking it's the answer, but a practical application of one's experiences that is the answer.

: At 10/28/2010 2:40:07 PM, jharry wrote: I have already been given the greatest Gift that anyone could ever hope for [Life], I would consider myself selfish if I expected anything more.
lovelife
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7/31/2010 12:59:51 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/31/2010 12:47:40 AM, Kleptin wrote:
At 7/31/2010 12:34:44 AM, lovelife wrote:
Its better to have more happiness then just some. I agree that you should be happy with what you get, but you should strive to get more. Not so much that you ignore other important things in your life, but just enough to be happier.

Striving for happiness doesn't make you happier. It just makes you more resistant. It takes more for you to be just as happy. Kind of like drugs.


Life is like drugs.

It wouldn't be just as much, the more you strive and accomplish the happier you'll be.

You keep saying that, but you don't explain why. Is the rich man with a mansion who finds an apple any happier than the starving man who finds an apple?


If you strive for more you will get more, and you will be happier. The more animals I save the happier I am. Does that mean hat cause I saved about 15 cats, 7 dogs, a couple of rabbits, and a raccoon that I shouldn't want to keep saving more animals? No, saving more of them will make me happier so I strive to save as many as I can. Long term goal in mind, day to day life lived.

Hope and meaning to life. Whatever you want done in your life, you better make steps, even if their small ones, to achieve it. Even if the main goal happens after your death if you do it right, more will follow your lead.

You make your own meaning in life. So long as you achieve that meaning, what does it matter whether you strive to be president or a garbage collector?


I never said that what you strive for matters did I? I just said that whatever you want its best to want the most out of it, and try the best to be the best you possibly can.

Its like someone said to make me undepressed a few days ago(not sure if the quote is 100% accurate, just what I remember and the impression it gave that stuck with me) "Life isn't meaningless, if you follow what you believe in and make a stand for it, it will influence others later, and with a collective effort it WILL make a difference"

That depends on what your meaning is. My meaning in life is simply to be happy, regardless of how.

That's everyones meaning in life really. What makes you happy and what you want to strive for is what matters.

If your goal is to illiminate crime would you simply become a polive officer? Or would you become a police officer or something higher ranked, with more authority, and encourage others to live a good crime free life, and if they see any wrong doings to do the right thing?
The latter seems to give more happiness and fulfillment.

Whatever you do your life is yours and whatever you want to do, think about your dying day and how you would see your life in the last moments. Did you do your best? Were you as happy as you could have been? Did you make a difference for what you believe in? And waht will you leave behind for others to see?
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
innomen
Posts: 10,052
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7/31/2010 2:26:24 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
Needs and wants. Often i have found that satisfying my needs creates happiness, or perhaps peace is a better word, but i strive to satisfy my wants which doesn't necessarily create happiness, and has the potential of creating misery in the short and long term. I also can confuse fun with happiness, and shoot for what i think is happiness, but in reality i am shooting for fun. Fun is fleeting and shallow, and often has no bearing at all on one's overall happiness. Knowing my needs are met and being grateful for that has helped me a lot over the last few years. Coming to grips with my fear of not having enough, or not getting something and it's connection to my unhappiness is something that i need to work on. I heard a quote last week, and it went something like this: An unreasonable fear that my instincts will not be satisfied is what will cause me unhappiness. I'm probably mucking it up, but you get the gist of it.

Keeping my expectations slightly lower than what reality tends to bear provides pleasant surprises in life.
feverish
Posts: 2,716
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7/31/2010 3:24:19 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
I believe that the most balanced and positive outlook for happiness is optimism of will and pessimism of intellect.

It's great to strive for perfection, as long as you don't seriously expect to achieve it.
Cody_Franklin
Posts: 9,483
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7/31/2010 3:30:46 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/31/2010 3:24:19 AM, feverish wrote:
I believe that the most balanced and positive outlook for happiness is optimism of will and pessimism of intellect.

It's great to strive for perfection, as long as you don't seriously expect to achieve it.

Depends on what your standard for perfection is. :P
feverish
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7/31/2010 3:38:32 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/31/2010 3:30:46 AM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 7/31/2010 3:24:19 AM, feverish wrote:
I believe that the most balanced and positive outlook for happiness is optimism of will and pessimism of intellect.

It's great to strive for perfection, as long as you don't seriously expect to achieve it.

Depends on what your standard for perfection is. :P

Well I see striving for absolute ;) perfection as exceeding any concrete or achievable goals. No matter how good things are there is always room for improvement.

This is why people who seem to have everything aren't generally significantly happier than anyone else.
Cody_Franklin
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7/31/2010 3:43:45 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/31/2010 3:38:32 AM, feverish wrote:
At 7/31/2010 3:30:46 AM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 7/31/2010 3:24:19 AM, feverish wrote:
I believe that the most balanced and positive outlook for happiness is optimism of will and pessimism of intellect.

It's great to strive for perfection, as long as you don't seriously expect to achieve it.

Depends on what your standard for perfection is. :P

Well I see striving for absolute ;) perfection as exceeding any concrete or achievable goals. No matter how good things are there is always room for improvement.

If your standard is infinity, i.e. inconsistent with reality, it's no wonder someone striving for "perfection" would never be happy.

This is why people who seem to have everything aren't generally significantly happier than anyone else.

Fair enough.
feverish
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7/31/2010 4:48:39 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/31/2010 3:43:45 AM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 7/31/2010 3:38:32 AM, feverish wrote:
At 7/31/2010 3:30:46 AM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 7/31/2010 3:24:19 AM, feverish wrote:
I believe that the most balanced and positive outlook for happiness is optimism of will and pessimism of intellect.

It's great to strive for perfection, as long as you don't seriously expect to achieve it.

Depends on what your standard for perfection is. :P

Well I see striving for absolute ;) perfection as exceeding any concrete or achievable goals. No matter how good things are there is always room for improvement.

If your standard is infinity, i.e. inconsistent with reality, it's no wonder someone striving for "perfection" would never be happy.

Exactly. That's where the pessimism of intellect comes in, the rationality that such things are unachievable.

If you want to achieve things you value then it's worth "striving" for probably unattainable goals, in the sense of wanting to be the very best you can, this is what I mean by optimism of will.

If you don't try, you definitely won't succeed, and if you believe you will succeed at something you are far more likely to than if you don't.

The pessimism of intellect is the checks and balances on your optimism of will, the realisation that you won't succeed at everything you try helps you to cope with inevitable setbacks.