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Let's talk about polygamy

BlackFlags
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10/29/2015 3:34:45 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
For or against? Since this is the society forum, we can talk about whether it should be legal and if it should be socially accepted as well.

I am pro-polygamy. It is every mans sexual fantasy to have a dozen wet hot obedient wives. Why deny men that level of happiness, unless you are a feminazi.
Vox_Veritas
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10/29/2015 3:38:42 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
What freakin' woman would desire such an arrangement?
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Wylted
Posts: 21,167
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10/29/2015 3:42:11 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 3:38:42 AM, Vox_Veritas wrote:
What freakin' woman would desire such an arrangement?

My fiance would, though I don't think I would. Two women is perfect for me. I think once you go beyond that, it requires too much energy to maintain those relationships
Garbanza
Posts: 1,997
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10/29/2015 3:45:33 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 3:34:45 AM, BlackFlags wrote:
For or against? Since this is the society forum, we can talk about whether it should be legal and if it should be socially accepted as well.

I am pro-polygamy. It is every mans sexual fantasy to have a dozen wet hot obedient wives. Why deny men that level of happiness, unless you are a feminazi.

I don't see why it's a problem from a feminazi perspective. A lot of women would prefer to share a hot guy than have to settle for a loser and why shouldn't they? I always assumed that the laws against polygamy came from men because it would mean most would more would miss out on sex. But maybe I'm missing something .
inferno
Posts: 10,549
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10/29/2015 3:47:32 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 3:45:33 PM, Garbanza wrote:
At 10/29/2015 3:34:45 AM, BlackFlags wrote:
For or against? Since this is the society forum, we can talk about whether it should be legal and if it should be socially accepted as well.

I am pro-polygamy. It is every mans sexual fantasy to have a dozen wet hot obedient wives. Why deny men that level of happiness, unless you are a feminazi.

I don't see why it's a problem from a feminazi perspective. A lot of women would prefer to share a hot guy than have to settle for a loser and why shouldn't they? I always assumed that the laws against polygamy came from men because it would mean most would more would miss out on sex. But maybe I'm missing something .

People do share all the time. Its called cheating.
Wylted
Posts: 21,167
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10/29/2015 5:56:33 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 3:45:33 PM, Garbanza wrote:
At 10/29/2015 3:34:45 AM, BlackFlags wrote:
For or against? Since this is the society forum, we can talk about whether it should be legal and if it should be socially accepted as well.

I am pro-polygamy. It is every mans sexual fantasy to have a dozen wet hot obedient wives. Why deny men that level of happiness, unless you are a feminazi.

I don't see why it's a problem from a feminazi perspective. A lot of women would prefer to share a hot guy than have to settle for a loser and why shouldn't they? I always assumed that the laws against polygamy came from men because it would mean most would more would miss out on sex. But maybe I'm missing something .

I always assumed that also. I figured it was to insure that weak men, didn't go without sex.
SM2
Posts: 546
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10/29/2015 10:41:59 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
I see no problem with it, legally or socially.

Legally, we can just redraw the marriage contract as a collective agreement. We do this for businesses all the time, and I see no reason why marriages shouldn't be allowed to go that route. Heck, we could even put them on the share market - who wouldn't want to buy a share of Brangelina?

Socially, what you do in your private life is your own business, as long as it's safe and between consenting adults.
intellectuallyprimitive
Posts: 1,000
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10/29/2015 11:21:56 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 3:45:33 PM, Garbanza wrote:
At 10/29/2015 3:34:45 AM, BlackFlags wrote:
For or against? Since this is the society forum, we can talk about whether it should be legal and if it should be socially accepted as well.

I am pro-polygamy. It is every mans sexual fantasy to have a dozen wet hot obedient wives. Why deny men that level of happiness, unless you are a feminazi.

I don't see why it's a problem from a feminazi perspective. A lot of women would prefer to share a hot guy than have to settle for a loser and why shouldn't they?

I suppose that is accurate to a degree. The inverse could be considered as well. Most guys would prefer to share a hot girl rather than pursue or settle with a fat girl or a nagging and worthless broad.
Rosalie
Posts: 4,605
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10/30/2015 4:57:54 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Personally, I would NOT want my husband to have another wife, if he did, I'd leave his a**. But some women are just into that sort of thing. For instance, some cultures think that polygamy is normal, not just because they practice it, but because it was in the bible. So, some people just don't see it as being wrong. Some women don't really have a preference either..
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Garbanza
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10/30/2015 5:11:04 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 11:21:56 PM, intellectuallyprimitive wrote:
At 10/29/2015 3:45:33 PM, Garbanza wrote:
At 10/29/2015 3:34:45 AM, BlackFlags wrote:
For or against? Since this is the society forum, we can talk about whether it should be legal and if it should be socially accepted as well.

I am pro-polygamy. It is every mans sexual fantasy to have a dozen wet hot obedient wives. Why deny men that level of happiness, unless you are a feminazi.

I don't see why it's a problem from a feminazi perspective. A lot of women would prefer to share a hot guy than have to settle for a loser and why shouldn't they?

I suppose that is accurate to a degree. The inverse could be considered as well. Most guys would prefer to share a hot girl rather than pursue or settle with a fat girl or a nagging and worthless broad.

Yeah. I wonder though, why the hot girl would pick two ordinary guys (the sort that use limp sterotypes, for example) when she could trade them in and get shares in a really hot guy? But I suppose people have different preferences.
ColeTrain
Posts: 4,291
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10/30/2015 5:27:33 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/30/2015 4:57:54 PM, Rosalie wrote:
For instance, some cultures think that polygamy is normal, not just because they practice it, but because it was in the bible.

I don't think this is a fair representation of what the Bible teaches, especially since most people who believe in the Bible accept Christianity, which condemned polygamy. It was from the Old Testament, prior to the New Dispensation. Essentially, this also outlines my views on the topic... I'm against it because of religious qualms.
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Rosalie
Posts: 4,605
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10/30/2015 8:17:43 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 3:42:11 AM, Wylted wrote:
At 10/29/2015 3:38:42 AM, Vox_Veritas wrote:
What freakin' woman would desire such an arrangement?

My fiance would, though I don't think I would. Two women is perfect for me. I think once you go beyond that, it requires too much energy to maintain those relationships

Aren't we getting married soon?
" We need more videos of cat's playing the piano on the internet" - My art professor.

"Criticism is easier to take when you realize that the only people who aren't criticized are those who don't take risks." - Donald Trump

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Wylted
Posts: 21,167
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10/30/2015 8:39:55 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/30/2015 8:17:43 PM, Rosalie wrote:
At 10/29/2015 3:42:11 AM, Wylted wrote:
At 10/29/2015 3:38:42 AM, Vox_Veritas wrote:
What freakin' woman would desire such an arrangement?

My fiance would, though I don't think I would. Two women is perfect for me. I think once you go beyond that, it requires too much energy to maintain those relationships

Aren't we getting married soon?

Yes
dhardage
Posts: 4,545
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10/30/2015 8:55:46 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
I think you're all limiting too much. Why not multiple husbands and wives? Plenty of love and attention to go around, plenty of parents to help raise the children. I feel as if people should be able to form any kind of family unit they want as long as its consensual and loving.
Chimera
Posts: 178
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10/30/2015 10:38:53 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
As long as it was a consensual relationship among all partners I would have no issue with it. I don't see why this should only be limited to polygamy though, when the same can be said for polyandry and polyamory in general. I could care less who your partners are honestly. Though I would prefer that the relationship be a healthy one at least.

Also, 'feminazi'? Really? There are huge amounts of feminists that would agree that there is nothing wrong with polygamy if it's consensual.
BlackFlags
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10/30/2015 10:48:14 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Feminazis are as predictable as us anarchists. As soon as someone calls them out, they 180 and turn the other way.

I could declare that feminazis want more rights for women, and they would be like, "Nope, we do not want your rights filthy man! We will do it by ourselves!"
Rosalie
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10/30/2015 11:00:06 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/30/2015 10:48:14 PM, BlackFlags wrote:
Feminazis are as predictable as us anarchists. As soon as someone calls them out, they 180 and turn the other way.

I could declare that feminazis want more rights for women, and they would be like, "Nope, we do not want your rights filthy man! We will do it by ourselves!"

http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net... ignorant men...
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Chimera
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10/30/2015 11:23:35 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/30/2015 10:48:40 PM, BlackFlags wrote:
Feminazis are as predictable as us anarchists. As soon as someone calls them out, they 180 and turn the other way.

Well, considering i'm an anarchist and a feminist, i don't know whether to feel offended or what. Lol.

I could declare that feminazis want more rights for women, and they would be like, "Nope, we do not want your rights filthy man! We will do it by ourselves!"

Lol, mostly because many feminists can't seem to agree with each other on how to abolish patriarchy and gender norms since it's such a large school of thought.

I mean, you have feminists like me who have no issue with trans people, then you have TERFs. Like wtf?

Also Chimera, there is a distinction between feminists and feminazis.

Really? Do tell.
BlackFlags
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10/30/2015 11:37:36 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/30/2015 11:23:35 PM, Chimera wrote:
Well, considering i'm an anarchist and a feminist, i don't know whether to feel offended or what. Lol.
I generally get along with anarcho-feminists quite well, since it seems like the most reasonable position for feminists to take if they truly wanted empowerment, and not entitlement.

The problem is that there are a lot of non-intellectual anarchists and a lot of non-intellectual feminists, and sometimes when they come together you produce an idiot.

Lol, mostly because many feminists can't seem to agree with each other on how to abolish patriarchy and gender norms since it's such a large school of thought.

Yes, but there is a fundamental difference between how you are defined and who you associate yourself with. I used to consider myself a liberal, but none of the other liberals were anarchists and mostly promoted statist authoritarianism, so I decided to stop associating myself with liberals.

When the majority of feminists are asking for entitlement, a problem arises with people who are asking for real and actual empowerment.

I mean, you have feminists like me who have no issue with trans people, then you have TERFs. Like wtf?

In prospect, I actually get Terfs. Groups that are trying to seperate themselves from the norm often dislike other groups which try to tag on to the movement.

A good example would be anarchy. There are so many rebellious students and emos who subscribe to anarchism, but do not actually understand the ideology, or the struggle that many anarchists are fighting for. They just like punk music and being rebellious, and when they integrate themselves into the anarchy movement, it degrades the image of everyone else associated with it.

Which is why I get Terfs like I said. A feminist who feels strongly about being empowered and the struggle of being a woman definitely has justification to judge those who change their sex and in the process associate themselves with females.

Also Chimera, there is a distinction between feminists and feminazis.

Really? Do tell.
A feminazi is the ultra-reactionary variant of a feminist.
Chimera
Posts: 178
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10/31/2015 12:29:17 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/30/2015 11:37:36 PM, BlackFlags wrote:
At 10/30/2015 11:23:35 PM, Chimera wrote:
Well, considering i'm an anarchist and a feminist, i don't know whether to feel offended or what. Lol.
I generally get along with anarcho-feminists quite well, since it seems like the most reasonable position for feminists to take if they truly wanted empowerment, and not entitlement.

Exactly, which is why I tend to not like feminists who seek to use the state to establish 'rights' for women, or to give 'rights' to LGBTQ people, when in reality you only have real 'rights' when you take them, not when they are given to you and can be arbitrarily taken away.


The problem is that there are a lot of non-intellectual anarchists and a lot of non-intellectual feminists, and sometimes when they come together you produce an idiot.

True.


Lol, mostly because many feminists can't seem to agree with each other on how to abolish patriarchy and gender norms since it's such a large school of thought.

Yes, but there is a fundamental difference between how you are defined and who you associate yourself with. I used to consider myself a liberal, but none of the other liberals were anarchists and mostly promoted statist authoritarianism, so I decided to stop associating myself with liberals.

When the majority of feminists are asking for entitlement, a problem arises with people who are asking for real and actual empowerment.

Far less feminists are asking for entitlement than most people think, those who seek entitlements are really just the louder ones within feminism and draw more attention to themselves. Most feminists work hard in order to fight against the gender structures that plague America, and rally with other like-minded folk to ensure we remain strong.


I mean, you have feminists like me who have no issue with trans people, then you have TERFs. Like wtf?

In prospect, I actually get Terfs. Groups that are trying to seperate themselves from the norm often dislike other groups which try to tag on to the movement.

A good example would be anarchy. There are so many rebellious students and emos who subscribe to anarchism, but do not actually understand the ideology, or the struggle that many anarchists are fighting for. They just like punk music and being rebellious, and when they integrate themselves into the anarchy movement, it degrades the image of everyone else associated with it.

Amen to that. But I don't see how this relates to TERFs.


Which is why I get Terfs like I said. A feminist who feels strongly about being empowered and the struggle of being a woman definitely has justification to judge those who change their sex and in the process associate themselves with females.

But that brings up the question of what actually makes a woman/man a woman/man. Personally, i'm of the belief that one becomes a woman or man or whatever one may identify as through life experience. Probably since I don't view sex and gender as the same thing, and more think that someone should just be themselves (e.g. wear the clothes you like, use the pronouns you prefer, present the characteristics your self-image shows, etc.).

Which is why I dislike TERFs, since they think all that makes you a woman are two X chromosomes and a vagina. Which is really quite arbitrary and essentialist. Why exclude Trans people when they question the gender roles and norms that patriarchy reinforces? It makes no sense to me.


Also Chimera, there is a distinction between feminists and feminazis.

Really? Do tell.
A feminazi is the ultra-reactionary variant of a feminist.

Ah, I see.
BlackFlags
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10/31/2015 1:28:30 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/31/2015 12:29:17 AM, Chimera wrote:
But that brings up the question of what actually makes a woman/man a woman/man. Personally, i'm of the belief that one becomes a woman or man or whatever one may identify as through life experience. Probably since I don't view sex and gender as the same thing, and more think that someone should just be themselves (e.g. wear the clothes you like, use the pronouns you prefer, present the characteristics your self-image shows, etc.).

The way I have always viewed it, is that people who change their gender or sex (whatever), are doing it our of a sense of insecurity. They are not comfortable with the body they live in, so they try really hard to associate as something else.

This is just a more subtle form of conformism, like how new punks try to imitate old punks, when punk is suppose to be a unique subculture based on beliefs of non-conformity.

It just doesn't strike me right. Some people have tried to explain it differently, but it always seems like the transgender community is built on vein appearance and thin skin.

Many Transgender people associate the way they do because they get a sense of empowerment, but when the reason for this association is built on an apparent weakness, such as feeling insecure with your natural appearance, then it makes sense why some feminists would want to distance themselves from the transgender community.

Just what I am thinking anyway.
BlackFlags
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10/31/2015 1:35:01 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
cont.

Of course, trying to change what and who you are naturally is different than choosing to defy certain gender norms. (and we probably will both agree most if not all gender norms are socially oppressive )

The difference is when you cross that line of people who are genuinely doing what they do for sensible and rational purposes, and people who are just outright vein and trying to mask their insecurity. It can be hard to distinguish these two groups of people, but I would estimate the number who are obsessed with vanity and escaping the judgement of their natural body dominate the transgender community.
Chimera
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10/31/2015 3:24:37 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/31/2015 1:28:30 AM, BlackFlags wrote:
At 10/31/2015 12:29:17 AM, Chimera wrote:
But that brings up the question of what actually makes a woman/man a woman/man. Personally, i'm of the belief that one becomes a woman or man or whatever one may identify as through life experience. Probably since I don't view sex and gender as the same thing, and more think that someone should just be themselves (e.g. wear the clothes you like, use the pronouns you prefer, present the characteristics your self-image shows, etc.).

The way I have always viewed it, is that people who change their gender or sex (whatever), are doing it our of a sense of insecurity. They are not comfortable with the body they live in, so they try really hard to associate as something else.

I don't see how it's insecurity when it takes quite a bit of courage to come out as trans and take control of your life regardless of what society tells you is the 'norm' for someone of your sex. Besides, many of them were insecure in their previous gender identity because it wasn't right for them. Trans people are living evidence that patriarchy is a flawed system and ought to be abolished.


This is just a more subtle form of conformism, like how new punks try to imitate old punks, when punk is suppose to be a unique subculture based on beliefs of non-conformity.

It just doesn't strike me right. Some people have tried to explain it differently, but it always seems like the transgender community is built on vein appearance and thin skin.

The trans community is anything but thin-skinned. Having to live your entire life targeted due to the clothes you wear, mannerisms you have, etc. makes you develop some pretty thick skin.

Also, how is it vain to care about one's appearance and to be how you wish to be? You do realize there are trans people who can give less of a f*** about what other people think of their appearance right? And those who care about how they appear to others aren't in any way wrong nor unreasonable to do so, since appearance has much to do with how others view you.


Many Transgender people associate the way they do because they get a sense of empowerment, but when the reason for this association is built on an apparent weakness, such as feeling insecure with your natural appearance, then it makes sense why some feminists would want to distance themselves from the transgender community.

Their empowerment is based on pride in their self-image and their courage to be who they are. Simply because an appearance is 'natural' doesn't mean that all people ought to have a 'natural' appearance. How someone wishes to appear is completely an individual decision.


Just what I am thinking anyway.

Of course, trying to change what and who you are naturally is different than choosing to defy certain gender norms. (and we probably will both agree most if not all gender norms are socially oppressive )

Of course.

The difference is when you cross that line of people who are genuinely doing what they do for sensible and rational purposes, and people who are just outright vein and trying to mask their insecurity. It can be hard to distinguish these two groups of people, but I would estimate the number who are obsessed with vanity and escaping the judgement of their natural body dominate the transgender community.

Is it not completely sensible and rational to be who you want to be and appear how you want to be? Would it be more rational to live your life how you don't want to live simply because one 'ought to be comfortable in their "natural" body'? Simply because someone wears makeup or whatever doesn't mean they are lying to themselves, it's just a form of expression.
BlackFlags
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10/31/2015 5:14:50 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/31/2015 3:24:37 AM, Chimera wrote:
I don't see how it's insecurity when it takes quite a bit of courage to come out as trans and take control of your life regardless of what society tells you is the 'norm' for someone of your sex.
It is the opposite. It is easier for people to escape their own identity than to identity as someone else. It is also quite easy to protect oneself from judgement when you enter a community with an already large network of falsified supports.

Besides, many of them were insecure in their previous gender identity because it wasn't right for them.
The fact that they are so concerned about their identity enough to spend a large portion of their life trying to change it speaks a lot about the vanity of trans people.

Trans people are living evidence that patriarchy is a flawed system and ought to be abolished.
What of females who change their identity to become men? There are just as many if not a whole lot more.

The trans community is anything but thin-skinned.
I disagree, and I have a bit of evidence for this one. Trans people are the most likely to commit suicide, and have the highest rate of depression and other mental health problems. Obviously there is a lack of control over ones emotion shown by the fact that a majority of trans people have some kind of diagnosed mental disorder.

Having to live your entire life targeted due to the clothes you wear, mannerisms you have, etc. makes you develop some pretty thick skin.
Facing your problems upfront and learning not to fear them anymore is how you develop thick skin. As I argued before, trans people change their identity because it is easier, and the easy road doesn't involve facing one's own struggle with their natural, not artificial body.

Also, how is it vain to care about one's appearance and to be how you wish to be?
It has always been a form of vanity to obsess over image. It goes without saying that trans people spend twice as much effort on their daily appearance than even the most artificial of people.

You do realize there are trans people who can give less of a f*** about what other people think of their appearance right?
I honestly do not believe that is true. It could be, but that isn't the case, since the basic for changing one's identity is definitely based on fear and insecurity.

And those who care about how they appear to others aren't in any way wrong nor unreasonable to do so, since appearance has much to do with how others view you
In some respect, but at what point do you want to be your own person and stop living to please others? In the grand scale of things, these people will make a very small impact on your life anyways. The real people you couldn't live without usually love you for who you actually are, and not who you are pretending to be.

I think trans people are putting on an act, and that probably is a second explanation for why the rate of suicide and depression is so high in the trans community. There is no way one can be mentally healthy when the entire image they project each day is a lie.

Simply because an appearance is 'natural' doesn't mean that all people ought to have a 'natural' appearance. How someone wishes to appear is completely an individual decision.

Sure, and I respect people's individual decisions. That doesn't me I always agree with them. Whether they want to accept reality, or at least what I think is reality, is also an individual decision.

Is it not completely sensible and rational to be who you want to be and appear how you want to be?
No, that is an emotional based reasoning, and not a rational one.

Would it be more rational to live your life how you don't want to live simply because one 'ought to be comfortable in their "natural" body'?
Don't you think if trans people could find a way to be socially accepted in their natural body, they would have less of a desire to change identities? It is usually social outsiders which are most likely to change identities, and this is because like I said, they cannot fit in with their natural body so they try to create an artificial one.

Simply because someone wears makeup or whatever doesn't mean they are lying to themselves, it's just a form of expression.

The problem isn't in simple defiance of gender norms. I am cool with guys and girls who want to do some things that are usually not common among the opposite sex.

On the contrary, who are they trying to fool when they declare themselves something everyone knows they are not? Sure, people will pretend to their faces that they are who they claim to be, but that will never make them apart of the true sex in their eyes.
Yassine
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11/5/2015 4:21:26 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 3:38:42 AM, Vox_Veritas wrote:
What freakin' woman would desire such an arrangement?

- Apparently many do, otherwise I doubt the practice would've been so prevalent. Much of the non-Western world practice Polygamy. Monogamy is actually a Western-Christian thing.
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Yassine
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11/5/2015 4:24:31 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 3:34:45 AM, BlackFlags wrote:
For or against? Since this is the society forum, we can talk about whether it should be legal and if it should be socially accepted as well.

- Social acceptance of Polygamy in the West is the only reason why it is not yet legal. Once there is demand for it, it will eventually be legal.

I am pro-polygamy. It is every mans sexual fantasy to have a dozen wet hot obedient wives. Why deny men that level of happiness, unless you are a feminazi.

- Such fantasies are actually realities, just not official realities. Polygamy is practiced heavily in the West, just not in an official capacity.
Current Debates:

Islam is not a religion of peace vs. @ Lutonator:
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