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Any users from Sweden

sadolite
Posts: 8,838
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11/4/2015 10:58:50 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
I am married to a Swede and all my in-laws are Swedes. But getting information about Sweden is like pulling teeth. So my question is, How's it going in your country with all the Muslims invading your country. Are they assimilating? Are there riots? I see lots of news about your country on the verge of financial and cultural collapse. What's up? Any of it true? I would like to get it from the horses mouth not from spin doctors. I am guessing it's bad because my own relatives get angry when ever I bring the subject up and just say they don't want to talk about it.
It's not your views that divide us, it's what you think my views should be that divides us.

If you think I will give up my rights and forsake social etiquette to make you "FEEL" better you are sadly mistaken

If liberal democrats would just stop shooting people gun violence would drop by 90%
sadolite
Posts: 8,838
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11/4/2015 11:01:38 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/4/2015 10:58:50 PM, sadolite wrote:
I am married to a Swede and all my in-laws are Swedes. But getting information about Sweden is like pulling teeth. So my question is, How's it going in your country with all the Muslims invading your country. Are they assimilating? Are there riots? I see lots of news about your country on the verge of financial and cultural collapse. What's up? Any of it true? I would like to get it from the horses mouth not from spin doctors. I am guessing it's bad because my own relatives get angry when ever I bring the subject up and just say they don't want to talk about it.

Also I ask the same question of German users.

There is no reliable news source in America that would print the actual truth about anything.
It's not your views that divide us, it's what you think my views should be that divides us.

If you think I will give up my rights and forsake social etiquette to make you "FEEL" better you are sadly mistaken

If liberal democrats would just stop shooting people gun violence would drop by 90%
Greyparrot
Posts: 14,306
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11/4/2015 11:01:56 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/4/2015 10:58:50 PM, sadolite wrote:
I am married to a Swede and all my in-laws are Swedes. But getting information about Sweden is like pulling teeth. So my question is, How's it going in your country with all the Muslims invading your country. Are they assimilating? Are there riots? I see lots of news about your country on the verge of financial and cultural collapse. What's up? Any of it true? I would like to get it from the horses mouth not from spin doctors. I am guessing it's bad because my own relatives get angry when ever I bring the subject up and just say they don't want to talk about it.

Most of the pristine interior and north of Europe is pissed that refugees won't just settle in the border countries and instead sneak all the way across the map.
BlackFlags
Posts: 904
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11/5/2015 12:29:00 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/4/2015 10:58:50 PM, sadolite wrote:
I am married to a Swede and all my in-laws are Swedes. But getting information about Sweden is like pulling teeth. So my question is, How's it going in your country with all the Muslims invading your country. Are they assimilating? Are there riots? I see lots of news about your country on the verge of financial and cultural collapse. What's up? Any of it true? I would like to get it from the horses mouth not from spin doctors. I am guessing it's bad because my own relatives get angry when ever I bring the subject up and just say they don't want to talk about it.

It seems like you got a lot of first hand references just within your family.
sadolite
Posts: 8,838
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11/5/2015 4:14:41 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/5/2015 12:29:00 AM, BlackFlags wrote:
At 11/4/2015 10:58:50 PM, sadolite wrote:
I am married to a Swede and all my in-laws are Swedes. But getting information about Sweden is like pulling teeth. So my question is, How's it going in your country with all the Muslims invading your country. Are they assimilating? Are there riots? I see lots of news about your country on the verge of financial and cultural collapse. What's up? Any of it true? I would like to get it from the horses mouth not from spin doctors. I am guessing it's bad because my own relatives get angry when ever I bring the subject up and just say they don't want to talk about it.

It seems like you got a lot of first hand references just within your family.

Like I said, they refuse to talk about it.
It's not your views that divide us, it's what you think my views should be that divides us.

If you think I will give up my rights and forsake social etiquette to make you "FEEL" better you are sadly mistaken

If liberal democrats would just stop shooting people gun violence would drop by 90%
Yassine
Posts: 2,617
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11/5/2015 4:17:50 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/4/2015 10:58:50 PM, sadolite wrote:
I am married to a Swede and all my in-laws are Swedes. But getting information about Sweden is like pulling teeth. So my question is, How's it going in your country with all the Muslims invading your country. Are they assimilating? Are there riots? I see lots of news about your country on the verge of financial and cultural collapse. What's up? Any of it true? I would like to get it from the horses mouth not from spin doctors. I am guessing it's bad because my own relatives get angry when ever I bring the subject up and just say they don't want to talk about it.

- I have family in Sweden too. All this is just propaganda.
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briantheliberal
Posts: 722
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11/5/2015 9:22:30 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/4/2015 10:58:50 PM, sadolite wrote:
I am married to a Swede and all my in-laws are Swedes. But getting information about Sweden is like pulling teeth. So my question is, How's it going in your country with all the Muslims invading your country. Are they assimilating? Are there riots? I see lots of news about your country on the verge of financial and cultural collapse. What's up? Any of it true? I would like to get it from the horses mouth not from spin doctors. I am guessing it's bad because my own relatives get angry when ever I bring the subject up and just say they don't want to talk about it.

I agree with the post above mine. It's mostly exaggerated propaganda created by white nationalists who cry about "white genocide" in "white" countries around the world. Many immigrants do commit crimes, but there are so much more who do not, most of which settle and contribute to society. I have personally spoken to Swedish people who agree with me here. The ones who do commit crimes do not do so because they are immigrants, or because of their race necessarily. They do it because they are just ignorant, raised by families in some countries currently plagued by violence due to religious tyranny, war, and political corruption.

Hope this helped.
Yassine
Posts: 2,617
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11/5/2015 11:16:39 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/5/2015 9:22:30 PM, briantheliberal wrote:
At 11/4/2015 10:58:50 PM, sadolite wrote:
I am married to a Swede and all my in-laws are Swedes. But getting information about Sweden is like pulling teeth. So my question is, How's it going in your country with all the Muslims invading your country. Are they assimilating? Are there riots? I see lots of news about your country on the verge of financial and cultural collapse. What's up? Any of it true? I would like to get it from the horses mouth not from spin doctors. I am guessing it's bad because my own relatives get angry when ever I bring the subject up and just say they don't want to talk about it.

I agree with the post above mine. It's mostly exaggerated propaganda created by white nationalists who cry about "white genocide" in "white" countries around the world. Many immigrants do commit crimes, but there are so much more who do not, most of which settle and contribute to society. I have personally spoken to Swedish people who agree with me here. The ones who do commit crimes do not do so because they are immigrants, or because of their race necessarily. They do it because they are just ignorant, raised by families in some countries currently plagued by violence due to religious tyranny, war, and political corruption.

Hope this helped.

+1

- Add to that, education, poverty, environment, plus a lenient judicial system...
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Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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11/5/2015 11:34:12 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/5/2015 9:22:30 PM, briantheliberal wrote:
I agree with the post above mine. It's mostly exaggerated propaganda created by white nationalists who cry about "white genocide" in "white" countries around the world. Many immigrants do commit crimes, but there are so much more who do not, most of which settle and contribute to society. I have personally spoken to Swedish people who agree with me here. The ones who do commit crimes do not do so because they are immigrants, or because of their race necessarily. They do it because they are just ignorant, raised by families in some countries currently plagued by violence due to religious tyranny, war, and political corruption.

Hope this helped.
So, why are white immigrants better off even when almost all of those factors are present in their lives?

lol
pakicetus
Posts: 66
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11/6/2015 5:50:38 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/5/2015 11:34:12 PM, Mirza wrote:
So, why are white immigrants better off even when almost all of those factors are present in their lives?

Inb4 yuhr priviledg'd
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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11/6/2015 5:08:36 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/6/2015 5:50:38 AM, pakicetus wrote:
At 11/5/2015 11:34:12 PM, Mirza wrote:
So, why are white immigrants better off even when almost all of those factors are present in their lives?

Inb4 yuhr priviledg'd
They'll make up any excuse for why they fare poorly both in their own countries and abroad, no matter how many opportunities are given to them to create success. Any blame that is directed at themselves, though, will be ignored and scratched. They'll blame whites for creating their ills even when we offer them opportunities they could have imagined creating for themselves without our aid.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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11/6/2015 5:09:36 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/6/2015 5:08:36 PM, Mirza wrote:
They'll make up any excuse for why they fare poorly both in their own countries and abroad, no matter how many opportunities are given to them to create success. Any blame that is directed at themselves, though, will be ignored and scratched. They'll blame whites for creating their ills even when we offer them opportunities they couldn't have imagined creating for themselves without our aid.
Fix.
briantheliberal
Posts: 722
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11/8/2015 3:08:33 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/5/2015 11:34:12 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 11/5/2015 9:22:30 PM, briantheliberal wrote:
I agree with the post above mine. It's mostly exaggerated propaganda created by white nationalists who cry about "white genocide" in "white" countries around the world. Many immigrants do commit crimes, but there are so much more who do not, most of which settle and contribute to society. I have personally spoken to Swedish people who agree with me here. The ones who do commit crimes do not do so because they are immigrants, or because of their race necessarily. They do it because they are just ignorant, raised by families in some countries currently plagued by violence due to religious tyranny, war, and political corruption.

Hope this helped.
So, why are white immigrants better off even when almost all of those factors are present in their lives?

lol

Are you implying that white immigrants are somehow inherently better in some way? They aren't. In fact, in Western European and Scandinavian countries, a large number of criminals in these places come from Eastern European countries. Also, because they are considered "white" they often do not face the same discrimination, and because of this, it allows them to better assimilate into these countries without being lumped into a separated category and blamed for the crimes that SOME people of their demographic commit. In addition to that, the factors mentioned above are not even close to being as big of a problem in these Eastern European countries as they are in the Middle East and African countries. Nice try though.
briantheliberal
Posts: 722
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11/8/2015 3:21:24 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/6/2015 5:08:36 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 11/6/2015 5:50:38 AM, pakicetus wrote:
At 11/5/2015 11:34:12 PM, Mirza wrote:
So, why are white immigrants better off even when almost all of those factors are present in their lives?

Inb4 yuhr priviledg'd
They'll make up any excuse for why they fare poorly both in their own countries and abroad, no matter how many opportunities are given to them to create success. Any blame that is directed at themselves, though, will be ignored and scratched. They'll blame whites for creating their ills even when we offer them opportunities they could have imagined creating for themselves without our aid.

You know what I find pathetic? The fact that you foolishly believe that you had any involvement in helping any of the nations from which these immigrant originate because you're white. You don't, and it's honestly really sad and transparent of you to dismiss any involvement that "white" countries had in the corruption and instability of these nations when they literally colonized them for years, then abandoned them, allowing them to become corrupt and plagued with violence and poverty, while you still benefit from the extortion of their resources (oil - for example). Give me a break with your nonsense. Stop pretending you (or people like you) don't deserve to held accountable for the destruction your ancestors created and benefit from.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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11/8/2015 3:31:20 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/8/2015 3:08:33 AM, briantheliberal wrote:
Are you implying that white immigrants are somehow inherently better in some way?
On average, they are better equipped; I'm not going to say we are inherently better, because it's all prone to change.

They aren't. In fact, in Western European and Scandinavian countries, a large number of criminals in these places come from Eastern European countries.
Do you understand the difference between people who migrate to perform crime, and people who migrate to reside in a new place? It seems like you don't, but there's a difference. European immigrants, whether Eastern, Southern, or what have you, do *much* better than their non-European counterparts in almost every area, be it in education, employment, integration, etc. In the UK, areas with many Eastern European migrants experience a *drop* in crime as opposed to rise. I'm not even going to bother citing sources that show what happens when an influx of migrants from non-European countries takes place.

Also, because they are considered "white" they often do not face the same discrimination, and because of this, it allows them to better assimilate into these countries without being lumped into a separated category and blamed for the crimes that SOME people of their demographic commit.
First of all, there's absolutely no reason to think that because discrimination occurs that therefore *this* much crime and issues with integration occurs in literally *every single European country that has non-European immigrants*. It can account for *some* issues, but the vast majority of cases of discrimination aren't exactly life-altering, and considering just how many jobs and education opportunities European states offer (esp. Germany, Sweden et al), being discriminated should absolutely NOT lead to nearly this high amount of issues caused by non-European immigrants. Secondly, just because you're white doesn't mean you don't face discrimination. It happens more often than you think, but whites nevertheless fare much better.

Don't attempt to dismiss facts and explain them away with discrimination or whatever. It's all problematic, but doesn't do much to justify the high rise in crime, nor other societal issues caused by migrants.

[UK crime drops in areas with European migrants: http://www.theguardian.com...]

In addition to that, the factors mentioned above are not even close to being as big of a problem in these Eastern European countries as they are in the Middle East and African countries. Nice try though.
That's not what I said, so try to read better next time. Even when whites do experience war and similar issues to blacks or other peoples, and they migrate, they generally fare much better in their societies.

Speaking of discrimination and "feeling out" being the cause of all those issues migrants cause, let me introduce you to Jews. :) https://en.wikipedia.org...
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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11/8/2015 3:33:14 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/8/2015 3:21:24 AM, briantheliberal wrote:
You know what I find pathetic? The fact that you foolishly believe that you had any involvement in helping any of the nations from which these immigrant originate because you're white. You don't, and it's honestly really sad and transparent of you to dismiss any involvement that "white" countries had in the corruption and instability of these nations when they literally colonized them for years, then abandoned them, allowing them to become corrupt and plagued with violence and poverty, while you still benefit from the extortion of their resources (oil - for example). Give me a break with your nonsense. Stop pretending you (or people like you) don't deserve to held accountable for the destruction your ancestors created and benefit from.
That's the English, Portuguese et al you're talking about. Blame them. :)
briantheliberal
Posts: 722
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11/8/2015 6:22:36 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/8/2015 3:31:20 AM, Mirza wrote:
At 11/8/2015 3:08:33 AM, briantheliberal wrote:
Are you implying that white immigrants are somehow inherently better in some way?
On average, they are better equipped; I'm not going to say we are inherently better, because it's all prone to change.

Better equipped how? What does this even mean?

They aren't. In fact, in Western European and Scandinavian countries, a large number of criminals in these places come from Eastern European countries.
Do you understand the difference between people who migrate to perform crime, and people who migrate to reside in a new place?

First of all, how does one "perform crime". Secondly, what does this have to do with anything I said?

It seems like you don't, but there's a difference. European immigrants, whether Eastern, Southern, or what have you, do *much* better than their non-European counterparts in almost every area, be it in education, employment, integration, etc. In the UK, areas with many Eastern European migrants experience a *drop* in crime as opposed to rise. I'm not even going to bother citing sources that show what happens when an influx of migrants from non-European countries takes place.

Because those Eastern European immigrants are better able to assimilate in other European countries. They do not face the same discrimination that people who do not look like them face in those same countries. Just being white/European has nothing to do with it. And if you are foolishly implying that, that makes you a racist because you are saying that one group is INHERENTLY better than another, which is why they do not commit as many crimes, ignoring all of the other factors that contribute to all these things.

Also, because they are considered "white" they often do not face the same discrimination, and because of this, it allows them to better assimilate into these countries without being lumped into a separated category and blamed for the crimes that SOME people of their demographic commit.

First of all, there's absolutely no reason to think that because discrimination occurs that therefore *this* much crime and issues with integration occurs in literally *every single European country that has non-European immigrants*.

This sentence needs to be worded better for me to actually understand what it is that you are actually saying. Please fix this.

It can account for *some* issues, but the vast majority of cases of discrimination aren't exactly life-altering, and considering just how many jobs and education opportunities European states offer (esp. Germany, Sweden et al), being discriminated should absolutely NOT lead to nearly this high amount of issues caused by non-European immigrants. Secondly, just because you're white doesn't mean you don't face discrimination. It happens more often than you think, but whites nevertheless fare much better.

So basically you agree that being white gives you an advantage in these countries? Thank you. Now with that being said, I agree with your assertion that discrimination is not the ONLY factor. In fact, I already said it was NOT the only factor, only that it contributes to the issues that are already there. I also mentioned poverty, cultural and other issues that contribute to this. Also you do realize that the overwhelming majority of immigrants (European or otherwise) DO NOT commit crimes right?

Don't attempt to dismiss facts and explain them away with discrimination or whatever. It's all problematic, but doesn't do much to justify the high rise in crime, nor other societal issues caused by migrants.

I didn't dismiss any facts, because you haven't presented any. I also did not say it was all because of discrimination, only that it is a FACTOR to consider. One thing is certain though, the difference between other European immigrants committing crimes and Non-Europeans committing crimes, is that the crimes that Europeans commit are not associated with and used to demonized OTHER Europeans of the same demographic. In addition to that, even the poorest European nations do not face the same issues that non-European nations do.

[UK crime drops in areas with European migrants: http://www.theguardian.com...]

See above.

In addition to that, the factors mentioned above are not even close to being as big of a problem in these Eastern European countries as they are in the Middle East and African countries. Nice try though.
That's not what I said, so try to read better next time. Even when whites do experience war and similar issues to blacks or other peoples, and they migrate, they generally fare much better in their societies.

"So, why are white immigrants better off even when almost all of those factors are present in their lives?"

That is what you said and implied. In fact, that was the whole point of you bringing up European immigrants in the first place. To make asinine, racially charged comparisons between the European and non-European immigrants. Your intention was to paint one group as better than the other by pretending they face the same issues in their native countries when they do not.

Speaking of discrimination and "feeling out" being the cause of all those issues migrants cause, let me introduce you to Jews. :) https://en.wikipedia.org...

Jews are overwhelmingly of white European descent. Judaism is a religion, not considered a race. In addition to that, Jews do not face half of the discrimination they used to, especially when compared to Muslims today. Try again.
briantheliberal
Posts: 722
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11/8/2015 6:22:39 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/8/2015 3:33:14 AM, Mirza wrote:
At 11/8/2015 3:21:24 AM, briantheliberal wrote:
You know what I find pathetic? The fact that you foolishly believe that you had any involvement in helping any of the nations from which these immigrant originate because you're white. You don't, and it's honestly really sad and transparent of you to dismiss any involvement that "white" countries had in the corruption and instability of these nations when they literally colonized them for years, then abandoned them, allowing them to become corrupt and plagued with violence and poverty, while you still benefit from the extortion of their resources (oil - for example). Give me a break with your nonsense. Stop pretending you (or people like you) don't deserve to held accountable for the destruction your ancestors created and benefit from.
That's the English, Portuguese et al you're talking about. Blame them. :)

These people (Spanish, Portuguese, British, French, Italians etc... ) created the system of racial classification and hierarchy that you currently benefit from (assuming you are white). And so long as you continue to deny this fact, and dismiss or make excuses for the issues that come from it, you are also partly to blame because you help to perpetuate it. When you (and people like you) start speaking out AGAINST stuff like this, then the issues you speak of will no longer exist, and the world will be a better place. You have the power to do this, most people who are not white do not. And it's because most white people do not try to change things (because they benefit from it) that they do not change.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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11/10/2015 11:29:03 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
I am aghast at your inability to use proper vocabulary and understand what the words you use mean.

At 11/8/2015 6:22:36 AM, briantheliberal wrote:
Better equipped how? What does this even mean?
On average, they are better able to solve problems, pass challenges, and more. There is good documentation on the intellectual differences between races, whether one may like it or not. Contrary to your presumption that this is "inherent" (learn to use the word, you filthy scum), it isn't; it's possible to change, and it's not every individual that is at or near the average, but every individual makes the average as it is now relatively lower compared to certain groups - in this context, Europeans.

If you think that genetics determine our skin colour, texture; hair colour, texture; our height, bone structure, and so much more, but not our intellectual potential, then give the idea that it actually does another try. Do it.

First of all, how does one "perform crime". Secondly, what does this have to do with anything I said?
Are you acting stupid here? I clearly meant "commit crime", but the fact that you either don't understand the obvious intended meaning or purposely point out I committed a typing error just to appear cool makes you a fool either way. :)

As for what it has to do, it's simple: Eastern Europeans who count in crime statistics are often not migrants, but temporary residents. Nevertheless, as per the study I gave, it seems that Eastern Europeans make crime *drop*. That's not quite the case with most non-European immigrants.

Because those Eastern European immigrants are better able to assimilate in other European countries. They do not face the same discrimination that people who do not look like them face in those same countries. Just being white/European has nothing to do with it. And if you are foolishly implying that, that makes you a racist because you are saying that one group is INHERENTLY better than another, which is why they do not commit as many crimes, ignoring all of the other factors that contribute to all these things.
Explain to me what "assimilate" means. Why is assimilation even important for an immigrant? He's asked more often than not to integrate, not assimilate. Are you capable of distinguishing between the two? I guess not. Now, move on to tell me *why* Eastern European immigrants assimilate better. Exactly what prevents the youngsters of non-European immigrants to be fully functional citizens? Are you going to act like the dimwit you are and tell me they face such severe discrimination at a young age that they begin committing crimes at disproportionate levels? Are you? If so, you're a complete idiot. You're unable to do anything but blame the white society for the ills of those they gave *A PLETHORA OF OPPORTUNITIES TO*. Opportunities to get success *in spite* of whatever challenges may come their way. You make it look like the teenagers from Africa or the Middle East who have *never tasted a real societal challenge* fail to find success and enter the criminal environment only because of the society or some ills their parents faced *even if their parents are healthy, working, or second-generation immigrants*.

I beg you to stop using the world "inherently". Ever. You don't know what it means. There's something called average; it means half over, half under Xn. If blacks *on average* are less intelligent, obviously that doesn't speak anything about any black individual by necessity, but it does say that the average folks aren't as capable as average folks of say, Europeans, to be ingenious, solve problems, etc. I hate to point this out, as it has no merit on judgement of an individual, but when we speak of masses of people, the average counts very much, and it's very important to put it under scrutiny.

I am aghast at being called a racist. You're a vile fool for uttering such an offensive word against me, when I obviously only speak of facts, and am not trying to degrade another group of people based on a bias (which I thankfully don't have). But let's turn this around - YOU are the racist because YOU keep ignoring something far better explanatory of the nature of some people: genetics. You literally rule this out. Completely. And every single time. Why? Does it shock you that mankind through evolution split into groups, some dark, some light, some more intelligent, some less? It's a depressing fact, but it's real. And you happen to be, what was the word, yes - a racist - for ignoring this factor that plays a *huge role* in our intellectual potential, and resort to blaming the white man for the ills of blacks and others.

Shame on you. :)

First of all, there's absolutely no reason to think that because discrimination occurs that therefore *this* much crime and issues with integration occurs in literally *every single European country that has non-European immigrants*.

This sentence needs to be worded better for me to actually understand what it is that you are actually saying. Please fix this.
Stupid on purpose once again, or is it unindented? It's pretty clear: even if discrimination does influence *some* people negatively, which I'll easily admit it does, that doesn't do well to explain such extreme crime numbers or other negative statistics in literally every European society. That you can't find *one* that non-Europeans haven't caused trouble in speaks more of them than it does of the host countries.

So basically you agree that being white gives you an advantage in these countries? Thank you. Now with that being said, I agree with your assertion that discrimination is not the ONLY factor. In fact, I already said it was NOT the only factor, only that it contributes to the issues that are already there. I also mentioned poverty, cultural and other issues that contribute to this. Also you do realize that the overwhelming majority of immigrants (European or otherwise) DO NOT commit crimes right?
Where have I denied it? There's an advantage, but it's almost negligible. It's pretty much evident on its own: when the smarter immigrants face the exact same challenges (cultural, environmental, economic, etc.) as the less smart ones, they fare better, be they black, brown, or white.

I guess intellect doesn't matter here. And I guess everyone has equal potential. :)

I didn't dismiss any facts, because you haven't presented any. I also did not say it was all because of discrimination, only that it is a FACTOR to consider. One thing is certain though, the difference between other European immigrants committing crimes and Non-Europeans committing crimes, is that the crimes that Europeans commit are not associated with and used to demonized OTHER Europeans of the same demographic. In addition to that, even the poorest European nations do not face the same issues that non-European nations do.
ABSOLUTE NONSENSE. Are you freakin' kidding me? How many times did we mention *Eastern Europeans* that everyone lumps together as one? But that's okay, not much to feel bad about there. :)

[UK crime drops in areas with European migrants: http://www.theguardian.com...]

See above.
Sure.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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11/10/2015 11:38:10 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
"So, why are white immigrants better off even when almost all of those factors are present in their lives?"

That is what you said and implied. In fact, that was the whole point of you bringing up European immigrants in the first place. To make asinine, racially charged comparisons between the European and non-European immigrants. Your intention was to paint one group as better than the other by pretending they face the same issues in their native countries when they do not.
Stretch your mind a little. You're *presuming* all the immigrants in Europe who commit crimes and generally fare poorly in the society come from horrid, catastrophic backgrounds, but *you have never attempted to back it up*. Indeed a lot of them have, but certainly not all. A lot of immigrants in Europe are economic migrants, and are pretty well-functional (i.e., they're not traumatized or anything of that sort). That they, and more importantly, their offspring, don't do very well in Europe, even when there are few genuine obstacles, is a reality they're to be blamed for, not Europeans.

Please explain how you can have the guts to just brush away the experience of Europeans. Haven't you heard of the Yugoslav war? No matter how people's lives were prior to the wars, the fact that many experienced horror and tragedy is enough to harm them psychologically. Yet, even with their then-low education and horrid experienced, their offspring fare very well. I can't cite enough data on how well my group, Bosnians, fare around the world - and we *do* face obstacles. Some get lower pay, for instance, than their average peers who do the same job with the same educational level.

Discrimination exists. Obstacles exist. They're generally not so severe for the average non-European immigrant, at least in Europe, for them to be that important factors in explaining the relatively poor rates of success in their societies.

Jews are overwhelmingly of white European descent. Judaism is a religion, not considered a race. In addition to that, Jews do not face half of the discrimination they used to, especially when compared to Muslims today. Try again.
Do you actually realize that the distinction between race and religion for Jews absolutely doesn't matter? They're an ethnic group, FYI, at least Ashkenazi and Sephardic Jews respectively. People do recognize them as such. Nevertheless, their specific dress code, names, and overall background does lead to *a lot* of hate crime and discrimination. In fact, you can argue Jews have it worse than non-European immigrants here. They're disliked often by both natives and newcomers. They're stigmatized. The only land they have is under media siege continually. Don't you think they have enough excuses to be social outcasts?

It's so sad how you ignore the challenges Jews face on a continent with a history of oppression and repression of their people, and with so much hatred targeted against them by immigrants and non-immigrants alike; by the media and average folks alike. Even if they face a little less discrimination and hatred than the immigrants, are you seriously going to be a loser of monstrous kind and tell me it's not enough to challenge them and make them social outcasts (criminals, leechers)?

Hasta la vista. Call me a racist against and you're a) reported, and b) ignored.
Mirza
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11/10/2015 11:42:46 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
For the record, I hate to appear this irritated, but when people can't do anything else but blame Europeans for their ills, I strongly begin to detest them. Take some f*king responsibility.
popculturepooka
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11/11/2015 1:47:59 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/6/2015 5:08:36 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 11/6/2015 5:50:38 AM, pakicetus wrote:
At 11/5/2015 11:34:12 PM, Mirza wrote:
So, why are white immigrants better off even when almost all of those factors are present in their lives?

Inb4 yuhr priviledg'd
They'll make up any excuse for why they fare poorly both in their own countries and abroad, no matter how many opportunities are given to them to create success. Any blame that is directed at themselves, though, will be ignored and scratched. They'll blame whites for creating their ills even when we offer them opportunities they could have imagined creating for themselves without our aid.

Well, whites are to blame for a lot of ills... *shrugs*
At 10/3/2016 11:49:13 PM, thett3 wrote:
BLACK LIVES MATTER!
popculturepooka
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11/11/2015 1:57:30 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/11/2015 1:49:50 AM, Mirza wrote:
At 11/11/2015 1:47:59 AM, popculturepooka wrote:
Well, whites are to blame for a lot of ills... *shrugs*
In Europe? lol >.<

Many European countries' pasts wrt to colonialism, racial stratification and the like isn't all that different from America. *shrugs*

And I happen to know quite a few non-white Europeans and their opinions and perceptions tend to differ quite markedely from the average white Europeans' opinion on these sort of issues. Kind of like America. So, make of that what you will...
At 10/3/2016 11:49:13 PM, thett3 wrote:
BLACK LIVES MATTER!
Mirza
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11/11/2015 2:10:56 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/11/2015 1:57:30 AM, popculturepooka wrote:
Many European countries' pasts wrt to colonialism, racial stratification and the like isn't all that different from America. *shrugs*
It has absolutely no relevance to the issues we have with immigrants in Europe today. I'm not ignoring what Europeans did before, nor what whites do today (America and its Western allies) that causes havoc for the people there, but there's a completely different situation once people are in Europe, and once they have offspring in Europe. It's the next generations that ought to make use of all the wonderful opportunities they have here, and failure simply cannot in the vast majority of cases be blamed on societal obstacles. Some can, and of course things do get more difficult when there is discrimination, but none of that explains the crime rates or other issues.

And I happen to know quite a few non-white Europeans and their opinions and perceptions tend to differ quite markedely from the average white Europeans' opinion on these sort of issues. Kind of like America. So, make of that what you will...
Everyone will look at this from their perspective. I can't help but get irritated when people use crappy excuses for why so many immigrants fail in Europe when this is literally a most wonderful place for them to be. I can't tell you not only from real empirical evidence, but my own anecdotes, how many immigrants enter the realm of failure at such an early age, when they get offered all the help of the world, have families and friends so they hardly even notice they're in a foreign land, don't experience discrimination, etc. It just doesn't make sense to blame it on anything but them. They just seem incapable of being proper citizens, and that's where it ends. Nobody can convince me that all the data, and my anecdotes, and anecdotes of literally everyone who has lived in immigrant areas, don't point toward the subjects in failure as the causes of their own failures.