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Free speech

sadolite
Posts: 8,842
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11/14/2015 12:23:39 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
So are progressive liberals for or against free speech on college campuses?
It's not your views that divide us, it's what you think my views should be that divides us.

If you think I will give up my rights and forsake social etiquette to make you "FEEL" better you are sadly mistaken

If liberal democrats would just stop shooting people gun violence would drop by 90%
lotsoffun
Posts: 1,610
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11/14/2015 3:35:20 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/14/2015 12:23:39 AM, sadolite wrote:
So are progressive liberals for or against free speech on college campuses?

They prove time and time again that they are for their own free speech but no one elses, especially any Israeli. There is no discourse any more. They pick up on a cause and refuse any opposing views by shutting people up with their favourite shut up phrase, "you're a racist", or shouting them down. Every one is a racist if they disagree, no matter what the subject is. I hope these these entitled little savages don't inherit the earth. Thank God there are still some thinkers on university campuses.
sadolite
Posts: 8,842
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11/14/2015 3:38:32 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/14/2015 3:35:20 AM, lotsoffun wrote:
At 11/14/2015 12:23:39 AM, sadolite wrote:
So are progressive liberals for or against free speech on college campuses?

They prove time and time again that they are for their own free speech but no one elses, especially any Israeli. There is no discourse any more. They pick up on a cause and refuse any opposing views by shutting people up with their favourite shut up phrase, "you're a racist", or shouting them down. Every one is a racist if they disagree, no matter what the subject is. I hope these these entitled little savages don't inherit the earth. Thank God there are still some thinkers on university campuses.

So what you are saying is college campuses are no longer critical thinking learning institutions but rather indoctrination camps and a complete waste of ones money?
It's not your views that divide us, it's what you think my views should be that divides us.

If you think I will give up my rights and forsake social etiquette to make you "FEEL" better you are sadly mistaken

If liberal democrats would just stop shooting people gun violence would drop by 90%
BlackFlags
Posts: 904
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11/14/2015 3:52:14 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/14/2015 3:35:20 AM, lotsoffun wrote:
At 11/14/2015 12:23:39 AM, sadolite wrote:
So are progressive liberals for or against free speech on college campuses?

They prove time and time again that they are for their own free speech but no one elses, especially any Israeli. There is no discourse any more. They pick up on a cause and refuse any opposing views by shutting people up with their favourite shut up phrase, "you're a racist", or shouting them down. Every one is a racist if they disagree, no matter what the subject is. I hope these these entitled little savages don't inherit the earth. Thank God there are still some thinkers on university campuses.

They actively want the government to step in and ban offensive language and offensive opinions (while offensive is totally subjective). True authoritarianism exemplified.
lotsoffun
Posts: 1,610
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11/14/2015 3:54:51 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/14/2015 3:38:32 AM, sadolite wrote:
At 11/14/2015 3:35:20 AM, lotsoffun wrote:
At 11/14/2015 12:23:39 AM, sadolite wrote:
So are progressive liberals for or against free speech on college campuses?

They prove time and time again that they are for their own free speech but no one elses, especially any Israeli. There is no discourse any more. They pick up on a cause and refuse any opposing views by shutting people up with their favourite shut up phrase, "you're a racist", or shouting them down. Every one is a racist if they disagree, no matter what the subject is. I hope these these entitled little savages don't inherit the earth. Thank God there are still some thinkers on university campuses.

So what you are saying is college campuses are no longer critical thinking learning institutions but rather indoctrination camps and a complete waste of ones money?

No, I didn't say that. I said that too many refuse to consider opinions other than their own and that they shout down and unfairly label people who disagree with them.
TBR
Posts: 9,991
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11/14/2015 3:56:22 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/14/2015 12:23:39 AM, sadolite wrote:
So are progressive liberals for or against free speech on college campuses?

Well.... The issue in this case is expectation of privacy, not free speech. Do you know the difference? However, I will say there is no progressive I know of who is not for free speech.
sadolite
Posts: 8,842
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11/14/2015 3:56:29 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/14/2015 3:54:51 AM, lotsoffun wrote:
At 11/14/2015 3:38:32 AM, sadolite wrote:
At 11/14/2015 3:35:20 AM, lotsoffun wrote:
At 11/14/2015 12:23:39 AM, sadolite wrote:
So are progressive liberals for or against free speech on college campuses?

They prove time and time again that they are for their own free speech but no one elses, especially any Israeli. There is no discourse any more. They pick up on a cause and refuse any opposing views by shutting people up with their favourite shut up phrase, "you're a racist", or shouting them down. Every one is a racist if they disagree, no matter what the subject is. I hope these these entitled little savages don't inherit the earth. Thank God there are still some thinkers on university campuses.

So what you are saying is college campuses are no longer critical thinking learning institutions but rather indoctrination camps and a complete waste of ones money?

No, I didn't say that. I said that too many refuse to consider opinions other than their own and that they shout down and unfairly label people who disagree with them.

So it's an indoctrination camp
It's not your views that divide us, it's what you think my views should be that divides us.

If you think I will give up my rights and forsake social etiquette to make you "FEEL" better you are sadly mistaken

If liberal democrats would just stop shooting people gun violence would drop by 90%
sadolite
Posts: 8,842
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11/14/2015 3:58:06 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/14/2015 3:56:22 AM, TBR wrote:
At 11/14/2015 12:23:39 AM, sadolite wrote:
So are progressive liberals for or against free speech on college campuses?

Well.... The issue in this case is expectation of privacy, not free speech. Do you know the difference? However, I will say there is no progressive I know of who is not for free speech.

Who in their right mind would expect privacy on a college campus
It's not your views that divide us, it's what you think my views should be that divides us.

If you think I will give up my rights and forsake social etiquette to make you "FEEL" better you are sadly mistaken

If liberal democrats would just stop shooting people gun violence would drop by 90%
BlackFlags
Posts: 904
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11/14/2015 3:59:49 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/14/2015 3:56:22 AM, TBR wrote:
At 11/14/2015 12:23:39 AM, sadolite wrote:
So are progressive liberals for or against free speech on college campuses?

Well.... The issue in this case is expectation of privacy, not free speech. Do you know the difference? However, I will say there is no progressive I know of who is not for free speech.

That is because you are a progressive, and have a different definition of free speech than everyone else. Of course you are going to agree with progressives on the progressive definition of free speech, given you do in fact declare yourself a progressive.

tbh though progressivism was a real actual movement started by early 20th century political philosophers with actual literature associated with it, that is nothing like what progressives promote today
TBR
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11/14/2015 4:01:31 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Thought you had been scared away for good...

Well.... The issue in this case is expectation of privacy, not free speech. Do you know the difference? However, I will say there is no progressive I know of who is not for free speech.

That is because you are a progressive, and have a different definition of free speech than everyone else. Of course you are going to agree with progressives on the progressive definition of free speech, given you do in fact declare yourself a progressive.

Nope. Just the one in the constitution. The constitution you think is worthless and meaningless.


tbh though progressivism was a real actual movement started by early 20th century political philosophers with actual literature associated with it, that is nothing like what progressives promote today

bare assertion. Like everything you argue
lotsoffun
Posts: 1,610
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11/14/2015 4:04:38 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/14/2015 3:52:14 AM, BlackFlags wrote:
At 11/14/2015 3:35:20 AM, lotsoffun wrote:
At 11/14/2015 12:23:39 AM, sadolite wrote:
So are progressive liberals for or against free speech on college campuses?

They prove time and time again that they are for their own free speech but no one elses, especially any Israeli. There is no discourse any more. They pick up on a cause and refuse any opposing views by shutting people up with their favourite shut up phrase, "you're a racist", or shouting them down. Every one is a racist if they disagree, no matter what the subject is. I hope these these entitled little savages don't inherit the earth. Thank God there are still some thinkers on university campuses.

They actively want the government to step in and ban offensive language and offensive opinions (while offensive is totally subjective). True authoritarianism exemplified.

If we are going to have free speech then it must be totally free. Who is to decide what is offensive? These young leftist bullies along with their leftist radical profs need to grow a spine. If you or I get offended by some words - too bad. We suck it up and counter with an intelligent response based on our own beliefs. we have a dialogue. I believe the holocaust happened but I defend anyone's right to say it didn't. These university campuses may very well be the downfall of democracy, because it's survival is predicated on free speech.
TBR
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11/14/2015 4:06:12 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/14/2015 3:58:06 AM, sadolite wrote:
At 11/14/2015 3:56:22 AM, TBR wrote:
At 11/14/2015 12:23:39 AM, sadolite wrote:
So are progressive liberals for or against free speech on college campuses?

Well.... The issue in this case is expectation of privacy, not free speech. Do you know the difference? However, I will say there is no progressive I know of who is not for free speech.

Who in their right mind would expect privacy on a college campus

No one. That is the point. They were absolutely silly to expect or demand it. They were also interfering with freedom of the press. You were implying this had something to do with freedom of speech - it does not.
lotsoffun
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11/14/2015 4:06:43 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/14/2015 3:56:29 AM, sadolite wrote:
At 11/14/2015 3:54:51 AM, lotsoffun wrote:
At 11/14/2015 3:38:32 AM, sadolite wrote:
At 11/14/2015 3:35:20 AM, lotsoffun wrote:
At 11/14/2015 12:23:39 AM, sadolite wrote:
So are progressive liberals for or against free speech on college campuses?

They prove time and time again that they are for their own free speech but no one elses, especially any Israeli. There is no discourse any more. They pick up on a cause and refuse any opposing views by shutting people up with their favourite shut up phrase, "you're a racist", or shouting them down. Every one is a racist if they disagree, no matter what the subject is. I hope these these entitled little savages don't inherit the earth. Thank God there are still some thinkers on university campuses.

So what you are saying is college campuses are no longer critical thinking learning institutions but rather indoctrination camps and a complete waste of ones money?

No, I didn't say that. I said that too many refuse to consider opinions other than their own and that they shout down and unfairly label people who disagree with them.

So it's an indoctrination camp

Read what I said
BlackFlags
Posts: 904
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11/14/2015 4:10:14 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/14/2015 4:01:31 AM, TBR wrote:
That is because you are a progressive, and have a different definition of free speech than everyone else. Of course you are going to agree with progressives on the progressive definition of free speech, given you do in fact declare yourself a progressive.
Which is very vague, but even with how vague it is, NO progressives are for free speech.

bare assertion. Like everything you argue
Wow? Yeah, you are right as always TBR, there were actually no progressive political philosophers in the early 20th century and they didn't have any literature! Totally...

Read Sun Yat Sen and Nicolas de Condorcet, and study a bit up on the style of governance and speeches of Otto Van Bismarck.

The original progressive political philosopers believes in a strong unregulated capitalist economy with a high focus on social spending and nationalism. You will find the same themes in all the early progressive writings.
BlackFlags
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11/14/2015 4:11:55 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/14/2015 4:04:38 AM, lotsoffun wrote:
If we are going to have free speech then it must be totally free. Who is to decide what is offensive? These young leftist bullies along with their leftist radical profs need to grow a spine. If you or I get offended by some words - too bad. We suck it up and counter with an intelligent response based on our own beliefs. we have a dialogue. I believe the holocaust happened but I defend anyone's right to say it didn't. These university campuses may very well be the downfall of democracy, because it's survival is predicated on free speech.

Agreed, although I wouldn't much mind the downfall of democracy. I would take it any day over the liberal class of fascism though.
TBR
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11/14/2015 4:13:24 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/14/2015 4:10:14 AM, BlackFlags wrote:
At 11/14/2015 4:01:31 AM, TBR wrote:
That is because you are a progressive, and have a different definition of free speech than everyone else. Of course you are going to agree with progressives on the progressive definition of free speech, given you do in fact declare yourself a progressive.
Which is very vague, but even with how vague it is, NO progressives are for free speech.
I say again. Bare assertion. Back that up with anything.


bare assertion. Like everything you argue
Wow? Yeah, you are right as always TBR, there were actually no progressive political philosophers in the early 20th century and they didn't have any literature! Totally...

Right. And that is what I am talking about... You are a fool.


Read Sun Yat Sen and Nicolas de Condorcet, and study a bit up on the style of governance and speeches of Otto Van Bismarck.

The original progressive political philosopers believes in a strong unregulated capitalist economy with a high focus on social spending and nationalism. You will find the same themes in all the early progressive writings.

Why on earth discuss this in connection with free speech? You have no idea how to argue.
TBR
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11/14/2015 4:15:29 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Off to take the kid to bed. Ill check in later. But to preempt. Yea, there is no such thing as rights, the constitution is just a piece of paper, you really are an anarchist, and don't think every dumb a$$ conservative thing you say. Blah blah...
BlackFlags
Posts: 904
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11/14/2015 4:19:24 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/14/2015 4:13:24 AM, TBR wrote:
I say again. Bare assertion. Back that up with anything.
Ah, okay buddy.

Free speech. The power to say what one wants to say. Are there any instances where progressives want to hinder someones power to say something? Can you think of one instance? Well, if so, then you have proved my point.

Right. And that is what I am talking about... You are a fool.
Come on TBR, that is bare assertion. You can't just ignore my entire post and assert that I am a fool without evidence. That isn't how debating works, buddy.

Why on earth discuss this in connection with free speech? You have no idea how to argue.
Because there is never a wrong time to enlighten a fascist
TBR
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11/14/2015 5:14:58 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/14/2015 4:19:24 AM, BlackFlags wrote:
At 11/14/2015 4:13:24 AM, TBR wrote:
I say again. Bare assertion. Back that up with anything.
Ah, okay buddy.

Free speech. The power to say what one wants to say. Are there any instances where progressives want to hinder someones power to say something? Can you think of one instance? Well, if so, then you have proved my point.

One? Well, you said all. Back your crap or stop saying it. You backtrack and attempt to make it sound like "not MEeee..." This is why I think you are childish. Blanket statement with nothing to back it, then equivocate, then back-down, then blame someone else. OWN IT!!!


Right. And that is what I am talking about... You are a fool.
Come on TBR, that is bare assertion. You can't just ignore my entire post and assert that I am a fool without evidence. That isn't how debating works, buddy.

This is your go to. Its not working on me. I have addressed your points over and over in our discussions. You have yet to address anything in return, and then attempt to blame me. It is you who are doing this wrong, and it makes you look childish.

Why on earth discuss this in connection with free speech? You have no idea how to argue.
Because there is never a wrong time to enlighten a fascist

Its never wrong to call out a fake anarchist. Conservative!
tvellalott
Posts: 10,864
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11/14/2015 5:18:09 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/14/2015 12:23:39 AM, sadolite wrote:
So are progressive liberals for or against free speech on college campuses?

It depends on what you're saying. ;)
"Caitlyn Jenner is an incredibly brave and stunningly beautiful woman."

Muh threads
Using mafia tactics in real-life: http://www.debate.org...
6 years of DDO: http://www.debate.org...
TBR
Posts: 9,991
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11/14/2015 5:20:46 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
NO progressives are for free speech.

So. Is this an exaggeration? Is it something you want to back? Is it a bare assertion? Or do you want to weasel out of it like a child?
BlackFlags
Posts: 904
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11/14/2015 6:43:21 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/14/2015 5:14:58 AM, TBR wrote:
One? Well, you said all. Back your crap or stop saying it. You backtrack and attempt to make it sound like "not MEeee..." This is why I think you are childish.
Only someone who feels threatened intellectually would feel the need to call his competition a child.

Blanket statement with nothing to back it, then equivocate, then back-down, then blame someone else. OWN IT!!!
Maybe you just don't want to accept my statements as having any merit? Maybe you just want to continue living in your ignorant little box? Maybe this whole conversation is just going to be another depressing testimony to how deluded the self righteous fascist mind is...

This is your go to. Its not working on me. I have addressed your points over and over in our discussions.
You are definitely full of it, because you claim to have actual discussions, yet anyone capable of looking through your past conversations would see instantly that you had never went beyond using classic party rhetoric lines on any discussion.

Instead you choose to whimper and gripe about how others do not match your undeclared "intellectual superiority." I hope you enjoy being a political plaything TBR, instead of realizing that these issues go beyond simple partisan sloganeering.

Grow up man, because you aren't getting any younger. It doesn't bode well when one of the oldest men on this site chooses to act the most immature, like you do in discussion after discussion.

Its never wrong to call out a fake anarchist. Conservative!
It is pretty clear that you have a very limited understanding of political philosophy and ideologies.

Obviously uneducated in this area, evidenced by how you consider someone a conservative who is pro-choice, pro-gay marriage, anti-military, and most importantly, an advocate of the abolition of all nations throughout the globe.

Got to admit, that is a little right of retarded.
tajshar2k
Posts: 2,385
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11/14/2015 12:33:43 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/14/2015 12:23:39 AM, sadolite wrote:
So are progressive liberals for or against free speech on college campuses?

No. That's the most idiotic idea I have ever heard, and if you support that, you are a communist or a racist.
"In Guns We Trust" Tajshar2k
tajshar2k
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11/14/2015 12:34:52 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/14/2015 12:33:43 PM, tajshar2k wrote:
At 11/14/2015 12:23:39 AM, sadolite wrote:
So are progressive liberals for or against free speech on college campuses?

No. That's the most idiotic idea I have ever heard, and if you support that, you are a communist or a racist.

f a cist not racist.
"In Guns We Trust" Tajshar2k
sadolite
Posts: 8,842
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11/15/2015 12:44:58 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/14/2015 12:34:52 PM, tajshar2k wrote:
At 11/14/2015 12:33:43 PM, tajshar2k wrote:
At 11/14/2015 12:23:39 AM, sadolite wrote:
So are progressive liberals for or against free speech on college campuses?

No. That's the most idiotic idea I have ever heard, and if you support that, you are a communist or a racist.

f a cist not racist.

Derogatory speech is speech. fascist speech is speech. Both equally offending. You are either for free speech or you are for censorship and a limited few deciding what is or isn't allowed. There is no gray area. Spare me the crying fire in an auditorium argument.
It's not your views that divide us, it's what you think my views should be that divides us.

If you think I will give up my rights and forsake social etiquette to make you "FEEL" better you are sadly mistaken

If liberal democrats would just stop shooting people gun violence would drop by 90%
tajshar2k
Posts: 2,385
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11/15/2015 12:48:21 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/15/2015 12:44:58 AM, sadolite wrote:
At 11/14/2015 12:34:52 PM, tajshar2k wrote:
At 11/14/2015 12:33:43 PM, tajshar2k wrote:
At 11/14/2015 12:23:39 AM, sadolite wrote:
So are progressive liberals for or against free speech on college campuses?

No. That's the most idiotic idea I have ever heard, and if you support that, you are a communist or a racist.

f a cist not racist.

Derogatory speech is speech. fascist speech is speech. Both equally offending. You are either for free speech or you are for censorship and a limited few deciding what is or isn't allowed. There is no gray area. Spare me the crying fire in an auditorium argument.

I never said it wasn't.
"In Guns We Trust" Tajshar2k
withywindle
Posts: 33
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11/19/2015 6:08:06 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/14/2015 12:23:39 AM, sadolite wrote:
So are progressive liberals for or against free speech on college campuses?

Can you cite a specific occurrence that illustrates your question?
sadolite
Posts: 8,842
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11/19/2015 10:17:08 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/19/2015 6:08:06 AM, withywindle wrote:
At 11/14/2015 12:23:39 AM, sadolite wrote:
So are progressive liberals for or against free speech on college campuses?

Can you cite a specific occurrence that illustrates your question?

Ya when conservative speakers are booed of stages before they even have a chance to speak and uninvited from giving commencement speeches for no other reason than their political affiliation. Do I have to give sources? If so, I would have to ask, are you really that out of touch with the world and what's going on college campuses? This is common knowledge among all people except those who live in complete denial.
It's not your views that divide us, it's what you think my views should be that divides us.

If you think I will give up my rights and forsake social etiquette to make you "FEEL" better you are sadly mistaken

If liberal democrats would just stop shooting people gun violence would drop by 90%
withywindle
Posts: 33
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11/20/2015 1:41:58 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/19/2015 10:17:08 PM, sadolite wrote:
At 11/19/2015 6:08:06 AM, withywindle wrote:
At 11/14/2015 12:23:39 AM, sadolite wrote:
So are progressive liberals for or against free speech on college campuses?

Can you cite a specific occurrence that illustrates your question?

Ya when conservative speakers are booed of stages before they even have a chance to speak and uninvited from giving commencement speeches for no other reason than their political affiliation.

Thats what i thougth you were referring to, but I wanted you to actually say it so that it was down for the record.

Do I have to give sources? If so, I would have to ask, are you really that out of touch with the world and what's going on college campuses? This is common knowledge among all people except those who live in complete denial.

Frankly, the fact that one simple question requesting clarification on a vague and non-specific post spurred you into insulting my attachment to reality should serve as a wake up call for you. Check your assumptions.
sadolite
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11/20/2015 1:48:13 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/20/2015 1:41:58 AM, withywindle wrote:
At 11/19/2015 10:17:08 PM, sadolite wrote:
At 11/19/2015 6:08:06 AM, withywindle wrote:
At 11/14/2015 12:23:39 AM, sadolite wrote:
So are progressive liberals for or against free speech on college campuses?

Can you cite a specific occurrence that illustrates your question?

Ya when conservative speakers are booed of stages before they even have a chance to speak and uninvited from giving commencement speeches for no other reason than their political affiliation.

Thats what i thougth you were referring to, but I wanted you to actually say it so that it was down for the record.

Do I have to give sources? If so, I would have to ask, are you really that out of touch with the world and what's going on college campuses? This is common knowledge among all people except those who live in complete denial.

Frankly, the fact that one simple question requesting clarification on a vague and non-specific post spurred you into insulting my attachment to reality should serve as a wake up call for you. Check your assumptions.

You set yourself up to appear to be detached from reality. You walked like a duck, quaked like a duck, and swam like a duck. Then suggest I shouldn't assume you are a duck.
It's not your views that divide us, it's what you think my views should be that divides us.

If you think I will give up my rights and forsake social etiquette to make you "FEEL" better you are sadly mistaken

If liberal democrats would just stop shooting people gun violence would drop by 90%