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2012: a self-fulfilling prophecy

darkkermit
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10/6/2010 8:27:40 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
So it has occurred to me that if people truly believe that December 21st, 2012 is indeed the end of the world, then people will commit horrendous crimes. Feeling that the end is imminent, they will have no reason to behave 'good'. Although even those with terminal diseases do not commit atrocious acts, those people are motivated to be good so as to be remembered after their death. However, if everybody will died, nobody will remember their atrocious acts anyways. These horrible acts will create chaos and riots. The police force will not be able to control these riots. Some police officers, believing the prophecy, will even join the chaos and riots. With anarchy ensured, those that do not believe in the prophecy will act anyways, either by joining an 'alliance' to protect oneself from other rapist or killers, or just because he or she can, now that the police force can no longer control the riots.

Then after December 21st, 2012 when all the crime, rape, and murders can we expect society to continue the way it was. No! It might not play out 100% like that, but one can see some sort of chaos ensure during the ending days of the world. Either way, I can't wait to see it happen
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lovelife
Posts: 14,629
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10/6/2010 8:42:45 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
If I remember correctly they also thought 2000 would be the end of the world. I don't think anyone really takes the 2012 stuff that seriously.
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
lovelife
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10/6/2010 8:44:36 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
Actually I heard that that day the aura borealis will be able to be seen worldwide, and all the planets align. Something like that, didn't pay too much attention.
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
devinni01841
Posts: 1,405
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10/6/2010 9:06:05 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
at least it's an amusing theory, rihgt?
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darkkermit
Posts: 11,204
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10/6/2010 9:10:04 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/6/2010 8:42:45 AM, lovelife wrote:
If I remember correctly they also thought 2000 would be the end of the world. I don't think anyone really takes the 2012 stuff that seriously.

I would beg to differ. 2012 has a much bigger momentum movement then 2000. There's a movie on 2012, a documentary on Youtube called "Surviving 2012 and Planet X" with over 2 million views. The history channel has provided some really good shows like "end of days", "Nostradamius", and other shows that provide "convincing" evidence of the end of the world. I used to believe in the 2012 end of world prophecy. I never believed in 2000 (although I was only 10 at the time).
Now, with the war on terrorism, the economic recession, and global warming it is better time then ever to think that the world is bleak and the world will end.
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gerrandesquire
Posts: 1,258
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10/6/2010 9:21:28 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/6/2010 8:27:40 AM, darkkermit wrote:
So it has occurred to me that if people truly believe that December 21st, 2012 is indeed the end of the world, then people will commit horrendous crimes. Feeling that the end is imminent, they will have no reason to behave 'good'. Although even those with terminal diseases do not commit atrocious acts, those people are motivated to be good so as to be remembered after their death. However, if everybody will died, nobody will remember their atrocious acts anyways. These horrible acts will create chaos and riots. The police force will not be able to control these riots. Some police officers, believing the prophecy, will even join the chaos and riots. With anarchy ensured, those that do not believe in the prophecy will act anyways, either by joining an 'alliance' to protect oneself from other rapist or killers, or just because he or she can, now that the police force can no longer control the riots.

Then after December 21st, 2012 when all the crime, rape, and murders can we expect society to continue the way it was. No! It might not play out 100% like that, but one can see some sort of chaos ensure during the ending days of the world. Either way, I can't wait to see it happen

I'm not sure about that. It all depends on perspective. Many will behave Extra good for the promise of heaven.
lovelife
Posts: 14,629
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10/6/2010 9:28:42 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/6/2010 9:21:28 AM, gerrandesquire wrote:
At 10/6/2010 8:27:40 AM, darkkermit wrote:
So it has occurred to me that if people truly believe that December 21st, 2012 is indeed the end of the world, then people will commit horrendous crimes. Feeling that the end is imminent, they will have no reason to behave 'good'. Although even those with terminal diseases do not commit atrocious acts, those people are motivated to be good so as to be remembered after their death. However, if everybody will died, nobody will remember their atrocious acts anyways. These horrible acts will create chaos and riots. The police force will not be able to control these riots. Some police officers, believing the prophecy, will even join the chaos and riots. With anarchy ensured, those that do not believe in the prophecy will act anyways, either by joining an 'alliance' to protect oneself from other rapist or killers, or just because he or she can, now that the police force can no longer control the riots.

Then after December 21st, 2012 when all the crime, rape, and murders can we expect society to continue the way it was. No! It might not play out 100% like that, but one can see some sort of chaos ensure during the ending days of the world. Either way, I can't wait to see it happen

I'm not sure about that. It all depends on perspective. Many will behave Extra good for the promise of heaven.

Plus thats kinda like atheists don't act good because there is no reason to, the only way to live on is to be remembered, the easiest way to be remembered is well lets just look at some dead famous people
Hitler
Napoleon
Dracula
Elizabeth Báthory

Just to name a few.
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
lovelife
Posts: 14,629
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10/6/2010 9:30:20 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/6/2010 9:10:04 AM, darkkermit wrote:
At 10/6/2010 8:42:45 AM, lovelife wrote:
If I remember correctly they also thought 2000 would be the end of the world. I don't think anyone really takes the 2012 stuff that seriously.

I would beg to differ. 2012 has a much bigger momentum movement then 2000. There's a movie on 2012, a documentary on Youtube called "Surviving 2012 and Planet X" with over 2 million views. The history channel has provided some really good shows like "end of days", "Nostradamius", and other shows that provide "convincing" evidence of the end of the world. I used to believe in the 2012 end of world prophecy. I never believed in 2000 (although I was only 10 at the time).
Now, with the war on terrorism, the economic recession, and global warming it is better time then ever to think that the world is bleak and the world will end.

I never found any of them that convincing. I think they just make things that sell Prophecies sell, even if they arent even prophecies.
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
gerrandesquire
Posts: 1,258
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10/6/2010 9:43:58 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/6/2010 9:30:20 AM, lovelife wrote:
At 10/6/2010 9:10:04 AM, darkkermit wrote:
At 10/6/2010 8:42:45 AM, lovelife wrote:
If I remember correctly they also thought 2000 would be the end of the world. I don't think anyone really takes the 2012 stuff that seriously.

I would beg to differ. 2012 has a much bigger momentum movement then 2000. There's a movie on 2012, a documentary on Youtube called "Surviving 2012 and Planet X" with over 2 million views. The history channel has provided some really good shows like "end of days", "Nostradamius", and other shows that provide "convincing" evidence of the end of the world. I used to believe in the 2012 end of world prophecy. I never believed in 2000 (although I was only 10 at the time).
Now, with the war on terrorism, the economic recession, and global warming it is better time then ever to think that the world is bleak and the world will end.

I never found any of them that convincing. I think they just make things that sell Prophecies sell, even if they arent even prophecies.

I don't even know what all these predictions are, i have refrained from reading all the theories because at the end of the day, it all comes down to living each day to the max. What does it matter? We all are going to die some day.
lovelife
Posts: 14,629
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10/6/2010 9:51:24 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/6/2010 9:43:58 AM, gerrandesquire wrote:
At 10/6/2010 9:30:20 AM, lovelife wrote:
At 10/6/2010 9:10:04 AM, darkkermit wrote:
At 10/6/2010 8:42:45 AM, lovelife wrote:
If I remember correctly they also thought 2000 would be the end of the world. I don't think anyone really takes the 2012 stuff that seriously.

I would beg to differ. 2012 has a much bigger momentum movement then 2000. There's a movie on 2012, a documentary on Youtube called "Surviving 2012 and Planet X" with over 2 million views. The history channel has provided some really good shows like "end of days", "Nostradamius", and other shows that provide "convincing" evidence of the end of the world. I used to believe in the 2012 end of world prophecy. I never believed in 2000 (although I was only 10 at the time).
Now, with the war on terrorism, the economic recession, and global warming it is better time then ever to think that the world is bleak and the world will end.

I never found any of them that convincing. I think they just make things that sell Prophecies sell, even if they arent even prophecies.

I don't even know what all these predictions are, i have refrained from reading all the theories because at the end of the day, it all comes down to living each day to the max. What does it matter? We all are going to die some day.

Dream as if you'll live forever, live as if you'll die tomorrow.

Good philosophy.

But I agree it doesn't matter, I'd rather not know when I'm going to die, just take life as it is.
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
Kinesis
Posts: 3,667
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10/6/2010 10:02:11 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/6/2010 9:28:42 AM, lovelife wrote:
At 10/6/2010 9:21:28 AM, gerrandesquire wrote:
At 10/6/2010 8:27:40 AM, darkkermit wrote:
So it has occurred to me that if people truly believe that December 21st, 2012 is indeed the end of the world, then people will commit horrendous crimes. Feeling that the end is imminent, they will have no reason to behave 'good'. Although even those with terminal diseases do not commit atrocious acts, those people are motivated to be good so as to be remembered after their death. However, if everybody will died, nobody will remember their atrocious acts anyways. These horrible acts will create chaos and riots. The police force will not be able to control these riots. Some police officers, believing the prophecy, will even join the chaos and riots. With anarchy ensured, those that do not believe in the prophecy will act anyways, either by joining an 'alliance' to protect oneself from other rapist or killers, or just because he or she can, now that the police force can no longer control the riots.

Then after December 21st, 2012 when all the crime, rape, and murders can we expect society to continue the way it was. No! It might not play out 100% like that, but one can see some sort of chaos ensure during the ending days of the world. Either way, I can't wait to see it happen

I'm not sure about that. It all depends on perspective. Many will behave Extra good for the promise of heaven.

Plus thats kinda like atheists don't act good because there is no reason to, the only way to live on is to be remembered, the easiest way to be remembered is well lets just look at some dead famous people
Hitler
Napoleon
Dracula
Elizabeth Báthory

Just to name a few.

Dracula was an atheist?
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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10/6/2010 10:17:06 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At least get the theory right. The 2012 theory is not that the world will end, but that it will be a new age of awakening. The Mayans predicted the end of a 26,500 year cycle that marks celestial alignments and that 12/21/2012 will be a day of celebration.

All the stuff about the world ending is disinformation from people who misunderstood the Mayans predictions.

I'm sure the majority of 2012 believers at least know the actual theory and therefore won't act as if the world is ending.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
lovelife
Posts: 14,629
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10/6/2010 10:19:26 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/6/2010 10:02:11 AM, Kinesis wrote:
At 10/6/2010 9:28:42 AM, lovelife wrote:
At 10/6/2010 9:21:28 AM, gerrandesquire wrote:
At 10/6/2010 8:27:40 AM, darkkermit wrote:
So it has occurred to me that if people truly believe that December 21st, 2012 is indeed the end of the world, then people will commit horrendous crimes. Feeling that the end is imminent, they will have no reason to behave 'good'. Although even those with terminal diseases do not commit atrocious acts, those people are motivated to be good so as to be remembered after their death. However, if everybody will died, nobody will remember their atrocious acts anyways. These horrible acts will create chaos and riots. The police force will not be able to control these riots. Some police officers, believing the prophecy, will even join the chaos and riots. With anarchy ensured, those that do not believe in the prophecy will act anyways, either by joining an 'alliance' to protect oneself from other rapist or killers, or just because he or she can, now that the police force can no longer control the riots.

Then after December 21st, 2012 when all the crime, rape, and murders can we expect society to continue the way it was. No! It might not play out 100% like that, but one can see some sort of chaos ensure during the ending days of the world. Either way, I can't wait to see it happen

I'm not sure about that. It all depends on perspective. Many will behave Extra good for the promise of heaven.

Plus thats kinda like atheists don't act good because there is no reason to, the only way to live on is to be remembered, the easiest way to be remembered is well lets just look at some dead famous people
Hitler
Napoleon
Dracula
Elizabeth Báthory

Just to name a few.

Dracula was an atheist?

No, but I wasn't trying to just find atheists, just people that everyone knows about.
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
Kinesis
Posts: 3,667
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10/6/2010 10:23:50 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/6/2010 10:17:06 AM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At least get the theory right. The 2012 theory is not that the world will end, but that it will be a new age of awakening. The Mayans predicted the end of a 26,500 year cycle that marks celestial alignments and that 12/21/2012 will be a day of celebration.

All the stuff about the world ending is disinformation from people who misunderstood the Mayans predictions.

I'm sure the majority of 2012 believers at least know the actual theory and therefore won't act as if the world is ending.

Who gives a F*cvk what the Mayan prediction actually were? It's bull either way.
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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10/6/2010 10:27:59 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/6/2010 10:23:50 AM, Kinesis wrote:
At 10/6/2010 10:17:06 AM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At least get the theory right. The 2012 theory is not that the world will end, but that it will be a new age of awakening. The Mayans predicted the end of a 26,500 year cycle that marks celestial alignments and that 12/21/2012 will be a day of celebration.

All the stuff about the world ending is disinformation from people who misunderstood the Mayans predictions.

I'm sure the majority of 2012 believers at least know the actual theory and therefore won't act as if the world is ending.

Who gives a F*cvk what the Mayan prediction actually were? It's bull either way.

Sorry, wrong word. It's calculations, not predictions.

The Mayans were advanced astronomers and calculated precicely many celestial cycles and alignments. How is that bull?
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
Kinesis
Posts: 3,667
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10/6/2010 11:02:18 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/6/2010 10:27:59 AM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At 10/6/2010 10:23:50 AM, Kinesis wrote:
At 10/6/2010 10:17:06 AM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At least get the theory right. The 2012 theory is not that the world will end, but that it will be a new age of awakening. The Mayans predicted the end of a 26,500 year cycle that marks celestial alignments and that 12/21/2012 will be a day of celebration.

All the stuff about the world ending is disinformation from people who misunderstood the Mayans predictions.

I'm sure the majority of 2012 believers at least know the actual theory and therefore won't act as if the world is ending.

Who gives a F*cvk what the Mayan prediction actually were? It's bull either way.

Sorry, wrong word. It's calculations, not predictions.

The Mayans were advanced astronomers and calculated precicely many celestial cycles and alignments. How is that bull?

It isn't. All of that is completely true. I'm not talking about how smart a civilisation they were. I'm saying that to think they have correctly predicted any significant worldwide event with pinpoint accuracy is absurd. It obviously won't happen.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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10/6/2010 11:20:02 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/6/2010 11:02:18 AM, Kinesis wrote:
At 10/6/2010 10:27:59 AM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At 10/6/2010 10:23:50 AM, Kinesis wrote:
At 10/6/2010 10:17:06 AM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At least get the theory right. The 2012 theory is not that the world will end, but that it will be a new age of awakening. The Mayans predicted the end of a 26,500 year cycle that marks celestial alignments and that 12/21/2012 will be a day of celebration.

All the stuff about the world ending is disinformation from people who misunderstood the Mayans predictions.

I'm sure the majority of 2012 believers at least know the actual theory and therefore won't act as if the world is ending.

Who gives a F*cvk what the Mayan prediction actually were? It's bull either way.

Sorry, wrong word. It's calculations, not predictions.

The Mayans were advanced astronomers and calculated precicely many celestial cycles and alignments. How is that bull?

It isn't. All of that is completely true. I'm not talking about how smart a civilisation they were. I'm saying that to think they have correctly predicted any significant worldwide event with pinpoint accuracy is absurd. It obviously won't happen.
That is correct.
feverish
Posts: 2,716
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10/6/2010 11:56:20 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/6/2010 9:28:42 AM, lovelife wrote:
the only way to live on is to be remembered, the easiest way to be remembered is well lets just look at some dead famous people
Hitler
Napoleon
Dracula
Elizabeth Báthory

Pretty sure Dracula is a fictional character. Could you be thinking of Vlad the Impaler?

No idea who Elizabeth Bathory was.
Caramel
Posts: 855
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10/6/2010 12:20:21 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
Kermit, you definitely have a point... I am more concerned about something slightly different though. I am more concerned with the more... religious aspects of all this. If someone wants to do something incredibly vile and is looking for the "right" time, all this nonsense is going to be perfect for them. Perhaps some religious miracles are going to just "happen" to take place and be "what everyone was waiting for." So I guess what I am saying is that while you are looking at the more incidental results of believing in this hogwash, I am concerned more about the direct, literal self-fulfilling prophecies that may arise. If anything will be the death of us all, it will be religion.
no comment
PARADIGM_L0ST
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10/8/2010 3:53:15 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/6/2010 8:27:40 AM, darkkermit wrote:
So it has occurred to me that if people truly believe that December 21st, 2012 is indeed the end of the world, then people will commit horrendous crimes. Feeling that the end is imminent, they will have no reason to behave 'good'.:

There's not enough people who actually believe it to be concerned enough with it. This is just yet one more "The sky is falling! The sky is falling!" predictions that never amounted to anything.

Failure after failure.

http://www.religioustolerance.org...

The largest scare (I didn't buy it) was the whole Y2K thing. I remember quite a few people were on edge about it, but it wasn't mass hysteria by any means.

While you're definitely on the right track about how a self-fulfilling prophecy works, I don't think there are enough people concerned with 2012 to care.
"Have you ever considered suicide? If not, please do." -- Mouthwash (to Inferno)
PARADIGM_L0ST
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10/8/2010 3:57:42 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/6/2010 8:42:45 AM, lovelife wrote:
If I remember correctly they also thought 2000 would be the end of the world.:

Among MANY others, yes. Y2K was its official moniker.

I don't think anyone really takes the 2012 stuff that seriously.:

There are specific kinds of people who are prone to these kinds of vagaries. They're the kind of people who avidly listen to "Coast to Coast" on the AM radio stations, who subscribe to PrisonPlanet, and who owns the entire X-Files box set. They like to believe in things like this. It brings them a kind of macabre joy.
"Have you ever considered suicide? If not, please do." -- Mouthwash (to Inferno)
PARADIGM_L0ST
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10/8/2010 4:18:40 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/6/2010 10:17:06 AM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At least get the theory right. The 2012 theory is not that the world will end, but that it will be a new age of awakening. The Mayans predicted the end of a 26,500 year cycle that marks celestial alignments and that 12/21/2012 will be a day of celebration.:

The Mayans made no prediction about 2012, whatsoever. That's an invention of people who enjoy all things cryptic and esoteric. All that really happened, given the evidence presented, is that the calender simply stopped. Nowhere did Mayans make any declaration that 12/21/2012 was a day of celebration or the end of the world. They were simply silent on the issue. This is just the interpretation of people who enjoy believing fanciful things.

"Most of the Mayan calendars were short. The Tzolk'in calendar lasted for 260 days and the Haab' approximated the solar year of 365 days. The Mayans then combined both the Tzolk'in and the Haab' to form the "Calendar Round", a cycle lasting 52 Haab's (around 52 years, or the approximate length of a generation). Within the Calendar Round were the trecena (13 day cycle) and the veintena (20 day cycle). Obviously, this system would only be of use when considering the 18,980 unique days over the course of 52 years. In addition to these systems, the Mayans also had the "Venus Cycle". Being keen and highly accurate astronomers they formed a calendar based on the location of Venus in the night sky. It's also possible they did the same with the other planets in the Solar System.

Using the Calendar Round is great if you simply wanted to remember the date of your birthday or significant religious periods, but what about recording history? There was no way to record a date older than 52 years.

The end of the Long Count = the end of the Earth?
The Mayans had a solution. Using an innovative method, they were able to expand on the 52 year Calendar Round. Up to this point, the Mayan Calendar may have sounded a little archaic – after all, it was possibly based on religious belief, the menstrual cycle, mathematical calculations using the numbers 13 and 20 as the base units and a heavy mix of astrological myth. The only principal correlation with the modern calendar is the Haab' that recognised there were 365 days in one solar year (it's not clear whether the Mayans accounted for leap years). The answer to a longer calendar could be found in the "Long Count", a calendar lasting 5126 years.

I'm personally very impressed with this dating system. For starters, it is numerically predictable and it can accurately pinpoint historical dates. However, it depends on a base unit of 20 (where modern calendars use a base unit of 10). So how does this work?

The base year for the Mayan Long Count starts at "0.0.0.0.0″. Each zero goes from 0-19 and each represent a tally of Mayan days. So, for example, the first day in the Long Count is denoted as 0.0.0.0.1. On the 19th day we'll have 0.0.0.0.19, on the 20th day it goes up one level and we'll have 0.0.0.1.0. This count continues until 0.0.1.0.0 (about one year), 0.1.0.0.0 (about 20 years) and 1.0.0.0.0 (about 400 years). Therefore, if I pick an arbitrary date of 2.10.12.7.1, this represents the Mayan date of approximately 1012 years, 7 months and 1 day.

This is all very interesting, but what has this got to do with the end of the world? The Mayan Prophecy is wholly based on the assumption that something bad is going to happen when the Mayan Long Count calendar runs out. Experts are divided as to when the Long Count ends, but as the Maya used the numbers of 13 and 20 at the root of their numerical systems, the last day could occur on 13.0.0.0.0. When does this happen? Well, 13.0.0.0.0 represents 5126 years and the Long Count started on 0.0.0.0.0, which corresponds to the modern date of August 11th 3114 BC. Have you seen the problem yet? The Mayan Long Count ends 5126 years later on December 21st, 2012."

Source: http://www.universetoday.com...

The Mayans eventually dissolved as a society before they could make more calendars. That doesn't equal the end of the world.
"Have you ever considered suicide? If not, please do." -- Mouthwash (to Inferno)