Total Posts:47|Showing Posts:1-30|Last Page
Jump to topic:

Government fails to protect Women.

Rosalie
Posts: 4,605
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 4:34:58 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
http://time.com......
" We need more videos of cat's playing the piano on the internet" - My art professor.

"Criticism is easier to take when you realize that the only people who aren't criticized are those who don't take risks." - Donald Trump
FaustianJustice
Posts: 6,205
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 4:50:11 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 4:34:58 PM, Rosalie wrote:
http://time.com......

Women don't need special consideration.

Equality.
Here we have an advocate for Islamic arranged marriages demonstrating that children can consent to sex.
http://www.debate.org...
Rosalie
Posts: 4,605
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 5:25:41 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 4:50:11 PM, FaustianJustice wrote:
At 2/24/2016 4:34:58 PM, Rosalie wrote:
http://time.com......

Women don't need special consideration.

Equality.

Special consideration?

So, you're saying the Government shouldn't protect a Women if there is a possibility of her getting killed?
" We need more videos of cat's playing the piano on the internet" - My art professor.

"Criticism is easier to take when you realize that the only people who aren't criticized are those who don't take risks." - Donald Trump
Rosalie
Posts: 4,605
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 6:07:53 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
Oops, my bad. Here is the correct link :

http://time.com...
" We need more videos of cat's playing the piano on the internet" - My art professor.

"Criticism is easier to take when you realize that the only people who aren't criticized are those who don't take risks." - Donald Trump
Rosalie
Posts: 4,605
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 6:08:04 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 6:05:08 PM, Torton wrote:
At 2/24/2016 4:34:58 PM, Rosalie wrote:
http://time.com......
This just leads to Time's homepage.

http://time.com...
" We need more videos of cat's playing the piano on the internet" - My art professor.

"Criticism is easier to take when you realize that the only people who aren't criticized are those who don't take risks." - Donald Trump
TheFlex
Posts: 1,745
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 6:15:00 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
There's too much fog in this story for me sympathize with one party over the other. It's all just unsubstantiated allegations.

"I don't want to work with him because he raped me."
"I didn't rape her."

I'm not trying to discredit if she actually was but I can't just take one side over another's side off of words alone. I can go into what I think if she was, or if she wasn't -- but there's nothing concrete here to stick it to either party.
FaustianJustice
Posts: 6,205
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 6:19:05 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 5:25:41 PM, Rosalie wrote:
At 2/24/2016 4:50:11 PM, FaustianJustice wrote:
At 2/24/2016 4:34:58 PM, Rosalie wrote:
http://time.com......

Women don't need special consideration.

Equality.

Special consideration?

So, you're saying the Government shouldn't protect a Women if there is a possibility of her getting killed?

The government "fails to protect" a lot of people every day, and in the instance of "getting killed", the government should protect everyone. However what constitutes a 'failure of government' to do so remains nebulous. What gender is assaulted the most and killed the most in the US?
Here we have an advocate for Islamic arranged marriages demonstrating that children can consent to sex.
http://www.debate.org...
FaustianJustice
Posts: 6,205
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 6:21:10 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 6:08:04 PM, Rosalie wrote:
At 2/24/2016 6:05:08 PM, Torton wrote:
At 2/24/2016 4:34:58 PM, Rosalie wrote:
http://time.com......
This just leads to Time's homepage.

http://time.com...

.... why didn't she say something when it started occurring? Supposedly this is something that has been occurring for a decade, why is this the first time we have heard of it?
Here we have an advocate for Islamic arranged marriages demonstrating that children can consent to sex.
http://www.debate.org...
Rosalie
Posts: 4,605
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 6:23:25 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 6:19:05 PM, FaustianJustice wrote:
At 2/24/2016 5:25:41 PM, Rosalie wrote:
At 2/24/2016 4:50:11 PM, FaustianJustice wrote:
At 2/24/2016 4:34:58 PM, Rosalie wrote:
http://time.com......

Women don't need special consideration.

Equality.

Special consideration?

So, you're saying the Government shouldn't protect a Women if there is a possibility of her getting killed?

The government "fails to protect" a lot of people every day, and in the instance of "getting killed", the government should protect everyone. However what constitutes a 'failure of government' to do so remains nebulous. What gender is assaulted the most and killed the most in the US?

Because the victim made the court *aware* of the situation. So, let's say she *does* get hurt, or killed by this man, who is at fault? Of course the government because they *knew* there was a chance of her being hurt by this man, but they ignored it.

"The government "fails to protect" a lot of people every day"


Not true. There is a difference between someone being shot in the hood randomly, and a case where a Women was raped, went to the court, and now is in possible danger of being killed because she snitched him out.

The government doesn't have control over who gets shot on a daily basis. They don't know when, or where it's going to happen, and who would get shot.

This is a different case. In this case, they *know* that this Women is in danger, yet they don't care, and chose nothing to do about it.
" We need more videos of cat's playing the piano on the internet" - My art professor.

"Criticism is easier to take when you realize that the only people who aren't criticized are those who don't take risks." - Donald Trump
Rosalie
Posts: 4,605
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 6:27:53 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 6:21:10 PM, FaustianJustice wrote:
At 2/24/2016 6:08:04 PM, Rosalie wrote:
At 2/24/2016 6:05:08 PM, Torton wrote:
At 2/24/2016 4:34:58 PM, Rosalie wrote:
http://time.com......
This just leads to Time's homepage.

http://time.com...

.... why didn't she say something when it started occurring? Supposedly this is something that has been occurring for a decade, why is this the first time we have heard of it?

I can really relate to this topic, so, I'm going to answer from my experience.

When I was around 11, I was physically abused by my mom's boyfriend. I didn't tell anyone for a few reasons..

1. I was ashamed of what had happened, and I didn't want anyone to think that a man had physically abused me.

2. My mom was in a relationship with this man, and I didn't want to make her un-happy.

3. It got so bad to the point I did tell her, and she didn't believe me.

When someone has been abused, molested, or raped, the victim feels ashamed and worthless. Maybe if you ever had any of this done to you, you would understand.
" We need more videos of cat's playing the piano on the internet" - My art professor.

"Criticism is easier to take when you realize that the only people who aren't criticized are those who don't take risks." - Donald Trump
FaustianJustice
Posts: 6,205
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 6:30:14 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 6:23:25 PM, Rosalie wrote:
At 2/24/2016 6:19:05 PM, FaustianJustice wrote:
At 2/24/2016 5:25:41 PM, Rosalie wrote:
At 2/24/2016 4:50:11 PM, FaustianJustice wrote:
At 2/24/2016 4:34:58 PM, Rosalie wrote:
http://time.com......

Women don't need special consideration.

Equality.

Special consideration?

So, you're saying the Government shouldn't protect a Women if there is a possibility of her getting killed?

The government "fails to protect" a lot of people every day, and in the instance of "getting killed", the government should protect everyone. However what constitutes a 'failure of government' to do so remains nebulous. What gender is assaulted the most and killed the most in the US?

Because the victim made the court *aware* of the situation. So, let's say she *does* get hurt, or killed by this man, who is at fault?

After a decade? The court just got made aware of this now, and proper authorities were left in the dark. Just for mine own curiosity, what has lent you to the immediate assumpt of guilt? What evidence are you privy to?

Of course the government because they *knew* there was a chance of her being hurt by this man, but they ignored it.

She was not released from her contract. Absolutely nothing prevents Kesha from getting whatever protection she feels would be necessary, nor does anything about the current revelations mandate her to be alone in a dark room with the guy.

"The government "fails to protect" a lot of people every day"


Not true. There is a difference between someone being shot in the hood randomly, and a case where a Women was raped, went to the court, and now is in possible danger of being killed because she snitched him out.

Why does that consideration not apply to the person shot, and snitching some one out?


The government doesn't have control over who gets shot on a daily basis. They don't know when, or where it's going to happen, and who would get shot. This is a different case. In this case, they *know* that this Women is in danger, yet they don't care, and chose nothing to do about it.

No, the DON'T know some one is in danger, you are assuming guilt! Like I previously asked, what evidence are you aware of that contributes to her case?
Here we have an advocate for Islamic arranged marriages demonstrating that children can consent to sex.
http://www.debate.org...
FaustianJustice
Posts: 6,205
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 6:32:38 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 6:27:53 PM, Rosalie wrote:
At 2/24/2016 6:21:10 PM, FaustianJustice wrote:
At 2/24/2016 6:08:04 PM, Rosalie wrote:
At 2/24/2016 6:05:08 PM, Torton wrote:
At 2/24/2016 4:34:58 PM, Rosalie wrote:
http://time.com......
This just leads to Time's homepage.

http://time.com...

.... why didn't she say something when it started occurring? Supposedly this is something that has been occurring for a decade, why is this the first time we have heard of it?

I can really relate to this topic, so, I'm going to answer from my experience.

When I was around 11, I was physically abused by my mom's boyfriend. I didn't tell anyone for a few reasons..

1. I was ashamed of what had happened, and I didn't want anyone to think that a man had physically abused me.

2. My mom was in a relationship with this man, and I didn't want to make her un-happy.

3. It got so bad to the point I did tell her, and she didn't believe me.

When someone has been abused, molested, or raped, the victim feels ashamed and worthless. Maybe if you ever had any of this done to you, you would understand.

Do you feel Kesha has the mentality and impressionability of an 11 year old?
Here we have an advocate for Islamic arranged marriages demonstrating that children can consent to sex.
http://www.debate.org...
Rosalie
Posts: 4,605
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 6:33:47 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 6:32:38 PM, FaustianJustice wrote:
At 2/24/2016 6:27:53 PM, Rosalie wrote:
At 2/24/2016 6:21:10 PM, FaustianJustice wrote:
At 2/24/2016 6:08:04 PM, Rosalie wrote:
At 2/24/2016 6:05:08 PM, Torton wrote:
At 2/24/2016 4:34:58 PM, Rosalie wrote:
http://time.com......
This just leads to Time's homepage.

http://time.com...

.... why didn't she say something when it started occurring? Supposedly this is something that has been occurring for a decade, why is this the first time we have heard of it?

I can really relate to this topic, so, I'm going to answer from my experience.

When I was around 11, I was physically abused by my mom's boyfriend. I didn't tell anyone for a few reasons..

1. I was ashamed of what had happened, and I didn't want anyone to think that a man had physically abused me.

2. My mom was in a relationship with this man, and I didn't want to make her un-happy.

3. It got so bad to the point I did tell her, and she didn't believe me.

When someone has been abused, molested, or raped, the victim feels ashamed and worthless. Maybe if you ever had any of this done to you, you would understand.

Do you feel Kesha has the mentality and impressionability of an 11 year old?

I believe *ANY* Women, at*ANY* age, would feel ashamed to be taken advantage of because she is merely a Women.

You are a disgusting individual.
" We need more videos of cat's playing the piano on the internet" - My art professor.

"Criticism is easier to take when you realize that the only people who aren't criticized are those who don't take risks." - Donald Trump
Torton
Posts: 988
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 6:35:44 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 6:08:04 PM, Rosalie wrote:
At 2/24/2016 6:05:08 PM, Torton wrote:
At 2/24/2016 4:34:58 PM, Rosalie wrote:
http://time.com......
This just leads to Time's homepage.

http://time.com...
So I read the article that discusses the actual case, and Sony, Kemosabe Records, and even the guy himself have all issued statements that that she could record completely without his involvement. The justification for her staying in the legally binding contract and without his involvement is that the record companies want to make money... which is basically true. [http://time.com...]

Additionally, she stated a few years back, and under oath, that "Dr. Luke did not sexually assault or drug me." [https://www.tmz.com...]

Also, everyone deserves a fair trial: innocent until proven guilty, and all that.
FaustianJustice
Posts: 6,205
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 6:36:12 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
http://time.com......
This just leads to Time's homepage.

http://time.com...

.... why didn't she say something when it started occurring? Supposedly this is something that has been occurring for a decade, why is this the first time we have heard of it?

I can really relate to this topic, so, I'm going to answer from my experience.

When I was around 11, I was physically abused by my mom's boyfriend. I didn't tell anyone for a few reasons..

1. I was ashamed of what had happened, and I didn't want anyone to think that a man had physically abused me.

2. My mom was in a relationship with this man, and I didn't want to make her un-happy.

3. It got so bad to the point I did tell her, and she didn't believe me.

When someone has been abused, molested, or raped, the victim feels ashamed and worthless. Maybe if you ever had any of this done to you, you would understand.

Do you feel Kesha has the mentality and impressionability of an 11 year old?

I believe *ANY* Women, at*ANY* age, would feel ashamed to be taken advantage of because she is merely a Women.

You are a disgusting individual.

No, I am stating the immediate difference between your example and what you are relating it too, of which youth is a huge contributing factor.

Is that a reasonable statement to make?
Here we have an advocate for Islamic arranged marriages demonstrating that children can consent to sex.
http://www.debate.org...
TheFlex
Posts: 1,745
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 6:36:54 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 6:23:25 PM, Rosalie wrote:
At 2/24/2016 6:19:05 PM, FaustianJustice wrote:
At 2/24/2016 5:25:41 PM, Rosalie wrote:
At 2/24/2016 4:50:11 PM, FaustianJustice wrote:
At 2/24/2016 4:34:58 PM, Rosalie wrote:
http://time.com......

Women don't need special consideration.

Equality.

Special consideration?

So, you're saying the Government shouldn't protect a Women if there is a possibility of her getting killed?

The government "fails to protect" a lot of people every day, and in the instance of "getting killed", the government should protect everyone. However what constitutes a 'failure of government' to do so remains nebulous. What gender is assaulted the most and killed the most in the US?

Because the victim made the court *aware* of the situation. So, let's say she *does* get hurt, or killed by this man, who is at fault? Of course the government because they *knew* there was a chance of her being hurt by this man, but they ignored it.

"The government "fails to protect" a lot of people every day"


Not true. There is a difference between someone being shot in the hood randomly, and a case where a Women was raped, went to the court, and now is in possible danger of being killed because she snitched him out.

We can't completely disregard Luke. If anything, the pressure is on him now. Her allegations put his every move under a microscope to be scrutinized at the public's convenience. The way Kesha has set this up is a lose-lose situation for him. He's damned if he continues to work with her and he's losing business when he doesn't.


The government doesn't have control over who gets shot on a daily basis. They don't know when, or where it's going to happen, and who would get shot.

This is a different case. In this case, they *know* that this Women is in danger, yet they don't care, and chose nothing to do about it.

Unless Luke has a past of doing this stuff (which I don't know because I've only read the time articles) or a past of a bad tempers/aggressions there is no actual danger. If he does have a past though, that's a different discussion.
beng100
Posts: 1,055
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 7:31:18 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 4:34:58 PM, Rosalie wrote:
http://time.com......

This appears to me to be a case where a man has used financial control to keep a woman quiet about sexual abuse he is subjecting her too. Yes it's possible she could have made up the allegations to get out of the contract but that seems highly unlikely to me. I can't see why she would want to make up such a severe allegation that would obviously create a huge media stir.

I can understand how the court came to its decision as by allowing kesha to break the contract could lead to women making up allegations of sexual abuse to get out of contracts. In my view though this has to be wrong. I think the law should change to allow people to extricate themselves from business contracts with people they accuse of sexually abusing them. Yes some people will lie but hopefully courts would identify these cases, eg-the woman has signed a very unfavorable contract, has a personal agenda/feud with the man in question, the allegations are clearly made up or the woman has shown a history of making up false allegations against men.

The problem is cases of rape and sexual assault are so hard to prove as it is one person's word against the other. I'm not really sure how to make these situations fairer but I think it has to be considered a woman would rarely make up allegations of rape unless it actually happened. I think too many rapists currently escape persecution. In some cases due to a woman feeling that a court either won't believe their claims, being too scared to actually take the case to court or a jury wrongly acquiting a rapist. It's clear some improvements are needed in this area although I'm not sure how.
beng100
Posts: 1,055
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 7:42:24 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 6:32:38 PM, FaustianJustice wrote:
At 2/24/2016 6:27:53 PM, Rosalie wrote:
At 2/24/2016 6:21:10 PM, FaustianJustice wrote:
At 2/24/2016 6:08:04 PM, Rosalie wrote:
At 2/24/2016 6:05:08 PM, Torton wrote:
At 2/24/2016 4:34:58 PM, Rosalie wrote:
http://time.com......
This just leads to Time's homepage.

http://time.com...

.... why didn't she say something when it started occurring? Supposedly this is something that has been occurring for a decade, why is this the first time we have heard of it?

I can really relate to this topic, so, I'm going to answer from my experience.

When I was around 11, I was physically abused by my mom's boyfriend. I didn't tell anyone for a few reasons..

1. I was ashamed of what had happened, and I didn't want anyone to think that a man had physically abused me.

2. My mom was in a relationship with this man, and I didn't want to make her un-happy.

3. It got so bad to the point I did tell her, and she didn't believe me.

When someone has been abused, molested, or raped, the victim feels ashamed and worthless. Maybe if you ever had any of this done to you, you would understand.

Do you feel Kesha has the mentality and impressionability of an 11 year old?

I think this comment, maybe unintentionally can be interpreted to suggest your attitude towards sexual abuse sufferers is rather sexist and insensitive.

Clearly anybody male or female can be controlled by another person physically, emotionally or financially. Many examples exist of people being kept in slavery, financially abused or subject to long term sexual abuse. It is wrong to suggest this does not happen, often to vulnerable people yes but you have to understand how some people have methods of yielding control over others. People are embarrassed what's happening to them, scared no one will believe them, fear the criminal will punish them for reporting the abuse or in some cases the victim themself actually mistakenly thinks the abuse they receive is their own fault.
FaustianJustice
Posts: 6,205
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 7:47:34 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 7:31:18 PM, beng100 wrote:
At 2/24/2016 4:34:58 PM, Rosalie wrote:
http://time.com......

This appears to me to be a case where a man has used financial control to keep a woman quiet about sexual abuse he is subjecting her too.

What lends you to that conclusion?

Yes it's possible she could have made up the allegations to get out of the contract but that seems highly unlikely to me. I can't see why she would want to make up such a severe allegation that would obviously create a huge media stir.

Sympathy to extricate herself from the contract.

I can understand how the court came to its decision as by allowing kesha to break the contract could lead to women making up allegations of sexual abuse to get out of contracts. In my view though this has to be wrong. I think the law should change to allow people to extricate themselves from business contracts with people they accuse of sexually abusing them. Yes some people will lie but hopefully courts would identify these cases, eg-the woman has signed a very unfavorable contract, has a personal agenda/feud with the man in question, the allegations are clearly made up or the woman has shown a history of making up false allegations against men.

The problem is cases of rape and sexual assault are so hard to prove as it is one person's word against the other. I'm not really sure how to make these situations fairer but I think it has to be considered a woman would rarely make up allegations of rape unless it actually happened.

What is the penalty should it come to light that she lied in situations like that?

I think too many rapists currently escape persecution. In some cases due to a woman feeling that a court either won't believe their claims, being too scared to actually take the case to court or a jury wrongly acquiting a rapist. It's clear some improvements are needed in this area although I'm not sure how.
Here we have an advocate for Islamic arranged marriages demonstrating that children can consent to sex.
http://www.debate.org...
Fkkize
Posts: 2,147
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 8:10:45 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 6:15:00 PM, TheFlex wrote:
There's too much fog in this story for me sympathize with one party over the other. It's all just unsubstantiated allegations.

"I don't want to work with him because he raped me."
"I didn't rape her."

I'm not trying to discredit if she actually was but I can't just take one side over another's side off of words alone. I can go into what I think if she was, or if she wasn't -- but there's nothing concrete here to stick it to either party.

Indeed.
: At 7/2/2016 3:05:07 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
:
: space contradicts logic
FaustianJustice
Posts: 6,205
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 8:16:39 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
This just leads to Time's homepage.

http://time.com...

.... why didn't she say something when it started occurring? Supposedly this is something that has been occurring for a decade, why is this the first time we have heard of it?

I can really relate to this topic, so, I'm going to answer from my experience.

When I was around 11, I was physically abused by my mom's boyfriend. I didn't tell anyone for a few reasons..

1. I was ashamed of what had happened, and I didn't want anyone to think that a man had physically abused me.

2. My mom was in a relationship with this man, and I didn't want to make her un-happy.

3. It got so bad to the point I did tell her, and she didn't believe me.

When someone has been abused, molested, or raped, the victim feels ashamed and worthless. Maybe if you ever had any of this done to you, you would understand.

Do you feel Kesha has the mentality and impressionability of an 11 year old?

I think this comment, maybe unintentionally can be interpreted to suggest your attitude towards sexual abuse sufferers is rather sexist and insensitive.

Not my intent. The anecdotal story related puts some one of immediately lower social stature (a child) to some one with given authority (parentis in locis). The dynamic is hard to overcome. Kesha, clearly, does not have that problem.

Clearly anybody male or female can be controlled by another person physically, emotionally or financially. Many examples exist of people being kept in slavery, financially abused or subject to long term sexual abuse. It is wrong to suggest this does not happen, often to vulnerable people yes but you have to understand how some people have methods of yielding control over others. People are embarrassed what's happening to them, scared no one will believe them, fear the criminal will punish them for reporting the abuse or in some cases the victim themself actually mistakenly thinks the abuse they receive is their own fault.

I am curious as to when Kesha would ever be without witnesses with the individual in question. Ever.
Here we have an advocate for Islamic arranged marriages demonstrating that children can consent to sex.
http://www.debate.org...
Fkkize
Posts: 2,147
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 8:17:21 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 6:33:47 PM, Rosalie wrote:
Do you feel Kesha has the mentality and impressionability of an 11 year old?

I believe *ANY* Women, at*ANY* age, would feel ashamed to be taken advantage of because she is merely a Women.

What makes you think this? Is there anything you know the article didn't mention suggesting this to be the reason?
I'd be pleased to hear it.

You are a disgusting individual.

Before you start insulting other, do you not think a grown person coming from a poor family, calling herself "Ke$ha" would react different from an innocent 11 year old?
: At 7/2/2016 3:05:07 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
:
: space contradicts logic
Rosalie
Posts: 4,605
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 8:19:03 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 8:17:21 PM, Fkkize wrote:
At 2/24/2016 6:33:47 PM, Rosalie wrote:
Do you feel Kesha has the mentality and impressionability of an 11 year old?

I believe *ANY* Women, at*ANY* age, would feel ashamed to be taken advantage of because she is merely a Women.

Because let's face it: men don't want to be with a women who was raped, or molested. I've heard it from guy friends as well.

What makes you think this? Is there anything you know the article didn't mention suggesting this to be the reason?
I'd be pleased to hear it.

You are a disgusting individual.

Before you start insulting other, do you not think a grown person coming from a poor family, calling herself "Ke$ha" would react different from an innocent 11 year old?

nope.
" We need more videos of cat's playing the piano on the internet" - My art professor.

"Criticism is easier to take when you realize that the only people who aren't criticized are those who don't take risks." - Donald Trump
beng100
Posts: 1,055
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 8:19:07 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 7:47:34 PM, FaustianJustice wrote:
At 2/24/2016 7:31:18 PM, beng100 wrote:
At 2/24/2016 4:34:58 PM, Rosalie wrote:
http://time.com......

This appears to me to be a case where a man has used financial control to keep a woman quiet about sexual abuse he is subjecting her too.

What lends you to that conclusion?

The article. Making up this sort of allegation would require a very inconsiderate and selfish personality. I acknowledge though it's just an opinion. I'm not claiming it as the truth.

Yes it's possible she could have made up the allegations to get out of the contract but that seems highly unlikely to me. I can't see why she would want to make up such a severe allegation that would obviously create a huge media stir.

Sympathy to extricate herself from the contract.

Understand your point. It's a difficult case with one person's word against the other.

I can understand how the court came to its decision as by allowing kesha to break the contract could lead to women making up allegations of sexual abuse to get out of contracts. In my view though this has to be wrong. I think the law should change to allow people to extricate themselves from business contracts with people they accuse of sexually abusing them. Yes some people will lie but hopefully courts would identify these cases, eg-the woman has signed a very unfavorable contract, has a personal agenda/feud with the man in question, the allegations are clearly made up or the woman has shown a history of making up false allegations against men.

The problem is cases of rape and sexual assault are so hard to prove as it is one person's word against the other. I'm not really sure how to make these situations fairer but I think it has to be considered a woman would rarely make up allegations of rape unless it actually happened.

What is the penalty should it come to light that she lied in situations like that?

I have unique views on criminal justice. In this sort of case I would probably issue a large fine, payable to Luke and issue kesha with 4 penalty points on a criminal licence. These points stay on a criminal licence for life. Any person picking up 12 points in a lifetime receives the death penalty. In this case custodial punishment is of no benefit as kesha does not pose a danger to society.


I think too many rapists currently escape persecution. In some cases due to a woman feeling that a court either won't believe their claims, being too scared to actually take the case to court or a jury wrongly acquiting a rapist. It's clear some improvements are needed in this area although I'm not sure how.
Fkkize
Posts: 2,147
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 8:23:27 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 8:19:03 PM, Rosalie wrote:
At 2/24/2016 8:17:21 PM, Fkkize wrote:
At 2/24/2016 6:33:47 PM, Rosalie wrote:
Do you feel Kesha has the mentality and impressionability of an 11 year old?

I believe *ANY* Women, at*ANY* age, would feel ashamed to be taken advantage of because she is merely a Women.

Because let's face it: men don't want to be with a women who was raped, or molested. I've heard it from guy friends as well.

I am not sure how this relates to what I said, but do you think a man who was raped is any more appealing to women?

What makes you think this? Is there anything you know the article didn't mention suggesting this to be the reason?
I'd be pleased to hear it.

You are a disgusting individual.

Before you start insulting other, do you not think a grown person coming from a poor family, calling herself "Ke$ha" would react different from an innocent 11 year old?

nope.

Ok, then.
I mean I have seen people on the internet claiming feminists are portraying women as children and never really wanted to believe it, but apparently I was wrong.
: At 7/2/2016 3:05:07 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
:
: space contradicts logic
beng100
Posts: 1,055
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 8:30:45 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 8:16:39 PM, FaustianJustice wrote:
This just leads to Time's homepage.

http://time.com...

.... why didn't she say something when it started occurring? Supposedly this is something that has been occurring for a decade, why is this the first time we have heard of it?

I can really relate to this topic, so, I'm going to answer from my experience.

When I was around 11, I was physically abused by my mom's boyfriend. I didn't tell anyone for a few reasons..

1. I was ashamed of what had happened, and I didn't want anyone to think that a man had physically abused me.

2. My mom was in a relationship with this man, and I didn't want to make her un-happy.

3. It got so bad to the point I did tell her, and she didn't believe me.

When someone has been abused, molested, or raped, the victim feels ashamed and worthless. Maybe if you ever had any of this done to you, you would understand.

Do you feel Kesha has the mentality and impressionability of an 11 year old?

I think this comment, maybe unintentionally can be interpreted to suggest your attitude towards sexual abuse sufferers is rather sexist and insensitive.

Not my intent. The anecdotal story related puts some one of immediately lower social stature (a child) to some one with given authority (parentis in locis). The dynamic is hard to overcome. Kesha, clearly, does not have that problem.

Understand your point in normal circumstances. The difference is though Luke has an authoritive position as he is in control of much of keshas finances and career. So he potentially could use this position as a control method to silence kesha. So there is a tough dynamic that could have kept her silent. It's also true there is a stigma and embarrassment many people of all ages feel about this sort of abuse. Often if not reported straight away a continuous cycle of abuse starts where it becomes harder and harder for the victim to speak out.

Clearly anybody male or female can be controlled by another person physically, emotionally or financially. Many examples exist of people being kept in slavery, financially abused or subject to long term sexual abuse. It is wrong to suggest this does not happen, often to vulnerable people yes but you have to understand how some people have methods of yielding control over others. People are embarrassed what's happening to them, scared no one will believe them, fear the criminal will punish them for reporting the abuse or in some cases the victim themself actually mistakenly thinks the abuse they receive is their own fault.

I am curious as to when Kesha would ever be without witnesses with the individual in question. Ever.

That is a strong point backing Luke's defence. It seems unlikely that no one would have witnessed the alleged crimes if they occurred. However other people being in on the abuse, or Luke managing the situation to create 1 on 1 time with no one else around cannot be ruled out.
Torton
Posts: 988
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 8:31:10 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 8:19:07 PM, beng100 wrote:
At 2/24/2016 7:47:34 PM, FaustianJustice wrote:
At 2/24/2016 7:31:18 PM, beng100 wrote:
At 2/24/2016 4:34:58 PM, Rosalie wrote:
http://time.com......

This appears to me to be a case where a man has used financial control to keep a woman quiet about sexual abuse he is subjecting her too.

What lends you to that conclusion?

The article. Making up this sort of allegation would require a very inconsiderate and selfish personality. I acknowledge though it's just an opinion. I'm not claiming it as the truth.

Yes it's possible she could have made up the allegations to get out of the contract but that seems highly unlikely to me. I can't see why she would want to make up such a severe allegation that would obviously create a huge media stir.

Sympathy to extricate herself from the contract.

Understand your point. It's a difficult case with one person's word against the other.

I can understand how the court came to its decision as by allowing kesha to break the contract could lead to women making up allegations of sexual abuse to get out of contracts. In my view though this has to be wrong. I think the law should change to allow people to extricate themselves from business contracts with people they accuse of sexually abusing them. Yes some people will lie but hopefully courts would identify these cases, eg-the woman has signed a very unfavorable contract, has a personal agenda/feud with the man in question, the allegations are clearly made up or the woman has shown a history of making up false allegations against men.

The problem is cases of rape and sexual assault are so hard to prove as it is one person's word against the other. I'm not really sure how to make these situations fairer but I think it has to be considered a woman would rarely make up allegations of rape unless it actually happened.

What is the penalty should it come to light that she lied in situations like that?

I have unique views on criminal justice. In this sort of case I would probably issue a large fine, payable to Luke and issue kesha with 4 penalty points on a criminal licence. These points stay on a criminal licence for life. Any person picking up 12 points in a lifetime receives the death penalty. In this case custodial punishment is of no benefit as kesha does not pose a danger to society.
Good god, this is a terrible system.


I think too many rapists currently escape persecution. In some cases due to a woman feeling that a court either won't believe their claims, being too scared to actually take the case to court or a jury wrongly acquiting a rapist. It's clear some improvements are needed in this area although I'm not sure how.
beng100
Posts: 1,055
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 8:40:18 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 8:17:21 PM, Fkkize wrote:
At 2/24/2016 6:33:47 PM, Rosalie wrote:
Do you feel Kesha has the mentality and impressionability of an 11 year old?

I believe *ANY* Women, at*ANY* age, would feel ashamed to be taken advantage of because she is merely a Women.

What makes you think this? Is there anything you know the article didn't mention suggesting this to be the reason?
I'd be pleased to hear it.

You are a disgusting individual.

Before you start insulting other, do you not think a grown person coming from a poor family, calling herself "Ke$ha" would react different from an innocent 11 year old?

It might be statistically more likely but the financial control Luke held over kesha plus the stigma that comes from other people knowing you have been subjected to sexual abuse means this cannot be guarenteed. Some people are more vulnerable then they outwardly appear. If people are dismissive and stereotypical of these sort of situations victims are less likely to come forward and report the abuse.
Fkkize
Posts: 2,147
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2016 8:45:03 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 8:40:18 PM, beng100 wrote:
At 2/24/2016 8:17:21 PM, Fkkize wrote:
At 2/24/2016 6:33:47 PM, Rosalie wrote:
Do you feel Kesha has the mentality and impressionability of an 11 year old?

I believe *ANY* Women, at*ANY* age, would feel ashamed to be taken advantage of because she is merely a Women.

What makes you think this? Is there anything you know the article didn't mention suggesting this to be the reason?
I'd be pleased to hear it.

You are a disgusting individual.

Before you start insulting other, do you not think a grown person coming from a poor family, calling herself "Ke$ha" would react different from an innocent 11 year old?

It might be statistically more likely but the financial control Luke held over kesha plus the stigma that comes from other people knowing you have been subjected to sexual abuse means this cannot be guarenteed. Some people are more vulnerable then they outwardly appear. If people are dismissive and stereotypical of these sort of situations victims are less likely to come forward and report the abuse.

And I agree to all you said. What I do not agree with is the intention behind this thread.
: At 7/2/2016 3:05:07 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
:
: space contradicts logic