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Should problem drinkers get to have guns?

PetersSmith
Posts: 5,859
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4/7/2016 4:41:22 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
https://ncadd.org... http://articles.latimes.com...

For those of you who are unaware, alcohol is usually involved in some way in most crimes. According to some statistics, around 50-75% of homicides involve alcohol, where either the victim or the assailant is under the influence. Homicides tend to involve guns because it's quick, easy, and they're somewhat easy to access such as in places like Colorado Springs, which has a massive homicide rate. So, do you think that if a person is diagnosed with alcoholism, or are convicted of a crime involving alcohol, they should not be able to obtain guns? If so, for how long? Should history of alcohol use be added to background checks? Should a bartender or host be partially responsible if someone who they gave drinks to kills someone shortly after (extension of host liability)? Discuss.
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Skepsikyma
Posts: 8,286
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4/7/2016 5:00:06 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/7/2016 4:41:22 AM, PetersSmith wrote:
https://ncadd.org... http://articles.latimes.com...

For those of you who are unaware, alcohol is usually involved in some way in most crimes. According to some statistics, around 50-75% of homicides involve alcohol, where either the victim or the assailant is under the influence. Homicides tend to involve guns because it's quick, easy, and they're somewhat easy to access such as in places like Colorado Springs, which has a massive homicide rate. So, do you think that if a person is diagnosed with alcoholism, or are convicted of a crime involving alcohol, they should not be able to obtain guns? If so, for how long? Should history of alcohol use be added to background checks? Should a bartender or host be partially responsible if someone who they gave drinks to kills someone shortly after (extension of host liability)? Discuss.

That would be an absolute nightmare to implement (as someone who works for the LCB in one of the two states with the strictest laws on alcohol regulation.)

It also probably wouldn't have much impact. The fact that a lot of homicides involve alcohol doesn't mean that they involve alcoholics. It would also be fiercely fought back against by gun owners. There's also a high possibility that the outcomes would vary according to class, as people in lower classes have a much harder time getting out of things like alcohol-related convictions.
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PetersSmith
Posts: 5,859
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4/7/2016 5:07:51 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/7/2016 5:00:06 AM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 4/7/2016 4:41:22 AM, PetersSmith wrote:
https://ncadd.org... http://articles.latimes.com...

For those of you who are unaware, alcohol is usually involved in some way in most crimes. According to some statistics, around 50-75% of homicides involve alcohol, where either the victim or the assailant is under the influence. Homicides tend to involve guns because it's quick, easy, and they're somewhat easy to access such as in places like Colorado Springs, which has a massive homicide rate. So, do you think that if a person is diagnosed with alcoholism, or are convicted of a crime involving alcohol, they should not be able to obtain guns? If so, for how long? Should history of alcohol use be added to background checks? Should a bartender or host be partially responsible if someone who they gave drinks to kills someone shortly after (extension of host liability)? Discuss.

That would be an absolute nightmare to implement (as someone who works for the LCB in one of the two states with the strictest laws on alcohol regulation.)

It also probably wouldn't have much impact. The fact that a lot of homicides involve alcohol doesn't mean that they involve alcoholics. It would also be fiercely fought back against by gun owners. There's also a high possibility that the outcomes would vary according to class, as people in lower classes have a much harder time getting out of things like alcohol-related convictions.

):
Empress of DDO (also Poll and Forum "Maintenance" Moderator)

"The two most important days in your life is the day you were born, and the day you find out why."
~Mark Twain

"Wow"
-Doge

"Don't believe everything you read on the internet just because there's a picture with a quote next to it."
~Abraham Lincoln

Guide to the Polls Section: http://www.debate.org...
Quadrunner
Posts: 1,164
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4/10/2016 7:51:10 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/7/2016 5:07:51 AM, PetersSmith wrote:
At 4/7/2016 5:00:06 AM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 4/7/2016 4:41:22 AM, PetersSmith wrote:
https://ncadd.org... http://articles.latimes.com...

For those of you who are unaware, alcohol is usually involved in some way in most crimes. According to some statistics, around 50-75% of homicides involve alcohol, where either the victim or the assailant is under the influence. Homicides tend to involve guns because it's quick, easy, and they're somewhat easy to access such as in places like Colorado Springs, which has a massive homicide rate. So, do you think that if a person is diagnosed with alcoholism, or are convicted of a crime involving alcohol, they should not be able to obtain guns? If so, for how long? Should history of alcohol use be added to background checks? Should a bartender or host be partially responsible if someone who they gave drinks to kills someone shortly after (extension of host liability)? Discuss.

That would be an absolute nightmare to implement (as someone who works for the LCB in one of the two states with the strictest laws on alcohol regulation.)

It also probably wouldn't have much impact. The fact that a lot of homicides involve alcohol doesn't mean that they involve alcoholics. It would also be fiercely fought back against by gun owners. There's also a high possibility that the outcomes would vary according to class, as people in lower classes have a much harder time getting out of things like alcohol-related convictions.

):

Yup

-Hank Hill
Wisdom is found where the wise seek it.
Quadrunner
Posts: 1,164
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4/10/2016 8:11:14 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/7/2016 5:07:51 AM, PetersSmith wrote:
At 4/7/2016 5:00:06 AM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 4/7/2016 4:41:22 AM, PetersSmith wrote:
https://ncadd.org... http://articles.latimes.com...

For those of you who are unaware, alcohol is usually involved in some way in most crimes. According to some statistics, around 50-75% of homicides involve alcohol, where either the victim or the assailant is under the influence. Homicides tend to involve guns because it's quick, easy, and they're somewhat easy to access such as in places like Colorado Springs, which has a massive homicide rate. So, do you think that if a person is diagnosed with alcoholism, or are convicted of a crime involving alcohol, they should not be able to obtain guns? If so, for how long? Should history of alcohol use be added to background checks? Should a bartender or host be partially responsible if someone who they gave drinks to kills someone shortly after (extension of host liability)? Discuss.

That would be an absolute nightmare to implement (as someone who works for the LCB in one of the two states with the strictest laws on alcohol regulation.)

It also probably wouldn't have much impact. The fact that a lot of homicides involve alcohol doesn't mean that they involve alcoholics. It would also be fiercely fought back against by gun owners. There's also a high possibility that the outcomes would vary according to class, as people in lower classes have a much harder time getting out of things like alcohol-related convictions.

):

I think you'd need to have a gun license for something like that to be implemented. You would still be able to buy and sell guns (US) though so anything that happens in households would probably be unpreventable. If it makes you feel any better, there is usually a blood alcohol limit similar to driving a car for handling a firearm.

Having grown up with (undiagnosed) alcoholics who own firearms, I don't think its right to tell an alcoholic he's untrustworthy 100% of the time, and I think if we consider him a gun wielding threat before proven otherwise that's discrimination based on Profile. Even a drunk person generally has the sense not to do things like shooting and driving while drunk. If they don't show direct evidence of danger then they should be given the benefit of the doubt, and kept an eye on.
Wisdom is found where the wise seek it.
SpiritandTruth
Posts: 2,315
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4/12/2016 11:51:37 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
Correlation doesn't equal causation. People who do violent things while drinking have a whole lot more going on inside of them than the alcohol.

Using this as a justification for denying someone their second amendment rights is a slippery slope.

Yeah, because the government really really doesn't want us to have guns, they already are trying to screen people who have "mental health" issues. Ever hear of Operational Defiance Disorder? It's a joke.
And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. As many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of the will of God. The hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth,