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Should we get rid of tipping

adam_4_18_1984
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5/31/2016 8:17:30 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
I find it quite ridiculous that waiters and waitresses demand that we give them a tip just for doing their jobs. Lets face it it's not our responsibility nor is it our job to give these folks in the food industry more money just for doing a job that they are required to do. Do we tip doctors when they save lives do we tip police officers do we tip teachers do we tip fast food workers of course not to think we should tip them because waiters don't make enough is a load of crap. By law the company is required to give their employees minimum wage but lets just say for argument sake that they don't what person would a functioning brain cell would think that the customer is responsible for the waiters or waitresses wage we are not if you don't like your job find another one it isn't societies problem nor is it customers fault that you waiters or waitresses don't like there job. Besides we aren't obligated to tip and you are just teaching folks when you tip that they are entitled to extra money for doing a job that they are required to do which is why they get paid in the first place.
Peepette
Posts: 1,238
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5/31/2016 8:37:51 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/31/2016 8:17:30 PM, adam_4_18_1984 wrote:
I find it quite ridiculous that waiters and waitresses demand that we give them a tip just for doing their jobs. Lets face it it's not our responsibility nor is it our job to give these folks in the food industry more money just for doing a job that they are required to do. Do we tip doctors when they save lives do we tip police officers do we tip teachers do we tip fast food workers of course not to think we should tip them because waiters don't make enough is a load of crap. By law the company is required to give their employees minimum wage but lets just say for argument sake that they don't what person would a functioning brain cell would think that the customer is responsible for the waiters or waitresses wage we are not if you don't like your job find another one it isn't societies problem nor is it customers fault that you waiters or waitresses don't like there job. Besides we aren't obligated to tip and you are just teaching folks when you tip that they are entitled to extra money for doing a job that they are required to do which is why they get paid in the first place.

Although it varies by state restaurant workers in the North East by law make a min. of $3.00 and hour. After claiming tips, which they have to do, most often their paychecks = 0. If you give these people a minimum wage your meal prices will go up substantially with no guarantee of good service. As it stands If your service is not up to par you tip less, at a high standard tip more. The systems as it is incentives wait staff and bartenders to put their customers first.
Cinnamon153
Posts: 13
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5/31/2016 8:58:50 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/31/2016 8:17:30 PM, adam_4_18_1984 wrote:
I find it quite ridiculous that waiters and waitresses demand that we give them a tip just for doing their jobs. Lets face it it's not our responsibility nor is it our job to give these folks in the food industry more money just for doing a job that they are required to do. Do we tip doctors when they save lives do we tip police officers do we tip teachers do we tip fast food workers of course not to think we should tip them because waiters don't make enough is a load of crap. By law the company is required to give their employees minimum wage but lets just say for argument sake that they don't what person would a functioning brain cell would think that the customer is responsible for the waiters or waitresses wage we are not if you don't like your job find another one it isn't societies problem nor is it customers fault that you waiters or waitresses don't like there job. Besides we aren't obligated to tip and you are just teaching folks when you tip that they are entitled to extra money for doing a job that they are required to do which is why they get paid in the first place.

Hmmm. That's a difficult one. I think that the original purpose behind 'the tip' was to reward the server for exemplary service. But, I agree that at some point in time it became an expectation and it's definitely gotten out of control.

The reason that I think it's difficult is because, for example, here in Canada the minimum wage for servers is actually set lower than the minimum wage for almost all other occupations (specifically in Alberta). So, someone serving alcohol (which would include waitresses in most restaurants) will make $0.50 less per hour and the reasoning behind that is that their wage is compensated in tips. Also, the tips that they receive are taxable.

So, I agree that we should really just do away with tipping because restaurants passing that burden of subsidizing their employees to the consumer is just unacceptable. But, I also think that the minimum wage for servers needs to match the minimum wage for all other occupations otherwise we'd be putting the servers wages below everyone else's (at least in Alberta) and that isn't good either.
We believe in ordinary acts of bravery, in the courage that drives one person to stand up for another.
Emmarie
Posts: 1,907
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5/31/2016 11:55:54 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/31/2016 8:37:51 PM, Peepette wrote:
At 5/31/2016 8:17:30 PM, adam_4_18_1984 wrote:
I find it quite ridiculous that waiters and waitresses demand that we give them a tip just for doing their jobs. Lets face it it's not our responsibility nor is it our job to give these folks in the food industry more money just for doing a job that they are required to do. Do we tip doctors when they save lives do we tip police officers do we tip teachers do we tip fast food workers of course not to think we should tip them because waiters don't make enough is a load of crap. By law the company is required to give their employees minimum wage but lets just say for argument sake that they don't what person would a functioning brain cell would think that the customer is responsible for the waiters or waitresses wage we are not if you don't like your job find another one it isn't societies problem nor is it customers fault that you waiters or waitresses don't like there job. Besides we aren't obligated to tip and you are just teaching folks when you tip that they are entitled to extra money for doing a job that they are required to do which is why they get paid in the first place.



Although it varies by state restaurant workers in the North East by law make a min. of $3.00 and hour. After claiming tips, which they have to do, most often their paychecks = 0. If you give these people a minimum wage your meal prices will go up substantially with no guarantee of good service. As it stands If your service is not up to par you tip less, at a high standard tip more. The systems as it is incentives wait staff and bartenders to put their customers first.
+10 I worked most of my adult like as a waitress. There is a lot more that goes into giving great service than people who have never worked in a restaurant think there is.
Peepette
Posts: 1,238
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6/1/2016 12:08:57 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/31/2016 8:58:50 PM, Cinnamon153 wrote:
At 5/31/2016 8:17:30 PM, adam_4_18_1984 wrote:
I find it quite ridiculous that waiters and waitresses demand that we give them a tip just for doing their jobs. Lets face it it's not our responsibility nor is it our job to give these folks in the food industry more money just for doing a job that they are required to do. Do we tip doctors when they save lives do we tip police officers do we tip teachers do we tip fast food workers of course not to think we should tip them because waiters don't make enough is a load of crap. By law the company is required to give their employees minimum wage but lets just say for argument sake that they don't what person would a functioning brain cell would think that the customer is responsible for the waiters or waitresses wage we are not if you don't like your job find another one it isn't societies problem nor is it customers fault that you waiters or waitresses don't like there job. Besides we aren't obligated to tip and you are just teaching folks when you tip that they are entitled to extra money for doing a job that they are required to do which is why they get paid in the first place.

Hmmm. That's a difficult one. I think that the original purpose behind 'the tip' was to reward the server for exemplary service. But, I agree that at some point in time it became an expectation and it's definitely gotten out of control.

The reason that I think it's difficult is because, for example, here in Canada the minimum wage for servers is actually set lower than the minimum wage for almost all other occupations (specifically in Alberta). So, someone serving alcohol (which would include waitresses in most restaurants) will make $0.50 less per hour and the reasoning behind that is that their wage is compensated in tips. Also, the tips that they receive are taxable.

So, I agree that we should really just do away with tipping because restaurants passing that burden of subsidizing their employees to the consumer is just unacceptable. But, I also think that the minimum wage for servers needs to match the minimum wage for all other occupations otherwise we'd be putting the servers wages below everyone else's (at least in Alberta) and that isn't good either.

The consumer is paying for it either way. Either in higher food prices to meet the minimum wage or via tipping. Tipping is far more direct . Here the min. wage is $10 per hour. Significantly less than min wage. Yes, the restaurant wage should be increased, but to the standard minimum without tipping, many would not earn a sufficient income to survive. The reason is here, wait staff have to claim tips on all credit cards transactions, most often this meets the 10% of sales required by law. Cash tips on the other hand is claimed in a limited manner, lesser taxation as a result.
Peepette
Posts: 1,238
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6/1/2016 12:24:04 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/31/2016 11:55:54 PM, Emmarie wrote:
At 5/31/2016 8:37:51 PM, Peepette wrote:
At 5/31/2016 8:17:30 PM, adam_4_18_1984 wrote:
I find it quite ridiculous that waiters and waitresses demand that we give them a tip just for doing their jobs. Lets face it it's not our responsibility nor is it our job to give these folks in the food industry more money just for doing a job that they are required to do. Do we tip doctors when they save lives do we tip police officers do we tip teachers do we tip fast food workers of course not to think we should tip them because waiters don't make enough is a load of crap. By law the company is required to give their employees minimum wage but lets just say for argument sake that they don't what person would a functioning brain cell would think that the customer is responsible for the waiters or waitresses wage we are not if you don't like your job find another one it isn't societies problem nor is it customers fault that you waiters or waitresses don't like there job. Besides we aren't obligated to tip and you are just teaching folks when you tip that they are entitled to extra money for doing a job that they are required to do which is why they get paid in the first place.



Although it varies by state restaurant workers in the North East by law make a min. of $3.00 and hour. After claiming tips, which they have to do, most often their paychecks = 0. If you give these people a minimum wage your meal prices will go up substantially with no guarantee of good service. As it stands If your service is not up to par you tip less, at a high standard tip more. The systems as it is incentives wait staff and bartenders to put their customers first.
+10 I worked most of my adult like as a waitress. There is a lot more that goes into giving great service than people who have never worked in a restaurant think there is.

I certainly agree with this. Despite having "professional" jobs I have always had a second job in the industry, for over 30 years serving and bartending. I'm in a different place than most bartenders in most restaurants, but worked my way through to where I am. It's is a hard job waiting on the public, they don't see the behind the scenes and kitchen BS servers have to put up with. And boy, your body aches after working a double. I make almost twice in tips than the 20 somethings I work with, I'm far from being a young person; but I know the public and what they like and can read them to give them a positive experience.
Emmarie
Posts: 1,907
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6/1/2016 1:47:55 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 6/1/2016 12:24:04 AM, Peepette wrote:
At 5/31/2016 11:55:54 PM, Emmarie wrote:
At 5/31/2016 8:37:51 PM, Peepette wrote:
At 5/31/2016 8:17:30 PM, adam_4_18_1984 wrote:
I find it quite ridiculous that waiters and waitresses demand that we give them a tip just for doing their jobs. Lets face it it's not our responsibility nor is it our job to give these folks in the food industry more money just for doing a job that they are required to do. Do we tip doctors when they save lives do we tip police officers do we tip teachers do we tip fast food workers of course not to think we should tip them because waiters don't make enough is a load of crap. By law the company is required to give their employees minimum wage but lets just say for argument sake that they don't what person would a functioning brain cell would think that the customer is responsible for the waiters or waitresses wage we are not if you don't like your job find another one it isn't societies problem nor is it customers fault that you waiters or waitresses don't like there job. Besides we aren't obligated to tip and you are just teaching folks when you tip that they are entitled to extra money for doing a job that they are required to do which is why they get paid in the first place.



Although it varies by state restaurant workers in the North East by law make a min. of $3.00 and hour. After claiming tips, which they have to do, most often their paychecks = 0. If you give these people a minimum wage your meal prices will go up substantially with no guarantee of good service. As it stands If your service is not up to par you tip less, at a high standard tip more. The systems as it is incentives wait staff and bartenders to put their customers first.
+10 I worked most of my adult like as a waitress. There is a lot more that goes into giving great service than people who have never worked in a restaurant think there is.

I certainly agree with this. Despite having "professional" jobs I have always had a second job in the industry, for over 30 years serving and bartending. I'm in a different place than most bartenders in most restaurants, but worked my way through to where I am. It's is a hard job waiting on the public, they don't see the behind the scenes and kitchen BS servers have to put up with. And boy, your body aches after working a double. I make almost twice in tips than the 20 somethings I work with, I'm far from being a young person; but I know the public and what they like and can read them to give them a positive experience.
Yeah, thats' why I went into lawn service. In the last job I had as a waitress, in October, the other waitresses were jealous cuz I made over 20% on a regular basis. They went so far as to mess with the computer and mess up my orders, as well as making it more difficult for the cooks who didn't speak English, but were great workers. Many people who enter the profession nowadays aren't service minded and don't enjoy serving, and then get mad when someone does genuinely enjoy giving services and is well compensated thru tips.

I've always been more of a at your service type of server than an entertaining type of server though. Eye contact with women first - ALWAYS!! Drinks promptly refilled, plates served gently and delicately, memory of orders, memory of extra condiments, extra napkins for messy dishes and children. "Let me know if you need anything, enjoy your meal." The younger cuter girls didn't understand how I made more money. I'd try to tell them,"when a couple comes in acknowledge the woman first!" but they were stuck on trying to be coy with the man thinking they would get a better tip, wrong!
Peepette
Posts: 1,238
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6/1/2016 1:53:52 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 6/1/2016 1:47:55 AM, Emmarie wrote:
At 6/1/2016 12:24:04 AM, Peepette wrote:
At 5/31/2016 11:55:54 PM, Emmarie wrote:
At 5/31/2016 8:37:51 PM, Peepette wrote:
At 5/31/2016 8:17:30 PM, adam_4_18_1984 wrote:
I find it quite ridiculous that waiters and waitresses demand that we give them a tip just for doing their jobs. Lets face it it's not our responsibility nor is it our job to give these folks in the food industry more money just for doing a job that they are required to do. Do we tip doctors when they save lives do we tip police officers do we tip teachers do we tip fast food workers of course not to think we should tip them because waiters don't make enough is a load of crap. By law the company is required to give their employees minimum wage but lets just say for argument sake that they don't what person would a functioning brain cell would think that the customer is responsible for the waiters or waitresses wage we are not if you don't like your job find another one it isn't societies problem nor is it customers fault that you waiters or waitresses don't like there job. Besides we aren't obligated to tip and you are just teaching folks when you tip that they are entitled to extra money for doing a job that they are required to do which is why they get paid in the first place.



Although it varies by state restaurant workers in the North East by law make a min. of $3.00 and hour. After claiming tips, which they have to do, most often their paychecks = 0. If you give these people a minimum wage your meal prices will go up substantially with no guarantee of good service. As it stands If your service is not up to par you tip less, at a high standard tip more. The systems as it is incentives wait staff and bartenders to put their customers first.
+10 I worked most of my adult like as a waitress. There is a lot more that goes into giving great service than people who have never worked in a restaurant think there is.

I certainly agree with this. Despite having "professional" jobs I have always had a second job in the industry, for over 30 years serving and bartending. I'm in a different place than most bartenders in most restaurants, but worked my way through to where I am. It's is a hard job waiting on the public, they don't see the behind the scenes and kitchen BS servers have to put up with. And boy, your body aches after working a double. I make almost twice in tips than the 20 somethings I work with, I'm far from being a young person; but I know the public and what they like and can read them to give them a positive experience.
Yeah, thats' why I went into lawn service. In the last job I had as a waitress, in October, the other waitresses were jealous cuz I made over 20% on a regular basis. They went so far as to mess with the computer and mess up my orders, as well as making it more difficult for the cooks who didn't speak English, but were great workers. Many people who enter the profession nowadays aren't service minded and don't enjoy serving, and then get mad when someone does genuinely enjoy giving services and is well compensated thru tips.

I've always been more of a at your service type of server than an entertaining type of server though. Eye contact with women first - ALWAYS!! Drinks promptly refilled, plates served gently and delicately, memory of orders, memory of extra condiments, extra napkins for messy dishes and children. "Let me know if you need anything, enjoy your meal." The younger cuter girls didn't understand how I made more money. I'd try to tell them,"when a couple comes in acknowledge the woman first!" but they were stuck on trying to be coy with the man thinking they would get a better tip, wrong!

You have that right, address the Mom. Men do not like to be neither hit on nor have their date ignored. With weddings, the bride and groom are self sufficient and catered to by the guest. Talk care of the MOB and MOG and your golden.
Emmarie
Posts: 1,907
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6/1/2016 2:14:33 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 6/1/2016 1:53:52 AM, Peepette wrote:
At 6/1/2016 1:47:55 AM, Emmarie wrote:
At 6/1/2016 12:24:04 AM, Peepette wrote:
At 5/31/2016 11:55:54 PM, Emmarie wrote:
At 5/31/2016 8:37:51 PM, Peepette wrote:
At 5/31/2016 8:17:30 PM, adam_4_18_1984 wrote:
I find it quite ridiculous that waiters and waitresses demand that we give them a tip just for doing their jobs. Lets face it it's not our responsibility nor is it our job to give these folks in the food industry more money just for doing a job that they are required to do. Do we tip doctors when they save lives do we tip police officers do we tip teachers do we tip fast food workers of course not to think we should tip them because waiters don't make enough is a load of crap. By law the company is required to give their employees minimum wage but lets just say for argument sake that they don't what person would a functioning brain cell would think that the customer is responsible for the waiters or waitresses wage we are not if you don't like your job find another one it isn't societies problem nor is it customers fault that you waiters or waitresses don't like there job. Besides we aren't obligated to tip and you are just teaching folks when you tip that they are entitled to extra money for doing a job that they are required to do which is why they get paid in the first place.



Although it varies by state restaurant workers in the North East by law make a min. of $3.00 and hour. After claiming tips, which they have to do, most often their paychecks = 0. If you give these people a minimum wage your meal prices will go up substantially with no guarantee of good service. As it stands If your service is not up to par you tip less, at a high standard tip more. The systems as it is incentives wait staff and bartenders to put their customers first.
+10 I worked most of my adult like as a waitress. There is a lot more that goes into giving great service than people who have never worked in a restaurant think there is.

I certainly agree with this. Despite having "professional" jobs I have always had a second job in the industry, for over 30 years serving and bartending. I'm in a different place than most bartenders in most restaurants, but worked my way through to where I am. It's is a hard job waiting on the public, they don't see the behind the scenes and kitchen BS servers have to put up with. And boy, your body aches after working a double. I make almost twice in tips than the 20 somethings I work with, I'm far from being a young person; but I know the public and what they like and can read them to give them a positive experience.
Yeah, thats' why I went into lawn service. In the last job I had as a waitress, in October, the other waitresses were jealous cuz I made over 20% on a regular basis. They went so far as to mess with the computer and mess up my orders, as well as making it more difficult for the cooks who didn't speak English, but were great workers. Many people who enter the profession nowadays aren't service minded and don't enjoy serving, and then get mad when someone does genuinely enjoy giving services and is well compensated thru tips.

I've always been more of a at your service type of server than an entertaining type of server though. Eye contact with women first - ALWAYS!! Drinks promptly refilled, plates served gently and delicately, memory of orders, memory of extra condiments, extra napkins for messy dishes and children. "Let me know if you need anything, enjoy your meal." The younger cuter girls didn't understand how I made more money. I'd try to tell them,"when a couple comes in acknowledge the woman first!" but they were stuck on trying to be coy with the man thinking they would get a better tip, wrong!

You have that right, address the Mom. Men do not like to be neither hit on nor have their date ignored. With weddings, the bride and groom are self sufficient and catered to by the guest. Talk care of the MOB and MOG and your golden.

I didn't wait banquets, but I did work as a bartender in 2 hotels when I was in my 20's. Most jobs I've had have been in informal atmospheres, but I always gave prompt and courteous service and was tipped well.
Cinnamon153
Posts: 13
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6/1/2016 4:06:27 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 6/1/2016 12:08:57 AM, Peepette wrote:
At 5/31/2016 8:58:50 PM, Cinnamon153 wrote:
At 5/31/2016 8:17:30 PM, adam_4_18_1984 wrote:
I find it quite ridiculous that waiters and waitresses demand that we give them a tip just for doing their jobs. Lets face it it's not our responsibility nor is it our job to give these folks in the food industry more money just for doing a job that they are required to do. Do we tip doctors when they save lives do we tip police officers do we tip teachers do we tip fast food workers of course not to think we should tip them because waiters don't make enough is a load of crap. By law the company is required to give their employees minimum wage but lets just say for argument sake that they don't what person would a functioning brain cell would think that the customer is responsible for the waiters or waitresses wage we are not if you don't like your job find another one it isn't societies problem nor is it customers fault that you waiters or waitresses don't like there job. Besides we aren't obligated to tip and you are just teaching folks when you tip that they are entitled to extra money for doing a job that they are required to do which is why they get paid in the first place.

Hmmm. That's a difficult one. I think that the original purpose behind 'the tip' was to reward the server for exemplary service. But, I agree that at some point in time it became an expectation and it's definitely gotten out of control.

The reason that I think it's difficult is because, for example, here in Canada the minimum wage for servers is actually set lower than the minimum wage for almost all other occupations (specifically in Alberta). So, someone serving alcohol (which would include waitresses in most restaurants) will make $0.50 less per hour and the reasoning behind that is that their wage is compensated in tips. Also, the tips that they receive are taxable.

So, I agree that we should really just do away with tipping because restaurants passing that burden of subsidizing their employees to the consumer is just unacceptable. But, I also think that the minimum wage for servers needs to match the minimum wage for all other occupations otherwise we'd be putting the servers wages below everyone else's (at least in Alberta) and that isn't good either.

The consumer is paying for it either way. Either in higher food prices to meet the minimum wage or via tipping. Tipping is far more direct . Here the min. wage is $10 per hour. Significantly less than min wage. Yes, the restaurant wage should be increased, but to the standard minimum without tipping, many would not earn a sufficient income to survive. The reason is here, wait staff have to claim tips on all credit cards transactions, most often this meets the 10% of sales required by law. Cash tips on the other hand is claimed in a limited manner, lesser taxation as a result.

Yes, I guess you have a point there. The consumer is going to pay for it either way. I guess I just sort of feel like the consumer is rewarding the owner for paying their staff so little. Like, it's sort of saying to the owner "Oh, I know you treat your employees like garbage that have no value to you, but don't worry, I'll make up the difference". I mean, obviously there have to be restaurant owners out there who treat their staff well, but it seems like a lot of the corporate restaurants just want to pay people as little as they possibly can...

I guess it comes down to this; is it better for servers to have a static wage that they can count on to be the same no matter what or is it better for servers for servers to make a low hourly wage and count on fluctuating tips? I could see pros and cons to both sides but I've never been a server and so I can't fairly answer that question without the experience behind it.

I was wondering something though. I had read that restaurant owners in the United States are required to gross up the wages of server staff if their tips and wage do not equal the minimum wage (so like, if the min. wage per week is $100 and the server only makes $75 with their wage and tips, the owner has to pay them the extra $25 so that they make the $100 minimum). Is that true?
We believe in ordinary acts of bravery, in the courage that drives one person to stand up for another.
Peepette
Posts: 1,238
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6/1/2016 7:44:59 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 6/1/2016 4:06:27 PM, Cinnamon153 wrote:
At 6/1/2016 12:08:57 AM, Peepette wrote:
At 5/31/2016 8:58:50 PM, Cinnamon153 wrote:
At 5/31/2016 8:17:30 PM, adam_4_18_1984 wrote:
I find it quite ridiculous that waiters and waitresses demand that we give them a tip just for doing their jobs. Lets face it it's not our responsibility nor is it our job to give these folks in the food industry more money just for doing a job that they are required to do. Do we tip doctors when they save lives do we tip police officers do we tip teachers do we tip fast food workers of course not to think we should tip them because waiters don't make enough is a load of crap. By law the company is required to give their employees minimum wage but lets just say for argument sake that they don't what person would a functioning brain cell would think that the customer is responsible for the waiters or waitresses wage we are not if you don't like your job find another one it isn't societies problem nor is it customers fault that you waiters or waitresses don't like there job. Besides we aren't obligated to tip and you are just teaching folks when you tip that they are entitled to extra money for doing a job that they are required to do which is why they get paid in the first place.

Hmmm. That's a difficult one. I think that the original purpose behind 'the tip' was to reward the server for exemplary service. But, I agree that at some point in time it became an expectation and it's definitely gotten out of control.

The reason that I think it's difficult is because, for example, here in Canada the minimum wage for servers is actually set lower than the minimum wage for almost all other occupations (specifically in Alberta). So, someone serving alcohol (which would include waitresses in most restaurants) will make $0.50 less per hour and the reasoning behind that is that their wage is compensated in tips. Also, the tips that they receive are taxable.

So, I agree that we should really just do away with tipping because restaurants passing that burden of subsidizing their employees to the consumer is just unacceptable. But, I also think that the minimum wage for servers needs to match the minimum wage for all other occupations otherwise we'd be putting the servers wages below everyone else's (at least in Alberta) and that isn't good either.

The consumer is paying for it either way. Either in higher food prices to meet the minimum wage or via tipping. Tipping is far more direct . Here the min. wage is $10 per hour. Significantly less than min wage. Yes, the restaurant wage should be increased, but to the standard minimum without tipping, many would not earn a sufficient income to survive. The reason is here, wait staff have to claim tips on all credit cards transactions, most often this meets the 10% of sales required by law. Cash tips on the other hand is claimed in a limited manner, lesser taxation as a result.

Yes, I guess you have a point there. The consumer is going to pay for it either way. I guess I just sort of feel like the consumer is rewarding the owner for paying their staff so little. Like, it's sort of saying to the owner "Oh, I know you treat your employees like garbage that have no value to you, but don't worry, I'll make up the difference". I mean, obviously there have to be restaurant owners out there who treat their staff well, but it seems like a lot of the corporate restaurants just want to pay people as little as they possibly can...

I guess it comes down to this; is it better for servers to have a static wage that they can count on to be the same no matter what or is it better for servers for servers to make a low hourly wage and count on fluctuating tips? I could see pros and cons to both sides but I've never been a server and so I can't fairly answer that question without the experience behind it.

I was wondering something though. I had read that restaurant owners in the United States are required to gross up the wages of server staff if their tips and wage do not equal the minimum wage (so like, if the min. wage per week is $100 and the server only makes $75 with their wage and tips, the owner has to pay them the extra $25 so that they make the $100 minimum). Is that true?

Yes, If their tip totals for the week divided by hours do not meet the minimum wage the restaurant has to kick in the difference. This is often the case for breakfast wait staff due to the low prices for breakfast.
Cinnamon153
Posts: 13
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6/1/2016 7:47:08 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/31/2016 8:58:50 PM, Cinnamon153 wrote:
At 5/31/2016 8:17:30 PM, adam_4_18_1984 wrote:


I was wondering something though. I had read that restaurant owners in the United States are required to gross up the wages of server staff if their tips and wage do not equal the minimum wage (so like, if the min. wage per week is $100 and the server only makes $75 with their wage and tips, the owner has to pay them the extra $25 so that they make the $100 minimum). Is that true?

Yes, If their tip totals for the week divided by hours do not meet the minimum wage the restaurant has to kick in the difference. This is often the case for breakfast wait staff due to the low prices for breakfast.

Well, that's at least a minor silver lining in the whole scenario. Hopefully restaurants actually follow through with that rule!
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dylancatlow
Posts: 12,246
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6/1/2016 8:51:07 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
Tipping is just another way of paying the waitstaff. Instead of paying for their service via higher food prices, we tip. Like any system, it has its upsides and downsides, but overall I think it's pretty dumb and see no need for it.
bballcrook21
Posts: 4,468
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6/1/2016 10:07:25 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
Tipping is voluntary for a reason. Waiters and waitresses, as well as many others in the service industry can vary from being hard working and polite individuals to being the exact opposite, which is why the tip reflects it. It's also a nice sign of gratuity towards the service provided, as well as the fact that most of these jobs are taken up by young individuals that could use the extra money.

I personally have no problem with tipping, and I never eat out without tipping at least 15-25% of the meal's cost. I find pleasure in thanking those for their good service, so I have no problem there.
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Redfordnutt
Posts: 222
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6/8/2016 1:09:24 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
I don't think the customer should have to directly pay the running costs of any establishment they choose to eat at as we are already paying for it through the amount we pay for the food compared to what it is actually worth.
Peepette
Posts: 1,238
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6/8/2016 2:13:18 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 6/8/2016 1:09:24 AM, Redfordnutt wrote:
I don't think the customer should have to directly pay the running costs of any establishment they choose to eat at as we are already paying for it through the amount we pay for the food compared to what it is actually worth.

As you know with purchasing groceries for your own home, they are not cheap. Especially higher priced proteins and better cuts not available in a typical stores. Food cost alone in a well run restaurant are about 35% before it is touched by a person. Together with several types of insurance requirements, licenses, utilities, chefs, cooks and other non-tipped payroll employees, a typical restaurant meal (not high end) is pretty reasonable in price. After expenses, profits run between 3-5% on food. Most restaurants make their profits off alcohol.
JurassinJohn
Posts: 29
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6/8/2016 10:15:29 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
For the time being no because the wages for waitresses atleast in the united states are far too low to not tip them. Once they raise their wages then tipping may no longer be as necessary but until then I'm going to continue tipping my waitresses.
YYW
Posts: 36,305
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6/8/2016 12:38:33 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/31/2016 8:17:30 PM, adam_4_18_1984 wrote:
I find it quite ridiculous that waiters and waitresses demand that we give them a tip just for doing their jobs.

Then you are an idiot. Let's talk about why you are an idiot.

The service industry is, as the name suggests, service driven. Tips are designed to reward high performers and not reward mediocrity or poor service.

The tip, though the amount is discretionary, is very much a real cost of dining out which, if you cannot afford, means you cannot afford to eat out. If you are too cheap to tip your waiter, then you don't deserve to be in a restaurant.

The non-tip alternative would hurt the entire food industry, because it would reduce the service incentive, and would result in patrons being less likely to go out to eat. Why? If bad waiters make as much money as the good ones, then good ones slack off. Hint: you're going to pay the tip one way or another, unless you're a piece of sh!t who stiffs people.

There are some countries where that is not true (like Germany, although you still do tip in Germany it's just different than here), but Germans' work ethic is vastly higher than Americans, which is why their system works.

Our system works too. It's the way things are, and people should leave it alone.
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Wylted
Posts: 21,167
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6/8/2016 4:00:58 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
You should look at the history of the anti-tipping movement in America. Very interesting, but likely justified given how tipping started out. It started out as just an excuse to get around slave labor. Negroes worked for tips instead of wages, and more progressive elements of society seeked to ban tipping for those reasons.

I think one of the later anti_tipping movements was called the "Anti Tipping League", but may be mistaken.
Wylted
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6/8/2016 4:08:38 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
Here is an article that talks about some of this as well as inadvertantly touches on some other problems with tipping.
http://mobile.nytimes.com...

By the way studies have actually been conducted that showing that people seem to just tip the same anount regardless of service. I believe this because I pretty much tip 20% everywhere regardless of service unless it is just horrible, and if I am a regular there I stil tip good but complain to management so I can keep my reputation.
FaustianJustice
Posts: 6,232
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6/8/2016 4:08:40 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 6/8/2016 12:38:33 PM, YYW wrote:
At 5/31/2016 8:17:30 PM, adam_4_18_1984 wrote:
I find it quite ridiculous that waiters and waitresses demand that we give them a tip just for doing their jobs.

Then you are an idiot. Let's talk about why you are an idiot.

The service industry is, as the name suggests, service driven. Tips are designed to reward high performers and not reward mediocrity or poor service.

The tip, though the amount is discretionary, is very much a real cost of dining out which, if you cannot afford, means you cannot afford to eat out. If you are too cheap to tip your waiter, then you don't deserve to be in a restaurant.

The non-tip alternative would hurt the entire food industry, because it would reduce the service incentive, and would result in patrons being less likely to go out to eat. Why? If bad waiters make as much money as the good ones, then good ones slack off. Hint: you're going to pay the tip one way or another, unless you're a piece of sh!t who stiffs people.

There are some countries where that is not true (like Germany, although you still do tip in Germany it's just different than here), but Germans' work ethic is vastly higher than Americans, which is why their system works.

Our system works too. It's the way things are, and people should leave it alone.

In other countries, "service", however is a genuine career. It pays well, people don't look down their nose at the waitstaff, etc.
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Wylted
Posts: 21,167
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6/8/2016 4:30:11 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
Oh I also try to tip in cash so the servers can more easily evade taxes. Unless I know for a fact the server is a Democrat, in which case I put it on my credit card to teach them a lesson.
YYW
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6/9/2016 1:04:56 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 6/8/2016 4:08:40 PM, FaustianJustice wrote:
At 6/8/2016 12:38:33 PM, YYW wrote:
At 5/31/2016 8:17:30 PM, adam_4_18_1984 wrote:
I find it quite ridiculous that waiters and waitresses demand that we give them a tip just for doing their jobs.

Then you are an idiot. Let's talk about why you are an idiot.

The service industry is, as the name suggests, service driven. Tips are designed to reward high performers and not reward mediocrity or poor service.

The tip, though the amount is discretionary, is very much a real cost of dining out which, if you cannot afford, means you cannot afford to eat out. If you are too cheap to tip your waiter, then you don't deserve to be in a restaurant.

The non-tip alternative would hurt the entire food industry, because it would reduce the service incentive, and would result in patrons being less likely to go out to eat. Why? If bad waiters make as much money as the good ones, then good ones slack off. Hint: you're going to pay the tip one way or another, unless you're a piece of sh!t who stiffs people.

There are some countries where that is not true (like Germany, although you still do tip in Germany it's just different than here), but Germans' work ethic is vastly higher than Americans, which is why their system works.

Our system works too. It's the way things are, and people should leave it alone.

In other countries, "service", however is a genuine career. It pays well, people don't look down their nose at the waitstaff, etc.

Not really.
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tejretics
Posts: 6,090
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6/12/2016 10:38:53 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
The purpose of tipping is to provide an incentive for good service.

So, obviously, we shouldn't get rid of it.
"Where justice is denied, where poverty is enforced, where ignorance prevails, and where any one class is made to feel that society is an organized conspiracy to oppress, rob and degrade them, neither persons nor property will be safe." - Frederick Douglass
Greyparrot
Posts: 14,295
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6/17/2016 2:56:44 PM
Posted: 5 months ago
Tipping is usually a good practice for restaurants that one may rarely frequent.

If you go to a place regularly, and there is a chance you could get a randomly bad server it might be upsetting to be forced to choose not to go to your regular place anymore because the owner is letting the customers rate, evaluate, and compensate their employees instead of having the owner personally vouching, paying, and vetting all his employees.
Jry2001
Posts: 45
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6/19/2016 8:07:55 PM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 5/31/2016 8:17:30 PM, adam_4_18_1984 wrote:
I find it quite ridiculous that waiters and waitresses demand that we give them a tip just for doing their jobs. Lets face it it's not our responsibility nor is it our job to give these folks in the food industry more money just for doing a job that they are required to do. Do we tip doctors when they save lives do we tip police officers do we tip teachers do we tip fast food workers of course not to think we should tip them because waiters don't make enough is a load of crap. By law the company is required to give their employees minimum wage but lets just say for argument sake that they don't what person would a functioning brain cell would think that the customer is responsible for the waiters or waitresses wage we are not if you don't like your job find another one it isn't societies problem nor is it customers fault that you waiters or waitresses don't like there job. Besides we aren't obligated to tip and you are just teaching folks when you tip that they are entitled to extra money for doing a job that they are required to do which is why they get paid in the first place.

Waitresses are often paid lower than minimum wage; the government allows that because they're tipped and therefore don't need as much wages.

Under our current system, if you don't tip the waitstaff, they'd end up making less than minimum wage. Eliminating tipping would force the restaurants to pay, meaning your food would become more expensive.
Danielle
Posts: 21,330
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6/20/2016 9:11:59 PM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/8/2016 12:38:33 PM, YYW wrote:
Then you are an idiot. Let's talk about why you are an idiot.

I'm completely baffled by all of the support for tipping in this thread. Customary tipping is really stupid and our society should stop doing it. It's not pragmatic and arguably immoral. I always tip 20% and it grinds my fvcking gears every single time.

FYI it's true that serving is a legitimate career in some countries. That makes sense when you consider how sh!tty the economy is in many countries. In some places they're just grateful to have jobs at all and that makes them pretty high class.
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Peepette
Posts: 1,238
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6/20/2016 10:31:09 PM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/20/2016 9:11:59 PM, Danielle wrote:
At 6/8/2016 12:38:33 PM, YYW wrote:
Then you are an idiot. Let's talk about why you are an idiot.

I'm completely baffled by all of the support for tipping in this thread. Customary tipping is really stupid and our society should stop doing it. It's not pragmatic and arguably immoral. I always tip 20% and it grinds my fvcking gears every single time.

FYI it's true that serving is a legitimate career in some countries. That makes sense when you consider how sh!tty the economy is in many countries. In some places they're just grateful to have jobs at all and that makes them pretty high class.

Why do think it's not pragmatic or immoral? just curious.
Greyparrot
Posts: 14,295
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6/22/2016 3:46:56 PM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/20/2016 10:31:09 PM, Peepette wrote:

Why do think it's not pragmatic or immoral? just curious.

Probably not pragmatic because the owner is not vetting his employees with proper compensation for work value....

And probably immoral because...well...wage gaps.
Greyparrot
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6/23/2016 12:54:27 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/20/2016 10:31:09 PM, Peepette wrote:

Why do think it's not pragmatic or immoral? just curious.

Basically, the customer is not always right, especially when it comes to tipping.