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Stem Cells Cure HIV

Korashk
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12/14/2010 12:52:27 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
http://www.huffingtonpost.com...
http://bloodjournal.hematologylibrary.org...

Apparently a man referred to as "Berlin Patient" had his HIV cured as a result of stem cell transplant. This is a fairly recent event and scientists and doctors are still studying, but it appears as though he's actually cured.

So what do you think of this? All the more reason for stem cell research as for as I'm concerned.

I'm aware that this would be more appropriate for News, but I feel it would recieve more attention here and it isn't entirely inappropriate for this section.
When large numbers of otherwise-law abiding people break specific laws en masse, it's usually a fault that lies with the law. - Unknown
Vi_Veri
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12/14/2010 12:54:05 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Holy sh1t.

I have always been behind stem cell research. This just gives me more reason to stand behind it.
I could give a f about no haters as long as my ishes love me.
Vi_Veri
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12/14/2010 1:00:30 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Told a friend of mine about this and he said:

"The man had a unique blood transfusion. The donor was one of the rare people who cannot get HIV. They have a deformity in their White blood cells and the virus cannot invade. So the Berlin patient, who needed a bone marrow transplant, got one from someone who had been shown to be immune to HIV."

Also, the study is from 2007 - a bit old and already disproved. Damn, Huffington continues to suck XD
I could give a f about no haters as long as my ishes love me.
belle
Posts: 4,113
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12/14/2010 1:03:20 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
well its not specifically *stem cells* that did it, but the fact that the cells possessed a mutation that confers resistence to HIV infection. given that these stem cells replaced most of the man's own immune cells, he is basically now (almost) immune to infection because the majority of his immune cells are immune to infection. gene therapy would probably achieve the same result, although i doubt we are skilled enough at gene therapy yet to make it happen.

this is great news though. i didn't even know there was a mutation that makes people immune to HIV infection.... awesome!
evidently i only come to ddo to avoid doing homework...
Freeman
Posts: 1,239
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12/14/2010 1:06:29 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 12/14/2010 12:52:27 PM, Korashk wrote:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com...
http://bloodjournal.hematologylibrary.org...

Apparently a man referred to as "Berlin Patient" had his HIV cured as a result of stem cell transplant. This is a fairly recent event and scientists and doctors are still studying, but it appears as though he's actually cured.

So what do you think of this? All the more reason for stem cell research as for as I'm concerned.

I'm aware that this would be more appropriate for News, but I feel it would recieve more attention here and it isn't entirely inappropriate for this section.

Hallelujah! Now we don't have to blend up all of our money and inject it into people with HIV.

Bonus points to the person that understands the allusion.

If there is ever a shortage of supply for a drug that may come of this, Christian conservatives that blocked stem cell funding should be the last group to receive the treatment.
Chancellor of Propaganda and Foreign Relations in the Franklin administration.

"I intend to live forever. So far, so good." -- Steven Wright
Vi_Veri
Posts: 4,487
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12/14/2010 1:08:08 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 12/14/2010 1:06:29 PM, Freeman wrote:
At 12/14/2010 12:52:27 PM, Korashk wrote:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com...
http://bloodjournal.hematologylibrary.org...

Apparently a man referred to as "Berlin Patient" had his HIV cured as a result of stem cell transplant. This is a fairly recent event and scientists and doctors are still studying, but it appears as though he's actually cured.

So what do you think of this? All the more reason for stem cell research as for as I'm concerned.

I'm aware that this would be more appropriate for News, but I feel it would recieve more attention here and it isn't entirely inappropriate for this section.


Hallelujah! Now we don't have to blend up all of our money and inject it into people with HIV.

Bonus points to the person that understands the allusion.

If there is ever a shortage of supply for a drug that may come of this, Christian conservatives that blocked stem cell funding should be the last group to receive the treatment.

Read above comments by belle and I. It wasn't stem cells that cured him.
I could give a f about no haters as long as my ishes love me.
Freeman
Posts: 1,239
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12/14/2010 1:11:49 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 12/14/2010 1:08:08 PM, Vi_Veri wrote:
At 12/14/2010 1:06:29 PM, Freeman wrote:
At 12/14/2010 12:52:27 PM, Korashk wrote:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com...
http://bloodjournal.hematologylibrary.org...

Apparently a man referred to as "Berlin Patient" had his HIV cured as a result of stem cell transplant. This is a fairly recent event and scientists and doctors are still studying, but it appears as though he's actually cured.

So what do you think of this? All the more reason for stem cell research as for as I'm concerned.

I'm aware that this would be more appropriate for News, but I feel it would recieve more attention here and it isn't entirely inappropriate for this section.


Hallelujah! Now we don't have to blend up all of our money and inject it into people with HIV.

Bonus points to the person that understands the allusion.

If there is ever a shortage of supply for a drug that may come of this, Christian conservatives that blocked stem cell funding should be the last group to receive the treatment.

Read above comments by belle and I. It wasn't stem cells that cured him.

Ahh... Ok.
Chancellor of Propaganda and Foreign Relations in the Franklin administration.

"I intend to live forever. So far, so good." -- Steven Wright
Korashk
Posts: 4,597
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12/14/2010 1:12:03 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 12/14/2010 1:03:20 PM, belle wrote:
well its not specifically *stem cells* that did it, but the fact that the cells possessed a mutation that confers resistence to HIV infection. given that these stem cells replaced most of the man's own immune cells, he is basically now (almost) immune to infection because the majority of his immune cells are immune to infection. gene therapy would probably achieve the same result, although i doubt we are skilled enough at gene therapy yet to make it happen.

this is great news though. i didn't even know there was a mutation that makes people immune to HIV infection.... awesome!

Just because it wasn't specifically stem cells that did it, isn't even a bad thing really. This mutation could be studied and [hopefully] replicated to be turned into an actual cure.
When large numbers of otherwise-law abiding people break specific laws en masse, it's usually a fault that lies with the law. - Unknown
belle
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12/14/2010 1:16:20 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 12/14/2010 1:12:03 PM, Korashk wrote:
At 12/14/2010 1:03:20 PM, belle wrote:
well its not specifically *stem cells* that did it, but the fact that the cells possessed a mutation that confers resistence to HIV infection. given that these stem cells replaced most of the man's own immune cells, he is basically now (almost) immune to infection because the majority of his immune cells are immune to infection. gene therapy would probably achieve the same result, although i doubt we are skilled enough at gene therapy yet to make it happen.

this is great news though. i didn't even know there was a mutation that makes people immune to HIV infection.... awesome!

Just because it wasn't specifically stem cells that did it, isn't even a bad thing really. This mutation could be studied and [hopefully] replicated to be turned into an actual cure.

i didn't say it was a bad thing (apparently you missed the part where i said this is great news :P), i was just clarifying, because when you think about it "stem cells cure HIV!" doesn't make any biological sense. also they've known about the mutation since 1996, and it only works against a certain strain of HIV so its not like thats big news. still hopeful that something good will come of it!
evidently i only come to ddo to avoid doing homework...
Vi_Veri
Posts: 4,487
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12/14/2010 1:21:40 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 12/14/2010 1:12:03 PM, Korashk wrote:
At 12/14/2010 1:03:20 PM, belle wrote:
well its not specifically *stem cells* that did it, but the fact that the cells possessed a mutation that confers resistence to HIV infection. given that these stem cells replaced most of the man's own immune cells, he is basically now (almost) immune to infection because the majority of his immune cells are immune to infection. gene therapy would probably achieve the same result, although i doubt we are skilled enough at gene therapy yet to make it happen.

this is great news though. i didn't even know there was a mutation that makes people immune to HIV infection.... awesome!

Just because it wasn't specifically stem cells that did it, isn't even a bad thing really. This mutation could be studied and [hopefully] replicated to be turned into an actual cure.

lol I never advocated against stem cell research - just revealed the truth: that stem cells had nothing to do with it.
I could give a f about no haters as long as my ishes love me.
Ren
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12/14/2010 3:18:05 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
There has always been a cure for HIV. It is a man-made derivative of hepatitis.

The people who are "immune" to HIV are not so because of a "deformity." When HIV was contrived between the 50's and 60's, it was meant to be ethnically specific. They wanted to make a disease to which "white" and "Asian" people were immune. This isn't as hard as it sounds; most pathogens are locally specific. Thus, they simply created a virus that will not respond to those who have an immunity to the bubonic plague.

The bubonic plague occurred almost exclusively in Europe and Asia. This, of course, happened in the Middle Ages, before mass transport and travel. Thus, those that have ancestry in either Europe or Asia have an inherent immunity to the bubonic plague. Those same people have a directly proportional immunity to the bubonic plauge. Moreover, there are people in Europe that are outright immune to the bubonic plague. Those same people are immune to HIV.

http://zeitlerweb.com...
http://www.pbs.org...
Ren
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12/14/2010 3:19:26 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 12/14/2010 3:18:05 PM, Ren wrote:
The bubonic plague occurred almost exclusively in Europe and Asia. This, of course, happened in the Middle Ages, before mass transport and travel. Thus, those that have ancestry in either Europe or Asia have an inherent immunity to the bubonic plague. Those same people have a directly proportional immunity to the HIV. Moreover, there are people in Europe that are outright immune to the bubonic plague. Those same people are immune to HIV.

Fixed.
belle
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12/14/2010 3:38:09 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 12/14/2010 3:18:05 PM, Ren wrote:
There has always been a cure for HIV. It is a man-made derivative of hepatitis.

The people who are "immune" to HIV are not so because of a "deformity." When HIV was contrived between the 50's and 60's, it was meant to be ethnically specific. They wanted to make a disease to which "white" and "Asian" people were immune. This isn't as hard as it sounds; most pathogens are locally specific. Thus, they simply created a virus that will not respond to those who have an immunity to the bubonic plague.

The bubonic plague occurred almost exclusively in Europe and Asia. This, of course, happened in the Middle Ages, before mass transport and travel. Thus, those that have ancestry in either Europe or Asia have an inherent immunity to the bubonic plague. Those same people have a directly proportional immunity to the bubonic plauge. Moreover, there are people in Europe that are outright immune to the bubonic plague. Those same people are immune to HIV.

http://zeitlerweb.com...
http://www.pbs.org...

they're immune because their CCR5 protein marker is broken. its been theorized that this is due to natural selection during the black death in europe, but they're not certain. nontheless, it is a nonfunctional gene, which is a deformity of sorts. and such people are only immune to one strain of HIV, not all of them. your "theory" also makes a huge leap from the fact that a gene that confers resistance to one disease also confers resistance to another (how is that shocking?) to the assumption that its a virus manufactured specifically to spare white people. and many white people and asians have died from the disease, which your "theory" entirely fails to explain. nice try though.
evidently i only come to ddo to avoid doing homework...
Ren
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12/14/2010 4:15:25 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 12/14/2010 3:38:09 PM, belle wrote:
they're immune because their CCR5 protein marker is broken. its been theorized that this is due to natural selection during the black death in europe, but they're not certain. nontheless, it is a nonfunctional gene, which is a deformity of sorts. and such people are only immune to one strain of HIV, not all of them. your "theory" also makes a huge leap from the fact that a gene that confers resistance to one disease also confers resistance to another (how is that shocking?) to the assumption that its a virus manufactured specifically to spare white people. and many white people and asians have died from the disease, which your "theory" entirely fails to explain. nice try though.

It wasn't a "try."

I understand that you're skeptical and thought that, inasmuch as you consider the proposition preposterous, there must be a very easy way to poke holes in it. But, your refutations were fairly weak, if not very well thought-out, because of how hasty you allowed your reaction to be as a result of your assessment of the claim. Nonetheless, I appreciate the opportunity to shed further light on the issue.

First, I think it's funny, how you attempted to make my proposition sound weaker by claiming that a genetic marker is "broken." In fact, the CR5 allele is actually absent, which is the only way that many Europeans and Asians survived the bubonic plague and smallpox. I only referenced the bubonic plague, but the illness is really irrelevant; more important, is what the illness does.

That leads me to my second point. It's not that they aren't certain that it was caused by an illness; it's that they aren't certain whether it was the bubonic plague or smallpox. That what caused these people to develop an this immunity, they are certain it is one of these two illnesses. I did think that this immunity occurred in Asians, as well; if you look at the distribution of HIV, it's relatively rare in Asian countries. But, in the reference that I posted, originating from PBS, they say that this mutation is absent in Asians, as well:

Another puzzle was the way this resistance is distributed throughout the world. In some Northern European populations it is relatively common. In Southern Europeans it is more rare, and it is almost entirely absent in Africans, Asians, and Native Americans. Logically, the mutation must have occurred in the past, acting as a defense against a different, previous epidemic caused -- like the AIDS epidemic -- by a pathogen that also targeted white blood cells.

Care to cite that these people are immune to only "one type of HIV?" I've never heard of or seen such a thing regarding these studies. The HIV virus in general requires the protein absent in the individuals to which my post refers in order to access human cells. So, you must be indicating some special type of HIV that uses another protein or a new means altogether to access cells and that is a very fascinating strain, indeed. I'd love to hear more about it.

Now, you derisively asked how it's shocking that an immunity to one disease translates into immunity to another. But, one can easily take this seriously and answer that it's nearly unheard of in medical science. In fact, you just said that the immunity to which I'm referring is specific to "one strain of HIV"--yet, you find it more believable that this same immunity carries over to a different viral species altogether?

Now, you said that "many white people and Asians have died from the disease." Now, apparently, whether it includes Asians is controversial. But, relatively speaking on a global scale, not many white and Asian people have died from the disease at all. It has mostly affected those that have had previous exposure to the bubonic plague and smallpox. But, I've already driven that point home, hmm?
SuperRobotWars
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12/14/2010 4:58:01 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Hoorah . . .
Minister Of Trolling
: At 12/6/2011 2:21:41 PM, badger wrote:
: ugly people should beat beautiful people ugly. simple! you'd be killing two birds with the one stone... women like violent men and you're making yourself more attractive, relatively. i met a blonde dude who was prettier than me not so long ago. he's not so pretty now! ha!
:
: ...and well, he wasn't really prettier than me. he just had nice hair.
Korashk
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12/14/2010 7:27:06 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 12/14/2010 1:21:40 PM, Vi_Veri wrote:
lol I never advocated against stem cell research - just revealed the truth: that stem cells had nothing to do with it.

I'm sure the stem cells had something to do with it.
When large numbers of otherwise-law abiding people break specific laws en masse, it's usually a fault that lies with the law. - Unknown
SuperRobotWars
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12/14/2010 7:37:25 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 12/14/2010 7:32:51 PM, FREEDO wrote:
This wonderful news. We need more abortions, stat!

We can harvest them from other organisms plus science is coming (and has come) to the point of being able to synthesize entire cells without the use of previously living organisms . . .
Minister Of Trolling
: At 12/6/2011 2:21:41 PM, badger wrote:
: ugly people should beat beautiful people ugly. simple! you'd be killing two birds with the one stone... women like violent men and you're making yourself more attractive, relatively. i met a blonde dude who was prettier than me not so long ago. he's not so pretty now! ha!
:
: ...and well, he wasn't really prettier than me. he just had nice hair.
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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12/14/2010 7:44:03 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 12/14/2010 7:37:25 PM, SuperRobotWars wrote:
At 12/14/2010 7:32:51 PM, FREEDO wrote:
This wonderful news. We need more abortions, stat!

We can harvest them from other organisms plus science is coming (and has come) to the point of being able to synthesize entire cells without the use of previously living organisms . . .

Aw darn.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
SuperRobotWars
Posts: 3,906
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12/14/2010 7:51:30 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 12/14/2010 7:48:58 PM, TulleKrazy wrote:
At 12/14/2010 7:32:51 PM, FREEDO wrote:
This wonderful news. We need more abortions, stat!

o_O Umbilical cords ftw.

As a wise robot war once said "We can harvest them from other organisms plus science is coming (and has come) to the point of being able to synthesize entire cells without the use of previously living organisms . . ."
Minister Of Trolling
: At 12/6/2011 2:21:41 PM, badger wrote:
: ugly people should beat beautiful people ugly. simple! you'd be killing two birds with the one stone... women like violent men and you're making yourself more attractive, relatively. i met a blonde dude who was prettier than me not so long ago. he's not so pretty now! ha!
:
: ...and well, he wasn't really prettier than me. he just had nice hair.
nonentity
Posts: 5,008
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12/14/2010 8:00:04 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 12/14/2010 7:51:30 PM, SuperRobotWars wrote:
At 12/14/2010 7:48:58 PM, TulleKrazy wrote:
At 12/14/2010 7:32:51 PM, FREEDO wrote:
This wonderful news. We need more abortions, stat!

o_O Umbilical cords ftw.

As a wise robot war once said "We can harvest them from other organisms plus science is coming (and has come) to the point of being able to synthesize entire cells without the use of previously living organisms . . ."

I'm curious... how?
Ren
Posts: 7,102
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12/14/2010 8:28:52 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 12/14/2010 8:00:04 PM, TulleKrazy wrote:
At 12/14/2010 7:51:30 PM, SuperRobotWars wrote:
At 12/14/2010 7:48:58 PM, TulleKrazy wrote:
At 12/14/2010 7:32:51 PM, FREEDO wrote:
This wonderful news. We need more abortions, stat!

o_O Umbilical cords ftw.

As a wise robot war once said "We can harvest them from other organisms plus science is coming (and has come) to the point of being able to synthesize entire cells without the use of previously living organisms . . ."

I'm curious... how?

http://en.wikipedia.org...
belle
Posts: 4,113
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12/14/2010 11:21:43 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 12/14/2010 4:15:25 PM, Ren wrote:
First, I think it's funny, how you attempted to make my proposition sound weaker by claiming that a genetic marker is "broken." In fact, the CR5 allele is actually absent

um no. the gene is broken- the deletion of 32 base pairs (hence the allele being named "delta 32") in the DNA coding for the protein renders the final product unusable- broken.

That leads me to my second point. It's not that they aren't certain that it was caused by an illness; it's that they aren't certain whether it was the bubonic plague or smallpox. That what caused these people to develop an this immunity, they are certain it is one of these two illnesses. I did think that this immunity occurred in Asians, as well; if you look at the distribution of HIV, it's relatively rare in Asian countries. But, in the reference that I posted, originating from PBS, they say that this mutation is absent in Asians, as well:

ok.

Care to cite that these people are immune to only "one type of HIV?"

"Certain populations have inherited the Delta 32 mutation resulting in the genetic deletion of a portion of the CCR5 gene. Homozygous carriers of this mutation are resistant to M-tropic strains of HIV-1 infection.[3]"
http://en.wikipedia.org...

also if you read the abstract from the original study it specifically mentions which strains of HIV this mutation is effective against:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...

I've never heard of or seen such a thing regarding these studies. The HIV virus in general requires the protein absent in the individuals to which my post refers in order to access human cells. So, you must be indicating some special type of HIV that uses another protein or a new means altogether to access cells and that is a very fascinating strain, indeed. I'd love to hear more about it.

some strains of HIV are also capable of using CXCR4 receptors, as the study linked by korask shows, and, i quote "This was observed although recovered CD4+ T cells contain a high proportion of activated memory CD4+ T cells, i.e. the preferential targets of HIV, and are susceptible to productive infection with CXCR4-tropic HIV"

Now, you derisively asked how it's shocking that an immunity to one disease translates into immunity to another. But, one can easily take this seriously and answer that it's nearly unheard of in medical science.

oh really? because you just said yourself that the CCR5 mutation spread due to selective pressures involving both smallpox and the plague. it seems that something about this receptor heightens the risk of infections from TWO other infectious diseases already. a third doesn't suddenly signal conspiracy. perhaps we should look more closely at the structure and function of the receptor... it would might lead to a deeper understanding of disease in general.

Now, you said that "many white people and Asians have died from the disease." Now, apparently, whether it includes Asians is controversial. But, relatively speaking on a global scale, not many white and Asian people have died from the disease at all. It has mostly affected those that have had previous exposure to the bubonic plague and smallpox. But, I've already driven that point home, hmm?

and? HIV arose in africa and is not airbourne. it makes perfect sense that in the place where it originated (and where the church tells people NOT to use condoms to protect themselves from infection) the infection would be most widespread. there are more malaria deaths in africa than anywhere else in the world. is that a conspiracy too?
evidently i only come to ddo to avoid doing homework...
nonentity
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12/15/2010 9:57:08 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 12/14/2010 11:21:43 PM, belle wrote:
and? HIV arose in africa and is not airbourne. it makes perfect sense that in the place where it originated (and where the church tells people NOT to use condoms to protect themselves from infection) the infection would be most widespread. there are more malaria deaths in africa than anywhere else in the world. is that a conspiracy too?

That doesn't explain the high rate of HIV among black Americans... just sayin'. :p