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What's the excuse this time...

ford_prefect
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9/19/2016 11:49:54 PM
Posted: 2 months ago
For a Tulsa police officer shooting and killing unarmed Terence Crutcher?

Betty Shelby is a murderous thug and a terrorist, plain and simple. I would feel much safer as an American with her off the streets. We simply cannot have people killing at will because they think themselves above the law. Cold blooded murder should be punished by life in prison. If the courts won't convict her, then to protect the lives of innocent Americans, street gangs should declare open season on her.
Axon85
Posts: 137
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9/20/2016 12:21:23 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/19/2016 11:49:54 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
For a Tulsa police officer shooting and killing unarmed Terence Crutcher?

Betty Shelby is a murderous thug and a terrorist, plain and simple. I would feel much safer as an American with her off the streets. We simply cannot have people killing at will because they think themselves above the law. Cold blooded murder should be punished by life in prison. If the courts won't convict her, then to protect the lives of innocent Americans, street gangs should declare open season on her.

Can you post a link with details?
popculturepooka
Posts: 7,924
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9/20/2016 12:30:50 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/20/2016 12:21:23 AM, Axon85 wrote:
At 9/19/2016 11:49:54 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
For a Tulsa police officer shooting and killing unarmed Terence Crutcher?

Betty Shelby is a murderous thug and a terrorist, plain and simple. I would feel much safer as an American with her off the streets. We simply cannot have people killing at will because they think themselves above the law. Cold blooded murder should be punished by life in prison. If the courts won't convict her, then to protect the lives of innocent Americans, street gangs should declare open season on her.

Can you post a link with details?

http://www.nydailynews.com...
At 10/3/2016 11:49:13 PM, thett3 wrote:
BLACK LIVES MATTER!
popculturepooka
Posts: 7,924
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9/20/2016 12:36:27 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/19/2016 11:49:54 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
For a Tulsa police officer shooting and killing unarmed Terence Crutcher?

Betty Shelby is a murderous thug and a terrorist, plain and simple. I would feel much safer as an American with her off the streets. We simply cannot have people killing at will because they think themselves above the law. Cold blooded murder should be punished by life in prison. If the courts won't convict her, then to protect the lives of innocent Americans, street gangs should declare open season on her.

You know what the excuses will be. "What about Chicago? He was reaching for his waistband! This is an isolated incident!" etc etc
At 10/3/2016 11:49:13 PM, thett3 wrote:
BLACK LIVES MATTER!
slo1
Posts: 4,351
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9/20/2016 12:37:03 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/19/2016 11:49:54 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
For a Tulsa police officer shooting and killing unarmed Terence Crutcher?

Betty Shelby is a murderous thug and a terrorist, plain and simple. I would feel much safer as an American with her off the streets. We simply cannot have people killing at will because they think themselves above the law. Cold blooded murder should be punished by life in prison. If the courts won't convict her, then to protect the lives of innocent Americans, street gangs should declare open season on her.

What is just as sad is that many people in America don't believe there is a problem with policing nor dark skinned people can be discriminated against due to bias.

The audio apparently captured that one cop said he looks like a bad dude.

http://www.nydailynews.com...
Axon85
Posts: 137
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9/20/2016 12:57:06 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/19/2016 11:49:54 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
For a Tulsa police officer shooting and killing unarmed Terence Crutcher?

Betty Shelby is a murderous thug and a terrorist, plain and simple. I would feel much safer as an American with her off the streets. We simply cannot have people killing at will because they think themselves above the law. Cold blooded murder should be punished by life in prison. If the courts won't convict her, then to protect the lives of innocent Americans, street gangs should declare open season on her.

From the video, it is little difficult to tell exactly what happened in the moments leading up to the shooting. It seems the individual does have his hands in the air initially although he does not appear to be complying. However, as he approaches the vehicle it looks as if he might be reaching into the car window. Again, I admit it is very difficult to make out. Hopefully, a thorough investigation will shed more light on those few moments.

In the meantime, I am not at all convinced that Betty Shelby is a "murderous thug and a terrorist". She may be just a regular police officer who legitimately feared for her life.
ford_prefect
Posts: 4,139
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9/20/2016 1:00:16 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/20/2016 12:57:06 AM, Axon85 wrote:
At 9/19/2016 11:49:54 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
For a Tulsa police officer shooting and killing unarmed Terence Crutcher?

Betty Shelby is a murderous thug and a terrorist, plain and simple. I would feel much safer as an American with her off the streets. We simply cannot have people killing at will because they think themselves above the law. Cold blooded murder should be punished by life in prison. If the courts won't convict her, then to protect the lives of innocent Americans, street gangs should declare open season on her.

From the video, it is little difficult to tell exactly what happened in the moments leading up to the shooting. It seems the individual does have his hands in the air initially although he does not appear to be complying. However, as he approaches the vehicle it looks as if he might be reaching into the car window. Again, I admit it is very difficult to make out. Hopefully, a thorough investigation will shed more light on those few moments.

In the meantime, I am not at all convinced that Betty Shelby is a "murderous thug and a terrorist". She may be just a regular police officer who legitimately feared for her life.

You realize the video shows at least 4 officers surrounding one suspect who was slowly walking with his hands up? Pardon my french but if you are that much of a little pu$$y to be frightened in that scenario, then what the Fvk are you doing working as a police officer?
ford_prefect
Posts: 4,139
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9/20/2016 1:08:13 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
I grew up in a poor, overwhelmingly non-white neighborhood. I've had exactly the same number of positive interactions with criminals as I have with police officers: ZERO.

I've actually also had the same number of negative experiences with cops and with criminals: one each.

That is pathetic. Cops are at best useless in this country, unless you're rich and white. At worst, they will murder you.

Why do I have to pay their salaries again? I don't mind letting the rich white guys hire them as private security for their gated mansions, but jail the bastards who kill innocents.
PetersSmith
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9/20/2016 1:09:31 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/19/2016 11:49:54 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
For a Tulsa police officer shooting and killing unarmed Terence Crutcher?

Betty Shelby is a murderous thug and a terrorist, plain and simple. I would feel much safer as an American with her off the streets. We simply cannot have people killing at will because they think themselves above the law. Cold blooded murder should be punished by life in prison. If the courts won't convict her, then to protect the lives of innocent Americans, street gangs should declare open season on her.

I just want to know why there was a police helicopter, more than one police car, and they all already had their guns on him even though the perceived problem was that the car broke down. Triple A should have been there, not a police squad ready for a fire-fight. Something else must have been going on.
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Axon85
Posts: 137
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9/20/2016 1:21:08 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/20/2016 1:00:16 AM, ford_prefect wrote:
At 9/20/2016 12:57:06 AM, Axon85 wrote:
At 9/19/2016 11:49:54 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
For a Tulsa police officer shooting and killing unarmed Terence Crutcher?

Betty Shelby is a murderous thug and a terrorist, plain and simple. I would feel much safer as an American with her off the streets. We simply cannot have people killing at will because they think themselves above the law. Cold blooded murder should be punished by life in prison. If the courts won't convict her, then to protect the lives of innocent Americans, street gangs should declare open season on her.

From the video, it is little difficult to tell exactly what happened in the moments leading up to the shooting. It seems the individual does have his hands in the air initially although he does not appear to be complying. However, as he approaches the vehicle it looks as if he might be reaching into the car window. Again, I admit it is very difficult to make out. Hopefully, a thorough investigation will shed more light on those few moments.

In the meantime, I am not at all convinced that Betty Shelby is a "murderous thug and a terrorist". She may be just a regular police officer who legitimately feared for her life.

You realize the video shows at least 4 officers surrounding one suspect who was slowly walking with his hands up? Pardon my french but if you are that much of a little pu$$y to be frightened in that scenario, then what the Fvk are you doing working as a police officer?

Correct. I see the suspect walking slowly with his hands up surrounded by 4 officers, and if he got shot under those circumstances then this is a wrongful shooting. However, it later appears as if he lowers his hands. Whether his hands were at his side or he was reaching into the car or into his waistband, I don't know. However, some of those scenarios do constitute a legitimate threat. I don't think one has to be a "little pu$$y" in order to fear for their life.
ford_prefect
Posts: 4,139
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9/20/2016 1:21:44 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/20/2016 1:09:31 AM, PetersSmith wrote:
At 9/19/2016 11:49:54 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
For a Tulsa police officer shooting and killing unarmed Terence Crutcher?

Betty Shelby is a murderous thug and a terrorist, plain and simple. I would feel much safer as an American with her off the streets. We simply cannot have people killing at will because they think themselves above the law. Cold blooded murder should be punished by life in prison. If the courts won't convict her, then to protect the lives of innocent Americans, street gangs should declare open season on her.

I just want to know why there was a police helicopter, more than one police car, and they all already had their guns on him even though the perceived problem was that the car broke down. Triple A should have been there, not a police squad ready for a fire-fight. Something else must have been going on.

Regardless of what else was or wasn't going on, the videos show a helicopter and multiple officers surrounding a single unarmed suspect who was not even close to behaving in a threatening manner. And they still shot him dead. Do you think that's right?
ford_prefect
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9/20/2016 1:29:23 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/20/2016 1:21:08 AM, Axon85 wrote:
At 9/20/2016 1:00:16 AM, ford_prefect wrote:
At 9/20/2016 12:57:06 AM, Axon85 wrote:
At 9/19/2016 11:49:54 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
For a Tulsa police officer shooting and killing unarmed Terence Crutcher?

Betty Shelby is a murderous thug and a terrorist, plain and simple. I would feel much safer as an American with her off the streets. We simply cannot have people killing at will because they think themselves above the law. Cold blooded murder should be punished by life in prison. If the courts won't convict her, then to protect the lives of innocent Americans, street gangs should declare open season on her.

From the video, it is little difficult to tell exactly what happened in the moments leading up to the shooting. It seems the individual does have his hands in the air initially although he does not appear to be complying. However, as he approaches the vehicle it looks as if he might be reaching into the car window. Again, I admit it is very difficult to make out. Hopefully, a thorough investigation will shed more light on those few moments.

In the meantime, I am not at all convinced that Betty Shelby is a "murderous thug and a terrorist". She may be just a regular police officer who legitimately feared for her life.

You realize the video shows at least 4 officers surrounding one suspect who was slowly walking with his hands up? Pardon my french but if you are that much of a little pu$$y to be frightened in that scenario, then what the Fvk are you doing working as a police officer?

Correct. I see the suspect walking slowly with his hands up surrounded by 4 officers, and if he got shot under those circumstances then this is a wrongful shooting. However, it later appears as if he lowers his hands. Whether his hands were at his side or he was reaching into the car or into his waistband, I don't know. However, some of those scenarios do constitute a legitimate threat. I don't think one has to be a "little pu$$y" in order to fear for their life.

You realize cops frequently interact with people who are not "possibly reaching for a weapon" but who actually have a gun in their hands or strapped to their back? If only there were some pattern or common attribute separating which people the cops talk to and try to deescalate the situation, and which people they just execute on the spot.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk...

Do you think police should have unloaded on these guys? I wonder why they didn't. I'd certainly be concerned for my safety around them.
popculturepooka
Posts: 7,924
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9/20/2016 1:35:45 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/20/2016 1:21:08 AM, Axon85 wrote:
At 9/20/2016 1:00:16 AM, ford_prefect wrote:
At 9/20/2016 12:57:06 AM, Axon85 wrote:
At 9/19/2016 11:49:54 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
For a Tulsa police officer shooting and killing unarmed Terence Crutcher?

Betty Shelby is a murderous thug and a terrorist, plain and simple. I would feel much safer as an American with her off the streets. We simply cannot have people killing at will because they think themselves above the law. Cold blooded murder should be punished by life in prison. If the courts won't convict her, then to protect the lives of innocent Americans, street gangs should declare open season on her.

From the video, it is little difficult to tell exactly what happened in the moments leading up to the shooting. It seems the individual does have his hands in the air initially although he does not appear to be complying. However, as he approaches the vehicle it looks as if he might be reaching into the car window. Again, I admit it is very difficult to make out. Hopefully, a thorough investigation will shed more light on those few moments.

In the meantime, I am not at all convinced that Betty Shelby is a "murderous thug and a terrorist". She may be just a regular police officer who legitimately feared for her life.

You realize the video shows at least 4 officers surrounding one suspect who was slowly walking with his hands up? Pardon my french but if you are that much of a little pu$$y to be frightened in that scenario, then what the Fvk are you doing working as a police officer?

Correct. I see the suspect walking slowly with his hands up surrounded by 4 officers, and if he got shot under those circumstances then this is a wrongful shooting. However, it later appears as if he lowers his hands.

Yes, after he got tazed...

Whether his hands were at his side or he was reaching into the car or into his waistband, I don't know. However, some of those scenarios do constitute a legitimate threat. I don't think one has to be a "little pu$$y" in order to fear for their life.
At 10/3/2016 11:49:13 PM, thett3 wrote:
BLACK LIVES MATTER!
Axon85
Posts: 137
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9/20/2016 2:15:59 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/20/2016 1:29:23 AM, ford_prefect wrote:
At 9/20/2016 1:21:08 AM, Axon85 wrote:
At 9/20/2016 1:00:16 AM, ford_prefect wrote:
At 9/20/2016 12:57:06 AM, Axon85 wrote:
At 9/19/2016 11:49:54 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
For a Tulsa police officer shooting and killing unarmed Terence Crutcher?

Betty Shelby is a murderous thug and a terrorist, plain and simple. I would feel much safer as an American with her off the streets. We simply cannot have people killing at will because they think themselves above the law. Cold blooded murder should be punished by life in prison. If the courts won't convict her, then to protect the lives of innocent Americans, street gangs should declare open season on her.

From the video, it is little difficult to tell exactly what happened in the moments leading up to the shooting. It seems the individual does have his hands in the air initially although he does not appear to be complying. However, as he approaches the vehicle it looks as if he might be reaching into the car window. Again, I admit it is very difficult to make out. Hopefully, a thorough investigation will shed more light on those few moments.

In the meantime, I am not at all convinced that Betty Shelby is a "murderous thug and a terrorist". She may be just a regular police officer who legitimately feared for her life.

You realize the video shows at least 4 officers surrounding one suspect who was slowly walking with his hands up? Pardon my french but if you are that much of a little pu$$y to be frightened in that scenario, then what the Fvk are you doing working as a police officer?

Correct. I see the suspect walking slowly with his hands up surrounded by 4 officers, and if he got shot under those circumstances then this is a wrongful shooting. However, it later appears as if he lowers his hands. Whether his hands were at his side or he was reaching into the car or into his waistband, I don't know. However, some of those scenarios do constitute a legitimate threat. I don't think one has to be a "little pu$$y" in order to fear for their life.

You realize cops frequently interact with people who are not "possibly reaching for a weapon" but who actually have a gun in their hands or strapped to their back? If only there were some pattern or common attribute separating which people the cops talk to and try to deescalate the situation, and which people they just execute on the spot.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk...

Do you think police should have unloaded on these guys? I wonder why they didn't. I'd certainly be concerned for my safety around them.

Those scenarios are not even remotely analogous. Secondly, you seem to be insinuating that this individual was shot due to his skin color and had he been white, police would have done more to de-escalate.

The police kill ~1000 people per year. Some white, some black. Sometimes the police successfully de-escalate the situation with a black person, other times with a white person. Sometimes the police end up killing a black person, other times they kill a white person. However, only a tiny % of these cases receive any media attention so this is a biased sample. By arbitrarily selecting only certain cases, I can muster support any narrative of my choosing.

Were these particular cops racist? I have no idea. For all I know, they just returned from a klan meeting. Or maybe unconscious racial bias made them more trigger happy, Or maybe they are not racist at all. Unless you have some way of definitively adjudicating between these possibilities, I suggest we put the topic aside since it will only result in tenuous conjecture.
Axon85
Posts: 137
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9/20/2016 2:22:52 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/20/2016 1:35:45 AM, popculturepooka wrote:
At 9/20/2016 1:21:08 AM, Axon85 wrote:
At 9/20/2016 1:00:16 AM, ford_prefect wrote:
At 9/20/2016 12:57:06 AM, Axon85 wrote:
At 9/19/2016 11:49:54 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
For a Tulsa police officer shooting and killing unarmed Terence Crutcher?

Betty Shelby is a murderous thug and a terrorist, plain and simple. I would feel much safer as an American with her off the streets. We simply cannot have people killing at will because they think themselves above the law. Cold blooded murder should be punished by life in prison. If the courts won't convict her, then to protect the lives of innocent Americans, street gangs should declare open season on her.

From the video, it is little difficult to tell exactly what happened in the moments leading up to the shooting. It seems the individual does have his hands in the air initially although he does not appear to be complying. However, as he approaches the vehicle it looks as if he might be reaching into the car window. Again, I admit it is very difficult to make out. Hopefully, a thorough investigation will shed more light on those few moments.

In the meantime, I am not at all convinced that Betty Shelby is a "murderous thug and a terrorist". She may be just a regular police officer who legitimately feared for her life.

You realize the video shows at least 4 officers surrounding one suspect who was slowly walking with his hands up? Pardon my french but if you are that much of a little pu$$y to be frightened in that scenario, then what the Fvk are you doing working as a police officer?

Correct. I see the suspect walking slowly with his hands up surrounded by 4 officers, and if he got shot under those circumstances then this is a wrongful shooting. However, it later appears as if he lowers his hands.

Yes, after he got tazed...


Perhaps you have more expertise in analysing such videos. I personally cannot tell whether he was initially tazed before or after he lowered his hands. The second question refers to what he was doing with his hands. Did he reach into his waistband or into the car? I honestly can't tell from the video. Thirdly, what were the events leading up this encounter? Did they just draw on him for no reason?

I see no choice but to wait for the results of the investigation before taking a side.
Axon85
Posts: 137
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9/20/2016 3:06:55 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
As it relates to the title of this thread, it's not about making excuses (either for the cop or the suspect), at least it shouldn't be. It's about waiting for the evidence, putting aside preconceived notions and group loyalties, and making an educated decision. Most people jump to conclusions in these situations, and some will end up jumping to the correct conclusion purely as a matter of chance (as opposed to insight). As I see it, questions remain that can sway the interpretation of these tragic events. If it turns out that there was no credible threat (real or perceived), then I will join in the condemnation of this officer. Until then, I have no interest in jumping on emotional bandwagons.
Axonly
Posts: 1,802
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9/20/2016 4:42:48 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
street gangs should declare open season on her.

That doesn't seem very sensible.
Meh!
ford_prefect
Posts: 4,139
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9/20/2016 5:25:09 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/20/2016 2:15:59 AM, Axon85 wrote:
At 9/20/2016 1:29:23 AM, ford_prefect wrote:
At 9/20/2016 1:21:08 AM, Axon85 wrote:
At 9/20/2016 1:00:16 AM, ford_prefect wrote:
At 9/20/2016 12:57:06 AM, Axon85 wrote:
At 9/19/2016 11:49:54 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
For a Tulsa police officer shooting and killing unarmed Terence Crutcher?

Betty Shelby is a murderous thug and a terrorist, plain and simple. I would feel much safer as an American with her off the streets. We simply cannot have people killing at will because they think themselves above the law. Cold blooded murder should be punished by life in prison. If the courts won't convict her, then to protect the lives of innocent Americans, street gangs should declare open season on her.

From the video, it is little difficult to tell exactly what happened in the moments leading up to the shooting. It seems the individual does have his hands in the air initially although he does not appear to be complying. However, as he approaches the vehicle it looks as if he might be reaching into the car window. Again, I admit it is very difficult to make out. Hopefully, a thorough investigation will shed more light on those few moments.

In the meantime, I am not at all convinced that Betty Shelby is a "murderous thug and a terrorist". She may be just a regular police officer who legitimately feared for her life.

You realize the video shows at least 4 officers surrounding one suspect who was slowly walking with his hands up? Pardon my french but if you are that much of a little pu$$y to be frightened in that scenario, then what the Fvk are you doing working as a police officer?

Correct. I see the suspect walking slowly with his hands up surrounded by 4 officers, and if he got shot under those circumstances then this is a wrongful shooting. However, it later appears as if he lowers his hands. Whether his hands were at his side or he was reaching into the car or into his waistband, I don't know. However, some of those scenarios do constitute a legitimate threat. I don't think one has to be a "little pu$$y" in order to fear for their life.

You realize cops frequently interact with people who are not "possibly reaching for a weapon" but who actually have a gun in their hands or strapped to their back? If only there were some pattern or common attribute separating which people the cops talk to and try to deescalate the situation, and which people they just execute on the spot.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk...

Do you think police should have unloaded on these guys? I wonder why they didn't. I'd certainly be concerned for my safety around them.

Those scenarios are not even remotely analogous. Secondly, you seem to be insinuating that this individual was shot due to his skin color and had he been white, police would have done more to de-escalate.

The police kill ~1000 people per year. Some white, some black. Sometimes the police successfully de-escalate the situation with a black person, other times with a white person. Sometimes the police end up killing a black person, other times they kill a white person. However, only a tiny % of these cases receive any media attention so this is a biased sample. By arbitrarily selecting only certain cases, I can muster support any narrative of my choosing.

Were these particular cops racist? I have no idea. For all I know, they just returned from a klan meeting. Or maybe unconscious racial bias made them more trigger happy, Or maybe they are not racist at all. Unless you have some way of definitively adjudicating between these possibilities, I suggest we put the topic aside since it will only result in tenuous conjecture.

I suggest we actually arrest the murderer for once and charge them. No other profession is allowed to shoot people dead with no repercussions. If literally anyone else in America had shot that man dead, they'd be under arrest, facing charges right now. But it was a cop so instead she goes on paid vacation with our tax dollars. But I guess that doesn't matter to apologists for these violent thugs.
ford_prefect
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9/20/2016 5:30:21 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/20/2016 4:42:48 AM, Axonly wrote:
street gangs should declare open season on her.

That doesn't seem very sensible.

It's a matter of public safety. At this point, nobody expects cops to protect poor people and minorities, but we should be able to at least expect them not to murder innocents. If cops and prosecutors protect their own thugs from criminal consequences, someone else needs to hold them accountable.
Axonly
Posts: 1,802
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9/20/2016 6:00:57 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/20/2016 5:30:21 AM, ford_prefect wrote:
At 9/20/2016 4:42:48 AM, Axonly wrote:
street gangs should declare open season on her.

That doesn't seem very sensible.

It's a matter of public safety. At this point, nobody expects cops to protect poor people and minorities, but we should be able to at least expect them not to murder innocents. If cops and prosecutors protect their own thugs from criminal consequences, someone else needs to hold them accountable.

I wonder how many people would be killed if gang warfare was allowed/encouraged
Meh!
Axon85
Posts: 137
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9/20/2016 7:22:24 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/20/2016 5:25:09 AM, ford_prefect wrote:
At 9/20/2016 2:15:59 AM, Axon85 wrote:
At 9/20/2016 1:29:23 AM, ford_prefect wrote:
At 9/20/2016 1:21:08 AM, Axon85 wrote:
At 9/20/2016 1:00:16 AM, ford_prefect wrote:
At 9/20/2016 12:57:06 AM, Axon85 wrote:
At 9/19/2016 11:49:54 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
For a Tulsa police officer shooting and killing unarmed Terence Crutcher?

Betty Shelby is a murderous thug and a terrorist, plain and simple. I would feel much safer as an American with her off the streets. We simply cannot have people killing at will because they think themselves above the law. Cold blooded murder should be punished by life in prison. If the courts won't convict her, then to protect the lives of innocent Americans, street gangs should declare open season on her.

From the video, it is little difficult to tell exactly what happened in the moments leading up to the shooting. It seems the individual does have his hands in the air initially although he does not appear to be complying. However, as he approaches the vehicle it looks as if he might be reaching into the car window. Again, I admit it is very difficult to make out. Hopefully, a thorough investigation will shed more light on those few moments.

In the meantime, I am not at all convinced that Betty Shelby is a "murderous thug and a terrorist". She may be just a regular police officer who legitimately feared for her life.

You realize the video shows at least 4 officers surrounding one suspect who was slowly walking with his hands up? Pardon my french but if you are that much of a little pu$$y to be frightened in that scenario, then what the Fvk are you doing working as a police officer?

Correct. I see the suspect walking slowly with his hands up surrounded by 4 officers, and if he got shot under those circumstances then this is a wrongful shooting. However, it later appears as if he lowers his hands. Whether his hands were at his side or he was reaching into the car or into his waistband, I don't know. However, some of those scenarios do constitute a legitimate threat. I don't think one has to be a "little pu$$y" in order to fear for their life.

You realize cops frequently interact with people who are not "possibly reaching for a weapon" but who actually have a gun in their hands or strapped to their back? If only there were some pattern or common attribute separating which people the cops talk to and try to deescalate the situation, and which people they just execute on the spot.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk...

Do you think police should have unloaded on these guys? I wonder why they didn't. I'd certainly be concerned for my safety around them.

Those scenarios are not even remotely analogous. Secondly, you seem to be insinuating that this individual was shot due to his skin color and had he been white, police would have done more to de-escalate.

The police kill ~1000 people per year. Some white, some black. Sometimes the police successfully de-escalate the situation with a black person, other times with a white person. Sometimes the police end up killing a black person, other times they kill a white person. However, only a tiny % of these cases receive any media attention so this is a biased sample. By arbitrarily selecting only certain cases, I can muster support any narrative of my choosing.

Were these particular cops racist? I have no idea. For all I know, they just returned from a klan meeting. Or maybe unconscious racial bias made them more trigger happy, Or maybe they are not racist at all. Unless you have some way of definitively adjudicating between these possibilities, I suggest we put the topic aside since it will only result in tenuous conjecture.

I suggest we actually arrest the murderer for once and charge them. No other profession is allowed to shoot people dead with no repercussions. If literally anyone else in America had shot that man dead, they'd be under arrest, facing charges right now. But it was a cop so instead she goes on paid vacation with our tax dollars. But I guess that doesn't matter to apologists for these violent thugs.

Yes, a cop shot a man dead. I don't think that's in dispute. However, there are circumstances under which police are allowed to use deadly force.

The question, from a legal standpoint, is whether this officer found herself in a situation wherein a reasonable officer would be justified in fearing for their life.
FaustianJustice
Posts: 6,225
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9/20/2016 12:41:56 PM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/19/2016 11:49:54 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
For a Tulsa police officer shooting and killing unarmed Terence Crutcher?

Betty Shelby is a murderous thug and a terrorist, plain and simple. I would feel much safer as an American with her off the streets. We simply cannot have people killing at will because they think themselves above the law. Cold blooded murder should be punished by life in prison. If the courts won't convict her, then to protect the lives of innocent Americans, street gangs should declare open season on her.

I have been told that the individual in question failed to comply with the officer's orders of halting his walk toward his own vehicle.

I haven't been able to get hold of a full video yet, however if the individual disregards officer's orders, and continues to their own vehicle as opposed to say, getting on the ground, what do you expect would be the reason for ignoring such a request?
Here we have an advocate for Islamic arranged marriages demonstrating that children can consent to sex.
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AlyceTheElectrician
Posts: 233
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9/20/2016 1:17:52 PM
Posted: 2 months ago
Honestly, there are no excuses. The role of the police needs a recalibration towards monitoring criminal activity, investigating, and testifying in court, only intervening when lives are in imminent danger. It is not their role to be the judge, jury, and executioner.
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Fernyx
Posts: 326
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9/20/2016 1:33:22 PM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/19/2016 11:49:54 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
For a Tulsa police officer shooting and killing unarmed Terence Crutcher?

Betty Shelby is a murderous thug and a terrorist, plain and simple. I would feel much safer as an American with her off the streets. We simply cannot have people killing at will because they think themselves above the law. Cold blooded murder should be punished by life in prison. If the courts won't convict her, then to protect the lives of innocent Americans, street gangs should declare open season on her.

I'll admit there is a police brutality issue, but the issue is police brutality, not racism.
ford_prefect
Posts: 4,139
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9/20/2016 10:38:47 PM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/20/2016 1:17:52 PM, AlyceTheElectrician wrote:
Honestly, there are no excuses. The role of the police needs a recalibration towards monitoring criminal activity, investigating, and testifying in court, only intervening when lives are in imminent danger. It is not their role to be the judge, jury, and executioner.

Agreed
kevin24018
Posts: 1,880
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9/20/2016 10:44:36 PM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/19/2016 11:49:54 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
For a Tulsa police officer shooting and killing unarmed Terence Crutcher?

Betty Shelby is a murderous thug and a terrorist, plain and simple. I would feel much safer as an American with her off the streets. We simply cannot have people killing at will because they think themselves above the law. Cold blooded murder should be punished by life in prison. If the courts won't convict her, then to protect the lives of innocent Americans, street gangs should declare open season on her.

Judged her guilty before all the evidence and facts know have we? You liberals will never learn, go put your head back in the sand.
kevin24018
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9/20/2016 10:45:49 PM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/20/2016 12:57:06 AM, Axon85 wrote:
At 9/19/2016 11:49:54 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
For a Tulsa police officer shooting and killing unarmed Terence Crutcher?

Betty Shelby is a murderous thug and a terrorist, plain and simple. I would feel much safer as an American with her off the streets. We simply cannot have people killing at will because they think themselves above the law. Cold blooded murder should be punished by life in prison. If the courts won't convict her, then to protect the lives of innocent Americans, street gangs should declare open season on her.

From the video, it is little difficult to tell exactly what happened in the moments leading up to the shooting. It seems the individual does have his hands in the air initially although he does not appear to be complying. However, as he approaches the vehicle it looks as if he might be reaching into the car window. Again, I admit it is very difficult to make out. Hopefully, a thorough investigation will shed more light on those few moments.

In the meantime, I am not at all convinced that Betty Shelby is a "murderous thug and a terrorist". She may be just a regular police officer who legitimately feared for her life.

You are talking to liberals, it's falling on deaf ears, but I agree with you, however if you can't play the blame game they will take their toys and go home.
ford_prefect
Posts: 4,139
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9/20/2016 10:47:48 PM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/20/2016 12:41:56 PM, FaustianJustice wrote:
At 9/19/2016 11:49:54 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
For a Tulsa police officer shooting and killing unarmed Terence Crutcher?

Betty Shelby is a murderous thug and a terrorist, plain and simple. I would feel much safer as an American with her off the streets. We simply cannot have people killing at will because they think themselves above the law. Cold blooded murder should be punished by life in prison. If the courts won't convict her, then to protect the lives of innocent Americans, street gangs should declare open season on her.

I have been told that the individual in question failed to comply with the officer's orders of halting his walk toward his own vehicle.

I haven't been able to get hold of a full video yet, however if the individual disregards officer's orders, and continues to their own vehicle as opposed to say, getting on the ground, what do you expect would be the reason for ignoring such a request?

There could be many reasons, including but not limited to:

1) He didn't hear the command.
2) He didn't understand the command.
3) He was confused because the officers issued conflicting demands (stand still, hands up, get down, show us your license, etc)
4) He feared the thugs would shoot him no matter what he did, so he tried to flee
5) He knew he had done nothing wrong so he refused to get down on the ground
6) He wanted to get his AK47 out from the car and mow down the officers who were so scared that they couldn't even hold their fire until they saw whether he had a gun or not

So tell me, of these reasons, which do you think a man deserves to die for? Do you think the police should always just assume it's #6? Also should the right to execute people for walking to their car be reserved for cops alone? Or can I do it to the 2nd amendment nuts too?
ford_prefect
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9/20/2016 10:50:01 PM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/20/2016 10:44:36 PM, kevin24018 wrote:
At 9/19/2016 11:49:54 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
For a Tulsa police officer shooting and killing unarmed Terence Crutcher?

Betty Shelby is a murderous thug and a terrorist, plain and simple. I would feel much safer as an American with her off the streets. We simply cannot have people killing at will because they think themselves above the law. Cold blooded murder should be punished by life in prison. If the courts won't convict her, then to protect the lives of innocent Americans, street gangs should declare open season on her.

Judged her guilty before all the evidence and facts know have we? You liberals will never learn, go put your head back in the sand.

Did you even watch the video? She's a cowardly thug who threatens the safety of innocent Americans. Maybe next time she will shoot your dad dead and then you'll be singing a different tune.
kevin24018
Posts: 1,880
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9/20/2016 10:55:17 PM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 9/20/2016 10:50:01 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
At 9/20/2016 10:44:36 PM, kevin24018 wrote:
At 9/19/2016 11:49:54 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
For a Tulsa police officer shooting and killing unarmed Terence Crutcher?

Betty Shelby is a murderous thug and a terrorist, plain and simple. I would feel much safer as an American with her off the streets. We simply cannot have people killing at will because they think themselves above the law. Cold blooded murder should be punished by life in prison. If the courts won't convict her, then to protect the lives of innocent Americans, street gangs should declare open season on her.

Judged her guilty before all the evidence and facts know have we? You liberals will never learn, go put your head back in the sand.

Did you even watch the video? She's a cowardly thug who threatens the safety of innocent Americans. Maybe next time she will shoot your dad dead and then you'll be singing a different tune.

typical liberal so ignorant, hostile and judgmental, clearly your insight and prognosticating powers are far beyond ours, could you tell me the winning lottery numbers too?