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Alternate Timeline . . .

SuperRobotWars
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1/19/2011 6:19:26 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
Suppose Africa during the age of discovery unified, and made the trade with the Arabic empires the utmost priority, as well as created much more advanced technologies and the implementation of a unified standing military, China stopped being overly internalized, and continued technological advancement, and the Aztec conquered the Incas and stopped the ritual sacrifice and mass funneling of resources towards religion . . . ?
Minister Of Trolling
: At 12/6/2011 2:21:41 PM, badger wrote:
: ugly people should beat beautiful people ugly. simple! you'd be killing two birds with the one stone... women like violent men and you're making yourself more attractive, relatively. i met a blonde dude who was prettier than me not so long ago. he's not so pretty now! ha!
:
: ...and well, he wasn't really prettier than me. he just had nice hair.
Puck
Posts: 6,457
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1/19/2011 6:37:33 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/19/2011 6:19:26 AM, SuperRobotWars wrote:
Suppose Africa during the age of discovery unified, and made the trade with the Arabic empires the utmost priority

Trading what? How large a nation? How unified? How diverse? What does the Mid East do? Remain contained? An alliance might threaten the Mediterranean were they so inclined.

as well as created much more advanced technologies

Such as?

and the implementation of a unified standing military,

Are they militaristic towards Europe? Portugal was the major colonist of Africa, France dabbled. You might change trade routes - India might conceivably be less important.

China stopped being overly internalized, and continued technological advancement

So ... they conquered more? Korea, Japan disappear I guess.

and the Aztec conquered the Incas and stopped the ritual sacrifice and mass funneling of resources towards religion . . . ?

That one very little difference. Since it was the Spanish that destroyed them.
SuperRobotWars
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1/19/2011 3:12:50 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Africa and China both entered into a industrial revolution level of technology . . .
Aztecs learned how to produce steel, gunpowder, and relatively advanced ships (at a similar level to that of the Spaniards fleet at the time) . . .
Africa adopted a modified version of Arabic and Egyptian as their official writing systems and opened public schools . . .
Aztecs simplified N'ahuatl and opened public schools . . .
Africa and China begin the construction of ironclad vessels, cartridge rounds, and breech lock weapons, as well as the use of bombs . . .
Minister Of Trolling
: At 12/6/2011 2:21:41 PM, badger wrote:
: ugly people should beat beautiful people ugly. simple! you'd be killing two birds with the one stone... women like violent men and you're making yourself more attractive, relatively. i met a blonde dude who was prettier than me not so long ago. he's not so pretty now! ha!
:
: ...and well, he wasn't really prettier than me. he just had nice hair.
Puck
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1/19/2011 3:28:30 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
By alternate I supposed nominally viable - since you just made it fantasy imagination world - anything goes. Which makes it kinda pointless as an exercise.

You'd probably enjoy http://scottwesterfeld.com...
SuperRobotWars
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1/19/2011 3:42:24 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/19/2011 3:28:30 PM, Puck wrote:
By alternate I supposed nominally viable - since you just made it fantasy imagination world - anything goes. Which makes it kinda pointless as an exercise.

You'd probably enjoy http://scottwesterfeld.com...

How so, I said prior to the age of discovery, in accordance to principle if China had continued advancing its technology it should have entered the age of the industrial revolution at a much faster rate, and if Africa had not encountered its own Dark Ag (due to climate issues) they could have been far more advanced especially with assistance from the Islamic world . . .
If Native Americans had invested more of their resources into technological development there is no reason that they could not have come to a level of technology in parallel to that of the early European Renaissance . . .
Plus its alternate history not our history . . .
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Minister Of Trolling
: At 12/6/2011 2:21:41 PM, badger wrote:
: ugly people should beat beautiful people ugly. simple! you'd be killing two birds with the one stone... women like violent men and you're making yourself more attractive, relatively. i met a blonde dude who was prettier than me not so long ago. he's not so pretty now! ha!
:
: ...and well, he wasn't really prettier than me. he just had nice hair.
Puck
Posts: 6,457
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1/19/2011 3:45:32 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/19/2011 3:42:24 PM, SuperRobotWars wrote:
Plus its alternate history not our history . . .
useless links

Yes, I did read the title. :P But your alternate is basically not following from anything precedent you set out in the opening post - you just jumped straight to 'tech up awesomness zomg' - which makes it a meaningless exercise because it doesn't arrive at anything in any meaningful manner.
SuperRobotWars
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1/19/2011 3:48:58 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/19/2011 3:45:32 PM, Puck wrote:
At 1/19/2011 3:42:24 PM, SuperRobotWars wrote:
Plus its alternate history not our history . . .
relevant information

Yes, I did read the title. :P But your alternate is basically not following from anything precedent you set out in the opening post - you just jumped straight to 'tech up awesomness zomg' - which makes it a meaningless exercise because it doesn't arrive at anything in any meaningful manner.

I am asking what do you think the future would hold for this alternate world . . . and if you don't like the given scenario come up with your own . . .
Minister Of Trolling
: At 12/6/2011 2:21:41 PM, badger wrote:
: ugly people should beat beautiful people ugly. simple! you'd be killing two birds with the one stone... women like violent men and you're making yourself more attractive, relatively. i met a blonde dude who was prettier than me not so long ago. he's not so pretty now! ha!
:
: ...and well, he wasn't really prettier than me. he just had nice hair.
HatedeatH
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1/19/2011 7:04:28 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Here's a better scenario: What if Germany would have won WW II?
vardas0antras: If Muhammad is great then why didn't he stop 911 ?
gavin.ogden: He was too busy starting it.
Puck
Posts: 6,457
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1/20/2011 12:09:31 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/19/2011 3:48:58 PM, SuperRobotWars wrote:
I am asking what do you think the future would hold for this alternate world . . . and if you don't like the given scenario come up with your own . . .

The issue is what you posited didn't follow from the original premises. Which is fine. Just call it imaginary. :P
Sangers
Posts: 419
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1/20/2011 12:51:06 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/19/2011 6:19:26 AM, SuperRobotWars wrote:
Suppose Africa during the age of discovery unified, and made the trade with the Arabic empires the utmost priority, as well as created much more advanced technologies and the implementation of a unified standing military, China stopped being overly internalized, and continued technological advancement, and the Aztec conquered the Incas and stopped the ritual sacrifice and mass funneling of resources towards religion . . . ?

There's a geographical explanation on why each continents developed differently. Africa's lack of trade is due to it having the shortest coastline, shallow ports unnavigable rivers and tropical climate. Asia on the other hand consists of flatlands and plains, allowing centralised empires like Ming and Manchu to form.

I don't think it's that simple to assume "What if" when it comes to history :P
Cerebral_Narcissist
Posts: 10,806
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1/20/2011 2:06:52 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/19/2011 6:19:26 AM, SuperRobotWars wrote:
Suppose Africa during the age of discovery unified, and made the trade with the Arabic empires the utmost priority, as well as created much more advanced technologies and the implementation of a unified standing military,

How is Africa supposed to just unify? Even today with modern technology and aid money most of its countries are failing.

China stopped being overly internalized, and continued technological advancement, and the Aztec conquered the Incas and stopped the ritual sacrifice and mass funneling of resources towards religion . . . ?

To write up a decent alternate timeline you need to find one reasonable deviation point. Like, what if Christopher Colombus was murdered halfway to the new world by his men, who decided to turn back? What if the Viking colonies in north america thrived. What if the gunpowder plot worked.

You need a reasonable departure, which results in reasonable (but not always obvious) ramifications.
I am voting for Innomen because of his intelligence, common sense, humility and the fact that Juggle appears to listen to him. Any other Presidential style would have a large sub-section of the site up in arms. If I was President I would destroy the site though elitism, others would let it run riot. Innomen represents a middle way that works, neither draconian nor anarchic and that is the only way things can work. Plus he does it all without ego trips.
tvellalott
Posts: 10,864
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1/20/2011 2:44:46 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/19/2011 3:12:50 PM, SuperRobotWars wrote:
Africa and China both entered into a industrial revolution level of technology . . .
Aztecs learned how to produce steel, gunpowder, and relatively advanced ships (at a similar level to that of the Spaniards fleet at the time) . . .
Africa adopted a modified version of Arabic and Egyptian as their official writing systems and opened public schools . . .
Aztecs simplified N'ahuatl and opened public schools . . .
Africa and China begin the construction of ironclad vessels, cartridge rounds, and breech lock weapons, as well as the use of bombs . . .

http://www.bookdepository.co.uk...
Read this, repose a logical scenario.
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SuperRobotWars
Posts: 3,906
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1/20/2011 2:53:58 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 2:06:52 AM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
At 1/19/2011 6:19:26 AM, SuperRobotWars wrote:
Suppose Africa during the age of discovery unified, and made the trade with the Arabic empires the utmost priority, as well as created much more advanced technologies and the implementation of a unified standing military,

How is Africa supposed to just unify? Even today with modern technology and aid money most of its countries are failing.

China stopped being overly internalized, and continued technological advancement, and the Aztec conquered the Incas and stopped the ritual sacrifice and mass funneling of resources towards religion . . . ?

To write up a decent alternate timeline you need to find one reasonable deviation point. Like, what if Christopher Colombus was murdered halfway to the new world by his men, who decided to turn back? What if the Viking colonies in north america thrived. What if the gunpowder plot worked.

You need a reasonable departure, which results in reasonable (but not always obvious) ramifications.

Military force . . . less time wasted on a tribal war and more spent on wars for unification . . .
Minister Of Trolling
: At 12/6/2011 2:21:41 PM, badger wrote:
: ugly people should beat beautiful people ugly. simple! you'd be killing two birds with the one stone... women like violent men and you're making yourself more attractive, relatively. i met a blonde dude who was prettier than me not so long ago. he's not so pretty now! ha!
:
: ...and well, he wasn't really prettier than me. he just had nice hair.
SuperRobotWars
Posts: 3,906
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1/20/2011 2:57:15 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 12:51:06 AM, Sangers wrote:
At 1/19/2011 6:19:26 AM, SuperRobotWars wrote:
Suppose Africa during the age of discovery unified, and made the trade with the Arabic empires the utmost priority, as well as created much more advanced technologies and the implementation of a unified standing military, China stopped being overly internalized, and continued technological advancement, and the Aztec conquered the Incas and stopped the ritual sacrifice and mass funneling of resources towards religion . . . ?

There's a geographical explanation on why each continents developed differently. Africa's lack of trade is due to it having the shortest coastline, shallow ports unnavigable rivers and tropical climate. Asia on the other hand consists of flatlands and plains, allowing centralised empires like Ming and Manchu to form.

I don't think it's that simple to assume "What if" when it comes to history :P

I know . . . but suppose the climate did not shift the way it did and several earthquakes, and China was internalized not just centralized internalization was the problem no centralization . . . *blame Confucius*
Minister Of Trolling
: At 12/6/2011 2:21:41 PM, badger wrote:
: ugly people should beat beautiful people ugly. simple! you'd be killing two birds with the one stone... women like violent men and you're making yourself more attractive, relatively. i met a blonde dude who was prettier than me not so long ago. he's not so pretty now! ha!
:
: ...and well, he wasn't really prettier than me. he just had nice hair.
I-am-a-panda
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1/20/2011 4:17:05 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Unified Africa falls apart due to it's size and inability to hold its sh!t together for 5 seconds. Zulu tribes and Berbers aren't going to happily live in the same empire.
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SuperRobotWars
Posts: 3,906
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1/20/2011 4:42:12 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 4:17:05 PM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
Unified Africa falls apart due to it's size and inability to hold its sh!t together for 5 seconds. Zulu tribes and Berbers aren't going to happily live in the same empire.

Then we shall kill the Zulus and the Berbers indiscriminately until they get along . . . plus who ever said they had to be next to each other we can build a wall to divide them if they so desire . . .
Minister Of Trolling
: At 12/6/2011 2:21:41 PM, badger wrote:
: ugly people should beat beautiful people ugly. simple! you'd be killing two birds with the one stone... women like violent men and you're making yourself more attractive, relatively. i met a blonde dude who was prettier than me not so long ago. he's not so pretty now! ha!
:
: ...and well, he wasn't really prettier than me. he just had nice hair.
Cerebral_Narcissist
Posts: 10,806
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1/21/2011 1:41:00 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 2:53:58 PM, SuperRobotWars wrote:
At 1/20/2011 2:06:52 AM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
At 1/19/2011 6:19:26 AM, SuperRobotWars wrote:
Suppose Africa during the age of discovery unified, and made the trade with the Arabic empires the utmost priority, as well as created much more advanced technologies and the implementation of a unified standing military,

How is Africa supposed to just unify? Even today with modern technology and aid money most of its countries are failing.

China stopped being overly internalized, and continued technological advancement, and the Aztec conquered the Incas and stopped the ritual sacrifice and mass funneling of resources towards religion . . . ?

To write up a decent alternate timeline you need to find one reasonable deviation point. Like, what if Christopher Colombus was murdered halfway to the new world by his men, who decided to turn back? What if the Viking colonies in north america thrived. What if the gunpowder plot worked.

You need a reasonable departure, which results in reasonable (but not always obvious) ramifications.

Military force . . . less time wasted on a tribal war and more spent on wars for unification . . .

That is a meaningless reply.
I am voting for Innomen because of his intelligence, common sense, humility and the fact that Juggle appears to listen to him. Any other Presidential style would have a large sub-section of the site up in arms. If I was President I would destroy the site though elitism, others would let it run riot. Innomen represents a middle way that works, neither draconian nor anarchic and that is the only way things can work. Plus he does it all without ego trips.
SuperRobotWars
Posts: 3,906
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1/21/2011 6:14:42 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/21/2011 1:41:00 AM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
At 1/20/2011 2:53:58 PM, SuperRobotWars wrote:
At 1/20/2011 2:06:52 AM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
At 1/19/2011 6:19:26 AM, SuperRobotWars wrote:
Suppose Africa during the age of discovery unified, and made the trade with the Arabic empires the utmost priority, as well as created much more advanced technologies and the implementation of a unified standing military,

How is Africa supposed to just unify? Even today with modern technology and aid money most of its countries are failing.

China stopped being overly internalized, and continued technological advancement, and the Aztec conquered the Incas and stopped the ritual sacrifice and mass funneling of resources towards religion . . . ?

To write up a decent alternate timeline you need to find one reasonable deviation point. Like, what if Christopher Colombus was murdered halfway to the new world by his men, who decided to turn back? What if the Viking colonies in north america thrived. What if the gunpowder plot worked.

You need a reasonable departure, which results in reasonable (but not always obvious) ramifications.

Military force . . . less time wasted on a tribal war and more spent on wars for unification . . .

That is a meaningless reply.

Its the accurate response . . .
Minister Of Trolling
: At 12/6/2011 2:21:41 PM, badger wrote:
: ugly people should beat beautiful people ugly. simple! you'd be killing two birds with the one stone... women like violent men and you're making yourself more attractive, relatively. i met a blonde dude who was prettier than me not so long ago. he's not so pretty now! ha!
:
: ...and well, he wasn't really prettier than me. he just had nice hair.
Calvincambridge
Posts: 1,141
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9/6/2011 8:07:10 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/19/2011 3:12:50 PM, SuperRobotWars wrote:
Africa and China both entered into a industrial revolution level of technology . . .
Aztecs learned how to produce steel, gunpowder, and relatively advanced ships (at a similar level to that of the Spaniards fleet at the time) . . .
Africa adopted a modified version of Arabic and Egyptian as their official writing systems and opened public schools . . .
Aztecs simplified N'ahuatl and opened public schools . . .
Africa and China begin the construction of ironclad vessels, cartridge rounds, and breech lock weapons, as well as the use of bombs . . .

When you say egyptian do you mean Coptic
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Wnope
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9/6/2011 9:31:55 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 2:44:46 AM, tvellalott wrote:
At 1/19/2011 3:12:50 PM, SuperRobotWars wrote:
Africa and China both entered into a industrial revolution level of technology . . .
Aztecs learned how to produce steel, gunpowder, and relatively advanced ships (at a similar level to that of the Spaniards fleet at the time) . . .
Africa adopted a modified version of Arabic and Egyptian as their official writing systems and opened public schools . . .
Aztecs simplified N'ahuatl and opened public schools . . .
Africa and China begin the construction of ironclad vessels, cartridge rounds, and breech lock weapons, as well as the use of bombs . . .

http://www.bookdepository.co.uk...
Read this, repose a logical scenario.

I was considering recommending this book.