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4K to start competing with HD

RoyLatham
Posts: 4,488
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9/2/2012 6:48:49 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
4K is video with four times the resolution of HD. As with HD there are different resolutions. 4K UHDTV at 3840 x 2160 (8.3 megapixels), compared to 1920 x 1080 for the best HD. Samsung is to start selling TV sets in South Korea this month, starting at US $22,000. Sony is bringing out an 84" set (http://store.sony.com...) for about $31K. Prices for 55" sets are expected to be around $11K next year.

There is currently no mass-produced media available to play to on the sets. Word is that older movies made on film are being scanned in the higher resolution. I doubt that the resolution is possible from 35mm movies, but some movies were shot on larger film formats like 70mm. Separately, I've notices that quad-density Blu-Ray media is available, allowing about 100 GB of storage. Four times the resolution shouldn't require four time the storage due to the efficiency of compressing the areas of the scene that have little detail.

The new format support stereo, and Sony has a set that allows 3D viewing without glasses. Passive stereo has been around for some time. It requires a screen with a lenticular beveled surface.

It will probably take 10 years for 4K to get to the level of acceptance that HD has today.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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9/2/2012 7:48:43 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
There are rumours about Sony engineering the next PlayStation (4) to support such a resolution. Perhaps the HD won't die out before at least a decade, but if big companies bring new products to compete, then the 4K might gain rapid, unexpected popularity.
lewis20
Posts: 5,093
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9/2/2012 11:05:11 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
I thought the reason TVs didn't go beyond HD was that that was about the best the human eye could perceive? I always assumed there wasn't much else standing in the way of a higher resolution picture.
"If you are a racist I will attack you with the north"- Abraham Lincoln

"Do not wear clothing woven of two kinds of material" - Leviticus 19 19

"War is a racket" - Smedley Butler
DirkBergurk
Posts: 32
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9/2/2012 12:39:41 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/2/2012 11:05:11 AM, lewis20 wrote:
I thought the reason TVs didn't go beyond HD was that that was about the best the human eye could perceive?

I believe it depends on how large your screen is and how close you are to the screen. Personally, I doubt anyone will be able to tell the difference. 4k seems like a gimmick.

I always assumed there wasn't much else standing in the way of a higher resolution picture.

Even on dual-layered BD, many HD movies have been able to fill the storage capacity. With 4 times as many pixels in 4k, they have needed a bigger storage medium and quad-layer BD will likely do the trick. I believe the upcoming H.265 codec will be able to half the storage size as well (compared to H.264).
lewis20
Posts: 5,093
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9/2/2012 8:09:53 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/2/2012 12:39:41 PM, DirkBergurk wrote:
At 9/2/2012 11:05:11 AM, lewis20 wrote:
I thought the reason TVs didn't go beyond HD was that that was about the best the human eye could perceive?

I believe it depends on how large your screen is and how close you are to the screen. Personally, I doubt anyone will be able to tell the difference. 4k seems like a gimmick.

I always assumed there wasn't much else standing in the way of a higher resolution picture.

Even on dual-layered BD, many HD movies have been able to fill the storage capacity. With 4 times as many pixels in 4k, they have needed a bigger storage medium and quad-layer BD will likely do the trick. I believe the upcoming H.265 codec will be able to half the storage size as well (compared to H.264).

I'm under the belief that the future is digital content anyway, that discs are on their way out.
"If you are a racist I will attack you with the north"- Abraham Lincoln

"Do not wear clothing woven of two kinds of material" - Leviticus 19 19

"War is a racket" - Smedley Butler
RoyLatham
Posts: 4,488
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9/2/2012 8:37:20 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/2/2012 11:05:11 AM, lewis20 wrote:
I thought the reason TVs didn't go beyond HD was that that was about the best the human eye could perceive? I always assumed there wasn't much else standing in the way of a higher resolution picture.

Eye resolution is measured as an angle. Eye resolution depends upon brightness and contrast, but the approximation most often used is one arc minute. That is 1/60 of a degree or 290 microradians.

With an HD 46" display, eye resolution requires the display to be 72 inches away. A 17" HD laptop achieves eye resolution at about 27 inches. A 4K display cuts those distances in half. The 84" 4K display will achieve eye resolution at only 64 inches.

To cover a sphere at eye resolution requires about 148 megapixels. With 4K projectors, it takes about 18 projectors to cover a dome at eye resolution. Such displays are desired for flight simulators. The system shown is the video uses 14 10-megapixel projectors, but with the distortion of projecting on a dome and and overlapping the images it only gets about 4 arc-minute resolution.

The brain does image processing, so it's possible to see a utility wire at a half mile, way below the one arc-minute figure.
DirkBergurk
Posts: 32
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9/3/2012 1:20:41 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/2/2012 8:09:53 PM, lewis20 wrote:
At 9/2/2012 12:39:41 PM, DirkBergurk wrote:
At 9/2/2012 11:05:11 AM, lewis20 wrote:
I thought the reason TVs didn't go beyond HD was that that was about the best the human eye could perceive?

I believe it depends on how large your screen is and how close you are to the screen. Personally, I doubt anyone will be able to tell the difference. 4k seems like a gimmick.

I always assumed there wasn't much else standing in the way of a higher resolution picture.

Even on dual-layered BD, many HD movies have been able to fill the storage capacity. With 4 times as many pixels in 4k, they have needed a bigger storage medium and quad-layer BD will likely do the trick. I believe the upcoming H.265 codec will be able to half the storage size as well (compared to H.264).

I'm under the belief that the future is digital content anyway, that discs are on their way out.

I definitely agree with that. Particularly since every improvement in disc technology usually requires the consumer to purchase a new disc player. Online media streaming is likely the future.

However, at present, streaming services that offer 'HD' media are really quite lousy when compared to Blu-ray content (comparing bit rate). It seems internet speeds and bandwidth are the limiting factor at the moment.
RoyLatham
Posts: 4,488
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9/4/2012 4:03:30 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
Motion video is improved substantially by displaying a black frame between every two image frames. This is really remarkable; it's po ssible to read something like the license plate on a moving car that is otherwise a blur. It requires no bandwidth, but the display must runtwice as faster and the brightness is cut in half.

Currently, digital movies are usually shot at 24 frames per second. There is a 48 frames per second variation of the standard. I haven't seen it, but some claim the higher frame rate is more impressive than 3D in terms of the user experience.
DirkBergurk
Posts: 32
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9/4/2012 9:41:11 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/4/2012 4:03:30 AM, RoyLatham wrote:
Currently, digital movies are usually shot at 24 frames per second. There is a 48 frames per second variation of the standard. I haven't seen it, but some claim the higher frame rate is more impressive than 3D in terms of the user experience.

I know 'The Hobbit' is coming out in that format and I am particularly interested in seeing that as well.