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Assassination, kill 1, save 10000.

KingVeridical
Posts: 2
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12/29/2016 10:59:04 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
If you could kill one child just by pulling a trigger, knowing that doing so would save 10,000 innocent children from dying by the childs hands, knowing that if you do not kill the child it will kill those 10,000 innocent children for no reason, knowing there is no way to stop the child and you only have two options, kill the child, or let it live, what would you do?
Geogeer
Posts: 5,468
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12/29/2016 11:23:21 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 12/29/2016 10:59:04 PM, KingVeridical wrote:
If you could kill one child just by pulling a trigger, knowing that doing so would save 10,000 innocent children from dying by the childs hands, knowing that if you do not kill the child it will kill those 10,000 innocent children for no reason, knowing there is no way to stop the child and you only have two options, kill the child, or let it live, what would you do?

Is the child currently intentionally threatening the other children or is this some sci-fi thing like going back and killing Hitler?
keithprosser
Posts: 5,183
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12/29/2016 11:38:51 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 12/29/2016 11:23:21 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 12/29/2016 10:59:04 PM, KingVeridical wrote:
If you could kill one child just by pulling a trigger, knowing that doing so would save 10,000 innocent children from dying by the childs hands, knowing that if you do not kill the child it will kill those 10,000 innocent children for no reason, knowing there is no way to stop the child and you only have two options, kill the child, or let it live, what would you do?

Is the child currently intentionally threatening the other children or is this some sci-fi thing like going back and killing Hitler?

Just answer the question as posed, G.

But the scenario is a toddler has a nuclear device strapped to them and is crawling towards the door of a room packed with 10,000 other kids. If the kid makes to the door the bomb will go off, killing everyone inside. You are 2000 yards away, too far to get to the kid before she reaches the door, but fortuately you were trained as a sniper and have a high-powered rifle to hand.

Just the sort of situation I find myself in most days.

What do you do?
zmikecuber
Posts: 4,614
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12/29/2016 11:39:05 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 12/29/2016 10:59:04 PM, KingVeridical wrote:
If you could kill one child just by pulling a trigger, knowing that doing so would save 10,000 innocent children from dying by the childs hands, knowing that if you do not kill the child it will kill those 10,000 innocent children for no reason, knowing there is no way to stop the child and you only have two options, kill the child, or let it live, what would you do?

I think this question has been asked before.
"Delete your fvcking sig" -1hard

"primal man had the habit, when he came into contact with fire, of satisfying the infantile desire connected with it, by putting it out with a stream of his urine... Putting out the fire by micturating was therefore a kind of sexual act with a male, an enjoyment of sexual potency in a homosexual competition."
zmikecuber
Posts: 4,614
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12/29/2016 11:39:18 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 12/29/2016 10:59:04 PM, KingVeridical wrote:
If you could kill one child just by pulling a trigger, knowing that doing so would save 10,000 innocent children from dying by the childs hands, knowing that if you do not kill the child it will kill those 10,000 innocent children for no reason, knowing there is no way to stop the child and you only have two options, kill the child, or let it live, what would you do?

Would you rape a child to end all child rape?
"Delete your fvcking sig" -1hard

"primal man had the habit, when he came into contact with fire, of satisfying the infantile desire connected with it, by putting it out with a stream of his urine... Putting out the fire by micturating was therefore a kind of sexual act with a male, an enjoyment of sexual potency in a homosexual competition."
KingVeridical
Posts: 2
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12/29/2016 11:41:47 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 12/29/2016 11:23:21 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 12/29/2016 10:59:04 PM, KingVeridical wrote:
If you could kill one child just by pulling a trigger, knowing that doing so would save 10,000 innocent children from dying by the childs hands, knowing that if you do not kill the child it will kill those 10,000 innocent children for no reason, knowing there is no way to stop the child and you only have two options, kill the child, or let it live, what would you do?

Is the child currently intentionally threatening the other children or is this some sci-fi thing like going back and killing Hitler?

For the sake of argument lets say that the child has been covert in making the plans to commit the crime and you know of its plans only because the child told you it was going to commit the crime previously and proved to you that it was not lying yet left you with no proof to go to the authorities with so you only have the two options, kill, or let others die.
keithprosser
Posts: 5,183
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12/30/2016 5:35:26 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 12/29/2016 11:41:47 PM, KingVeridical wrote:
For the sake of argument lets say that the child has been covert in making the plans to commit the crime and you know of its plans only because the child told you it was going to commit the crime previously and proved to you that it was not lying yet left you with no proof to go to the authorities with so you only have the two options, kill, or let others die.

So a kid tells me she is going to kill 10,000 other kids and not only am I the only one gulllible enough to believe her but I decide to follow her around with a rifle because that is the only way I can think of stopping her.

Hmm... tricky one... I think it depends what colour the trolley is.
illegalcombat
Posts: 1,200
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12/30/2016 11:50:24 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 12/29/2016 11:39:18 PM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 12/29/2016 10:59:04 PM, KingVeridical wrote:
If you could kill one child just by pulling a trigger, knowing that doing so would save 10,000 innocent children from dying by the childs hands, knowing that if you do not kill the child it will kill those 10,000 innocent children for no reason, knowing there is no way to stop the child and you only have two options, kill the child, or let it live, what would you do?

Would you rape a child to end all child rape?

Deontology meet consequentialism.
Benshapiro
Posts: 4,116
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1/1/2017 1:47:34 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 12/29/2016 11:39:18 PM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 12/29/2016 10:59:04 PM, KingVeridical wrote:
If you could kill one child just by pulling a trigger, knowing that doing so would save 10,000 innocent children from dying by the childs hands, knowing that if you do not kill the child it will kill those 10,000 innocent children for no reason, knowing there is no way to stop the child and you only have two options, kill the child, or let it live, what would you do?

Would you rape a child to end all child rape?

That's a good question. Personally, no. We have to wonder if God isn't operating under this logic though. God must have a morally sufficient reason for permitting child rape, no?
keithprosser
Posts: 5,183
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1/1/2017 2:45:43 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/1/2017 1:47:34 AM, Benshapiro wrote:
At 12/29/2016 11:39:18 PM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 12/29/2016 10:59:04 PM, KingVeridical wrote:
If you could kill one child just by pulling a trigger, knowing that doing so would save 10,000 innocent children from dying by the childs hands, knowing that if you do not kill the child it will kill those 10,000 innocent children for no reason, knowing there is no way to stop the child and you only have two options, kill the child, or let it live, what would you do?

Would you rape a child to end all child rape?

That's a good question. Personally, no. We have to wonder if God isn't operating under this logic though. God must have a morally sufficient reason for permitting child rape, no?

I think 'Not existing' counts as a morally sufficient reason.
XLAV
Posts: 14,342
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1/1/2017 9:06:02 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
This is pretty similar to the trolley problem but it involves children and more people.

Personally if I don't know the 1 then I'd save the 10000.
Baby, you're the highlight of my lowlife

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David_Debates
Posts: 353
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1/3/2017 7:14:13 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 12/29/2016 10:59:04 PM, KingVeridical wrote:
If you could kill one child just by pulling a trigger, knowing that doing so would save 10,000 innocent children from dying by the childs hands, knowing that if you do not kill the child it will kill those 10,000 innocent children for no reason, knowing there is no way to stop the child and you only have two options, kill the child, or let it live, what would you do?

No, because how do I know that the child will not have a change of mind? Am I omnipotent?
If so, this situation is illogical and thus I won't answer.
If not, then I wouldn't because I should not and don't have the power to somehow save lives by killing others. Plus, I'm not morally responsible for another person's sin, but I would be responsible for murder if I were to kill the one child.
People don't think the universe be like it is, but it do.
-Black Science Man
keithprosser
Posts: 5,183
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1/3/2017 11:49:59 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/3/2017 7:14:13 AM, David_Debates wrote:
At 12/29/2016 10:59:04 PM, KingVeridical wrote:
If you could kill one child just by pulling a trigger, knowing that doing so would save 10,000 innocent children from dying by the childs hands, knowing that if you do not kill the child it will kill those 10,000 innocent children for no reason, knowing there is no way to stop the child and you only have two options, kill the child, or let it live, what would you do?

No, because how do I know that the child will not have a change of mind? Am I omnipotent?
If so, this situation is illogical and thus I won't answer.
If not, then I wouldn't because I should not and don't have the power to somehow save lives by killing others. Plus, I'm not morally responsible for another person's sin, but I would be responsible for murder if I were to kill the one child.

Well, you're honest anyway. I wonder why you are worried about being 'responsible for murder', tho'. They don't put a sniper who takes out a terrorist on death row, so perhaps it's your soul you are worried about?

You needn't worry on that score - I am sure that when you go to heaven with your soul untarnished with the sin of murdering the one child God and other angels will not begrudge the 10,000 children you selfishly sacrificed to get there.
David_Debates
Posts: 353
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1/3/2017 4:42:03 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/3/2017 11:49:59 AM, keithprosser wrote:
At 1/3/2017 7:14:13 AM, David_Debates wrote:
At 12/29/2016 10:59:04 PM, KingVeridical wrote:
If you could kill one child just by pulling a trigger, knowing that doing so would save 10,000 innocent children from dying by the childs hands, knowing that if you do not kill the child it will kill those 10,000 innocent children for no reason, knowing there is no way to stop the child and you only have two options, kill the child, or let it live, what would you do?

No, because how do I know that the child will not have a change of mind? Am I omnipotent?
If so, this situation is illogical and thus I won't answer.
If not, then I wouldn't because I should not and don't have the power to somehow save lives by killing others. Plus, I'm not morally responsible for another person's sin, but I would be responsible for murder if I were to kill the one child.

Well, you're honest anyway. I wonder why you are worried about being 'responsible for murder', tho'. They don't put a sniper who takes out a terrorist on death row, so perhaps it's your soul you are worried about?

I'd rather not play a part in murder.

You needn't worry on that score - I am sure that when you go to heaven with your soul untarnished with the sin of murdering the one child God and other angels will not begrudge the 10,000 children you selfishly sacrificed to get there.

But I would not have killed those 10,000 children. Not only that, but this entire hypothetical is illogical.
People don't think the universe be like it is, but it do.
-Black Science Man
keithprosser
Posts: 5,183
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1/3/2017 6:25:49 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/3/2017 4:42:03 PM, David_Debates wrote:
But I would not have killed those 10,000 children. Not only that, but this entire hypothetical is illogical.

I think its a badly stated problem because its so unrealistic, but not in the strictest sense 'illogical'. If you want a more realistic version - one you might actually face one day - then imagine you are the passenger in car and the driver has a heart-attack and loses control at 90 mph. You can reach the steering wheel but nothing else to control the car.

In a second or two if you do nothing you will hit a crowd of people and kill a dozen people, but you can still swerve and just hit one person. Choose.
ANON_TacTiX
Posts: 762
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1/4/2017 4:46:40 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 12/29/2016 10:59:04 PM, KingVeridical wrote:
If you could kill one child just by pulling a trigger, knowing that doing so would save 10,000 innocent children from dying by the childs hands, knowing that if you do not kill the child it will kill those 10,000 innocent children for no reason, knowing there is no way to stop the child and you only have two options, kill the child, or let it live, what would you do?

Kill the child, easy. Simple math. 1 is far less than 10,000, and there aren't really any moral issues to take into account.
Mharman
Posts: 4,391
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1/11/2017 2:34:58 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/1/2017 1:47:34 AM, Benshapiro wrote:
At 12/29/2016 11:39:18 PM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 12/29/2016 10:59:04 PM, KingVeridical wrote:
If you could kill one child just by pulling a trigger, knowing that doing so would save 10,000 innocent children from dying by the childs hands, knowing that if you do not kill the child it will kill those 10,000 innocent children for no reason, knowing there is no way to stop the child and you only have two options, kill the child, or let it live, what would you do?

Would you rape a child to end all child rape?

That's a good question. Personally, no. We have to wonder if God isn't operating under this logic though. God must have a morally sufficient reason for permitting child rape, no?

He doesn't allow rape whatsoever.
"Why am I suddenly getting banner ads for Nazi dating services?" - Greyparrot
GrimlyF
Posts: 1,298
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1/11/2017 8:26:51 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
The thread reeks of pre-determinism. We cannot know the future so the child lives. If we could know the future then it is set and cannot be changed. Remember the paradox.
Child lives=dead children. Child dies= no dead children= no reason to kill child.
Deb-8-A-Bull
Posts: 3,461
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1/12/2017 10:10:48 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 12/29/2016 11:41:47 PM, KingVeridical wrote:
At 12/29/2016 11:23:21 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 12/29/2016 10:59:04 PM, KingVeridical wrote:
If you could kill one child just by pulling a trigger, knowing that doing so would save 10,000 innocent children from dying by the childs hands, knowing that if you do not kill the child it will kill those 10,000 innocent children for no reason, knowing there is no way to stop the child and you only have two options, kill the child, or let it live, what would you do?

Is the child currently intentionally threatening the other children or is this some sci-fi thing like going back and killing Hitler?

For the sake of argument lets say that the child has been covert in making the plans to commit the crime and you know of its plans only because the child told you it was going to commit the crime previously and proved to you that it was not lying yet left you with no proof to go to the authorities with so you only have the two options, kill, or let others die.

The 10,000 kids are not even alive.
Let him /her live.