The Instigator
jrardin12
Pro (for)
The Contender
backwardseden
Con (against)

Absolute Morality proves Biblical Creation

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Debate Round Forfeited
backwardseden has forfeited round #4.
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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 8/20/2018 Category: Philosophy
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Debating Period
Viewed: 631 times Debate No: 117805
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (13)
Votes (0)

 

jrardin12

Pro

I believe I added too much information in my other two debates. I am going to narrow my points as to why evolution cannot account for morality without basing it on Biblical Creation.

1. Evolutionists have no logical reason to believe in any sort of moral imperative within their own worldview.
2. In the evolution worldview, Right and wrong can be nothing more than electro-chemical reactions in the brain " the result of time and chance. If the concepts of right and wrong are to be meaningful, Evolution cannot be true.
3. Right and wrong are Christian concepts that go back to Genesis. By attempting to be moral, Therefore, The evolutionist is being irrational, For he must borrow biblical concepts that are contrary to his worldview.
4. The Bible teaches that God is the Creator of all things (Gen. 1:1; John 1:3). All things belong to God (Ps. 24:1), And thus God has the right to make the rules. So an absolute moral code makes sense in a biblical creation worldview. But if the Bible were not true, If human beings were merely the outworking of millions of years of mindless chemical processes, Then why should we hold to a universal code of behavior?
backwardseden

Con

Debating you is like debating silly pity on a yardstick of a lost nightmare on his petting zoo filled with Sponge Bob's waiting to become wet squeegees.
"1. Evolutionists have no logical reason to believe in any sort of moral imperative within their own worldview. " And you believe this how and why because you have absolutely no proof of this considering the absolute fact that you cannot even prove that your god exists and is completely immoral regardless in YOUR storybook who truly hates children.
* 2 Samuel 12:11-14 11 Thus saith the LORD, Behold, I will raise up evil against thee out of thine own house, And I will take thy wives before thine eyes, And give them unto thy neighbour, And he shall lie with thy wives in the sight of this sun. 12 For thou didst it secretly: but I will do this thing before all Israel, And before the sun. 13 And David said unto Nathan, I have sinned against the LORD. And Nathan said unto David, The LORD also hath put away thy sin; thou shalt not die. 14 Howbeit, Because by this deed thou hast given great occasion to the enemies of the LORD to blaspheme, The child also that is born unto thee shall surely die. From evilbible. Com [The child dies seven days later. ] This has got to be one of the sickest quotes of the Bible. God himself brings the completely innocent rape victims to the rapist. What kind of pathetic loser would do something so evil? And then he kills a child! This is sick, Really sick! (rape)
* Deuteronomy 2:34 "And we took all his cities at that time, And utterly destroyed the men, And the women, And the little ones, Of every city, We left none to remain:"
* Numbers 31:17-18 "17 Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, And kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. 18 But all the women children, That have not known a man by lying with him, Keep alive for yourselves. " (rape)
* Leviticus 26:21-22 "And if ye walk contrary unto me, And will not hearken unto me; I will bring seven times more plagues upon you according to your sins. 22 I will also send wild beasts among you, Which shall rob you of your children, And destroy your cattle, And make you few in number; and your high ways shall be desolate. " Rob you of your children?
* 1 Samuel 15:3 "3 Now go and smite Amalek, And utterly destroy all that they have, And spare them not; but slay both man and woman, Infant and suckling, Ox and sheep, Camel and a$$. " (babies)
* Hosea 13:16 "Samaria shall become desolate; for she hath rebelled against her God: they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, And their women with child shall be ripped up. " Wow. Such a nice gentle caring god who is all warm and fuzzy inside. This book should clearly be read to children - correct? (babies) (abortion)
* 2 Kings 15:16 "Then Menahem smote Tiphsah, And all that were therein, And the coasts thereof from Tirzah: because they opened not to him, Therefore he smote it; and all the women therein that were with child he ripped up. " (abortion)
* Exodus 21:17 "And he that curseth his father, Or his mother, Shall surely be put to death. "
* Leviticus 20:9 "For every one that curseth his father or his mother shall be surely put to death: he hath cursed his father or his mother; his blood shall be upon him. "
* Mark 7:10 "For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, Let him die the death:"
* Matthew 15:4 "For God commanded, Saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, Let him die the death. "
* Matthew 10:21 "And the brother shall deliver up the brother to death, And the father the child: and the children shall rise up against their parents, And cause them to be put to death. "
Do you think you should be put---to---death for cursing at your parents? Y____? N____? Why? Why Not? Your god thinks you should. After all its repeated AT LEAST 5 fricken times in his bible. Oh but wait, What if its the reverse? What if your parents rape, Beat, And torture you which is what happens most of this time. Oh nothing happens to them. That"s according to YOUR bible. Indeed YOUR god truly hates children.
So you have NOTHING to say about YOUR god being moral at all.

"2. In the evolution worldview, Right and wrong can be nothing more than electro-chemical reactions in the brain " the result of time and chance. If the concepts of right and wrong are to be meaningful, Evolution cannot be true. " How and why do you know this? If you are going to state something then you need to back it up with something called "evidence". Strange isn't it that evolution is proven fact. Oh and btw, Those electro-chemical reactions in the brain are what demonstrates what man knows is hot and cold, Pain, Suffering, Love, Care, Peace, Hate etc etc etc and you know something? In certain trees it is now known that they are sociable as parent trees care for their young. You can go to youtube with. . .
Talking to Trees
The hidden life of trees
Tallest Trees on Earth
Are plants conscious? | Stefano Mancuso
Stefano Mancuso: The roots of plant intelligence

"3. Right and wrong are Christian concepts that go back to Genesis. " Yeah that's a good one in which was clearly 100% wrong when your god decided the best course of action was to destroy all life - a deliberate genocide of all living things because he a true crybaby couldn't get his way with one species when there are millions of species and then he told one family to build a boat in which could have never floated in the fist place for something in which never happened. So the bible lied. Your bible never made any attempts to be moral especially in genesis and was completely immoral.

"4. The Bible teaches that God is the Creator of all things" So? What does that prove? Nothing. It does not in any way prove that your god exists. Its a horrible fable that nobody, Especially children should follow. Yeah all things belong to god. Am snickering at that one. YOUR bible is nothing more than a superior ego god complex and nothing more. Oh yes your god has the right to make up all the rules. Does he have the right to commit genocide after genocide after genocide and murder innocent babies, Children and pregnant women for absolutely no reason at all? Of course you have no answer. " So an absolute moral code makes sense in a biblical creation worldview" OK let's test your morality VS your god's morality. . How's that for a plan? Sounds good?
Do you think you should be put to death just because you blaspheme? Y____? N____? Your god thinks so. Leviticus 24:16, Do you think you should die if you work on the sabbath? Y____? N____? Your god thinks so. Exodus 31:14, And Numbers 15: 32-36, Do you think you should die for merely cursing at your parents? Y____? N____? Your god thinks so. Exodus 21:17, Leviticus 20:9, Mark 7:10, Matthew 15:4, Do you think you should die if you commit adultery? Y____? N____? Your god thinks so. Leviticus 20:10, Here"s some other wonderful kissy kissy poo poo things that YOUR god thinks you should die for Do you think you should die if you are a homosexual? Y___? N____? Your god thinks so. Leviticus 20:13, Do you think you should die if you worship other gods? Y____? N____? Your god thinks so. Deuteronomy 13: 9-10 and Deuteronomy 17: 2-5. If you've answered "yes" to any of the questions then its simple you have no moral code and this debate needn't continue because I do and so do billions of other have a moral code. YOUR god in which you cannot even prove exists, Does not.
Debate Round No. 1
jrardin12

Pro

You give a long list:

2 Samuel 12:11-14. Before I answer this question you have to explain the murder of millions of babies by abortion. You also have to tell me what rape has to do with anything.

Deuteronomy 2:34, Numbers 31:17-18, Leviticus 26:21-22, 1 Samuel 15:3, Hosea 13:16: Wars between people groups dominate ancient history, So it shouldn"t surprise us that the Old Testament records a lot of wars. But some skeptics object to some of the commands God gave for the Israelite"s conquest of the Promised Land, I. E. Canaan.

Probably the most cited "atrocity" is the Lord"s command to destroy the Amalekites totally, Including their women, Children, And property. However, God commanded their destruction because they had opposed Israel when they came up out of Egypt. Deuteronomy says, "Remember what Amalek did to you as you came out of Egypt, How he attacked you on the way when you were faint and weary, And cut off your tail, Those who were lagging behind you, And he did not fear God" (Deuteronomy 25:17"18, 1 Samuel 15:2"3). God swore that He would utterly destroy them (Exodus 17). They were going to be driven out of the Promised Land and replaced by Israel because of their sins"which included heinous immorality and child sacrifice. This was God"s judgment against them"Israel was merely God"s agent for that judgment"and so Israel was to destroy everything completely and not take any of it for themselves. When Saul and his army spared King Agag and took some livestock, It was such a serious offence that God in turn judged Saul and permanently removed His favour from him (1 Samuel 15 ff. ). In fact, Some Amalekites were left in other locations"David defeated a raiding party of Amalekites in 1 Samuel 30.

God"s action against the Amalekites is only immoral to those who do not recognize God"s right to judge the people He created when they rebel against Him. God has the right to deal with His creations the way He chooses (people said to be "playing God" usurp these privileges). In fact, God warned the Israelites that if they practiced the abominations of the Canaanites, They would be driven out of the land as well (Deuteronomy 29:18"28).

Exodus 21:17, Leviticus 20:9: God condemns murder in so many places that to accuse Him of murder (that is, The intentional killing of persons which have committed no capital offense) is ludicrous. The "atrocity lists" invariably include the death penalty passages from the Mosaic Law. But these are made into capital offenses, So someone who is killed as a result of disobeying these laws is being executed, Not murdered. Unbelievers might complain that capital punishment for these reasons is unjust, But the burden of proof is on them to prove that it is unjust. So the death penalty passages will not be dealt with in this article. Killing in the biblical wars is also not dealt with, Because criticisms of war killing assume that the war is not just, Which the critic must prove.

Mark 7:10 Matthew 15:4 - While this sounds rather harsh for squeamish modern thoughts, Ancient societies were always one step away from anarchy. It was especially serious for Ancient Israel, Because this is the people from whom the Messiah would come. Rebellion against parents would threaten the entire social order, So God dealt with it very strongly in the Old Testament. The penalty of being stoned to death was imposed because cursing one"s parents and ignoring their authority was considered a serious offense before God, The same as murder or adultery. Just the threat of this penalty was probably enough to curb rebellion, Unlike the way that rebellion of youth is encouraged and celebrated today.

2 Kings 15:16 Matthew 10:21: Here are several instances where I don't like debating you because it shows your lack of knowledge about the Bible. If you read 2 Kings 15:18 you will find that Menahem is not God's man.
Matthew 10:21 is a verse you should be happy about. One day (as in the past) people are going to turn Christians in to be put to death. Brothers will turn in brothers that they find worshiping God. Fathers will turn in children they find going to church and children will take their parent to court to be killed if they find them praying to God.

I am not trying to debate the Bible. I want you to give me one good reason from your evolutionary worldview on why their should be absolute morality. If the Bible were not true, If human beings were merely the outworking of millions of years of mindless chemical processes, Then why should we hold to a universal code of behavior?
backwardseden

Con

Your headliner post states "Absolute Morality proves Biblical Creation" and then in your last paragraph of your previous RD you state "I am not trying to debate the Bible" so you absolutely 100% ARE trying to debate the bible unless you don"t know what in the flying pregnant fetus screw what you say, Which as always is true with you, Or your brain is nothing more than a soggy milkshake that shakes rattles and rolls into different glove departments of complete failures of blackened ash that you don"t even know exists. So I"m not going to continue with this debate until my questions are answered, Especially the questions on your morality with your god of the Y____ or N____. And if there is any Y____ then don't even bother posting me back as previously stated because then that would mean that your moral compass is completely bankrupt and corrupt just like your god in which you cannot even prove even exists.

Oh and btw, You can dump the ideal abortion nonsense, K? After all YOUR god committed countless abortions in YOUR bible. Yeah with a big dopey doy, That"s a HUGE SUPERMASSIVE major hypocritical contradiction. God commits abortions who knows how many times within several verses in his bible, So that means that christians do not follow their god which is extremely hypocritical and contradictory from his bible HS 13:16 sick and disgusting, 2 KS 8: 9-15 sick and disgusting, 2 HS 15:16 sick and disgusting, HS 9: 11-16, And perhaps the biggest acts of abortions were committed in the great flood according to this so-called god of the bible in the great flood (which never happened btw) so who knows how many pregnant mothers died there in his bible. And yeah, In the previous RD there were some verses that were truly sick and demented that proved it. So either way its a super massive hypocritical contradiction on your part and yeah YOU were a complete stupid moron for bringing it up. And better yet with all the genocides that YOUR god has caused, He certainly has murdered A LOT of pregnant women in them. You are REALLY intelligent hot stuff.
3, 000 EX 32:27-28, 14, 700 NU 16:49, 24, 002 NU 25: 1-11, 12, 000 JOS 8: 1-25, 10, 000 JG 1:4, 120, 000 JG 8:7-10, 42, 000 JG 12:3-6, 1, 000 JD 15:14-15, 3, 000 JD 16:27-30, 25, 101 JD 16:27-30, 1 SAM 4 34, 002, 1 SAM 6:19 50, 070, 2 SAM 8 65, 850, 1 KI 20: 28-29 100, 000, 1 KI 20: 30 27, 000, 2 KI 19 35 -37 185, 000, 2 CHR 13 17-18 500, 000! , 2 CHR 28:6 120, 000, Esther 9:5-18 75, 813, 2 CHR 14: 9-14 1, 000, 000! Etc
Now let"s even dig into the issue even further. So then this means that YOUR god who is supposed to be all knowing and all powerful and omnipotent and perfect and is in control of everything and is in charge of everything is in truth none of those things. And that"s according to you. After all women are having abortions. God cannot foresee that these women are having abortions before they happen, Otherwise he would not create these women to stop them. Oh but wait, God created abortions and put that thought inside of women that its perfectly OK to have abortions to begin with because after all god himself has committed abortions by the millions - at least. GET A CLUE. Are you really THAT stupid? I guess you are.

So your stupid idiotic abortion ideal is now off the table.
Debate Round No. 2
jrardin12

Pro

So what is you explanation for absolute morality?
backwardseden

Con

We're done. Bye.
Debate Round No. 3
jrardin12

Pro

See I want to learn about your wisdom, But you don't wish to impart all you want to do is trash the Bible which obviously you don't understand and prevent me from discussing debates with intelligent people who want to answer my questions. Then you get on my debates without finishing. So please don't debate me anymore.
This round has not been posted yet.
Debate Round No. 4
This round has not been posted yet.
This round has not been posted yet.
Debate Round No. 5
13 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by mosc 3 years ago
mosc
@backwards butt

The lady doth protesteth overmuch.
Posted by backwardseden 3 years ago
backwardseden
@mosc - At least 32doni32nido32 has genuine friends and loved ones. You a screeching owl and a nobody and always on a pathway to sheer and utter ruin because you want it that way, You with your stale ugly painted breath you have nobody, No one. Its just as you like it and want it.
Posted by 32doni32nido32 3 years ago
32doni32nido32
@mosc
Raising a family even as a gay couple isn't perverted. It's different from the norm, Yes, But not perverted. The thoughts that go through your head are the description you accuse me of. I don't think about that stuff as much as you do. . . And I'm the gay one. So this logic is pretty strange and I'm certain that I now have a reason to question your sexuality rather than you questioning mine.
No, Seriously, It's weird.
Posted by mosc 3 years ago
mosc
@iq 32

Raise a family as a couple of fagg*ts. Ewwwww that's truly perverted.
Posted by 32doni32nido32 3 years ago
32doni32nido32
@mosc

But none of that has been, Pervert.
No, I'm actually perfectly fine with raising a family.
I just don't want to marry a woman.

At your tender age, You have decided to insult people for no reason.
Posted by mosc 3 years ago
mosc
@IQ 32
Its the spunk that's shot into your anus and mouth that's totally gross. At your tender age you have chosen infertility and b/c you hate yourself you don't want to marry a woman and raise a family. That's disgusting.
Posted by 32doni32nido32 3 years ago
32doni32nido32
@mosc
What do you mean?
He said what I had thought; it's not gross.
Posted by mosc 3 years ago
mosc
@IQ 22

Its not what's gone through your mind that's utterly and totally gross.
Posted by 32doni32nido32 3 years ago
32doni32nido32
@Im_Intelligent

That's exactly what had gone through my mind. But you commented this before me, So I'll give you credit for it.
Posted by backwardseden 3 years ago
backwardseden
@Im_Intelligent - Yeah I'm sure you saw what I posted in response to his RD2. When he said "I am not trying to debate the Bible. " Well gee he sure could have fooled me.
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