The Instigator
Ennee
Pro (for)
The Contender
Karar738
Con (against)

Aliens are real

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Debate Round Forfeited
Karar738 has forfeited round #3.
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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/12/2018 Category: Science
Updated: 8 months ago Status: Debating Period
Viewed: 356 times Debate No: 107941
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (3)
Votes (0)

 

Ennee

Pro

1) The universe is absolutely massive (which in itself is an understatement) and that with every word I write it multiplies its size by a fucktillion. It is nigh impossible for there not to be a planet or planets with life that are not Earth. Aliens might perhaps nt be in out galaxy, or anywhere in the currently observable universe, but it would make no sense for aliens to be nonexistent.

As Bill Nye put it in this tweet https://twitter.com...
the universe is too vast for Earth to be the nly planet that has life.


2) There is already several planets that are theorized to once have supported life, or have the conditions which allow for it to support life. Mars is a bad example, although it has potential to support lifeforms that require water, since water had been observed there. Some planets that might support life similar to ours (carbon based and requiring water) are Proxima Centauri b, Gliese 667 Cc, and Kepler-442 b, among others that can be found in the link underneath:
https://en.wikipedia.org...;

3) Aliens can exist without interacting with humans. Everyone constantly seems to think that aliens need to be humanoid or have extremely advaced technology in order to exist, but honestly that is not necesary. Aliens may live billions of lightyears away still in their version of the Jurassic Era and they still would exist. Saying "aliens can't exist because al sightings were false" does not mean that aliens do not exist: it only debunks the alleged 'sightings'. There might be real aliens out there wondering if there are other planets with life on them as well, the same way we wonder about it.

Karar738

Con

Yes, the universe is mind boggling massive but something is wrong. If aliens do exist we would've seen them by now. If a species is 1 million years more advanced than us then they'd be all over the galaxy and possibly the universe. This is known as the fermi paradox.
Debate Round No. 1
Ennee

Pro

Refering to point 3 of my previous argument:

3) Aliens can exist without interacting with humans. Everyone constantly seems to think that aliens need to be humanoid or have extremely advaced technology in order to exist, but honestly that is not necesary. Aliens may live billions of lightyears away still in their version of the Jurassic Era and they still would exist. Saying "aliens can't exist because all sightings were false" does not mean that aliens do not exist: it only debunks the alleged 'sightings'. There might be real aliens out there wondering if there are other planets with life on them as well, the same way we wonder about it.

Aliens do not, in fact, have to have existed for millions of years before us. They might not have advanced technology as us, maybe they're in their own version of the Stone Age. Maybe the alien species is more like dogs; they might not be as intelligent as us, or they might not possess a form which allows them to do complex task, or even think of doing complex tasks. Alien fauna might be less or more advanced than us, but there is no need for them to actually interact with us. Like how Mt. Everest has always been the world's tallest mountain even before being discovered, aliens can exist without us ever seeing them.

Extraterrestrial life definitley exists outside of our solar system, most likely outside of our galaxy, and might even be on the opposite side of the universe. Considering that the laws of physics can be universally applied, it is unlikely that a species has developed a spacecraft capable of supporting life for BILLIONS of lightyears, excluding the fact that they would need nourishment when they did not have access to planets with ecosystems that support their physical necessities, and would need to find an extremely effective energy source that could fuel the spacecraft. They also would need to achieve light-speed in order to make the journey in as little as several billions of years. They might use light from the surrounding stars as energy, but there's a limit to how fast they can move. Perhaps there's a legion of aliens coming our way, but they have not gotten here yet.

As for the "If a species is 1 million years more advanced than us then they'd be all over the galaxy and possibly the universe" argument, the species might have simply wanted a new set of planets to settle on. Finding those planets, they might have chosen to stay there and not colonize the rest of the universe. Not every extraterrestrial species is going to be the Europe of the universe.
Furthermore, the species might be non-violent, have morals and ethics that we humans are incapable of comprehending, or something similarly mind boggling. As such, they may have no desire to counquer other planets or meet new civilizations. For all we know, they might be observing everything in order to learn about us, or use us for entertainment.

In short (kind of)
1) Alien species might be younger than us and be less advanced. As such, there is a chance that they're in the Jurassic Stage, are still their world's equivalent of apes, or are medieval-version humans who simply did not know a single damn about the universe.
2) Even if alien species were to a million years more advanced than us, they might be too far from us to be able to do anything, might have morals and/or ethics that make them uninterested in doing anything, or they simply are observing us without interaction.
3) Not interacting with aliens =/= Nonexistence of aliens. New species are discovered on Earth every single day and yet that does not mean that the species has been magically poofed into existence by Scientist McScience who just so happened to imagine it. An undiscovered species still exists, it simply is not discovered by the humans.

Side note:
Thank you for picking up this debate!! It's my first debate here, and I am very happy it got responded to so soon. Have a great day Karar!
Karar738

Con

1. Yes, aliens don't need to interact with humans but think of the past.
When Native Americans were massacred by Americans, Americans could've not massacred them, but they were savages.
Yes, if given enough time advanced civilizations will pop up. You are using the information fallacy, that's like saying there is a teapot between Earth and Mars. It's impossible to find it out.
2. Yes if there is a fucktillion planets, there probably were planets existing billions of years before Earth. Then they probably there were planets existing before Earth creating super advanced civilizations.
3. These are called Von_Neumann_universal_constructor. These machines are like nanobots but they send data and self-replicate.
4. It's in human nature for us to conquer and since humans are the most advance species that is most likely applicable.
Debate Round No. 2
Ennee

Pro

1) Thinking of the past does not mean it will repeat in the future. Not only that, we can't apply human psychology to creatures that are not human, and that are not from Earth. As such, aliens may have no desire to massacre others, may do not have the desire to conquer planets, or may live on a planet that does not have the resources that would allow them to created advanced technology. Perhaps they just don't feel the need for it, and don't use the resources even f they have them!
Also, who are you calling savages in this instance? The group of people who have been living on their land for centuries, who had morals and social structures and their own culture, or the greedy group of people who decided to mindlessly massacre the natives of the land? Not all 'advanced' civilizations are the same as white people.

2) The super advanced civilizations might have died out! Humans are pretty much killing themselves by killing their planet. We are also in a position where we have have no habitable planets around us (and making Mars vaguely habitable would take a lot of resources and time), and no technology to take us to a habitable planet. Even if the species has advanced technology, it might not be advanced enough. They might have died on their planet, or trying to get out of it.

3) I'm not certain what was the point of bringing up nanobots that self-replicate when we are talking about a sentient species made of flesh and bone that needs proper nourishment for their bodies to thrive. Nourishment which might not be found on other planets, or which is so scarce that no large numbers could have survived. They might be able to reproduce asexually and 'self-replicate' like so, but that does not diminish their need for nourishment that they might not have access to.

4) Human nature is not the only nature. Plenty other species do not show this kind of desire to conquer, although their brains are not evolved to have advanced intelligence. I also do not believe that it's human nature to conquer. Many human groups have not conquered anything and instead choose to stay on their territory. Conquering is more of a pride and greed type of thing. Unless you're a nihilist and believe that humans are destructive by nature, I don't think that this is an applicable train of thought.

Aliens and alien life aren't exactly things we might be able to understand. Advanced civilizatins might have slower developmental processes, or they do not develop technology at all, or the technology they develop is different from ours and simply is not suited for space travel. Maybe their forms aren't like ours, and as such they have human-like intelligence and consciousness but not the bodies. Maybe there was never a need for an advanced civilization to develop. Maybe humans are the only advanced species, with the alien life being plants and lesser animals. Maybe there's some alien bacteria, maybe not. When I say aliens I don't exactly mean "humanoid extraterrestrial". I mean all life outside of Earth, because that's pretty much what aliens are.

Thank you for debating with me! It's been fun :)
This round has not been posted yet.
Debate Round No. 3
3 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Posted by Nd2400 8 months ago
Nd2400
Ennee: When i first saw your debate i was about to go all over this. But since reading your first few arguments i decided to stop. Why did i stop. Mostly because you got some few good points. AI doesn't have to mean they a whole lot smarter than us. The universe is never ending, and something could be out there like the Jurassic period. Either though you can not prove something is out there, no one could prove you wrong either. Interesting debate topic, i glad you went where you did.
Posted by Ennee 8 months ago
Ennee
In response to TheMorningStar, I am trying to prove that considering the universe is basically infinite (as far as we are aware), alien life is practically a given. There are already many planets observed to be able to support terrestrial life (including plants, viruses, bacteria, animals, and us humans). That means that there might already be life on there, or that life is in its beginning stages. Since we see the old version of everything due to the way that light works, I'd say that we see Life Planet 1.0 without life, while the planet is currently Life Planet 3894.2 with plenty of life on it right now.

My point is that the probability of aliens existing is 100%, and as such they do exist. They may not have made contact, or their contact has been hidden/forgotten. Their lack of interaction with us is however not a viable proof of their nonexistence, nor are the alleged sightings or 'UFO's proofs that they are real. The existence of aliens is real because given how our own planet works, the existence of planets like our own, and the sheer infinite potential of the universe, it is impossible for Earth to be the only planet with life on it.
Posted by TheMorningsStar 8 months ago
TheMorningsStar
For this debate would one you (the one with the burden of proof) have to show that aliens are real or just that it is probable that aliens are real? Because that changes things quite a bit...
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