The Instigator
SamuelAZimmerman
Pro (for)
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0 Points
The Contender
mackeeper
Con (against)
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0 Points

Capitalism is better than socialism/communism

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 9/20/2018 Category: Economics
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 572 times Debate No: 118328
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (6)
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SamuelAZimmerman

Pro

Capitalism is the best form of economy, Because it encourages people to form businesses and companies. Those companies then compete to sell their goods/services with other companies. This competition between corporations then allows the consumer to get the lowest possible price for the best possible product. Capitalism also encourages people to work hard, To raise their financial status. I won't deny that greed is the fuel capitalism runs on, But that doesn't make it bad. Capitalism, Even if it is run off of greed, Still lets people move in their financial status, And rewards hard work. On the other hand, In socialistic and communistic societies, The government has a monopoly on business and pays people evenly. On paper, It may sound ok, But in reality it encourages laziness and forces a small percentage of hard workers to carry the burden of the majority of work done.
mackeeper

Con

Before we can start we first need to agree on a definition of what a 'good' or a 'bad' economic system would be - from there we can argue whether capitalism or socialism meets those definitions.

From your opening statement you use the following criteria to characterise a 'good' economic system:
1) people are able to buy high quality products cheaply
2) people are encouraged to work hard
3) the workload is fairly distributed amongst the people

I will argue that socialism is a better system than capitalism based on its ability to bring about these outcomes.

1) In a communist society (which is one form of socialism), The means of production are publicly owned so there would be no need to 'buy' anything at all - the state would allocate resources such that the needs of each individual would be met. For instance, In a capitalist society, If you need a lightbulb you are forced to purchase one from a private lightbulb manufacturer who owns all of the lightbulbs. In a communist society all lightbulbs would be equally shared amongst all the citizens such that anyone who needs one will be able to take one.

Also, There is no reason to think that capitalism incentivises quality - in fact, In my example, It is in the interests of the lightbulb manufacturer to sell you shitty lightbulbs that go out quickly so that you need to buy more, Whereas in a communist economy it would be in everyones interest to ensure the lightbulbs are as efficient as possible.

2) I disagree with the implication that 'working hard' is a positive thing in-and-of itself.

Work should only ever be a means to an ends - in communism, People work in order to ensure welfare of the commune, Under capitalism people work to ensure the profit margins of their employers. You seem to think that as long as people are working, It doesn't matter what they are actually working for.

3) this one I just kinda find absurd. Are you seriously gunna argue that capitalism is better at distributing labour amongst society? Look around you, Who does the majority of the work in society? The working class - that's why they're called the working class. Billionaires can ensure that their grandchildren's grandchildren never have lift a finger their entire life and yet you're saying that socialism is the one that encourages slackers? Usually when pro-capitalist people misrepresent socialism they argue that it will lead to work camps and gulags - but nope, You're saying it will make everyone lazy, That's an interesting one. . . .
Debate Round No. 1
SamuelAZimmerman

Pro

SamuelAZimmerman forfeited this round.
mackeeper

Con

uh. . . ?
Debate Round No. 2
SamuelAZimmerman

Pro

SamuelAZimmerman forfeited this round.
mackeeper

Con

mackeeper forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
SamuelAZimmerman

Pro

SamuelAZimmerman forfeited this round.
mackeeper

Con

mackeeper forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
SamuelAZimmerman

Pro

SamuelAZimmerman forfeited this round.
mackeeper

Con

mackeeper forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
6 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 6 records.
Posted by Thomas_Witt 3 years ago
Thomas_Witt
As a marxist I feel like I should butt in and correct a lot of false beliefs people seem to have about socialism in general.
Socialism is not when the government does things. The military is not socialist, No government program is socialist as they all operate under the capitalist mode of production.
Democratic socialism is not socialism, It is glorified social democracy and is still very much capitalist.
What would socialism actually look like then?
It would be where all factories and the ways in which things are produced are owned by society as a whole. This CAN be done through nationalization of factories but these factories still MUST be placed under the control of the workers not a state bureaucrat.
Under capitalism you are forced to sell your labour to a capitalist and all value that you produce in that job belongs to the capitalist, You simply get the wage and they gain all the profits which come from whatever YOU made. This creates a sense of alienation between work and the constant commodity fetishism that is required to continuously sell commodities as you are completely seperated from everything you do in society and put in constant competition with your peers to rise to the top of the capitalist heirarchy.
Socialism does not mean you are payed the same as everyone else, In fact it is so much more complicated than that so much so that the two cannot even be compared.
You are not payed, Essentially the value that you produce in your job is given to society as a whole and you take back from society exactly equal to the value that you gave(more value created more value you get back. ) This would be done through the use of a modern planned economy which would utilize digital payment methods for labour certificates, And would require the use of supercomputers to calculate the labour values which all make up a modern economy.
This extensive computation was not possible in say the USSR as it was done by hand, They simply had production goals for each indu
Posted by Block19 3 years ago
Block19
China adopted socialism in the 80's and in that time the have managed to become Americas biggest economic competitor on a global scale. Not to mention how the current economic climate and trade war will only help China gain economic power.
Posted by Debating_Horse 3 years ago
Debating_Horse
Remember when people thought that socialism would work, And when they tried it, It failed? Yeah me too!
Posted by Block19 3 years ago
Block19
I think the biggest factor that people are overlooking is not which economic policy a nation adopts, But rather what political structure the governing body operates under. That will have a huge impact on how the economy is regulated, Regardless of what economy you are using. Unregulated capitalism leads to monopolies that crush competition and expand the division between the rich and the poor virtually eliminating the middle class as we know it. Unregulated communism leads a nation with no currency where everyone who can work, Must work, And the government will provide you with the things you need to survive; regardless of whether or not you are happy about it. Socialism is the middle ground between the two, In fact Karl Marx understood that it would be impossible for a country to successfully transition from a capitalistic society to a communist one without going through i significant transition period. Socialism should not be confused for communism, Socialist societies understand that individuals should be able to purchase things as they wish, This includes property, Something you would not find in a true communist society.
Posted by canis 3 years ago
canis
With capitalism you can not really blame anyone if 90 % of the population has 5 % of the "income". With socialism you would wonder why.
Posted by Masterful 3 years ago
Masterful
Why would you put extra effort into work knowing you're getting payed the same as everyone else? Why would I become a doctor? Being a toilet cleaner would be so much easier.

The best way to play a benevolent communist society is to show willing but not able, If that's not viable then the society is malevolent.
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