The Instigator
TheBoldDebator
Pro (for)
Winning
8 Points
The Contender
backwardseden
Con (against)
Losing
7 Points

Christianity against Atheism

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Post Voting Period
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after 3 votes the winner is...
TheBoldDebator
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 11/22/2018 Category: Religion
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 6,147 times Debate No: 119118
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (488)
Votes (3)

 

TheBoldDebator

Pro

God created the Heavens and Earth. Don't believe that? I got biblical evidence. (Genesis 1) If you can't believe the Bible, How much more any other books? You say scientists have everything and know everything, But they weren't around for 'A Million Years' when everything supposedly happened with the big bang and all. No, That stuff never happened nor do scientists have evidence. It's a theory. A theory is much like a guess, You don't have actual proof it has happened. I have proof and so do many others on how God is real. He has given me many blessings and I thank Him for it. You have suffered many bad things in your lifetime and you blame God? Well I got one thing to say about that. God is not the cause of your problems. It's the devil. You say you want to go to Hell? No, You're not going to have some huge party there. You're going to burn for eternity. That's wasn't God's intent for the world. You say you're an atheist? Well then why do people blame God when bad things happen? And they say that God doesn't exist, But they blame him? Don't you think that's rude? And what do you think came first, The egg or the chicken?
backwardseden

Con

Greetings! I will accept your debate. Now I do apologize if my language does sound a bit harsh. It is the way I talk.

Reasons for accepting atheism and not the god according to the bible in which nobody can prove even exists. . .

Now one rule that I must stipulate and that is that dsjpk5 will not be allowed to vote in the voting process because he is a racist bigot who always votes the same way, No exceptions, None. And if this debate goes the distance, He will once again vote the same way, Christian, Certainly vote for you in the conduct area, And not even take a look at the evidence which I will win handily. If he votes, This debate will thus be disqualified.

First for all you don't know what "atheism" is. In which nearly 100% of the population on planet earth doesn't, It is simply by the very definition of the dictionary "1. The doctrine or belief that there is no God. 2. Disbelief in the existence of a supreme being or beings. " DO NOT TURN IT INTO ANYTHING ELSE because that"s all it is.

Now that you know what atheism is let"s get right down to it and point out reasons to ---never--- accept or even believe in the god of the bible, Not for any reason, Not ever.

Sure let"s first try to (gulp) ease into what you stated.
"God created the Heavens and Earth. " According to what? "I got biblical evidence. " The bible isn"t evidence. More like its lack-there-of-evidence. The god of the bible would not be stupid enough, Not ever, Not for any reason, To use text as a form of communication, The worst form of communication possible.
NOTHING is established in scripture so everybody can get it wrong as there have been 0 updates in at least 2, 000 years. There"s translations upon translations upon translations upon translations upon copies upon copies upon copies upon copies upon dead languages upon dead languages with absolutely 0% of a chance to trace it back to the original. And there"s no original in the first place! So absolutely nobody is interpreting correctly. Not you, Not the pope, No minister, No priest, No pastor, No-bo-dy. And within those translations and copies throughout the generations, Characters and what they have said, Especially with its leading characters, Namely god and christ, Their quotes/ verses have changed over time. Oh really? Who has the right and or know how to change ANY of god"s language to update it to whatever they felt like and or to amputate it into ---their--- language? Did they consult god and or jesus to see if this was OK? Of course not. And more importantly did they get it right as an updated version to what these characters would say in this day and age, Or even back then when the translations were updated? So once again god if as stated was reasonably intelligent, In which he"s clearly not, Would ---never--- use text as a form of communication, The worst form of communication possible because he would have certainly have foreseen all of these major faults. There are at least 100 common sense reasons why your god would never use text as a form of communication. I would hope that you can think of some of them. You are better than this! I can mention more if you would like? Oh and btw, Nobody can even prove that this god of the bible exists! Nobody ever has in the entire history of the human race.

"You say scientists have everything and know everything, " That is a 100% false statement and you know what? There's nothing wrong with that. What is wrong with saying "I don"t know"? But to supposed christians there"s no such a thing because dare their/ your god be imperfect? Of course not. Newsflash: he is not. After all according to the bible your god created man with all of his broken bones, Diseases, Heart attacks etc. Even worse this unproved god had to create life only to destroy it only to recreate it in a supposed biblical flood that never occurred. Would you like to watch A LOT of videos that ARE scientifically correct and the biblical account of the flood and Noah"s ark is fictitious, Erroneous and false and would not be supported in any scientific community of merit anywhere in the world?

Actually scientists DO have evidence for the big bang. You might want to do some research on it in which you clearly haven"t done. You also might want to do some research into that scientists have no evidence whatsoever for your god. And not a single shred of it. After all there"s no way to prove this god of yours because in your bible your god never describes what your god is. There"s no tests for your god. There"s no demonstrations for your god. There"s no declarations for your god. What is your god? What is IT? You don"t even know because there are no descriptions. So don"t say there"s no evidence for the big bang when you have no idea if there is or isn"t. You haven"t done any research on it.
Sure there"s no actual proof on the big bang until it can be performed in a test tube. How can your god be performed in a test tube if there"s no evidence?
"Assume that we have no answer. Then the answer is "I don"t know". The answer isn"t "I can"t think of anything better, Therefore a god did it. ""Matt Dillahunty

"I have proof and so do many others on how God is real. He has given me many blessings" that"s not proof. A blessing is not tangible, Testable or demonstratable.
"and I thank Him for it. " Well then according to your bible, You thank an absolute monster who has murdered 2, 821, 364 all in one teeny tiny little splatch of land which included babies, Children and pregnant women (abortions in which you so-called christians are supposed to be so against) so its a double contradiction because of "thou shalt not kill" and yet your god murders for absolutely no reason whatsoever especially with mass genocides. You as a supposed christian are forced to justify it especially with the murders of babies, Children and pregnant women.

"You have suffered many bad things in your lifetime and you blame God? " No atheists don"t believe in god. Remember? But let"s put that theory into effect for those who do believe in your god. Yeah you should absolutely blame god. If not then its simple really, Then your god is not a god, He is not in control of everything, Is not in charge of everything, Is not all knowing or all powerful, Is not omnipotent is not perfect by any means. So why believe?
"God is not the cause of your problems. It's the devil. " So the same statements can be stated in the above paragraph. And since its the devil according to you, It means that your god is not in control, Not in charge etc etc etc especially of the devil" so why not let this devil reign free? Oh please. I have my own life and so do billions of others to NOT deal with this nonsense that you can"t prove.
Hell like heaven doesn't exist. But let's suppose it does only according to you. I will be sent to hell simply because I do not believe in your jesus in which there is no proof for him having ever existed. If a person who rapes, Beats and tortures 6 five year old girls and then later finds your christ, He will get to go to heaven. What great morals your religion conveys. Want the verses? I am moral. Your completely bankrupt, Corrupt religion is not.
Tracie Harris "If I could stop a person from raping a child, I would. That"s the difference between me and your god. He watches and shuts the door and you go ahead and you rape that child and when your"re done I"m gonna punish you. If I did that people would think I"m a freakin" monster. "

Something you don"t get is that all religions are invented to explain the unexplained. All religions known have 3 things in common, At least. 1. They all have a creation myth. 2. They all have a an above word. A heaven if you will. 3. They all have a below world. A hell if you will.
"You say you want to go to Hell? " Hell like heaven doesn"t exist. And I unlike you don"t have to worry about looking over my shoulder every second of every day worrying about it.
"That's wasn't God's intent for the world. " How do you know? Apparently, You must know your god better than he knows himself if this god of yours exists.
"You say you're an atheist? " Once again look at the definition. "Well then why do people blame God when bad things happen? " Only if you are tepid enough to believe.

You"ve talked about your god not wanting to punish people? Um no. He"s completely immoral. Absolutely your god wants to punish people. Let's give you a morality test and see just how moral you are. If you answer "yes" to any of these 6 questions, Then you are as immoral as your god. All of these question 100% require a direct "no" answer. PE-IR-OD. No they Are not my questions. I have only rewritten them because DDO was not taking them in their original text. Btw, This is the OT. The NT is far worse in it immorality than the OT.
According to your god you should be put to death if you blaspheme. Do you think that's a good idea? Y____? N____? Leviticus 24:16, According to your god you should be put to death if you work on the sabbath. Do you think that's a good idea? Y____? N____? Exodus 31:14, And Numbers 15: 32-36, According to your god you should be put to death if you curse at your parents. Do you think that's a good idea? Y____? N____? Exodus 21:17, Leviticus 20:9, Mark 7:10, Matthew 15:4, According to your god you should be put to death if you commit adultery. Do you think that's a good idea? Y____? N____? Leviticus 20:10. That's directly from your 10 commandments. Here are some other things that YOUR god thinks you should be put to death for. . . According to your god you should be put to death if you are a homosexual? Do you think that's a good idea? Y___? N____? Leviticus 20:13, According to your god you should be put to death if you do not worship him. Do you think that's a good idea? Y____? N____? Deuteronomy 13: 9-10 and Deuteronomy 17: 2-5.

We'll get into other reasons as to why atheism is the correct way to be in other rounds should you wish this debate to continue. Please tc and have fun.
Debate Round No. 1
TheBoldDebator

Pro

First of all, Before I continue further, I would like to thank you to agreeing to this debate.

Second of all, I suppose I should've explained the true definition to Christianity to those of you who don't know. It's basically a belief based on the teachings and miracles of Jesus. The evidence of Christianity comes from the Bible as most of you know. Jesus is the Christ. "Christ" means anointed one and it's not his last name cause we all know people didn't really have last names back in those days. When God sent his son Jesus to Earth to die for us, He rose 3 days later and the Old Testament Laws and Prophecies were fulfilled. This is why we don't follow some of the things from the OT such as no working on the Sabbath. If you want a better definition, Just tell me.
Well let me start by answering your questions and such.

So, You know how there are many Christians in the world? When Jesus died and rose again and all that stuff, People saw and believed. And when you see something AMAZING happen, Do you just stay there and keep quiet? NO! If you had the cure for cancer, You would tell everyone about it unless you were selfish. So, Those Christians told other people and they believed and told other people and it went on and on and a lot of Asia became Christians when the 11 disciples of Jesus went out and spread the word.

You also talked about translations. Apostles and different men of God were spoken to by God of what to write. In 2 Timothy 3:16 it says, "All scripture is given by inspiration of God, And is profitable for doctrine, For reproof, For correction, For instruction in righteousness. " As you see, The Word of God was of God. He helped interpret the Bible into other languages and another thing. When there was the fall of the Tower of Babel, Everyone had their own languages and stuff. So, When you mix those different people together, They also have their own languages. Therefore, The different types of people helped translate the Bible into the other languages. And yes, They did consult God. But also, The different translations other than the King James Bible is wrong. In Deuteronomy 4:2 it says, "Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, Neither shall ye diminish ought from it, That ye may keep the commandments of the Lord your God which I command you. " Meaning, Mankind was never allowed to change the word of God and that's how we have all those wrong translations these days.

As God has created everything in the world and humans themselves, He didn't push diseases nor heart attacks on people. When Eve and Adam ate of the fruit of the knowledge of good and evil, They were banned from the garden and sin entered the world. (Genesis) And God doesn't always keep the bad from the world because He gave mankind their own choices. He didn't force salvation upon anyone either.

And no, I would not like 100 evolution videos about such falseness.

And how dare you blame God for murdering babies? ! ? MANKIND ARE THE ONES WHO SET UP ABORTION CLINICS! NO! GOD HAD NO PART WHATSOEVER IN IT!

What do you believe will happen in your afterlife? Tell me that please. For some of the yes and no questions, I actually agree yes.
These answers having nothing to do with you, But rather your beliefs.
backwardseden

Con

Sure, No np in continuing this debate. I"ve always been fascinated in how religion manipulates the human mind into destructive capabilities especially when there is absolutely no proof of any god ever existing not for any religion, Not ever. Christianity, Namely the bible in which its religion is solely based is no exception. And you were mentioning that your religion is based upon jesus christ and his teachings, And yet there is no proof of his existence. Strange isn"t it that all miracles, Every single one of them over the past two centuries have been debunked? That"s because science have caught up with them and proved them to be hogwash.

Let"s be real honest and coy here. Do you know who this years winner of AGT is? His name is Shin Lim. He must have fooled at least 200 million people with his card magic. Now do you really think that your jesus, In which there's no proof that he ever existed could have not fooled a simple 12 apostles?

And once again, Your god would never be stupid enough to use text, The worst form of communication possible. Do you really think that supposing that your jesus existed, That the verses in the bible are exactly to the letter what he said with all the translations and language barriers through the thousands of yars that have transpired with no backups whatsoever because there was no original to trace it back to the original? Did your jesus have secretaries to jot down every single verb he stated? Oh I get it, Every single sentence he stated that is in your bible was translated through memory - and memory is always subject to failure.
To prove how correct this it, Get a circular table of 8 or 9. Whisper into the first person"s ear 4 to five random sentences. Something like "Its a fine sunny day today. I shall arrive at work soon. When I am there I have a lot of work that needs to be done. My cubicle is a disaster. " Then that person tries to whisper those same sentences into the next person"s ear and so on and on until it finally gets back to you. By the time it gets back to you, The sentences are so grabled that making sense of the original sentences is impossible. Try it! Now do you really think that your apostles got it right considering the fact that these people of the time in that area couldn"t read or write?

Now there is evidence of christianity as a religion. So? It doesn"t make it true. Its just as true as Ronald McDonald or santa, Or thor, Or even He-Man or She-Ra "I am the power".

"When God sent his son Jesus to Earth to die for us, . . . " WRONG. Nobody sent anybody to die for me and or anybody who is sane. Again YOU ARE BETTER THAN THIS. Nobody who is sane am going to partake is someone"s knowing suffering. How stupid is that? The Buddhists teach the end of suffering. Its not a "belief". Christianity beliefs teach the beginning of suffering. It is a fabric of its teaching. Awe gee, I just cannot imagine which one I would choose in not knowing a single thing about either or if I only knew those two things about them.

Even worse is your christ could have only suffered for 17 hours tops. That"s it. There are millions that suffer, Sometimes for decades. A perfect example is your god knowingly creates children to be raped, Beaten and tortured by daddy, Age 4, As daddy sticks his you know what inside of them pumping away while he punches them in the face sometimes twice per week. Your god knowingly creates daddy and gives the power to daddy to knowingly do this and again, If not, Then your god is not a god, Is not in control of everything, Doesn't know everything, Is not in charge of everything, Is not all knowing and all powerful, Is not omnipotent, And is certainly not perfect. The devil? Then your god gives control to the devil which is far worse. Either way the victims suffer as clearly as---your---god---wants---it. If not, Then he would not create it. Simple. And then you have the victims. In this case the children who suffer, Who have no free will whatsoever to get away and SCREAM.
So DO NOT talk to me about hell. When your god knowingly creates hell for millions of children each and every single year. Got it?

Getting back to jesus"
"He rose 3 days later and the Old Testament Laws and Prophecies were fulfilled. " Really? Show me where in the OT that this was stated? The fact of the matter is, Is that its not even close. Nice guess from something in which you clearly know nothing about.
"This is why we don't follow some of the things from the OT such as no working on the Sabbath. " No you do what you want how you want and when you want to suit you and only you. Now to prove you 100% wrong from both the OT and the NT (once again sorry about my harsh language but its the way I talk but the again thus far you"ve answered and or have gotten to nothing that I"ve presented in my previous argument).

Let"s start off with (and btw this is not my idea but it proves that your bible is a joke unto itself, No offense)"
John 5: 16-18 "16 And therefore did the Jews persecute Jesus, And sought to slay him, Because he had done these things on the sabbath day. 17 But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, And I work. 18 Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, Because he not only had broken the sabbath, But said also that God was his Father, Making himself equal with God. "
There are several problems with this. 1. 17 Sorry, Ain"t no possible way that jesus"s daddy is going to work on the sabbath, Not ever, Not for any reason, Not ever. So either 2. Jesus is a complete moron and doesn"t know this in which thus he is completely incapable of being the messiah or 3. Jesus flatly lied about it that is daddy would be working on the sabbath thus proving himself to be a false messiah. 4. 18 jesus proclaimed HIMSELF to be the messiah. This in no way was ordained by his daddy to be the messiah (this is also proved with John 14:6 "Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, The truth, And the life: no man cometh unto the Father, But by me. ". 5. Or god is going to work on the sabbath which would never ---ever--- happen because then that would thus prove the entire OT to be false. 6. Actually since god is never going to work on the sabbath and since these few verses thus prove christ to be the false messiah, It also proves that christianity is false and the entire NT is false.

This is not my idea either (once again it proves your christ to be false and your bible to be erroneous)
Pay attention closely:
*Proverbs 30:5 "Every word of God is pure: he is a shield unto them that put their trust in him. "
*Isaiah 40:8 "The grass withereth, The flower fadeth: but the word of our God shall stand for ever. "
*2 Timothy 3:16 "All scripture is given by inspiration of God, And is profitable for doctrine, For reproof, For correction, For instruction in righteousness:"
*Psalm 19:7 "The law of the Lord is perfect, Converting the soul: the testimony of the Lord is sure, Making wise the simple. "
*Psalm 119:160 "Thy word is true from the beginning: and every one of thy righteous judgments endureth for ever. "
* James 1:17 "Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, And cometh down from the Father of lights, With whom is no variableness, Neither shadow of turning. "
In other words god"s word is PERFECT. It cannot be changed by anyone or anything. Christ, Being the lowly drab that he supposedly was in which like god who in which nobody can even prove has ever existed could not change the laws of his god because the laws of his god ARE PERFECT. Therefore he could not break the laws of god such as working on the sabbath and should have rightly been executed.

"When Jesus died and rose again"" We're going to ignore that. Not enough room.

OK let"s get into more reasons why your god would never use text as a form of communication, The worst form of communication possible. You just invented excuses. I really hate that.
Let"s give you a few translations to show you how distorted your so called truth of the bible can get. .
* In the Bishop"s bible, The one before the KJV, The word "Tyrant" was used I don"t know how many times (its at least 400 from what completed records show) and then in the KJV that was replaced by "King". WHAT? Tyrant and KIng are two different and totally apples and oranges with each having totally different meanings.
* In Isaiah 45:7 KJV "I form the light, And create darkness: I make peace, And create evil: I the Lord do all these things. " In the NIV version its "I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and create disaster; I, The Lord, Do all these things. " In the NLT its "I create the light and make the darkness. I send good times and bad times. I, The Lord, Am the one who does these things. The words "evil" and "disaster" and "bad"are completely 3 completely different words that have 0% of nothing to do with each other and completely change the meaning of the verses. With each different verse, The messages are completely different. The synonyms of each word don"t even match.
There's a couple more that I have searched through if you want. Now if it occurs in these translations, Then it i=occurs through all of them spreading different messages and you have no idea which one of them is correct. Nobody does. Nobody interprets correctly. Its not even a close call. Your god would ---never--- use text as a form of communication!

You might want to check up on that one where your god murders babies, Children and pregnant women. I will post a few verses for you to look up in the comments section, That is if DDO will take them. In the past they haven"t. But you might want to use some common sense young lady and FIGURE THINGS OUT in that once again your god murdered 2, 821, 364 in your bible alone oh and oh yeah what do you call the great flood? Do you think that everyone were men? No babies, No children, No pregnant women - thus no abortions? Simply google "how many did god kill in the bible? "

I'm out of space
Debate Round No. 2
TheBoldDebator

Pro

First of all, I will be talking about your sense of thinking "God manipulating people. "
The word "manipulation" is usually implied as negative. But, When the word is attributed to God, It talks of His control over the world and His honor and glory. God made everything perfect including mankind. It wasn"t in His plan that there would be hundreds, Thousands, Millions of people dying lost in their sins going to a fiery Hell today from generations to generations. It was the turning of mankind from being God centered to being self centered, That caused all the problems in the world. Mankind is so selfish and manipulate for their own desires which is why most people have took on the word with a negative, Selfish meaning.

God"s interference in the world is of a good thing than people think a bad. Because God gave every human being their own mind to think and to do anything they desire, Mankind has chosen to use that to their advantage of evil and manipulation in the world today which is another reason why bad things happen. Bad things are of the bad decisions we make today. It"s not of God. God had the Great Flood to wash out the world"s wickedness, Although, The world is just more evil today. You mentioned that God let/wanted women and children die in the Flood, But He gave every human a chance at that time in history. He gave them over a hundred years to board the ark and such, But no one took the chance to save their life and they laughed and mocked at the whole idea of rain coming. God will destroy the world again, Not of water, But of fire. As I was saying, God"s holiness cannot tolerate mankind"s sin nature, So He sent His only son Jesus into the world to die for everyone to create a way for mankind to go to Heaven. Some people die to their own selfish desires and their pride which is why they go to Hell.

These days, People say that Jesus was just a historical figure or some myth, But there"s a good deal of evidence that has been proven of His existence 2, 000+ years ago.
(this small paragraph is not mine, But of some of my research)
"Within a few decades of His supposed lifetime, He"s mentioned by Jewish and Roman historians, As well as by dozens of Christian writings. For example: King Arthur who lived around AD 500. At that time, However, He is not mentioned until 300-400 years after he lived. The evidence of Jesus is not limited to later folklore, As are the accounts of Arthur.
Proof that Jesus was real. "

In the Bible, The first writings of Jesus were written by St. Paul, And scholars agree that the earliest of these letters were written within 25 years of Jesus"s death at the very latest, While the detailed biographical accounts of Jesus in the New Testament gospels date from around 40 years after he died. These all appeared within the lifetime of numerous eyewitnesses and provide descriptions that comport with the culture and geography of first-century Palestine.

"As far as we know, The first author outside the church to mention Jesus is the Jewish historian Flavius Josephus, Who wrote a history of Judaism around AD93. He has two references to Jesus. One of these is controversial because it is thought to be corrupted by Christian scribes (probably turning Josephus"s negative account into a more positive one), But the other is not suspicious " a reference to James, The brother of "Jesus, The so-called Christ". "

About 20 years after Josephus we have the Roman politicians Pliny and Tacitus, Who held some of the highest offices of state at the beginning of the second century AD. From Tacitus we learn that Jesus was executed while Pontius Pilate was the Roman prefect in charge of Judaea (AD 26-36) and Tiberius was emperor (AD 14-37) " reports that fit with the timeframe of the gospels. Pliny contributes the information that, Where he was governor in northern Turkey, Christians worshipped Christ as a god. Neither of them liked Christians " Pliny writes of their "pig-headed obstinacy" and Tacitus calls their religion a destructive superstition.

In the ancient world, There was never debates over whether if Jesus was a historical figure. In the earliest literature of the Jewish Rabbis, Jesus was denounced as the illegitimate child of Mary and a sorcerer. Among pagans, The satirist Lucian and philosopher Celsus dismissed Jesus as a scoundrel, But we know of no one in the ancient world who questioned whether Jesus lived. In a recent book, The French philosopher Michel Onfray talks of Jesus as a mere hypothesis, His existence as an idea rather than as a historical figure. A bit over 10 years ago, The Jesus Project was set up in the US; one of its main questions for discussion was that of whether or not Jesus existed. Some authors have even argued that Jesus of Nazareth was doubly non-existent, Contending that both Jesus and Nazareth are Christian inventions. It is worth noting, Though, That the two mainstream historians who have written most against these hyper sceptical arguments are atheists: Maurice Casey (formerly of Nottingham University) and Bart Ehrman (University of North Carolina). They have issued stinging criticisms of the "Jesus-myth" approach, Branding it pseudo-scholarship. Nevertheless, A recent survey discovered that 40% of adults in England did not believe that Jesus was a real historical figure.

"Recently there have been claims that Jesus was a great-grandson of Cleopatra, Complete with ancient coins allegedly showing Jesus wearing his crown of thorns. In some circles, There is still interest in the Shroud of Turin, Supposedly Jesus"s burial shroud. Pope Benedict XVI stated that it was something that "no human artistry was capable of producing" and an "icon of Holy Saturday". It is hard to find historians who regard this material as serious archaeological data, However. The documents produced by Christian, Jewish and Roman writers form the most significant evidence. These abundant historical references leave us with little reasonable doubt that Jesus lived and died. The more interesting question " which goes beyond history and objective fact " is whether Jesus died and lived. "

You were talking about some dude fooling over a million people with card magic. Card magic and miracles are totally different. It is generally believed that magic is an act of a human being, Whereas, A miracle is an act of God. Both miracle and magic might appear to be the same, But the two do have differences.

Miracles to a great extent rely on the will of God. A reason to why we cannot expect miracles to happen time and again. They happen very rarely, If at all they are destined to happen. Miracles are based on the power of God and do not use energy. It is considered that God usually works with the laws of nature to perform miracles. Theologians say that, God regularly works through his created nature, Yet is free to work without, Above, Or against it as well. Miracles have nothing to do with the control of objects. A miracle is often characterized by a beneficial event that is statistical, But not contrary to the law of nature. Miracles are a source of astonishment and delight; however, It is only after experiencing a miracle that we think about God and praise him.
Magic is yet another act, An act performed by human beings. Magic is an attempt to understand, Experience and influence the world using symbols and performing acts. It is the twisting and turning of the object's nature. While performing magic, We use the so called energy present around and try to suppress the real nature of the objects. Magic is not a will of God, It is personal. Magic is wielded and something to be impressed upon. It happens in front of our very eyes, Much to our delight and astonishment. The skill of the magician becomes evident in the act of magic, Whereas the power of God becomes evident in the act of miracle.
Now, Jesus suffering on the cross. He was willing to die for the world. That"s a lot. That"s how much God loves us and yet the world rejected their creator which is so sad. He was spit upon, Beaten, They banged a crown of thorns with thorns over 3 inches and it went to his skull, They mocked him, Laughed at him even, And He carried His own cross until someone had to help Him, And He died a painful death on the cross. And you say that"s not painful? It"s sad how selfish the world is today and that the world would crucify Him JUST BECAUSE they were SO SELFISH and just because He did some miracles that actually did good!
Perhaps the most difficult and emotionally charged question ever asked the pastor or apologist is why God let a particular child suffer or die. The question is rarely abstract. The typical Christian answer is, "We won"t know until we get to heaven. " Of course, We will certainly know more when we get to heaven, But is that all we can answer? I suggest we know more than that. We may not know all of God"s reasons for letting a particular child die at a particular moment, But we can answer why God allows children to die.
Children suffer and die due to three main causes. First, Children suffer and die due to pestilence and disease enabled when the Lord cursed the ground after Adam and Eve sinned. He banished Adam and Eve from the Garden of Eden, Thus barring humans from the rejuvenating power of the Tree of Life. God warned Adam and Eve that if they ate from the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil, "thou shalt surely die" (Gen. 2:17), And He didn"t add "at a ripe old age of natural causes. " He just said, "thou shalt surely die, " and we"ve been attending funerals ever since. Second, Children also suffer and die because of the mistakes and sins of others, Such as leaving a pool gate unsecured, Drunk driving, Murder, And so on. Third, Children suffer and die because natural laws work in regular ways: the gravity that keeps us on planet Earth also enables fatal falls; the fire that warms also burns; the water in which we swim can also drown.
Can't say more. I'm running out typing space.
backwardseden

Con

Now you are really p**sing me off. Let"s attack your comments first because you claimed that your god does not kill babies in which you were proven to be 100% wrong because you have no idea as to the trash or garbage that your bible preaches or what it entails. NONE and don"t even for a second pretend that you do. YOU GOT ME? "In Deuteronomy 2:32-34 and Hosea 13:16 and 1 Samuel 15:3 They were in battle and of course in battle you go fight the enemy. " NO WRONG. Your god was committing deliberate genocide against tribes that didn"t wasn"t to bow, Yield or kneel to his ruling in which your god thus murdered innocents babies, And pregnant women (ABORTIONS) in the process. So much goes for your god believing in peace, Love, Kindness, Care, Harmony, Of any kind but instead showing off his evil, Anger, Wrath, Vengeance, Rage, Fury, Jealousy in which this storybook character of your god superior god complex has freely admitted to. Great! Baggage human emotions of all things! And YOUR god has NEVER achieved peace for any length of time, Not anywhere, Not ever since his inception.
Yeah you avoided completely and totally answering the morality questions because you cannot answer them because you know that your god if moral would ---never--- place immoral laws like them into place.

Moving on and I"m going to jump right to it and thus end this debate"
"Because God gave every human being their own mind to think and to do anything they desire, Mankind has chosen to use that to their advantage of evil and manipulation in the world today which is another reason why bad things happen. Bad things are of the bad decisions we make today. It"s not of God. God had the Great Flood to wash out the world"s wickedness, "
I am ending this debate because. . .
1. That is 100% false and it might help, Just a teeny tiny little bit of you would actually read your bible and check up on that as well as check up on other information that you get completely false and wrong (more on that later).
2. Your morals, Just like your god"s are completely bankrupt and immoral. You just proved it. You"ve just justified the murder, For whatever reason of babies, Children and pregnant women. There is no justification for it. None. Not ever. Yeah that"s what your great flood was among all of your other DELIBERATE and for no reason other umpteen genocides.
3. You proved you and your god to be hypocritical and contradictory. Its perfectly OK for your god to murder (as he did in the great flood in which he did with babies, Children and pregnant women in which you perfectly justify) but not man. Oh and btw, Your god ordered man to go into battle for him and cause deliberate genocides for him. As stated in the previous RD simply google "how many people has the god of the bible murdered? " But you haven't because you are cowardly. And since your god murders those that are pregnant women and thus knowingly commits abortions of all kinds, As he has done in his massive genocides such as the great flood, In which not even the dumbest so-called christian can deny, It is extremely contradictory and hypocritical OF YOU AS A SO-CALLED CHRISTIAN TO BE AGAINST ABORTIONS!
4. Remember when I said that there"s no scientific evidence for the great food? I and so will every single sane person take science over a homicidal maniac god that butchered ALL LIVING THINGS in which you cannot even prove even exists? However your sanity is gone because you justify your god butchering innocent babies still suckling on their mother's nipples, Children and pregnant mothers.
Here is that scientific evidence in which you cannot refute"
http://www. Youtube. Com/watch? V=24WbQkRx2_8&t=46s - How Archaeology Disproves Noah's Flood
http://www. Youtube. Com/watch? V=BitwnxiPH34&t=50s - How Anthropology Disproves Noah's Flood
http://www. Youtube. Com/watch? V=_KEfj3LLNSY&t=58s - How Dendrochronology Disproves Noah's Flood
http://www. Youtube. Com/watch? V=vWZtbZGtiGA - How Meteorology Disproves Noah's Flood
http://www. Youtube. Com/watch? V=DrDTaHjg2IQ&t=530s - How Mythology Disproves Noah"s Flood
http://www. Youtube. Com/watch? V=5MeHmWapM4Y - How Geology Disproves Noah's Flood
http://www. Youtube. Com/watch? V=VRXNJvWkkoI&t=1s - How Paleontology Disproves Noah's Flood
http://www. Youtube. Com/watch? V=5svTzxVa-xQ&t=329s - The Math of the Great Flood
http://www. Youtube. Com/watch? V=8IPGwAf0Ivw&t=156s - Noah's Ark Debunked
http://www. Youtube. Com/watch? V=tyWcka7drWk - 39 Problems with the Noah's Ark Story (includes the great flood also)
http://www. Youtube. Com/watch? V=_um69RqBpSw&t=330s - Noah's Ark is Plagiarized. Here's how we know "
http://www. Youtube. Com/watch? V=qalTJzk4kO0&t=911s - Bible"s Buried Secrets 14:45

Now see, You don"t know anything at all, Nothing about science. That was sadly proved by your bluff in your explanation of the big bang in RD 1. So how can anything you say be taken seriously?
5. To---prove---how---wrong---and---falsifiable---you---are and I do not need and am not required to read a single other sentence from your most recent argument especially when you said, This is the absolute main reason why I am ending this debate with what you stated and its a humdinger of utter arrogance and stupidity "Because God gave every human being their own mind to think and to do anything they desire, Mankind has chosen" That"s a good one. Babies, Children, Pregnant mothers who were completely innocent had the choice to be wiped out by your god in the great flood in which never happened?
6. You have yet to prove, Not even close that your god exists. You only assume that he does with absolutely no evidence in which there is no evidence. None. No one, Not one person in the entire history of the human race has ---ever--- been able to prove YOUR god. The Big Red Book and the Big Blue books are more evidence of your god.

Please, Save yourself the trouble and don"t even bother posting me back. I will continue to believe in peace, Love, Kindness, Care, Peace, Harmony. Your god, In which you cannot even prove even exists in which has freely admitted in your storybook bible in which is not evidence is a superior god complex and nothing else has claimed he is "evil, Anger, Wrath, Vengeance, Rage, Fury, Jealous" namely baggage human emotions. Just what everybody wants in a so-called "supreme deity" - right?

I wish you the very best. Please tc and have fun.
Debate Round No. 3
TheBoldDebator

Pro

So you forfeit? I still have a lot to say about this.
backwardseden

Con

"I still have a lot to say about this. " That's not my problem. That's yours. You ruined your ability to debate what you wanted to say when you invented excuses for something in which you know nothing about (christianity) and yet you pretended that you did.
Debate Round No. 4
TheBoldDebator

Pro

Actually, That's YOUR fault. You're the one who decided you don't want to debate. You could've just told me that from the start and spare me the trouble of typing.
backwardseden

Con

backwardseden forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
488 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by TheBoldDebator 2 years ago
TheBoldDebator
Well, After so long I come back to this website and see this debate. My knowledge and choice of words in round 1 made me cringe XD
Posted by omar2345 3 years ago
omar2345
Sorry TheBoldDebator for the bad vote on my part. Dsjpk5 did start it but I did allow it to change my vote. If I was debating properly I would have given Con the most convincing argument and you the conduct point. Reason is Con was less civil. Con won the most convincing argument because Con did state Atheism is not against Christianity instead the only is that it disbelieves or lack belief of a God.
Posted by TheBoldDebator 3 years ago
TheBoldDebator
Thanks for debating this against me @backwardseden
Posted by omar2345 3 years ago
omar2345
@dsjpk5

It was about Christianity against Atheism.

Pro made an argument that atheists as in all of them have a problem with Christianity. Backwardseden gave a definition which does not state they have a problem with Christianity. Everything else was off topic and not what the debate was about.
Posted by dsjpk5 3 years ago
dsjpk5
It's not enough. You have to address both sides. He made some arguments, But you didn't evaluate them.
Posted by omar2345 3 years ago
omar2345
@dsjpk5

The reason why the arguments were compelling as mentioned below as my evidence is because TheBoldDebator did not give a point of contention to backwardseden. By not giving a point of contention and instead changing what the debate she lost sight to argue against backwardseden's point.

"No counter argument was given about the subject from what I read. "- That should be enough.

If that is not enough above then I would say the definition was not clearly laid out by TheBoldDebator and backwardseden gave the definition. Pro did not say it was wrong or gave a different interpretation. Meaning by TheBoldDebator not giving a point of contention the point was made without a rebuttal as a statement saying she could not rebut. Assuming this but if she had a point of contention then she would have said something about it in the debate.
Posted by dsjpk5 3 years ago
dsjpk5
You're making my case for me, Omar. One must do more than list arguments made. One must explain why certain arguments were compelling (in your view).
Posted by omar2345 3 years ago
omar2345
@dsjpk5

Here it is:

TheBoldDebator carried on debating whereas backwardseden forfeited.

Claim from Pro: You say you're an atheist? Well then why do people blame God when bad things happen? And they say that God doesn't exist, But they blame him?

Against rebutted: 1. The doctrine or belief that there is no God. 2. Disbelief in the existence of a supreme being or beings. " DO NOT TURN IT INTO ANYTHING ELSE because that"s all it is.

No counter argument was given about the subject from what I read.

Any problems ask me in the comments.

Note I gave 7 points to backwardseden to make sure he did not lose. My initial argument that dsjpk5 was arguing about was not valid since I did give an argument therefore dsjpk5 is wrong.
Posted by omar2345 3 years ago
omar2345
@dsjpk5

You know what you can do?

! ""$%^^&= that.

You made the first poor vote and it was only fair that I did the same since I won't allow you to make someone who does not deserve to lose lose. I did have my reason in the comments. I'll find it and post it above and why not while you are here give your reason?
Posted by dsjpk5 3 years ago
dsjpk5
Omar, That's why your vote was poor. . You don't explain every point you voted for.
3 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Vote Placed by Leaning 3 years ago
Leaning
TheBoldDebatorbackwardsedenTied
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Total points awarded:10 
Reasons for voting decision: Honestly, I'm not exactly sure 'what was being debated. If it was just accepting Christianity, that doesn't seem too bad for Pro. If it was that the Christian deity and all that is spoke in the Bible is true, bit harder. But to me, exactly what was being debated seemed a bit muddled. Though Con certainly loses on conduct, and it can be hard to be found convincing if you forfeit rounds or are rude. I think Pro made some alright arguments for the existence of Jesus.
Vote Placed by omar2345 3 years ago
omar2345
TheBoldDebatorbackwardsedenTied
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Total points awarded:07 
Reasons for voting decision: Reason in comments. Added another vote for backwardseden because dsjpk5 did not give valid reasoning. "Poor vote" without explaining it okay. Now he has decided to give 7 votes which makes no sense. I am going to give backwardseden 7 points so that he is not unfairly losing a debate because of someone who for sure has a grudge or inherent biases that is the basis of his reasons for voting a certain way. "Poor vote" without explaining it is not argument and I can assume your intention since you haven't given me anything to work with.
Vote Placed by dsjpk5 3 years ago
dsjpk5
TheBoldDebatorbackwardsedenTied
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Total points awarded:70 
Reasons for voting decision: Countering Omar's poor vote.

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