The Instigator
Con (against)
2 Points
The Contender
Pro (for)
5 Points

Did Christ really have to die?

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Post Voting Period
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after 2 votes the winner is...
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 7/18/2014 Category: Religion
Updated: 7 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 868 times Debate No: 59129
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (2)
Votes (2)




The position of Con, (me) will be that the actual literal physical death of Christ was not mandatory for Christian salvation to become effective. The following scripture will be given as a starter-

But the LORD said to Samuel, "Do not consider his appearance or his height, for I have rejected him. The LORD does not look at the things people look at. People look at the outward appearance, but the LORD looks at the heart." (I Samuel 16:7)

This is a debate based on the Bible. It is taken for granted that the account given in the Bible about Jesus is what actually happened, (that Jesus was born, lived and died as the Gospels state). I trust that someone will take the Pro side in seriousness and treat the subject with respect. Hopefully Pro will find enough material to make 3 meaningful arguments to prove the position that Christ had to die physically.

This is a debate about the necessity for the physical death of the Messiah/Christ to take place.
Thanks and good luck.


I accept and, since my opponent did not give any first round acceptance rules, I will jump right into arguments and rebuttals. Besides, there is only three rounds! This seems to be an intriguing topic for a lot of people. Thank you for the instigation.


I am a Protestant (Christian), and unlike some Christians, I take the whole Bible literally because most of it is backed up by historical and scientific evidence. I grew up with great Christian influences and this website helps challenge my faith I am younger than you might've guessed, but don't underestimate me. I like how the hip hop culture reaches out to many non Christians and how many Believers are entitled and CAN preach the Gospel to the everyday world, as it is needed desperately for hope of survival and a Rock to stand strong with (Psalm 18:2 and 18:31 and 31:3, Exodus 15:2, Deuteronomy 32:18, etc.). [1]

I will be taking on the idea that "the physical death of Jesus Christ on the Cross, or the Messiah, was necessary." I have a question: is Con going to argue that there could have been another way for Christ to symbolically or physically
"take away our sins," or is it all going to be about the necessity for the death? I realize that the BoP is all on me.


We think of death as a horrible object--I'm not sure what noun it would be--or idea, or concept, because it ends life for the person on earth and brings the emotional burden of loss upon people who were close to the dead person. If Christ died and He was the Messiah, there would be a cry of emotion among the people who had walked with Jesus in life. His family, his disciples, and the witnesses of God's miracles which Christ did on earth. It is all basically a love story, except for much more important and dramatic than most typical ones now days. In the Bible, it is quite a drama how the Pharisees, King Herod, and Pontius Pilate weren't sure what Jesus did wrong yet the people wanted Him to be killed rather than the actually-guilty Barabbas. It is even more interesting how Jesus' own disciple was the one said to betray Him,

1. Jesus had to die on the cross to pay for our wrongdoing, for our sins. The law required that mankind die for his wrongdoing (sins) because mankind violated God's law. We all violate God's law in some way or another, whether through deed, or thought, or both. God knew that man could not improve his behavior enough to satisfy the demands of the law or enough to merit going to Heaven to be with Him. So, He sent His Son, Jesus, to die for our wrongdoing, sins (John 3:16).

2. Jesus had to die on the cross to satisfy the law -- that sin be paid for by death. The cross was the chosen instrument for the death of Jesus because this was the form of death inflicted on criminals and ordered by the Romans who governed Jerusalem at this time. It was the most grueling kind of death a person could face. The word "excruciating" is rooted in the word "crucifixion". It was perhaps the most excruciating form of death to exist. And yet Jesus died willingly for us--so that we could know Him and have eternal life.

3. Jesus died on the cross to fulfill prophesy. The death of Jesus upon the cross was prophesied in several places in the Old Testament Bible, including in Isaiah 53 and also in Psalm 22.

Was Jesus' death necessary for salvation?
It was a love story so important that, if Jesus had not died on the cross for us, we could not be saved. He died on the cross willingly because He loved us and wanted to make a way for us to spend eternity with Him. Jesus died on the cross to pay the penalty for our wrongdoings. If He had not died, He could not have paid for our wrongdoings (our sins). Therefore, He chose to die so that we could be saved by believing on Him.

You asked for three good reasons why Jesus had to die on the cross, and I think I did that and more. Another thing: I don't see a reason why Christ dying on the cross to pay for our sins is a bad thing, especially because of his resurrection from the dead! You see, His death not only paid for our guilt and led us to knowledge and a relationship with God, but also symbolized the fact that Jesus brings LIFE and SATISFACTION, that through HIS BLOOD we might be saved.

I look forward to the next round.

Debate Round No. 1


Con's Rebuttal to Pro's number 1-

Pro said, (second to last paragraph):
"Was Jesus' death necessary for salvation? It was a love story..."
Con's answer: Every love story that I have ever heard of or read has had an author.
"Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God." (Hebrews 12:2)

God never asked for anyone's advice on how to write His love story. He could have written it any way that He wanted to. Or He could have not written it at all. It was all up to Him. Therefore since Christ is God and the Author of our faith as in Hebrews above Jesus did not originally have to go die. Christ as the Author could have simply written the story another way.

But this debate is about the Gospel as we know it. We are debating the love story that we actually have. So we want to know if Christ had to die keeping within the story as it was written leading up to His death. We want to know what was the intent of the Author before Christ was executed.

The mind of God concerning Human sacrifice before the Crucifixion. Here is my scripture to support my position that Human sacrifice goes against the Mind of the Author of the love story-

They have built the high places of Topheth in the Valley of Ben Hinnom to burn their sons and daughters in the fire--something I did not command, nor did it enter my mind. Jer. 7:31
Sacrifice and offering you did not desire-- but my ears you have opened -- burnt offerings and sin offerings you did not require. Ps. 40:6
Let no one be found among you who sacrifices their son or daughter in the fire, who practices divination or sorcery, interprets omens, engages in witchcraft, Deu. 18:10

And here is my scripture supporting my position that Human sacrifice goes against the Mind of the Author of the love story before the Law of Moses was given-

Genesis 22

Question: Does the Pro side want to present any scripture to support a position that the Author of the love story is in favor of Human sacrifice?

Con's argument number 2: Point 1:
"Abram believed the LORD, and he credited it to him as righteousness." (Genesis 15:6)

(Credit is a big deal. Example: As long as no one shows up to the U.S. government debt party who is actually big enough to force the American government to pay off the credit it can go right on creating more and more credit. But if someone shows up with enough power to force the U.S. to pay off the credit then there might be some trouble.)

God extended credit to Abraham. The debt was owed to God. The debt was owned by God. There is never going to be a time when anyone can force God to pay off the debt. And God as the free owner of the debt can accept payment in any form He wants. Or He can refuse payment if that is what He wants. And there is no one who can do or say anything about it. Ever.

God looked into the heart of Abraham and saw the faith. Then God showed us the faith that was in Abraham's heart in Genesis chapter 22. We can't look into Abraham's heart. God had to show it to us.

God also looked into the heart of Jesus of Nazareth and saw the willingness to go to the Cross. If Christ was not willing to be the sacrifice but instead had to be forced then the sacrifice would have been void. It was mandatory that Christ had to be willing out of Love. If Christ acted for any other reason than love the sacrifice would have been worthless. It is what is in our hearts that is important. What we do is a by-product of what is in our hearts. If the Romans and the High Priest would have refused to execute Christ then Christ would not have had the opportunity. But we know that Christ would die for us because God showed us what was in Christ's heart.

Con's argument number 2: Point 2:

The Lord's Prayer:

Our Father in heaven,
hallowed be your name.
Your kingdom come,
your will be done,
on earth, as it is in heaven.
Give us this day our daily bread,
and forgive us our debts,
as we also have forgiven our debtors.
And lead us not into temptation,
but deliver us from evil.

"and forgive us our debts, as we also have forgiven our debtors."

We all, both Christians and non-Christians forgive others all the time. No sacrifice is required for forgiveness to take place. It just happens. God can forgive us just like we can forgive one-another.

"The stone the builders rejected has become the cornerstone." (Ps. 118:22)

Christ has become the chief cornerstone. He has become our chief sacrifice. It is not about forgiveness. It is about whether or not we accept God's sacrifice.

The Death of Christ has become...


JasperFrancisShickadance forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 2


The death of Christ has become-

1) A stumbling block to the Jews
2) Foolishness to the Gentiles
3) Power of God and Wisdom of God to the Believers in Christ

God took the most notorious act in history and made it into a love story.


JasperFrancisShickadance forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
2 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Posted by pivot 7 years ago

The Gospel is a love story.
The sin in our lives is real.
The conclusion of your number 1 contains the term 'symbolized'.

We have to use 'symbol' when we can't see the real thing. In my opening 1 Samuel verse it says that people can't see something. Then it says that God can see that thing that the people can't see.

Love stories usually contain the idea of a misunderstanding. One or both parties can't see what is in the heart of the other. You put this all together in your argument number 1 Pro. Very good.
Posted by pivot 7 years ago
Welcome JasperFrancisShickadance,

Hope we have an informative debate. From a purely orthodox position I want you to win this debate.
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by Truth_seeker 7 years ago
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Total points awarded:15 
Reasons for voting decision: I vote pro because he made a very compelling argument and while con quotes scripture to refute the idea of sacrifice, he took it out of context and didn't necessarily refer to human sacrifice, but to divination.
Vote Placed by Phoenix61397 7 years ago
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Total points awarded:10 
Reasons for voting decision: FF

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