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Does the god mentioned in the bible exist

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 4/10/2018 Category: Religion
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Debating Period
Viewed: 529 times Debate No: 112565
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Can we know"really know"that God exists? We need to be aware, first of all, that we can"t prove God exists in the same way we can prove the correct solution to a geometry problem or a scientific formula. We should remember, too, that although we can"t prove God exists, neither can we prove that He doesn"t.
H. M. S. Richards, Sr., founder of The Voice of Prophecy, put it like this: "It is easy for a person to say that God does not exist, but it is impossible for anybody to prove it. On the other hand, to the one who believes in God, there are many evidences of His existence."
The point is this: God"s existence is ultimately a matter of faith, however there are many evidences or reasons to believe that God is real. Let"s look at some of those evidences from the two great sources we have that tell us about God"the things He has made (nature) and the words He has spoken (the Bible.)

Lets look at nature for now. From the beginning of recorded history, one of the main reasons human beings have believed in God has been the marvelous things they saw all around them in nature. The psalmist wrote, "The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament [the sky] shows His handiwork. . . . There is no speech nor language where their voice is not heard" (Psalm 19:1, 3).
Look up into the starry night sky. How many stars can you see, just by looking with your eyes? The answer depends on whether the moon is full, on whether you are in a city or on a mountainside, and on other factors. Scientists tell us there are about 5,000 to 6,000 stars bright enough to be visible to the naked eye. However, you can see only about half of those at any one time because the earth itself gets in the way.
The night sky is impressive, but besides the stars which you can see, there are also millions of stars and galaxies you can"t see"all moving at incomprehensible speeds, perfectly balanced, perfectly synchronized in space. Who orchestrates this marvelous dance? Is it reasonable to think all this is taking place without any design or direction"just happening by chance? No wonder Isaiah says, "Lift up your eyes on high, and see who has created these things. . . . He calls them all by name, by the greatness of His might" (Isaiah 40:26).
And what is true of the vastness of space is also true of the microscopic world. A single grain of sand is made up of billions of molecules, atoms, and electrons, whirling around each other like a tiny solar system. Physicists have unlocked many secrets of the atomic and subatomic world, but they still don"t know exactly how it all works. And they certainly can"t create that miniature world. But Someone did. The apostle Paul says that "since the creation of the world" we can understand who God is and what He is like "by the things that are made" (Romans 1:20).
Let"s look at one further evidence for God from the world of nature"your own body! Until something goes wrong, we often don"t think about the incredible way all the systems and organs of our bodies work together flawlessly. Nerves and muscles, bones and tissues, our heart and brain and lungs, eyes and ears"all these things and hundreds more"are seamlessly connected into a functioning, healthy human person. Thousands of years ago, the psalmist pondered the intricate way his body was put together and exclaimed to God, "You formed my inward parts. . . . I will praise You, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made; marvelous are Your works" (Psalm 139:13, 14).
We could find evidences for the existence of God from the amazing world of nature, but the point is clear: Behind everything we see in the world around us we find two things. We find intelligence, and we find power. And those are attributes of God. For those who believe, it is simply inconceivable that our complex, marvelous universe could have come into being without an infinitely wise, powerful God who designed and created it.

Now lets look at the bible:one of the most obvious sources to look at.The Bible does not present formal arguments that God exists; it simply declares that He exists. The very first words of Scripture state grandly, "In the beginning God. . . ." (Genesis 1:1). Those opening chapters of the Bible go on to paint a picture of this self-existent, all-powerful God creating the heavens and the earth. As the apostle Paul says, "By Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth. . . . He is before all things, and in Him all things consist" (Colossians 1:16, 17).
In the Bible, God reveals Himself to us in a way that allows us to have a better understanding of Him than we could ever gain through nature alone. As convincing as they are, the evidences for God in nature can be misunderstood. In fact, that has often been the case. Throughout the ages, men and women have seen God in nature, but all too often they have confused the two. They have thought that nature was God and that God was nature. That"s why they began worshiping the sun and the seasons. That"s why they began imagining all kinds of deities that controlled rainfall and crops and sickness.
Without God revealing Himself to us more fully in the Bible, we would never be able to know Him as He wants us to. Job 11:7 asks, "Can you search out the deep things of God? Can you find out the limits of the Almighty?" The answer, of course, is no. So God has revealed Himself to us in the Bible to give us a more complete understanding of Himself than nature alone provides. Let"s look at some of the things the Bible tells us about God. Prophecy:Fulfilled prophecy tells us that there is a God who knows the future. God declares, "I am God, and there is none like Me, declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times things that are not yet done" (Isaiah 46:10). The Bible contains many prophecies that have been fulfilled exactly as predicted. One of these is the great prophetic outline of world empires given in Daniel 2 which predicted that four world empires would follow one another"Babylon, Medo-Persia, Greece, and Rome"and that the fourth would be broken up into fragmented nations that would never reunite as a world power. That historical procession occurred exactly as predicted.
Another example is the fact that significant events in Jesus" life on earth were foretold centuries before He was born. These include His virgin birth (Isaiah 7:14); where He would be born (Micah 5:2); His death and resurrection (Luke 23:23; Psalm 16:10); and even how much money His betrayer would receive (Zechariah 11:12). History confirms these and many other Bible prophecies and demonstrates there is a God who knows the future. Another point I want to touch on is god revealed in jesus"s life.Jesus" life on earth reveals His Father"s existence and tells us what God is like. Of all the ways in which God is revealed to us, the greatest and clearest is Jesus Himself. Jesus said, "He who has seen Me has seen the Father" (John 14:9). Jesus came to show us what God is like. When Jesus healed the sick, He was showing us what God is like. When Jesus held the children on His lap, He was showing us what God is like. When Jesus fed the hungry, encouraged the despondent, forgave sins, rebuked unrepentant sinners, and worked miracles"He was showing us what God is like. Jesus was God, come down to live with us in human flesh (John 1:1, 2; 10:30).

Another point I want to look at is gods love. God is love. All that Jesus revealed to us about God can be summarized in one word"love. In fact, this is the word the Bible uses to describe God. "He who does not love does not know God, for God is love" (1 John 4:8). How do we know that God is love? "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life" (John 3:16). God"s love for us is demonstrated in the amazing gift of Jesus who came to live for us and die for us on the cross. Jesus said, "Greater love has no one than this, than to lay down one"s life for his friends. You are My friends if you do whatever I command you" (John 15:13, 14). Jesus calls you and me, His "friends!"

Now everyone always tells you that jesus is in your heart but what evidence do we have? The Bible says that it is foolish not to believe in God. "The fool has said in his heart, "There is no God" " (Psalm 14:1; 53:1). Something deep in our hearts knows that there is a God who loves us and cares for us. When we deny that knowledge and refuse to believe in God, we are acting foolishly. The Bible says, "Without faith it is impossible to please Him [God], for he who comes to God must believe that He is and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him"(Hebrews 11:6). If we seek Him, will we find Him? Yes. God says, "You will seek Me and find Me, when you search for Me with all your heart" (Jeremiah 29:13).

Now if you are all still not convinced,I am 90% sure that you will be convinced after I say this. I present to you the greatest evidence of god.The greatest evidence that God exists is the transformed lives of the men and women who have searched for Him and have found Him and have invited Him into their hearts. This experience has convinced them beyond any doubt that God lives and that He lives in their lives each day. For those who have not yet asked God into their heart, God has a special invitation"and a special promise: "Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him" (Revelation 3:20).


"Can we know"really know"that God exists?" Welp its pretty simple really, there"s 0% proof that he does, and suppose that he does, he"s based on pure hate and evil and nothing but as this god of YOURS truly hates children. "We"" Who is this "we"? No its you. Its not "we". Atheists do not believe in a god(s) so its only you and don"t include us atheists with your hate and evil. K?
"H. M. S. Richards, Sr., founder of The Voice of Prophecy", is cut off right there and I need no more information on him or any creationists for that matter as all creationists are fakes and frauds. Why? Because they do not believe in their product, namely their god, and they are not stupid enough to ever put their god on trial again because they are indeed smart enough to know that all they have to go on is faith based oriented and faith can never be proved. So since they cannot stand behind their product, namely their god, they cannot be taken seriously for anything.

"The point is this: God"s existence is ultimately a matter of faith," Well that was just proven as being correct. Faith is not evidence. Your god of the bible, in which this god of the bible would never use text as a form of communication, the worst form of communication possible for your god in the first place, so the bible is not evidence as well, would never use faith nor text to get his messages across to anyone especially with his bloated superior ego complex that is screams all across the bible. What is evidence is simply your god talking to us as an example. Here"s more on faith"
"Why would you believe anything on faith? Faith isn"t a pathway to truth. Every religion has some sort of faith. If faith is your pathway you can"t distinguish between christianity, Hinduism, judaism, any of these others. How is it that you use ---reason--- in every of the other endeavor in your life and then when it comes to the ultimate truth, the most important truth your"re saying that faith is required and how is that supposed to reflect on a god? What kind of a god requires faith instead of evidence?" Matt Dillahunty

"Faith is the reason people give when they don"t have evidence." Matt Dillahunty

"Faith can be very very dangerous, and deliberately to implant it into the vulnerable mind of an innocent child is a grievous wrong." Richard Dawkins

"Faith is the great cop-out, the great excuse to evade the need to think and evaluate evidence. Faith is the belief in spite of, even perhaps because of, the lack of evidence." Richard Dawkins

Um n, sorry, there"s 0% evidence or reason for god being real. Here"s a video for you to understand on the BOP. - Burden of Proof

"one of the main reasons human beings have believed in God" How many was that? Not many. Its only one small little splatch of land.
With (Psalm 19:1, 3)." Sure there is, someone wrote that on a piece of paper, and it was translated through the generations again and again and again with copies upon copies, with dead languages that have died off with 0% possibility of tracing it back to the original so you have no idea, none, nor does anybody else if they are interpreting correctly. Wow are you 100% phenomenally gullible and you"d believe anything, especially if its printed in your bible. Great! Then you MUST believe in the hate and evil that is your god. Here"s some quotes and videos to help you out on text" - Christians don't understand the character of God -The god that christians believe in is amazingly STUPID!!!
"If god is all knowing and he knows the future of all events and he wrote a book that can only be interpreted as if it endorses slavery and if its heinous violence against your children against your neighbors" how could a god be that omnipotent and devise a book where we can"t distinguish between the law of Israel and god"s law? I mean their interwoven where we have metaphor and fact and nobody can distinguish the two. We don"t know what we"re supposed to take figuratively. We don"t know what we"re supposed to take literally. Was it actually a tree? I mean come on. How can anyone distinguish this. I mean come on. It doesn"t make any sense. It doesn"t matter how its translated. It doesn"t matter what version. If it was written by an omnipotent being there would be ONE VERSION. And there would be only ONE WAY to interpret it because it would be written well." Aron Ra
Actually it wouldn"t be written at all. What"s wrong with your god comin" down and talking to people? "Hey you know some of that stuff that"s in the book? I"m here to correct it." Matt Dillahunty

"We have to rely on copies of copies of anonymous authors with no originals and the textural testimony to a miracle for example, there"s no amount of reports, anecdotal reports that is sufficient to justify in believing that actually happened as reported. And anything that would qualify as a god would clearly understand this and if it wanted to clearly convey this to people in a way that is believable would not be relying on ---TEXT--- to do so. And this to me is the nail in the coffin for christianity. The god that christians believe in is amazingly ---STUPID---!!! If it actually wants to achieve its goal by spreading its word to humanity by relying on text, by relying on languages that die off, by relying on anecdotal testimony, that"s not a pathway to truth. And anything that would qualify for a god would know this.which shows either god does not exist or doesn"t care enough about the people to understand the nature of evidence to actually present it. Now which of those two possibilities is accurate?" Matt Dillahunty

"The night sky is impressive, but besides the stars which you can see, there are also millions of stars and galaxies you can"t see" See, that"s what I truly can"t stand about so-called christians who are not christians because there"s no such a thing, is they know absolutely NOTHING about science and yet they pretend that they do to cover their a$$ fome shaking milk from a tin can. There are trillions of stars not millions, nice pathetic guesswork in which naturally failed, and some scientists are now jumping that number into a sextillion. And Stephen Hawking believed that there are 125 billion, that"s with a "b" galaxies. AND to make matters a whole lot worse for you and your god" it is known that at each center of each galaxy is a supermassive black hole. Yep that"s an estimated 125 billion of them. And black holes are nothingness. There haven"t even been 125 billion people on this planet ---ever---. So your god favors black holes, nothingness, over human souls.

The vastness of space if off by, well nobody knows, so scientists say "I don"t know" because they don"t know, and anybody that claims to have the answers to everything, and is all knowing and is all powerful such as your god is a true idiot and a moron, because there"s always something to learn and new to understand and know, so that "I don"t know" is always in play except for one thing. Take one lucky guess at what that one thing is?

"And what is true of the vastness of space is also true of the microscopic world." Oh yes! And you know what? That"s what rules the earth. Not man. So your god lied.
Genesis 1:26 is B.S. as microorganisms and bacteria rule the earth. Not man. Man does NOT have dominion over the earth. He never has and never will.
"26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth." Oh and btw, who is this "us" and who is this "our"? god is supposed to be one god. Well that verse proved, plus a few others in the bible, proves god to be multiple gods.

Indeed your bible continues to fail and be fraudulent.

I'm out of space.
Debate Round No. 1


I"d like to draw your attention to 3 miracles:the miracle of lanciano,the staircase of saint joseph and the incorruptable bodies of certain saints.

The miracle of lanciano is a eucharistic miracle, purported to have occured in the eighth century in lanciano itally. In a nutshell,a monk had doubts of the real presence of christ in the eucharist. When he said the words if consecration"this is my body and this is my blood." The bread and wine turned into actual flesh and blood. And this flesh ladies and gentlemen was a piece of flesh near the heart where during that time,there was no way at all to slice that musscle out.

The staircase of saint joseph is something which till today still cannot be explained is a miracle which occured in mexico. In a nutshell, there was a group of sisters who were sent fron kentucky to mexico to found a school for girls. By order of the bishop, a chapel was to be built and to be placed under the care of the sisters. Ater its construction,the builders were faced with a problem:there was no way to climb up from the ground floor to the choir loft. A staircase wouldve been impossible to build and a ladder wouldve taken up too muh room. The builders insised to demolish the choir but instead the nuns prayed a novena to saint joseph. After the novena, a mysterious man said that he could build a staircase on one condition:he"d be granted total privacy.

For three months the man was locked in the chapel and no one was seen entering or leaving the chapel. When the staircase was built, the man left without asking for any reward. The staircase itself is weird as it seems. A spiral staircase with no centeral support!? You got that right. A spiral staircase,6 meters long, no centeral support snd 200 years old. Bear in mind it has been used alot of times. Till today the staircase is surrounded by 3 mysteries:the physics if its structure,the buders identity and the type of spruce wood the builder used. As we all know spruce has alot of species but this species of wood till today is still unidentified.

The incorruptable bodies in a nutshell is very simple. We all know when you die your body starts decomposition immediately. Even under special care the body does not stop decomposition, however way you treat it the body will decompose just at a slower rate. One particular saint I want to look at is saint bernadette. It has been if Im not mistaken 150 years since she died and till today not a single sign on decomposition has been spotted on her. There has been hundreds of cases like these. And till today there still has not been any scientific evidence for this to happen.

Since my opponent denys the existence of god,after all that I said, can he/she proove to me that all the events stated above are explicable by natural or scientific laws? Because the last I checked, he definition of miracle is:an event inexplicable by natural or scientific laws hence attributed to divine agency.

Also if god doesnt exist,explain this with science: This although is a trailer for a documentary included real footage of exorcisms. So how can we deny the fact that god doesnt exist?
-"Everyone knows that there is a god. Now there is no way for me to proove to you that that is false,but I rejected." So a fellow athetist of yours just said there is a god but he has no way to proove there isnt and hence rejected him just like that? So I guess ladies and gentlemen we can come to a conclusion that athetists dont believe in god but cant find evidence to proove so and hence they reject god.
-"What kind of god requires faith and not evidence?" He requires both faith and evidence. Hear me out:so the most badic thing you use to believe is faith. But evidence? According to alot of people,there isnt. Side topic:how was the earth created? Big bang right? And what caused big bang? Gravity right? What "commanded" gravity to cause the asteroid to hit earth(if if was an asteroid its been years since I read about it. To be fair Im only a 13 year old kid.)? You wanted evidence god exists well let me ask you:how was gravity formed/created? This is evidence god exists. This is evidenve and all christians/catholics have the faith to believe in him. You do as well just for the fact that you have not opened your heart to god. As mentioned by god in the book of revelations, he says and I quote,"Behold I stand at the door and knock. If anyone answers and opens the door,I will come into him."
-"Its possible I could be the devil." So he affirms the fact that devils are real? Funny isnt it? I thought athetists dont believe in superior beings? Isnt the devil one? He is a bad guy in the bible and with every villan comes a hero so thats god. Are you saying you believe the villan exist but the hero doesnt?

-he"s based on pure hate and evil and nothing but as this god of YOURS truly hates children.

I suggest you read Matthew 19:14 which says and I quote,"Jesus said, "Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these."" He could"ve said,"Dont let the children come near me. This is the work of the evil one and they must perish." But no! Let the children come to me and do not hinder them. Plus he loves them so much that he offered heaven to them! So before you give me your exodus crap,re read Matthew 19:14.


Continuing form last round since you only allowed 8.000 characters instead of 10,000,
And btw, since the bible is proven to be fake and fraudulent AND since you are using verses from other characters in your bible, NOT god so they do not even prove that YOUR god exists, AND since YOUR god would NEVER use text as a source of communication, the worst form of communication possible, all verses that you quote from other characters are unacceptable and wow, even so they most certainly are in now way proof of god, nor evidence of god, which is the title of this debate "Does the god mentioned in the bible exist, in which the BOP is ALWAYS upon you, no exceptions, none.
"Physicists have unlocked many secrets.... yadda yadda - miniature world. But Someone did." Oh really? According to what? You? How would you know? What grade of imbecilic gestures of yodeling Buddhist monk wrong turns going left on right did you come up with a "who"? Wow did it ever dawn on you sparky that it could have been a what? Or it it was NOTHING as Stephen Hawking has come up with a mathematical equation that proves that something does comes from nothing? So regardless your god was not needed to have created the known universe, much less life here on this planet or anywhere else it might exist in this known universe.

Then you mention of god"s existence on our own bodies? Wow. Well that proves god"s failures and imperfections. Yeah you only assume your god exists WITHOUT PROOF. Bad idea. Regardless, according to you, YOUR god created EVERYBODY and he continues to do as such. Therefore that 100% shows that this god of YOURS is imperfect. This god knowingly creates man with his broken bones, his heart attacks, his typhoid, smallpox, bubonic plague, AIDS, influenza, incurable cancer thus far etc etc etc. That"s the furthest from perfection. Oh and the best part is your god makes it so so so easy for man to murder each other in which it was taught to by YOUR god as your god murders every single day just as he did in the past POOF according to your bible which proves he"s a contradictory hypocrite.You have 0 outs. Your god is 100% pure evil and is hate to allow any of it, in which is all suffering and pain, especially to give it to children. And there"s 0 that children can learn from it. Nothing. What you have to say in contrast, doesn"t work. That"s because others who know otherwise from your saddened nobody god, who never, not once admitted in his bible that he was for a single verse "happy", which is yet another reason why your god would never rely on text for communication, and myself knows that this god of YOURS doesn"t exist unless he"s based on the ultimate pure hate and evil.

OH GREAT BY YOUR VERY OWN WORDS YOU PROVE YOURSELF TO BE FALSE AND INCORRECT!!!!!!!!! "Let"s look at one further evidence for God from the world of nature"your own body! Until something goes wrong," Well well well well, something goes wrong with EVERYBODY. There"s NOBODY, NO ONE that lives PERFECT lives. NOT EVER!!!!!! YOUR god makes damn sure of that. Until something goes wrong? Oh please. Whoever said ANYTHING had to go wrong? Why gosh golly gee, YOUR god did. At one time people lived to be on average of 34 years, then it was bumped up to 43 years as time rolled on, then it was bumped up to 56 years and now its bumped up to an average of 77 years. And you know what spatterjunk in your neon brain? I HAS 0 TO DO with YOUR god in which you cannot even prove even exists, otherwise your god would have given man these breakthroughs, unless he"s a proven sadist. Um no, in which you cannot even prove your god exists, if he does exist, he clearly loves to watch the suffering and pain of man, especially in that of children who suffer from cancer as an example. The living longer in man has 100% to do with scientific breakthroughs and evolution. Man has gotten rid of smallpox, the bubonic plague, we know how to get rid of typhoid, we know that washing our hands before touching food always prevents sickness etc etc etc and NONE of that was taught by your pathetic god. But your god made sure that those diseases happened which caused the lives of at least 1 billion. Duh, there's trees that live for THOUSANDS OF YEARS or more. So once again, YOUR god lied. Gen 1:26 as he favors trees over man.

"We find intelligence, and we find power. And those are attributes of God." Really? According to what? You? How would you know? What grade of titanic rock of rages smut on King Cohen long lives every other religion that would disagree with you and go to war over it with you which is why there"s been at least 1 billion dead all in the supposed "good" name of YOUR god in which you cannot even prove even exists.

As the apostle Paul says,(Colossians 1:16, 17). That"s NOT god saying one god damned word now is it? Nope. Doesn"t count.
"In the Bible, God reveals Himself to us in a way"" This god of YOUR never once gave man a way to test, demonstrate nor define him. - Testing for god = WATCH IT
So you, nor anyone has any idea as to what this god of yours is. Some say he"s "love". Well What is "love"? I have love. Billions have love. Same is true with harmony, peace, kindness, care for each other, etc etc etc AND we all DO NOT need YOUR god for any of it. But wait!!! Your god has a super super He-Man She Ra superior ego complex in which your bible absolutely 100% rages with. YOUR bible is all about your god's ego, and nothing else, Take away his ego and you have absolutely nothing as your bible is worth nothing. You have no damn god being proud of and all of these things in which were babbled on to death by a true crybaby god into oblivion god in YOUR BIBLE, creation, Noah, the great flood (in which never happened), the ark (which could have never floated), Exodus, moses, the 10 commandments (the sabbath, adultery, cursing at your parents, blaspheme if broken requires death), passover, the parting of the red sea, his deliberate genocides for no reason, Sodom and Gomorrah, etc ARE ALL EGO. Oh and oh yeah, YOUR GOD is also god damned proud of evil, anger, vengeance, rage, fury, jealousy all in which he's freely admitted to having. All in which are EGO all in which a supreme deity would NEVER have. Yeah this god fellow passed those down to man so in turn man could learn to hate. SP DO NOT TALK TO ME about YOUR god's "love" especially when you have no genuine friends or loved ones so you cannot possibly know the meaning of the word.

"Prophecy:Fulfilled prophecy tells us that there is a God who knows the future. God declares, "I am God, and there is none like Me, yadda yadda" That IS NOT PROPHECY FULFILLED wow. See that"s what I mean by so-called christians not being able to interpret correctly. Its a meaningless verse showing NOTHING! Oh and duh, that abomination you interpret from must be a Swahili version or something because its WAY off from "Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:" and has NOTHING TO DO WITH "there is none like me" Sheesh! That's why I cannot possibly take you seriously among with the absolute fact that you are so pathetically brainwashed and gullible that anybody who claims themselves to be ANY prominent figure from your bible, that if they were to show up at your door tomorrow, you'd dump everything you were doing, and happily follow that person to the poison well and drink from it, jump into any volcano because they said so and not think twice and not care either. You just flat out proved it.

No biblical prophesies have bee fulfilled. Not one. If so, your god would be the only one worshiped and none other until the dying end. PERIOD. Its that simple.

Who cares about jesus? He was a false prophet and you are a false christian. - Why Does Every Intelligent christian disobey jesus?

I'm out of space.
Debate Round No. 2


Everyone admits that religious belief is widespread throughout human history. But the question arises: Does this undisputed fact amount to evidence in favor of the truth of religious claims? Even a skeptic will admit that the testimony we have is deeply impressive: the vast majority of humans have believed in an ultimate Being to whom the proper response could only be reverence and worship. No one disputes the reality of our feelings of reverence, attitudes of worship, acts of adoration. But if God does not exist, then these things have never once"never once"had a real object. Is it really plausible to believe that?
The capacity for reverence and worship certainly seems to belong to us by nature. And it is hard to believe that this natural capacity can never, in the nature of things, be fulfilled, especially when so many testify that it has been. True enough, it is conceivable that this side of our nature is doomed to frustration; it is thinkable that those millions upon millions who claim to have found the Holy One who is worthy of reverence and worship were deluded. But is it likely?
It seems far more likely that those who refuse to believe are the ones suffering from deprivation and delusion"like the tone-deaf person who denies the existence of music, or the frightened tenant who tells herself she doesn't hear cries of terror and distress coming from the street below and, when her children awaken to the sounds and ask her, "Why is that lady screaming, Mommy?" tells them, "Nobody's screaming: it's just the wind, that's all. Go back to sleep."

As you might be thinking:But the majority is not infallible. Most people were wrong about the movements of the sun and earth. So why not about the existence of God?
Reply: If people were wrong about the theory of heliocentrism, they still experienced the sun and earth and motion. They were simply mistaken in thinking that the motion they perceived was the sun's. But if God does not exist, what is it that believers have been experiencing? The level of illusion goes far beyond any other example of collective error. It really amounts to collective psychosis.

For believing in God is like having a relationship with a person. If God never existed, neither did this relationship. You were responding with reverence and love to no one; and no one was there to receive and answer your response. It's as if you believe yourself happily married when in fact you live alone in a dingy apartment.
Now we grant that such mass delusion is conceivable, but what is the likely story? If there were no other bits of experience which, taken together with our perceptions of the sun and earth, make it most likely that the earth goes round the sun, it would be foolish to interpret our experience that way. How much more so here, where what we experience is a relationship involving reverence and worship and, sometimes, love. It is most reasonable to believe that God really is there, given such widespread belief in him"unless atheists can come up with a very persuasive explanation for religious belief, one that takes full account of the experience of believers and shows that their experience is best explained as delusion and not insight. But atheists have never done so.

This then brings you to another question:But isn't there a very plausible psychological account of religious belief? Many nonbelievers hold that belief in God is the result of childhood fears; that God is in fact a projection of our human fathers: someone "up there" who can protect us from natural forces we consider hostile.
Reply A: This is not really a naturalistic explanation of religious belief. It is no more than a statement, dressed in psychological jargon, that religious belief is false. You begin from the assumption that God does not exist. Then you figure that since the closest earthly symbol for the Creator is a father, God must be a cosmic projection of our human fathers. But apart from the assumption of atheism, there is no compelling evidence at all that God is a mere projection.
In fact, the argument begs the question. We seek psychological explanation only for ideas we already know (or presume) to be false, not those we think to be true. We ask, "Why do you think black dogs are out to kill you? Were you frightened by one when you were small?" But we never ask, "Why do you think black dogs aren't out to kill you? Did you have a nice black puppy once?"
Reply B: Though there must be something of God that is reflected in human fathers (otherwise our symbolism for him would be inexplicable), Christians realize that the symbolism is ultimately inadequate. And if the Ultimate Being is mysterious in a way that transcends all symbolism, how can he be a mere projection of what the symbol represents? The truth seems to be"and if God exists, the truth is"the other way around: our earthly fathers are pale projections of the Heavenly Father. It should be noted that several writers (e.g., Paul Vitz) have analyzed atheism as itself a psychic pathology: an alienation from the human father that results in rejection of God.

-"Can you show me its open?" Assuming I cant,can you show me that it wasnt? Same thing. If you ask me to proove to you there is a god,assuming I dont have evidence to give to you that there is one,can you give me evidence I cant deny in the next argument that god doesnt exist?

-Drinking real poision

It was meant as a metaphor. Driving out demons meant driving out snakes and "drink the snakes poision and it wont harm you at all." When you drive a demon out of someone,the snake doesnt appear physically so hence its a metaphor.

-This god of YOUR never once gave man a way to test, demonstrate nor define him.

We do. Its just that even with countless arguments we mention,you are going to be a loyal athetist and deny god. Proof? "Everyone knows that there is a god. Now there is no way for me to proove to you that that is false,but I rejected." ~Matt Dillahunty. This prooves the mindset of an athetist so whatever evidence we give them,they will deny it in every way possible.

-I'm out of space.

Maybe if you"d stop with the insults which arent necessary you"ll have more?


Purely by accident I stumbled onto this. WATCH IT! - The Failure of Prayer and Miracle Claims
OK I already told you I would ignore your "miracles" because what you say is "I don"t know because you don"t know. Period. You just don"t upchuck them up to miracles in which no jury of merit would ---ever--- believe you unless you conjured them up by your fist from your hands from being clenched to tight to grab too many nuts and bolts to tur them into gravy. And you completely ignored what I produced which is most certainly a lot lot lot more, BY FAR so-called "miracles" than anything you"ve produced. So you basically blew RD2.
""Everyone knows that there is a god." Oh really? According to what? You? How would your uterus projecting vomit at a winnie the poo poo blank-itty-blank wishful thinker did your templeton pecker come up with that one? Um no they don"t. You just assume they do. The people"s in the Brazilian rainforest don"t. The Inuit don"t. The aborigines who have been around for 20,000 years don"t until your white man coughed upped sickened sex decided to infiltrate them did. Well at least the god according to YOUR bible. I really should end this debate right now because you said something so far fetched and so hairy armpit ignorant and stupid, just like the "miracle" ideals.
Let"s also get one thing nice and sparkling clear" you either learn to use a simpleton spell check, or I"m not even going to bother with your crap. You get me boy? If this was in high school English, you"d be flunked out immediately. Hell in college, a total idiot spelled the word "sure" as "shore" and the professor flunked him on HIS FINAL EXAM. Now my English is not spot on perfect, but I do know how to use a spell check. I also use my own language to spice things up. You are just insulting to me at being an idiot. This isn"t first grade.
Since there are so many spelling errors within your next paragraph, its truly unreadable. Its NOT my job to rummage through what you say in an attempt to make any understanding out of it. If you cannot be clear and concise, especially with your spelling, that"s not my problem, that"s yours.
"He requires both faith and evidence." Nope. He would only require evidence especially with his super duper bloated superior ego complex. Faith is NOT a way to get his word out AT ALL. Evidence is. Faith is NOT evidence. And with YOUR god"s bloated superior ego complex he would have the need, the necessity and the requirement for evidence, not faith. And you didn"t even pay any attention to what Matt Dillahunty nor to what Richard Dawkins stated because if you did, you would have fully understood what they said with no questions asked and no rebuttals. None.

"Side topic:how was the earth created? Big bang right?" Um no WRONG. COMPLETELY WRONG. I"m ending this. Contact me when you have an actual clue as to what you are talking about rather than guessing. K? I truly hate it when idiots like you actually pretend that they know something about nothing and yet they pretend that they do. And because they don't, they invent excuses for it to make up for their utter lack of education and intelligence. And you have a 0 education not only on science but on your "miracles" as well. YOU flat out guess. And with those "miracles" that you claim, because you don't have an answer, you automatically assume "I'm an idiot, I have no explanation, therefore it must be at all costs and NOTHING else is possible, therefore it must be god and I absolutely refuse to do ANY other research into it. And because I'm such a moron, I also refuse to look at other "puzzles" that have nothing---whatsoever---to---do---with---my---god, because it is only my god that matters and screw the rest no matter of their importance." That's your exact attitude. You are really pathetic. Bye. UNLESS you get an education on science and know what you are talking about rather than guessing, even for the most simple of things. I mean jeez. And yet you fully expect me to bit into YOUR conversation. ARE YOU SERIOUS?
And you wonder why you have no genuine friends or loved ones. Well that's why especially when you plant ridiculous and false evidence that nobody of sound mind is going to believe, not ever. They, and myself will say "i don't know". Nighty night.
Debate Round No. 3


Im not going to write much but heres a link for you that god exists. Oh and look! Its written by athetists!

-"None of then have any good evidence supporting them." As mentioned in my previous argument and obviously Im pretty sure you didnt bother to read it,the definition of miracles is:an event which is inexplicable by natural or scientific laws and hence attributed to divine agency.

Obviously it was according to Steven Hawkings. Wow a 13 year old knows how to use google apart from an athetist who spent more than 13 years denying god. I didnt know you athetist deny google too. Oh and look hes like you denying that god didnt create earth which sets him on the same path as you denying god. Well look at this: There is something I"d like to touch on regarding this article:
-But in the new text, co-written with American physicist Leonard Mlodinow, he said new theories showed a creator is "not necessary". He then says and I quote,"Because there is a law such as gravity, the universe can and will create itself from nothing." So was it pure coincidence that somehow everything was formed through the laws of gravity. I"d like to question my opponent(although he may be too scared to answer and rely on the one and only quote he uses all the time,"I dont know."),who created gravity?

Ladies and gentlemen I"d also like to pull your attention to the fact that in my opponents last argument he stated that hes not going to bother with the rest of my argument. Through this its either he doesnt want to answer it as hes too lazy or he has no answer. And also notice that he does not counteract to whatever I say and has not given any argument god does not exist but just counteracts to whatever I say? Which brings me to question ladies and gentlemen:does my opponent have solid proof god does not exist? Also notice that he didnt mention in his last argument he was "out of space"?
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Debate Round No. 4
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Debate Round No. 5
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