The Instigator
omar234
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
Athias
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points

God is illogical

Do you like this debate?NoYes+0
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 0 votes the winner is...
It's a Tie!
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 1/1/2019 Category: Philosophy
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 498 times Debate No: 119708
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (18)
Votes (0)

 

omar234

Pro

Made this up. Using Bible sources as evidence. Logic is used for the explanation. Circular arguments cannot be given like you are not God how do you know? I can say the same and the conversation goes nowhere. I also used logic since there is still no evidence for God. This is strictly a logical debate. I will allow any form of logic apart from circular logic that show flaws in my arguments. Best way I would say for Con to set out the rebuttals is with a claim, Evidence and explanation.

I will only be tackling 3 attributes and hope my opponent does not go off topic and stays directly on topic.

God is illogical (Bible version (NABRE))

God: the creator and ruler of the universe and source of all moral authority; the supreme being.

Illogical: lacking sense or clear, Sound reasoning.

Omniscience (All-knowing)

Omniscience: the state of knowing everything.

It is illogical for God to do what God does if God is logical.

Evidence of omniscience: Isaiah 46:10 New American Bible (Revised Edition) (NABRE)

At the beginning I declare the outcome;
from of old, Things not yet done.
I say that my plan shall stand,
I accomplish my every desire.

Evidence of wanting to save us: 1 Timothy 2:3-4 New American Bible (Revised Edition) (NABRE)
This is good and pleasing to God our savior, Who wills everyone to be saved and to come to knowledge of the truth.

Evidence of free will: Ben Sira 15:11-20 New American Bible (Revised Edition) (NABRE)
Do not say: “It was God’s doing that I fell away, ”
for what he hates he does not do.

Do not say: “He himself has led me astray, ”
for he has no need of the wicked.

Abominable wickedness the Lord hates
and he does not let it happen to those who fear him.

God in the beginning created human beings
and made them subject to their own free choice.
If you choose, You can keep the commandments;
loyalty is doing the will of God.
Set before you are fire and water;
to whatever you choose, Stretch out your hand.
Before everyone are life and death,
whichever they choose will be given them.

Immense is the wisdom of the Lord;
mighty in power, He sees all things.
The eyes of God behold his works,
and he understands every human deed.
He never commands anyone to sin,
nor shows leniency toward deceivers.


By God knowing everything. God knows free will does not save people and does not allow them to come to the knowledge of truth. If it did why are there so many people following other Religions or do not follow a Religion? God knowing beforehand someone will go their entire life without being saved goes against what God is said to supposed to do in the Bible which is illogical.

Real world examples of this would be kings. Though they are a thing of a past they still used whatever means to keep control of the kingdom they ran. More present example would be a dictatorship. Kim controls everything people do and makes them believe that Kim is God. By doing this Kim controls the country. Kim is not God but is more capable of controlling North Korea then God is saving people even though the massive difference between them.


Omnipotence

Omnipotence: the quality of having unlimited or very great power.

By God having unlimited or very great power God has no purpose.

Evidence of omnipotence: Psalm 147:5 New American Bible (Revised Edition) (NABRE) Great is our Lord, Vast in power, With wisdom beyond measure.
Given that God has unlimited power. God has no purpose. Why does God care about the human race? Since God already knows everything and has unlimited power there is nothing God strives for apart from Its creations happiness? What is the purpose of that? It is illogical to believe that a God for some reason would want to exist even though God has already hit the peak of everything. Meaning God is looking forward to nothing and is what watching us as part of Its amusement (assumption) even though God knows how everything ends.

Real world examples: Science is the pursuit of knowledge. When we have all-knowledge science becomes obsolete. Religion is the pursuit of pleasing of God. When we have pleased God we have little to no use left.

Omnipresence

Omnipresence: the state of being widespread or constantly encountered.

If God is everywhere why can’t we use our five senses to perceive God?

Evidence of omnipresence: Proverbs 15:3 New American Bible (Revised Edition) (NABRE)
The eyes of the Lord are in every place, Keeping watch on the evil and the good.

God cannot be perceived using our 5 senses so God is illogical yet the Bible States God is everywhere. Everywhere should include inside our 5 senses yet it does not.

Real world examples: I can see water therefore it is water. I heard shouting therefore someone is shouting. I can taste food. I can smell food. I can touch solid and liquid objects.


This was mainly stuff I came up with using the 3 main attributes.

Would like a Christian to find a way to say God is logical by rebutting claims I made.

May we both learn something new.
Athias

Con

First and foremost, And I think we should clear this up: a circular argument is not when a person goes back and forth over a seemingly redundant point. A circular argument is when an argument's premise and conclusion are the same. Now on to the argument:

Omniscience

At best, It describes an inconsistent behavior, I. E. God "wills everyone to be saved, " while free will weeds out those who will be saved and those who will not. If one accepts the stipulative definition that "will" in this case is "desire, " then it would make sense, In the case that God desires everyone be saved, But allows them the capacity to make choices in favor or against that goal. Almost like a parent in letting one's children sink or swim. You desire the best for them nonetheless.

Omnipotence

You did a better job with Omniscience. Your argument borders on an appeal to incredulity in that you don't conceive any purpose in having omnipotence premised on, At best, Pretexts, And thereby concluding that God's omnipotence is illogical. I'm not going to presume the reason God is described to have created human beings, But incapacity to grasp its purpose, An abstract concept no less, Doesn't inform irrationality or inconsistency.

Omnipresence

What if one is always thinking about God, Even dreaming about God, Does that not constitute God being everywhere since everywhere is subject to perception, And thoughts of God is perception manifest?

As for your real wold examples let's scrutinize them:

"I can see water therefore it is water. " Does this apply to someone who's been blind their whole life?

"I heard shouting therefore someone is shouting. " Does this apply to someone who's been deaf their whole life?

"I can taste food. I can smell food. I can touch solid and liquid objects. " Does this apply to someone who suffers from ageusia, Anosmia, And/or a somatosensory deficit?
Debate Round No. 1
omar234

Pro

omar234 forfeited this round.
Athias

Con

Athias forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 2
omar234

Pro

omar234 forfeited this round.
Athias

Con

Athias forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
18 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by omar2345 3 years ago
omar2345
You are misinformed.
As you clearly see I have been on this site for longer.
Going by this you are copying me.
Posted by omar234 3 years ago
omar234
"Who are you speaking to imposter?
Yourself? "

i mean ur trying to be me sooo. And when u say "yourself" that could either mean myself or talking to you since u are omar too
Posted by omar2345 3 years ago
omar2345
Who are you speaking to imposter?
Yourself?

At least actually succeed in trying to copy me.
Posted by omar234 3 years ago
omar234
i love talking to myself
Posted by omar234 3 years ago
omar234
no i don't know who that is
Posted by omar2345 3 years ago
omar2345
@omar234

"Creep. This is weird. "

Are you also copying BossChick as well?
Posted by omar2345 3 years ago
omar2345
Look at the profiles for proof.
Posted by omar234 3 years ago
omar234
No Athias don't listen to him he's the troll.
Posted by omar2345 3 years ago
omar2345
@Athias

This is most likely a troll.
Look at his profile.
Then look at mine.
Posted by omar2345 3 years ago
omar2345
Why are you copying Thoht when you should be trying to copy me?
Come on do a good job of it.
No votes have been placed for this debate.

By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use.