The Instigator
backwardseden
Pro (for)
The Contender
NathanH12
Con (against)

Its time to put down ALL guns and believe in peace! No one needs a gun, Not ever, Not for any reason

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 10/9/2019 Category: Education
Updated: 6 days ago Status: Debating Period
Viewed: 198 times Debate No: 123178
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (12)
Votes (0)

 

backwardseden

Pro

There can be no worldwide peace with guns and weapons of superior firepower in it.

Guns have absolutely no use except to maim, Kill, Cause pain, Splatter guts, And cause horrific grief.

Its time to do the right and the correct and only thing to do which is to put guns down forever. This includes ---everybody--- all at once, For ---everybody--- to put down their guns and take a step back and believe in peace and not violence and hate in which ALL guns are.

Guns are NOT weapons of peace.

Guns are weapons of hate, Violence, Bloodshed, War, Pain, Destruction, Murder, Grief etc.

There is nothing good about guns. Nothing.

Give 3 examples in each of the 5 rounds why a gun is needed. AND EXPLAIN to---the---letter why a gun is needed?

Be Clear, Concise, And accurate.

No one under the age of 20 will be allowed to accept this debate. Why? These are ADULT issues. For those in your teens, You do not have the ability in any possible way to grasp the damage, The psychological terror of what guns are UNLESS (let me repeat) UNLESS you've experienced first hand what guns have done unto you or can do in which case you would take the Pro side especially if you've seen guts spilled out from your best friend or a loved one.
Btw, Don't be stupid and pretend you are someone you are not. People who lie, Cheat and steal are very easily found out. Not a good idea.

Dsjpk5 is disqualified from the voting procedures as he tries to pretend he's god and thus change the voting structure of who wins and loses here on DDO.
NathanH12

Con

Hello hi. Happy to debate you sir.

Per usual I will do a breakdown of your claim/argument

"There can be no worldwide peace with guns and weapons of superior firepower in it. "

This is true, Though you have a strange usage of the word "superior. " But while this is true, You must ignore the fact that many evil persons, Governments, And organizations of any sort will willingly give up their guns. If we disarm ourselves what stops them from destroying our life, Liberty and property? While I believe in peace I also believe we must defend ourselves when necessary. There cannot and will not be peace so long as evil is in this world, But there can be justice. And if you think everyone is a morally good and responsible person, Well, There is no need to ban guns is there?

"Guns have absolutely no use except to maim, Kill, Cause pain, Splatter guts, And cause horrific grief. "

Obviously untrue. To make your argument you have to ignore the fact that guns also defend us and our families from murder, Burglary, And even rape.

Its time to do the right and the correct and only thing to do which is to put guns down forever. This includes ---everybody--- all at once, For ---everybody--- to put down their guns and take a step back and believe in peace and not violence and hate in which ALL guns are.

Ok first off guns are incapable of hating people (but that's beside the point. ) So this situation is a Utopia that will never happen. The reason it will never happen is because a lot of people are. . . Evil. To say this is not true is to lie. I need a gun to defend myself, And more importantly to defend my family. Once again of course I believe in peace, Which is why I need a gun. Evil people (which, Surprisingly, Exist contrary to your belief) want to strip me of my natural rights to life, Liberty, And property. There cannot be peace if someone attempts to kill me. I believe in peace but I also believe in defense of our liberties that are given to us by our natural Creator.

"Guns are NOT weapons of peace. "

Correct. They are tools of defense. Do you believe in defense?

"Guns are weapons of hate, Violence, Bloodshed, War, Pain, Destruction, Murder, Grief etc. "

True. They are also tools of defense, Which defend the natural rights I have mentioned above. Do you believe 2 things can be true at once?

"There is nothing good about guns. Nothing. "

Only if you don't believe in defense

"Give 3 examples in each of the 5 rounds why a gun is needed. AND EXPLAIN to---the---letter why a gun is needed? "

Easy. I NEED a gun because 1) I must protect myself and my family from the evils of the world that threaten to take my own life as well as theirs. 2) My wife needs a gun for the same reasons, Also to protect her from being raped/harmed. 3) In case the government becomes tyrannical (which can happen surprisingly enough) as a last resort to salvage a fallen republic. Though I do not believe there is a threat of a tyrannical government today in the U. S. , It could very well be a threat in 50 to 100 years.

"Be Clear, Concise, And accurate. "

Done

"No one under the age of 20 will be allowed to accept this debate. Why? These are ADULT issues. For those in your teens, You do not have the ability in any possible way to grasp the damage, The psychological terror of what guns are UNLESS (let me repeat) UNLESS you've experienced first hand what guns have done unto you or can do in which case you would take the Pro side especially if you've seen guts spilled out from your best friend or a loved one. "

So people can be right about things even if they are young. If I said that your wrong because Donald Trump agrees with me and David Hogg agrees with you, And since Hogg is younger than 20 I must be right, That is a logical fallacy. Age and morality are almost never directly equated.

"Btw, Don't be stupid and pretend you are someone you are not. People who lie, Cheat and steal are very easily found out. Not a good idea. "

Ok I'll try not to haha

Alrighty so to start the next round, After you draft you rebuttal to my arguments, Here is an additional question for round 2.
1. Would everyone in the world give up their guns, Like the dictatorship that is in the Chinese leadership?
2. Given that evil people exist, Why should my family and I not have a right to protect ourselves from them? (I do not believe the answer is throwing flowers at rapists when they attempt to rape my wife. )
Debate Round No. 1
backwardseden

Pro

Seasoned beatings.

Now since you are only 17, A truly pathetic youngun" and cannot in any possible way understand guns, Their effects, The knowing slaughter, Kids dying in the streets, And you are a child trying to compete in an adult arena, Has no idea as to what true pain and suffering is point-blank-obviously, Did not pay attention to what was said in RD 1, You do get that it is my right to terminate this debate and OR insult, Degrade, Dehumanize you - correct?

Per usual I will do a breakdown of your claim/argument
"There can be no worldwide peace with guns and weapons of superior firepower in it. "
That"s not my claim by any means even though I 100% agree with it. It is the claims of many who know better who have come up with 4 ideals into what is required to be done in order for there to be worldwide peace. Granted, This was done long before you were even born and a 5th one was added to the tab thanx to all the different things that have been added. Everything falls under these 5 categories IF there is to be worldwide peace.

"If we disarm ourselves what stops them from destroying our life, Liberty and property? "
What a silly notion as guns do exactly that. They destroy lives liberty and property. EVERYBODY has to give up their guns.
"While I believe in peace I also believe we must defend ourselves when necessary. "
There"s no such a thing as defending yourself with a gun.
Who said there has to be "evil"? Evil is something that is taught, Processed, Practiced and learned. Hate is something that is taught, Processed, Practiced and learned. Evil and hate are both mindsets. ALL mindsets can be changed/ broken/ reworked. ALL participants have to be willing. Nah. Not for this religious wealthy gun yielding society. Its simply ridiculous. Notice that pretty close to all Native American Indian tribes that came before this crap rarely if ever taught, Processed, Practiced = what? And learned any of this s--t which is why they lived in peace until the white so-called (don"t worry there is no such a thing as a christian) christian sweaty greasy pig decided to nearly wipe them out?

Why does there need to be "justice"? What if justice is wrongly delivered? Religion fatally does this all the time. Also Donald s--t for a salesman Trump the worst president of all time, Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao, Hong Xiuquan, Hitler etc etc etc justice - really? Justice, Yeah, That"s their sociopath psychotic justice.
"And if you think everyone is a morally good and responsible person, Well, There is no need to ban guns is there? "
Its not a matter if what "I" think. Its a matter of what everybody else thinks. Regardless when you have those guns laying around, Kids, Children like you are going to look down those barrels and murder themselves. ALL GUNS are required to be eliminated.

"Guns have absolutely no use except to maim, Kill, Cause pain, Splatter guts, And cause horrific grief. "

Obviously untrue. To make your argument you have to ignore the fact that guns also defend us and our families from murder, Burglary, And even rape.
See this shows that you are a teeny bopper and you have in no possible way done any research of any kind. ALL STUDIES OF MERIT, NO EXCEPTIONS, NONE, Show that using guns " us and our families from murder, Burglary, And even rape" is an exceptionally bad idea.
* "How Often Do People Use Guns In Self-Defense? "
Read the entire thing
It defames the CDC and the Gary Kleck supposed idiot study in which no educated idiot can possibly take seriously.

Scientific American "More Guns Do Not Stop More Crimes, Evidence Shows"
"Also in 2015 a combined analysis of 15 different studies found that people who had access to firearms at home were nearly twice as likely to be murdered as people who did not. "
"This evidence has been slow to accumulate because of restrictions placed by Congress on one of the country's biggest injury research funders, The CDC. Since the mid-1990s the agency has been effectively blocked from supporting gun violence research. "
"The CDC's hands are still tied. After the 2012 school shooting that took the lives of 20 children and six adults in Newtown, Conn. , President Barack Obama signed an executive order requesting that the CDC spend $10 million on gun violence research. But Congress did not appropriate the funds. In fact, According to Linda DeGutis, Who directed the CDC's Injury Center from 2010 to 2014, Agency employees weren't even allowed to discuss Newtown. "We couldn't talk to the media except on background. We couldn't be quoted on anything, " she recalls. "There were CDC staff members who wouldn't even mention the word "gun. "" (Current staffers declined to be interviewed for this article. )"
"A growing body of research suggests that violence is a contagious behavior that exists independent of weapon or means. In this framework, Guns are accessories to infectious violence rather than fountainheads. But this does not mean guns don't matter. Guns intensify violent encounters, Upping the stakes and worsening the outcomes"which explains why there are more deaths and life-threatening injuries where firearms are common. Violence may be primarily triggered by other violence, But these deadly weapons make all this violence worse. "
"The frequency of self-defense gun use rests at the heart of the controversy over how guns affect our country. Progun enthusiasts argue that it happens all the time. In 1995 Gary Kleck, A criminologist at Florida State University, And his colleague Marc Gertz published a study that elicited what has become one of the gun lobby's favorite numbers. They randomly surveyed 5, 000 Americans and asked if they, Or another member of the household, Had used a gun for self-protection in the past year. A little more than 1 percent of the participants answered yes, And when Kleck and Gertz extrapolated their results, They concluded that Americans use guns for self-defense as many as 2. 5 million times a year. "

* Google "How many shots do you get in self defense? "
ANSWER: "According to one long-standing statistic, Most self defense shootings involve an average of two shots. "
Do you really think you"d be able to do any kind of damage with a mere TWO shots? Especially when you only have the time to take out your gun, Point, Aim, Probably miss, And shoot BEFORE the criminal is on top of you ready to slit your throat?

* "Harvard Injury Control Research Center Gun Threats and Self-Defense Gun Use"
9-10. Few criminals are shot by decent law-abiding citizens
Using data from surveys of detainees in six jails from around the nation, We worked with a prison physician to determine whether criminals seek hospital medical care when they are shot. Criminals almost always go to the hospital when they are shot. To believe fully the claims of millions of self-defense gun uses each year would mean believing that decent law-abiding citizens shot hundreds of thousands of criminals. But the data from emergency departments belie this claim, Unless hundreds of thousands of wounded criminals are afraid to seek medical care. But virtually all criminals who have been shot went to the hospital, And can describe in detail what happened there.

* The Huffington Post "Amend The Second Amendment To End Gun Violence" Dec 6 2017
"Last year the Violence Policy Center found that a gun owner is 32 times more likely to use their weapon in criminal homicide rather than in self-defense. Usually the first reason a gun advocate says there is a need to own guns is the self-protection myth. Now that that myth has been debunked and it has been proven that justifiable homicides are rare, We must move past the old self-defense narrative and think with clearer heads when discussing gun ownership. "
****"There are seventeen countries around the world where the police are not armed. "
"In 2004 a survey of British police officers found that 82 percent of them did not want to be armed. They see themselves as the guardians of the public. "

* Journal of American Medicine 6/30/16
"And, As statistics show, The more guns that are purchased, The less safe we all are. Especially gun purchasers, Who are 80% more likely to be wounded by their own gun than by anyone else"s. "
"Especially when 3D printers are capable of creating lethal guns in just minutes, Without a waiting period or even the involvement of a gun manufacturer. "

Oh yeah, There"s many more. Simply google it.

"Ok first off guns are incapable of hating people (but that's beside the point. " well then you wouldn"t have mentioned it. Regardless, Its an NRA thought, Perhaps the most corruptible company to have ever existed here in the states).
Stupid thought by stupid teeny bopper idiot person. Guns bring about violence and hate especially POWER in people. Duh.

The reason it will never happen is because a lot of people are. . . Evil. To say this is not true is to lie. " Strange, People, Like I said lived in peace, Oh for 20, 000 years as the aborigines did until they were wiped out by the genocidal so-called christians following their text.
"I need a gun to defend myself, And more importantly to defend my family. Once again of course I believe in peace, Which is why I need a gun. "
B. S. You were 100% proven wrong on that.
"Evil people (which, Surprisingly, Exist contrary to your belief) want to strip me of my natural rights to life, Liberty, And property. "
Did it ever dawn on YOU that YOU are the evil person clinging to your guns? Nah. That"s far too hard for you to contemplate. Put your guns down. Its an entirely U. S. Thought that needs to be changed. Its a mindset. ****

Property? Not after WWIII which is right where we're headed with the Donald not putting your guns down worst president of all time Trump era.

Property. Ownership. Possessions. What does any of this truly matter? Yeah. Wealth/ money. This country is so hell bent on "me me me" which leads to greed. Why?

I'm out of space.
NathanH12

Con

Alright it's debunking time.

It is always your right to insult, degrade, or dehumanize anyone you wish. This is a free country. But while you do that I will actually defeat you in this debate while you scream like a snowflake baby.

"There can be no worldwide peace with guns and weapons of superior firepower in it. It is the claims of many who know better who have come up with 4 ideals into what is required to be done in order for there to be worldwide peace."

I bet I can guess who those strong supporters of those philosophies were. Hitler, Stalin, and Mao to name a few. They told their citizens that if there were no guns on the streets, surely the homicide rate would decrease. Well, turns out that millions died because the governments killed off there own citizens because these "enlightened philosophers" were corrupt.

Everything falls under these 5 categories IF there is to be worldwide peace.

Can you name these the next rounds? Thank you

What a silly notion as guns do exactly that.

A gun is a tool and the wielder is the weapon, as my friend in the marines says. A gun can't kill people, only an evil person can. Evil people will find different ways to kill people. Good people without guns can't defend themselves.

"There"s no such a thing as defending yourself with a gun."

Bull crap. It's done 500,000 to 3 million times a year here in the U.S.

"Who said there has to be "evil"? Evil is something that is taught, Processed, Practiced and learned. Hate is something that is taught, Processed, Practiced and learned. Evil and hate are both mindsets. ALL mindsets can be changed/ broken/ reworked. ALL participants have to be willing."

The thing is they aren't. Taking guns away from people does not make them less evil obviously. Just because you can change people is in no way a rational for stripping everyone of their God given right of self defense.

Why does there need to be "justice"?

Goodness I shouldn't have to answer this. Justice enforces the law and defend the interests of the United States according to the law. It ensures public safety against foreign and domestic threats.

ALL STUDIES OF MERIT, NO EXCEPTIONS, NONE, Show that using guns " us and our families from murder, Burglary, And even rape" is an exceptionally bad idea.

According to the CDC, guns are used 300,000 times a year a year offensively by criminals and used 500,000 to 3 million times a year defensively by gun owners. Defending yourself with a gun is not just a "good idea," it's our constitutional right.

* "How Often Do People Use Guns In Self-Defense? "
Read the entire thing

No.
The reason I say no is because your job is not to spam articles on how guns cause bad things to happen. Your job is to draw out arguments used by the articles and use them to your cause. How am I supposed to debunk paragraphs of what they are saying along with paragraphs of what you are saying. Use the arguments they use and I will debunk those.

What's funny is that I don't even have to debunk what you quoted from your article. It supports my case. It's conclusion merely states "They concluded that Americans use guns for self-defense as many as 2. 5 million times a year. " Yes that fits with the data I disposed earlier. Thank you.

The second supports my case too. Getting 2 shots on your aggressor will incapacitate him. Also, it isn't rocket science to shoot someone. In less than a second you can whip out a gun and pull the trigger. A bullet will stop a criminal don't worry sir.

In the third article, it first displays the pro gun argument is that guns are used in self defense hundreds of thousands of times.
The researchers then went to hospitals to see how many criminals showed up after being shot. The thing is, this study is invalid and will not produce an accurate result (a result they do not show anyway) because when a criminal is shot, they can also be arrested shortly after without going illegally to a hospital. Also, the study does not account for when a citizen uses a gun without discharging it to discourage a potential aggressor from attacking said citizen

As to the fourth article, .02 percent of gun owners commit any kind of fire arm violation in the U.S. To say that a gun owner is 32 times more likely to commit homicide than self defense is obviously untrue.

In the fifth article, It says that the more guns that are purchased, the less safe we are. I would appreciate for you to explain how more guns equals more murder when the number of privately-owned firearms has increased 56 percent whilst the gun homicide rats has decreased 49 percent.

Stupid thought by stupid teeny bopper idiot person. Guns bring about violence and hate especially POWER in people. Duh.

They do. They are also used defensively by citizens every day, thousands of times.

Strange, People, Like I said lived in peace, Oh for 20, 000 years as the aborigines did until they were wiped out by the genocidal so-called Christians following their text.

What a load of baloney haha. You actually know no history whatsoever do you. I would ask for evidence on that but let's keep this in the gun debate parameter.

Did it ever dawn on YOU that YOU are the evil person clinging to your guns? Nah. That"s far too hard for you to contemplate. Put your guns down. Its an entirely U. S. Thought that needs to be changed. Its a mindset. ****

I will put my gun down when heck freezes over. My self defense, my God given right, to own and operate a fire arm will not be infringed by someone with no knowledge of history, justice, or even guns for that matter.

Property. Ownership. Possessions. What does any of this truly matter? Yeah. Wealth/ money. This country is so hell bent on "me me me" which leads to greed. Why?

Um yes I believe people should have a right to their rightfully owned property. But I do agree this country is all "me me me,"
because otherwise socialism probably wouldn't exist.

Ok I have 2 questions for you that you must answer. You avoided the questions the first time but you can't this time.

1. Would everyone in the world give up their guns, Like the dictatorship that is in the Chinese leadership?
2. Explain how more guns equals more murder when the number of privately-owned firearms has increased 56 percent whilst the gun homicide rats has decreased 49 percent.
Debate Round No. 2
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Debate Round No. 3
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Debate Round No. 4
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Debate Round No. 5
12 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by Our_Boat_is_Right 3 days ago
Our_Boat_is_Right
Yeah, Well couldn't say I didn't warn you about him :)
Posted by NathanH12 3 days ago
NathanH12
Yeah sorry guys. He left after my last argument. Then he just tried to find someone else to debate the exact same topic.
Posted by 1leroy 6 days ago
1leroy
I would like to give an example of two people fighting that laid down their weapons. The Argentinians and Mapuche people were fighting over Argentina when the Argentines decided to make a deal with the Mapuches, Both armies will bury their guns and never touch them again, Good idea right? While the Mapuche went back to their jobs and families the Argentines rearmed themselves and took over the Mapuche people. Perfect peace, When the Argentines won.
From this war came a quote, "those who beat their guns into plows will plow for those who don't".
Never give up your weapons.
Posted by Our_Boat_is_Right 1 week ago
Our_Boat_is_Right
@backwardsman

How is Gary kleck debunked? How is he an invalid source?
Posted by Anonymous03 1 week ago
Anonymous03
Why the f*ck are you debating this topic again backwardseden?
ARE YOU INCAPABLE OF ACCEPTING THAT YOU LOST THE TOPIC?
Posted by backwardseden 1 week ago
backwardseden
@NathanH12 - I should have not debated with you before reading your comment. Sorry. Utopia? Wow. Do you think that getting rid of guns is going to bring about an all inspired utopia? Really? How is this going to occur without other things occuring as well my poor boy rectal itch sandwich who knows absolutely nothing about anything and only guesses and really doesn't know anything about a utopia in the first pace because NOT ONE has ever been achieved? Here's you since you despise a utopia. . . All you want to do is believe in a heavenly brutal war. You believe its true on the battlefields, In the classrooms, And in the streets with innocent children dying for no reason at all since to love your tummy-tucked guns. Oh and yeah, You are a child with the mind of a child totally 100% incapable of debating on the issue of guns in an adult arena. You think that the ripping opening of guts, Blood spirting out, The SCREAMING of bullet ridden peasants is so huggable and loveable, The agony of death, Is cute, Lovely, And wonderful.
Perhaps if you actually had something even remotely intelligent and educated to say, There could be an actual conversation. Nah. That's far too difficult for you and other teeny boppers like you who cannot grasp what guns are.
Bye.
Posted by backwardseden 1 week ago
backwardseden
@NathanH12 - I should have not debated with you before reading your comment. Sorry. Utopia? Wow. Do you think that getting rid of guns is going to bring about an all inspired utopia? Really? How is this going to occur without other things occuring as well my poor boy rectal itch sandwich who knows absolutely nothing about anything and only guesses and really doesn't know anything about a utopia in the first pace because NOT ONE has ever been achieved? Here's you since you despise a utopia. . . All you want to do is believe in a heavenly brutal war. You believe its true on the battlefields, In the classrooms, And in the streets with innocent children dying for no reason at all since to love your tummy-tucked guns. Oh and yeah, You are a child with the mind of a child totally 100% incapable of debating on the issue of guns in an adult arena. You think that the ripping opening of guts, Blood spirting out, The SCREAMING of bullet ridden peasants is so huggable and loveable, The agony of death, Is cute, Lovely, And wonderful.
Perhaps if you actually had something even remotely intelligent and educated to say, There could be an actual conversation. Nah. That's far too difficult for you and other teeny boppers like you who cannot grasp what guns are.
Bye.
Posted by WhoPutYouOnThePlanet 1 week ago
WhoPutYouOnThePlanet
Anyone remember the futurama scene where they ditched all weapons and aliens invaded?
Posted by Our_Boat_is_Right 1 week ago
Our_Boat_is_Right
@nathanH12

Great argument. You just schooled that old man.

As a fair warning. . . Backwardseden will avoid all your arguments and write incoherent arguments that make no sense, While using insults and ad-hominem as his argument because he knows he's wrong.
Posted by NathanH12 1 week ago
NathanH12
Sorry bout writing so much haha. Heres my point simple and clear

This world isn't a magic unicorn utopia where we say "drop your guns everyone" and suddenly all the bad guys drop their guns and we have peace from here to eternity. If that were the case we probably would have solved world peace by now. It's almost like. . . Bad people exist. Huh.
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