The Instigator
Mingodalia
Pro (for)
The Contender
Rasmit
Con (against)

Liberals are destroying colleges with their cult

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Debate Round Forfeited
Rasmit has forfeited round #5.
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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 3/18/2018 Category: Politics
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Debating Period
Viewed: 682 times Debate No: 111016
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (7)
Votes (0)

 

Mingodalia

Pro

I believe that Liberals are destroying colleges. They have created an ideology that is much like a religion, and trying to ram it down kids' throats. This is causing parents to become hesitant to send their kids to colleges for fear of brainwashing.
Rasmit

Con

I shall start off by defining what liberal means. Liberal is used to define freedom, sometimes to the extent of utopianism (not in this argument). In this argument, liberal refers to a person or quality that acts towards freedom. Religions involve some form of deity, not just an ideology. Therefore, liberals are not a certain religion. A liberal is simply a person/s fighting for freedom, especially for civil rights like with racial segregation. No person is forced to go to a liberal college, and not all colleges have a liberal area, especially those that want students to specialize in STEM, as liberals have no almost relation to that area. Also, for brainwashing, liberal colleges are not forcing you to be liberal. If you go to one, you are already liberal since you chose to go there. As for destroying colleges, what context are you portraying? If you mean ruining college life, I do not understand how that happens, since college is a free area of study. If you mean changing the idea of a college, there is no evidence of a change in how college works (related to liberals, at least).
Debate Round No. 1
Mingodalia

Pro

Liberal:
"In the US, the word has been associated with both the Republican and Democratic parties (now it is more commonly attached to the latter)"


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Con: In this argument, liberal refers to a person or quality that acts towards freedom. Religions involve some form of deity, not just an ideology. Therefore, liberals are not a certain religion. A liberal is simply a person/s fighting for freedom, especially for civil rights like with racial segregation. No person is forced to go to a liberal college, and not all colleges have a liberal area, especially those that want students to specialize in STEM, as liberals have no almost relation to that area. Also, for brainwashing, liberal colleges are not forcing you to be liberal. If you go to one, you are already liberal since you chose to go there. As for destroying colleges, what context are you portraying? If you mean ruining college life, I do not understand how that happens, since college is a free area of study. If 8you mean changing the idea of a college, there is no evidence of a change in how college works (related to liberals, at least).
------------------------

In 2015, a series of protests at the University of Missouri related to race, workplace benefits, and leadership resulted in the resignations of the president of the University of Missouri System and the chancellor of the flagship Columbia campus. The moves came after a series of events that included a hunger strike by a student and a boycott by thefootball team. The movement was primarily led by a student group named Concerned Student 1950. The movement and protests were documented in two films, one made by MU student journalists and the other, 2 Fists Up, by Spike Lee. (A known ideological Liberal)

The fist up is the known symbol of "black power" (The evil cousin of white power)

The President of the university was pushed out with no due process.



The University of Missouri had to close many of its dorms because enrollment plummitted after what happened.


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Liberal colleges' enrollment has dropped significantly since the manifestations of militant Progressivism all across the nation. It has poisoned the environment of colleges to the point of national boycotts, especially colleges known for "social justice warfare".


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The Liberal, Progressive college environment has risen to the point of being acts of terrorism. Would you want your Moderate/Conservative child going here? Me neither.

--Gay Conservative threatened--

The event at UC Berkeley for Conservative speaker Milo Yiannopoulos was canceled. Why? Progressives became violent in protest, began destroying buildings and cars, and set them on fire. The damage was estimayed at over $100,000.


--Female Conservative threatened--
Anne Coulter has had multiple speaking events cancelled because of Progressive threats of violence and death threats.


--Jewish Conservative threatened--

Ben Shapiro gets constant death threats and threats of violence at events he speaks at. One event of his cleared the balcony for fears that Progressives were going to hurl things and hurt or kill those below.




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And Con says "they aren't brainwashed", yet students who go to these schools say there is a brainwashing process going on in these schools towards militant Progressivism.

According to polls, many students believe 9/11 was not conducted by Islamic extremists, & were told so by liberal professors.


Here's a student's documentation of his experience, where he tells about the moment that it hit him that there was a liberal propoganda conspiracy going on. He then documented his journey out of it.


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Here, Larry Elder gives a dialogue on how to attempt to unbrainwash your kids after college.

Rasmit

Con

I will do my argument and rebuttal together since they are very related. I will cite the part that I am arguing before I do.
---------------------------------------------
In 2015, a series of protests at the University of Missouri related to race, workplace benefits, and leadership resulted in the resignations of the president of the University of Missouri System and the chancellor of the flagship Columbia campus. The moves came after a series of events that included a hunger strike by a student and a boycott by the football team. The movement was primarily led by a student group named Concerned Student 1950. The movement and protests were documented in two films, one made by MU student journalists and the other, 2 Fists Up, by Spike Lee. (A known ideological Liberal). The fist up is the known symbol of "black power" (The evil cousin of white power)
The President of the university was pushed out with no due process. The University of Missouri had to close many of its dorms because enrollment plummeted after what happened.

First some fallacies. You state that the president resigned, but then you state that he was pushed out. Which is it? Needs to be specified to create a good argument.

Now the main part. Not all liberals agree on certain things, just as political parties and groups of close friends. You only say liberals, not a certain form of them. Therefore, the evidence cited is not enough to cover all liberals. You state that there was a hunger strike and boycott. Those aren't generalized to liberals either. They are simply actions of freedom of expression. As for the rest of the cited text, there is nothing that would be of the topic.
----------------------------------------------
Liberal colleges' enrollment has dropped significantly since the manifestations of militant Progressivism all across the nation. It has poisoned the environment of colleges to the point of national boycotts, especially colleges known for "social justice warfare".
The Liberal, Progressive college environment has risen to the point of being acts of terrorism. Would you want your Moderate/Conservative child going here? Me neither.
The event at UC Berkeley for Conservative speaker Milo Yiannopoulos was canceled. Why? Progressives became violent in protest, began destroying buildings and cars, and set them on fire. The damage was estimated at over $100,000.
Anne Coulter has had multiple speaking events canceled because of Progressive threats of violence and death threats. Ben Shapiro gets constant death threats and threats of violence at events he speaks at. One event of his cleared the balcony for fears that Progressives were going to hurl things and hurt or kill those below. And Con says "they aren't brainwashed", yet students who go to these schools say there is a brainwashing process going on in these schools towards militant Progressivism. According to polls, many students believe 9/11 was not conducted by Islamic extremists, & were told so by liberal professors. Here's a student's documentation of his experience, where he tells about the moment that it hit him that there was a liberal propaganda conspiracy going on. He then documented his journey out of it.

Once again, you assume that all liberals are bad because certain groups are doing what they have the freedom to do, protest. You are not only attack liberals but the constitution too. Also, we are not discussing progressivism. This creates a red herring. When you reference the polls, you are arguing the right to beliefs and expressions. That is another red herring. As for the last part, there is no evidence other than some students talking about on the internet (that I can find).
Debate Round No. 2
Mingodalia

Pro

(Con:)
"Therefore, the evidence cited is not enough to cover all liberals."

The words "all liberals" are never used by me anywhere in the debate.

The title of the debate is not "All liberals are destroying colleges". And it is obvious & common sense to realize the term does not refer to all liberals on the entire planet Earth.

(Con:)
"You state that the president resigned, but then you state that he was pushed out. Which is it?"

Both. The players threatened a walkout, had a lot of support outside of sports, & a walkout would have cost the university millions for every game missed.

The Missouri football stadium, Faurot Field, Holds 71,168 fans. Multiply this by ticket prices and concession losses, & it's a loss of over $1 million per home game.

When you don't show for an away game, you owe the same type of estimate in losses to the other school. In this case, Missouri is in the SEC, & most of its stadiums are much larger than mLMissouri's. It would have millions upon millions of dollars to have a walkout.


SEC Stadium capacities-

Texas A&MKyle Field 102,512
TennesseeNeyland Stadium 102,455
LSUTiger Stadium 102,321
AlabamaBryant-Denny Stadium 101,821
GeorgiaSanford Stadium 92,746
FloridaBen Hill Griffin Stadium 88,548
AuburnJordan-Hare Stadium 87,451
S. CarolinaWilliams-Brice Stadium 80,250
ArkansasRazorback Stadium 72,000



-----

In this story, the liberal faculty at Missouri strongly supported the walkout and urged students to walkout in protest.


According to studies, Liberal professors outnumber Conservative professors about 12 to 1.


-----

(Con:)
"You state that there was a hunger strike and boycott."

I also pointed out they were strongly encouraged by liberal faculty.

-----

(Con:)
"Once again, you assume that all liberals are bad because certain groups are doing what they have the freedom to do, protest."

I still have never mentioned ALL liberals. The title of the debate is "Liberals are destroying colleges". And I still hold that position.

(Con:)
"You are not only attack liberals but the constitution too. "

I haven't attacked or even mentioned the Constitution. I have not attacked their right to protest nor claimed protests are illegal. I have simply pointed out that Liberals are destroying colleges, regardless of what the law says or their rights are.

(Con:)
"When you reference the polls, you are arguing the right to beliefs and expressions."

No. I am proving through polls the positions that most Liberals take.
Rasmit

Con

Let me first start by arguing the common misconception. You say liberals in the title, so you are not addressing liberal colleges specifically, so it has to be assumed you mean liberals in general.

Second, When you say the faculty encouraged the actions, who are they protesting against? If they are part of a college that is all liberal that supports liberal movements, how are they opposing the college? Surely the entire college is in on it. Which leads me to wonder why they even had the protest take place during an expensive event anyways? Couldn't they just protest in public? This also leads me to wonder how they pushed out the president if he encouraged some of their actions.

Third, you say you are proving what position most liberals take, but your evidence has a small sample that is not large enough? Can you cite any more polls to strengthen that argument?

Fourth, you say liberal professors outnumber conservative professors, but what about republican, democratic, green, and other parties in between?
Debate Round No. 3
Mingodalia

Pro

Let me first start by arguing the common misconception. You say liberals in the title, so you are not addressing liberal colleges specifically, so it has to be assumed you mean liberals in general.

Yes, Liberals instigated the movement, and Liberal professors instigated the movement, and without due process of the law.

Second, When you say the faculty encouraged the actions, who are they protesting against?

Actions of the President that they felt were "systematic racism".

If they are part of a college that is all liberal that supports liberal movements, how are they opposing the college?

They weren't. They were opposing the President.

Which leads me to wonder why they even had the protest take place during an expensive event anyways?

They didn't protest during an expensive event. They threatened to not attend the football game that they were supposed to play in.

This also leads me to wonder how they pushed out the president if he encouraged some of their actions.

He didn't encourage their actions. They threatened to not play in football games if he didn't resign or get fired.

Third, you say you are proving what position most liberals take, but your evidence has a small sample that is not large enough? Can you cite any more polls to strengthen that argument?

https://www.politico.com...

http://news.gallup.com...

https://www.cato.org...

https://www.washingtonpost.com...

peech/2017/09/18/cbb1a234-9ca8-11e7-9083-fbfddf6804c2_story.html?utm_term=.345fc23aba29

http://www.bbc.com...

https://www.nytimes.com...


Fourth, you say liberal professors outnumber conservative professors, but what about republican, democratic, green, and other parties in between?

Liberal professors are 12/13 of the faculty population regardless of what the other 1/13 is.
Rasmit

Con

2., 3., and 5. Why is the person President if he doesn't follow the beliefs of the college. Form:
A is B
B are against C
A supports C
Here is the analogy:
He is a certain sector of Republicans
The certain sector of Republicans are against allowing illegal immigrants to stay
He supports allowing illegal immigrants to stay.
Each premise contradicts the others. No matter what, one premise is false, or the statement is fallacious.
Note: In this case, B refers to the liberal form of the college, not all liberals. So it would be like the certain sector of the Liberals.

4. The act of not attending counts as a protest, since they are protesting by not going to a required place. Also, I do not know too much about football, but in the sports I play, you are not required to go to a game, just tell them beforehand.

6. First off, the argument of a conservative is one that is both fallacious and not very liked, which is why there are a low number of them. Second off, your evidence only supports Liberal to Conservative and Democratic to Republic, but I do not see anything about Liberal to everything else.

By the way, the numbers reference the number answer you say, not the number I put them as.
Debate Round No. 4
Mingodalia

Pro

REBUTTAL

(Con:)
"The act of not attending counts as a protest, since they are protesting by not going to a required place. Also, I do not know too much about football, but in the sports I play, you are not required to go to a game, just tell them beforehand."

It's not quite that simple in this case. In this case millions of dollars would be lost for every game the players did not attend. The millions of dollars were used as a ransom to get the President to quit or be fired. The university couldn't afford to lose millions of dollars every week.

(Con:)
"First off, the argument of a conservative is one that is both fallacious and not very liked. That's why there aren't very many."

1)62,984,825 people voted for Donald Trump, a Conservative.

2)Most Americans identify as Conservative or Moderate-

http://news.gallup.com...

3)U.S. Conservatives outnumber Liberals-

http://news.gallup.com...

------------------

EXAMPLES

-------------------

Ben Shapiro, a Jewish Conservative speaker, cost $600,000 to pay for security for a UC Berkeley speaking event because of fear of Liberal violence. The balcony was closed off for fear that liberal protestors would hurl things from the balcony into the crowd below.

Excerpt from article-

"Ben Shapiro was invited to speak by the Young America's Foundation, a conservative college group, and Berkeley's College Republicans organization. The invite sparked outrage and protests that had the city's police taking unprecedented steps to keep the peace."

http://www.dailycal.org...

-----------

Milo Yiannopulos, a gay Conservative speaker came to speak at Berkeley. His event was shut down because of violent protests where Liberal protestors overran security, attacked security, and began breaking windows, destroying cars, setting fires, & using fire bombs. There was an estimated $800,000 in damages.

https://www.mercurynews.com...

Pictures from event-

Pic 1-

https://2.bp.blogspot.com...

Pic 2-

http://www.berkeleyside.com...

Pic 3-

http://i0.kym-cdn.com...

Pic 4-

https://i.ytimg.com...

----------

There were threats of violence at Berkeley when Anne Coulter, a female Conservative speaker, was scheduled to speak. She chose to- cancel the event.

https://mobile.nytimes.com...

----------

Oddly enough Mahmoud Ahmadinejad has been allowed to speak at colleges with no protests. Ahmadinejad is well known for his comments about wiping Israel off the map with nuclear weapons and leading "death to America" chants.

http://www.washingtonpost.com...

https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org...

https://mobile.nytimes.com...

----------

THE ABSURD-

A student legislative council at the University of California-Irvine"approved 6-4, a resolution"to ban the American flag from student government offices. The banners felt those should be "inclusive" spaces, while the American flag has been "flown in instances of colonialism and imperialism." And besides, "freedom of speech, in an area that aims to be as inclusive as possible, can be interpreted as hate speech."

Hundreds of academics, grad students, and undergraduates from around the country signed a letter in support of the "Irvine Six", saying that the "paraphernalia of nationalism is in fact often used to intimidate" and that "the resolution has drawn admiration nationally from much of the academic community."

http://www.foxnews.com...

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The student government at George Washington University approved a proposal that required student leaders to attend LGBT sensitivity training and teaching on "using proper gender pronouns." A conservative student group, the Young America"s Foundation chapter at GW, declined to do it. "YAF treats everyone with respect", said representative Amanda Robbins, "and doesn"t need to be lectured on how to do so."

The campus LGBT group, "Allied in Pride","responded"that YAF"s "refusal to use preferred gender pronouns should be considered an act of violence."

https://mssc.gwu.edu...

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Examples like these, including the increasing demand for "trigger warnings," the liberal attempts to stamp out "microaggressions," etc show us the dog eating its own tail nature of political correctness. Its claim to support diversity actually produces demands for conformity. Its claims for inclusivity requires it to exclude those who are patriotic or pro American. Its attempts to morph the classroom into a "safe space" have made classes unsafe for those whose views don't agree with the Liberal norms. This is nothing more than madness.
This round has not been posted yet.
Debate Round No. 5
7 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 7 records.
Posted by Renie 3 years ago
Renie
Ben Shapiro's event at UC Berkley needed $500,000 USD to cover the amount of police force (including helicopters) to ensure the eventgoers and Shapiro were unharmed - from antifa and protesters from the left. Just saying.
Posted by Mingodalia 3 years ago
Mingodalia
Who's in power has nothing to do with colleges. The power at colleges themselves is liberal. 12 of 13 professors are liberal in the U.S.
Posted by WOLF.J 3 years ago
WOLF.J
I'm sure mods, indps n cons can do what they want. Liberals aren't in power though mate.
Posted by Mingodalia 3 years ago
Mingodalia
Liberals are causing moderates, independents, & conservatives to not want to send their kids to college for fear of brainwashing to the far left extremist religion.
Posted by WOLF.J 3 years ago
WOLF.J
please elaborate
Posted by Mingodalia 3 years ago
Mingodalia
Either and both.
Posted by WOLF.J 3 years ago
WOLF.J
in what sense, from a funding perspective or a student one.?
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