The Instigator
drummerrboi357
Pro (for)
Winning
4 Points
The Contender
ConstructiveCriticism
Con (against)
Losing
0 Points

Modern Video games have little to no sexism Change My mind

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
drummerrboi357
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 10/24/2018 Category: Entertainment
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 801 times Debate No: 118701
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (3)
Votes (1)

 

drummerrboi357

Pro

I have been a part of the gaming Subculture for 15 years when my mother first bought me a ps1 (Play Station One) back in the early 2000's threw out my time I have played multiple types of games. Adventure, Movie licensed, RPG, FPS etc. Threw out my years later in the modern age of gaming. There were accusations of video games being sexist. I believe this is false. GTA is an example that comes up often. I believe GTA is just representing what is in the real world. There are prostitutes there is a Strip club. If anything it just insulates what's wrong with the real world more then just saying it's sexist. Also, Video games have proven multiple times now especially in the modern era there are multiple female characters in gaming that can take care of themselves. That also doesn't come into the damsel in distress trope. If they do it will be thrown obvious means. Example, They're outnumbered, The foe is currently too strong for them to fight and eventually might overcome. I would love for someone to debate this with me civilly and I will look forward to your reply.
ConstructiveCriticism

Con

Hey. I've been a gamer for around 10 years- started with the PS2 and haven't looked back since. I play pretty much every genre imaginable, And I gotta say, Sexism is something I come across a lot. I get what you're saying when you mention how the GTA Strip Club just emulates real world events- it's unfortunate that sexism exists in the real world, But it's good you acknowledge this. However, This does not make it not sexism- prostitution is exploitative and objectifies women, Putting it in a game does not suddenly make it okay- GTA quite simply displays sexism. Small things like this, Exposing people to things like prostitution normalises it in some way; it makes it seem more acceptable, Disconnects people from the harsh reality of desperate women involved in prostitution.

I also disagree with your implied notion that the prostitution portrayed in GTA is realistic- the BBC created a few interesting videos on YouTube regarding the lives of female UK University students forced into prostitution to make ends meet. One in particular struck me- a story about a student abused by a client. Making prostitution appear as it does in GTA detracts from the real life issue- however, I went off on a tangent here.

I do agree with you that overt sexism, Like what is shown above has decreased in recent years- and I even take my hat off to some games, For example, The Call Of Duty franchise who are adding female characters in modern games. I don't consider the "damsel in distress" convention as serious, However, It is a part of the underlying sexism of most video games. You'd never see the princess saving Mario, Eh? As you say, This is through obvious means, But it doesn't make it not sexist. Let's take FIFA as an example, There is a very limited female gamemode available, That allows the user to play with female players, However, It does not offer nearly as many features as it's male counterpart- now- you could say that this represents the clear gap in popularity between male and female football, HOWEVER, In my opinion, A fully fledged female game option could encourage many young gamers into looking into supporting real female football.

Now- something I want to tackle, Is online and multiplayer modes. Now, Sexism on these modes is obviously community driven and not something the game developer can easily solve- short of banning sexist users, However, It is important to tackle. There are plenty of articles regarding the abuse received by female gamers, And many mentions of serious harassment (! ) and sexual comments. This is not to say that male gamers don't receive abuse as well, However, The abuse hurled at female gamers is often targeted and singles them out based on gender.

Thanks- I doubt I'll change your mind, But I look forward to your response. Especially regarding the multiplayer thing.
Debate Round No. 1
drummerrboi357

Pro

Thank you for your reply and also Hope you're a fellow brit because that would be awesome. I do agree with some of your points majority on Prostitution. If it came across that GTA's interpretation of prostitution is what I think it's really like then I am sorry. IT's not what I mean at all. I know that women who have to make ends meet have to do some desperate things that could possibly have them ending up worse than they currently are. The only point I will mention is that Some women do sex work on there own. (Source here)https://www. Youtube. Com/watch? V=G2mnyro54xo

When it comes to female Options in video games though there are plenty. As for your Mario comment, There is a game where you play as princess peach and you save Mario and Luigi from Bowser. It's called Super Princess Peach. Now A lot on the opposition say is that her power is her emotions saying that women are highly emotional. The thing is if it was Mario the staff that princess peach uses would work on him the same way. Also, I Haven't played many sports games since im more into the RPG crowd but FIFA 16 does have the option to play with female players. I don't know how limited or unlimited the spectrum of gameplay it has but it is an option.

I know this may be irrelevant to the argument but you do have to acknowledge that there are role models in gaming that are female even though they're fictional. For example, Want to be an explorer and archaeologist a very well paid and life-changing position laura croft is the spitting image of an archaeologist. Do you want to inspire to become a fighting champ in any type of fighting Chun-li (The women in blue with the exposed thighs if you never played street fighter) who was a woman of the cloth and spends every amount of money to her church? Also as a bonus Yoshinori Ono who is actually transgendered :). I know these people are fictional and as I said this might be off topic. So feel free to glance this over.

As for multiplayer, It's branching off to the community rather than the actual topic I was talking about. But I will say that I do not tolerate that type of behaviour. The point I will make though is pretty much amounts to what the person can take when it comes to insults. If it's death threats and violence that's out of order. But when it comes to insults just plain insults there is a system in consols to block the person or mute them to not hear them or receive messages from them.

Sorry if I sound rude when you read this. I hope to read your reply soon.
ConstructiveCriticism

Con

Yes- I am a Brit- aye. And nah ^^ you didnt come off as rude at all.

I was unaware of the peach spinoff, But after looking into it it seems like a fairly decent remake- however, It is important to note that Nintendo was criticised by some for the difficulty of the game- a GameSpot review noted it was "way too easy for the average platformer player. ". Is this in itself not indicative of a sexist undertone? The fact that the game is the only (correct me if I am wrong) Mario game specifically marketed at females and also the only platforming Mario game played at a significantly lower difficulty than the others is in fact sexist in itself, I wouldnt have an issue with it all if there was a difficulty adjustment option, However the game assumes Female gamers to be of a lower skill level.

And yes- I agree and appreciate the fact there are female role models in some games, Just as there are male. However- this does not mean that there is less sexism in modern games. Just because there are non-sexist games, Does not detract from the fact there are still sexist games out there.

In reference to your comment about FIFA 16 offering a womens mode, That was my point, Lol. To elaborate on that, The womens mode offers gameplay on an incredibly limited spectrum, I could go into more detail but I'll save you most of it, In a way, Is it not worse to offer such a small spectrum of gameplay than to offer no womens gameplay at all. And, I think this gets to the crux of the problem. FIFA's womens mode is a nod to the drive against sexism, But that's all it is, A nod, Almost an insult in that it provides very little in the way of gameplay, And yet was fairly heavily marketed by EA. Many games offer things like this; for example, Let's take Call Of Duty BO3, The first in the franchise to allow for a female protagonist to be played in the campaign. This would usually be great news, However, It is undermined by the fact the protagonist is addressed as a male multiple times throughout the campaign- the community itself has some pretty serious sexist undertones.

On the multiplayer topic- I think, It has to be considered as part of the game seeing how popular multiplayer is within the community. I get that insults happen, And personally I couldn't care less. However, Targeted harassment is not something that should exist in any community, And really, More needs to be done to create a comfortable environment within the community. When a female logs on to the online section of a game, They are still playing the game, And any sexism they experience is something that needs to be stopped. In a modern game, Multiplayer is almost always part of the package.
Debate Round No. 2
drummerrboi357

Pro

When it comes to multiplayer it's pretty much up to the person. A person simply doesn't wake up and say "I'm going to be sexist today. " It's pretty much there environment and what situation therein. The point I'm trying to say is that the games themselves. Should not be used as a scapegoat for sexism. For example, When dungeons and dragons were brought out to the public the media were in an uproar saying that it makes kids go insane that they turn children into devil worshipers. Which this type of practice still is done today. My friend's auntie believes that D&D short for is of course not Christian to play.

As for the sexist games comment if you're talking about games like Hunie pop or the sakura spirit series there are games like that for women as well such as Dramatical Murder which is a visual novel about a guy who is discovering himself sexually which does involve imagery that is not suitable for children. So when it comes to games that treat females in that type of way there will always be one game to equalize that.

As for EA, They are a bad company when it comes to games. There is a reason why they won the raspberry award twice. As for Battlefield. Some of there games take place in WW2/1 so I think they were going for historical accuracy. As for them not allowing a female option that is a bit unfair but The majority of the audience of those games are Male. Whether there sexist or not companies only care about three things when it comes to there games whether there the nicest company like Nintendo or rubbish like EA. Who is are the main audience? How well we make the product. How much money can we make? A the end of the day it's their hands on the line if they're going to get a paycheck or not.

As for the review on Gamespot, This is my opinion but I don't trust game review companies they can be easily bought through the company for advertising there game on their site and they could easily give a good rating to a slightly mediocre game. While smaller indi like games don't get their fair share.

As for the difficulty on Super princess peach Nintendos audience is primarily for children when was the last time you rage quit from a Mario game. Sure It may not excuse them for making it more difficult. But since it was released at 2005 I believe it progressed from it's time where young girls were only getting games like Barbie explorer on the ps1
ConstructiveCriticism

Con

ConstructiveCriticism forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
drummerrboi357

Pro

My opponent has sadly forfeited this round I hope she comes back with a repute. Please vote fairly with no bias
ConstructiveCriticism

Con

ConstructiveCriticism forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
drummerrboi357

Pro

My opponent has forfeited this round please vote fairly.
ConstructiveCriticism

Con

ConstructiveCriticism forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
3 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Posted by omar2345 3 years ago
omar2345
sexism
prejudice, Stereotyping, Or discrimination, Typically against women, On the basis of sex.

It is not really a problem. It is only a problem if people decide to think video games are real. GTA V is an exaggerated version of real life. Some games can be realistic but it is not real. For someone to say sexism it would be how is it being discriminatory? If it is not portraying women correctly then I think the problem lies in the accuser. By saying women do not act like this means you have some authority into determining what a women is. As far as I know everyone is an individual and people are different so to say this is a bad representation would disregard it being fiction and women being different. Video games are not real and if you do not like it do not play it. Why are you affecting someone else enjoyment in that kind of entertainment? I don't like people who say EA are a good company. What do I do? Live and let live because they are allowed to have their opinions and allowed to play the game. I am not going to stop them playing their preferred video game and I think everyone else should do the same. If you don't like it don't play it. It is as simple as that.

Online harassment does happen with women more then men. This should be taken as a case by case basis. Don't generalise so that you are not boxing every argument into one or making it trivial. I would say if you have a problem with harassment online simply block said user, Mute, Don't play the game or play the off line portion of it. It is avoidable. Harassment can be based on gender but I would rather have free speech then allow EA block certain words like DLC. It sets a bad precedent.
Posted by drummerrboi357 3 years ago
drummerrboi357
Yet In video games, Men are portrayed as built muscular dudes with guns. As for the RPG armour argument, The elder scrolls series, For example, Doesn't have any of that nor any RPG's that you play as a female that I play today. All I'm saying is that men get this type of treatment as well so it isn't just females that get it so technically it's equal footing when it comes to gaming and how they portray gender. Also if there are the game s like this can you tell me what they are?
Posted by McSloth 3 years ago
McSloth
I'm surprised no one has brought up the problem with how women are portrayed in video games in terms of their outfits and armor. Look at fighting games and RPGs for example, When playing a female character there is no escaping objectification, Hell for a vast majority of RPGs the best amour in the game is usually the most revealing for female characters. On the other hand, Men get to wear amour that is the farthest thing from revealing. That is pretty blatant sexism coming from the game designers.
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by omar2345 3 years ago
omar2345
drummerrboi357ConstructiveCriticismTied
Agreed with before the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Agreed with after the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
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Total points awarded:40 
Reasons for voting decision: ConstructiveCriticism-forfeited drummerrboi357- Rebutted against points sufficiently even though most of ConstructiveCriticism were assumptions instead of actual sexism and were misinformed. Examples: (Con)A fully fledged female game option could encourage many young gamers into looking into supporting real female football (Pro) FIFA 16 does have the option to play with female players (Con)The abuse hurled at female gamers is often targeted and singles them out based on gender: provided no evidence (Pro) But when it comes to insults just plain insults there is a system in consols to block the person or mute them to not hear them or receive messages from them. There are more then this but it should give an idea that Pro sufficiently answered points Con did make.

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