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Resolved: Big Bang is a far superior group than Super Junior

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Post Voting Period
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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 6/2/2014 Category: Music
Updated: 7 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 7,316 times Debate No: 55932
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (5)
Votes (0)




Ladies and Gentlemen, Boys and Girls.

My name is Lawrentian and I would like to affirm the resolution, Resolved: Big Bang is a far superior group than Super Junior. In order for the affirmative to victor in this debate, I believe that all I need to prove is that Big Bang is the better group.

Contention 1: Popularity

My first contention is that of popularity. I believe that a crucial factor in this debate is that of popularity since it is to my understanding that popularity derives from the overall fanbase of one's group. I believe that both debaters can agree that youtube is a very reliable source in expressing the aggregate of ones popularity and fanbase. On youtube, Super Junior's most viewed song, Sorry Sorry, (44 million views) does not even compare to Big Bang's Fantastic Baby which upholds the recognition of 100 million views. Even Big Bang's second most viewed music video, Bad Boy, has more views that Sorry Sorry. Therefore, I believe that we can conclude that Big Bang not only has a greater domestic recognition, but also international popularity. Big Bang is far more globally recognized for one simple reason: They're the superior group.

Contention 2: Lack of Quality

This is an argument that even many Super Junior fans would agree with. The quality of Super Junior has not lived up to society's standards. For a group that has once been proclaimed with the title of "Kpop Kings", Super Junior has released very poor quality music, aside from the fact they have barely been active for the past few years. It seems like SM has moved on from Super Junior, investing more time promoting newer groups such as SHINee and F(x). Super Junior is almost all but forgotten and definitely are not the same group they once were years ago. On the other hand, Big Bang is the opposite with their most recent album Still Alive received numerous All-Kills on music charts and winning many international recognition.

As a fan, I admit Super Junior is a great and respectable group; one of the best actually. However, as I stated in my burden before, all I have to fulfill to win is to prove that Big Bang is superior as to which I have well supported with my two contentions.


Greetings to all viewers.
My name is TheBunnyAssassin and I would like to negate the resolution, Resolved: Big Bang is a far superior group than Super Junior. I will be proving that Super Junior is a superior group.

Contention 1: Popularity

"Popularity (pop"u"lar"i"ty) noun- the state or condition of being liked, admired, or supported by many people." Super Junior, which is a globally recognized group, is popular. Just because Big Bang's one video reached 100 million views, we cannot conclude that they are "popular". Anybody can repeatedly watch a video over and over, thus reaching such a high number. In addition, according to March 24, 2014 Allkpop's [Tournament] Battle of the Best Boy and Girl Groups!, Super Junior soundly beat Big Bang by a majority of 53% of the votes, compared to Big Bang's 47%. With 295,446 voters, we can conclude that the voters truly sought out Super Junior as a band with higher popularity. Moreover, right after the round was over, the final match was created: Super Junior versus the k-pop goddesses, Girls Generation. The result was still the popular choice: Super Junior. With 373,121 votes, Super Junior won beat the "goddesses of k-pop" by 4 percent. Overall, from these statistical analyses, and not by mere views on a music video (that can be repeated), Super Junior is superior to Big Bang and the band of the people.

Contention 2: Diversity

Compared to Big Bang, Super Junior envelopes a wide plethora of music genres. In addition, instead of focusing solely on music, Super Junior have taken measures to also participate in numerous Korean Dramas, as MC hosts, and other social and public events. One of the greatest superiority of Super Junior is their music. Unlike many other entertainment brands, SuJu has many subgroups: Super Junior- M, Super Junior- T, Super Junior- H, Donghae and Eunhyuk, and the successful solo singer, Henry Lau. Utilizing this wider approach to music, this boy group has demonstrated far more of a diversity to music by appealing not only to the younger audience, but also to older people. The diversity of this group also benefits their company, SM Entertainment. Compared to YG Entertainment (Big Bang's company), SM has an operating income of 44 million (USD) compared to YG's 17 million (USD). In addition, SM's net income is 34 million (USD) compared to YG's 15.6. Due to a more appealing approach to music, and the usage of diversity, Super Junior multitasks by not only engaging the crowd, but also benefitting their home company.

From these contentions and real-life statistical analyses (not just personal assumptions), we can conclude that Super Junior is superior to Big Bang. Please take my reasons into account and vote for the negative.
Debate Round No. 1


My opponent provided many valid arguments in his first constructive. However, sadly to say, most of them are very inaccurate, contradictory or bias in a given sense.

His first argument was that of "Popularity"; countering the first contention of my case. He disagreed with the impartialness and questioned the accuracy of my evidence in which he claimed that youtube was not a valid source since the view aggregate increases every time one visits the video. Then, quite ironically, he provide evidence from the Allkpop "Battle" in which Super Junior DID win. However, I would like for the voters to realize that "voters from the Allkpop tournament" were ALSO able to vote numerous times. I quite find his contradiction amusing and would like for the judge to cross his contention 1 off from the voting ground.

In his second argument, he boasted about how Super Junior had many subgroups; however, I don't see how this is significant at all to the progress of the debate. Super Junior has many what? My opponent has clearly forgotten to address this point. Furthermore, my opponent provided many stats on the wealth/income of SM vs YG. He seemed to have been motivated by the idea that because of Super Junior, SM attained more money. However, this i hardly true since Super Junior were very inactive in 2013 and the main contributor to SM's income was Exo, whom released THREE albums in the span of one year. The judge needs to realize that Super Junior were not the main reason SM's income was so high during the 2013 year. Also, SM simply had a larger income due to the fact that they have more groups. End of.

Yes, my opponent provide real statistics such as SM and YG's income during the 2013 year. No, it does not affect the course of the debate simply because Super Junior barely had much to do with it. His contradictory and hypothetical statements show that the rest of his arguments are unreliable. Fantastic Baby. Thank you.


First, I would like to counter the assumption my opponent just propagated above me. When he stated that the fans of Super Junior were "able to vote numerous times", he inferred that Super Junior only won the Allkpop contest through fans who voted multiple times. Now I ask the audience a question. Our topic is to debate that Big Bang is "superior" to Super Junior. If Big Bang is so "popular" then wouldn't their loyal fans ALSO vote multiple times for them. Therefore, we can conclude that the Super Junior is superior in popularity to Big Bang because this group has instilled a sense of both loyalty and support from their fans.

I will continue my rebuttals in the next round.
Thank you.
Debate Round No. 2


Lawrentian forfeited this round.


Greetings to all spectators,
Continuing on from my previous rebuttals, I would also like to state that my opponent's second contention is highly biased and fallacious. In addition, what rights does he have to claim that "the quality of Super Junior has not lived up to society's standards"? Is this a fact? No. This a fallacious assumption based off of one's own bias. Moreover, his third sentence contains false information: "aside from the fact that they (Super Junior) have barely been active for the past few years". For everybody's information, Super Junior's subgroup Super Junior- M just released their SWING album on March 21, 2014. Due to Suju-M being a subgroup of Super Junior, this release counts as an album released by Super Junior.
My response to Lawrentian's first rebuttal about "Super Junior has many subgroups" so what?" quote is that their subgroups promote diversity. It appeals to a wider audience, not just focusing on the main youth group of K-pop, as Big Bang does.
Finally, I would also ask a question to the audience.
Why did Lawrentian forfeit, when he so passionately fought the last few rounds? Has he given up Big Bang's plight?

Round 4 is utilized merely for conclusions, and new arguments should not be addressed. Thank you.
Debate Round No. 3


Wow!! Super Junior promotes diversity due to their abundant subgroups!!(sarcasm). Let's be real, both groups promote diversity and just by having members of different races does not determine ones diversity "level" considering the the number of international fans Big Bang has.

And yes, I did forfeit round 3. The reason I did so was simply due to the fact that I did not need to propose a third argument since it simply does not change the outcome of the debate.

I will now take time to sum up my voting issues for this debate and why I deserve to win this debate.

1. It is quite absurd my opponent defines "popularity" based off of a silly little contest on Allkpop compared to videos on youtube which EVERY fan watches. My opponent stated quote"If Big Bang is so "popular" then wouldn't their loyal fans ALSO vote multiple times for them." I'd like to say the same for him: if Super Junior was so popular, then wouldn't their loyal fans ALSO watch their videos multiple times for them?

2. My opponent's rebuttals to my contentions were quite weak as he completely ignored my contention two. I'll take his ignorance a gesture of forfeiture towards my second argument and now we can all conclude that my opponent AGREES that Super Junior has been recently lacking in quality.

3. I refuted against all my opponent's contentions + rebuttals with evidence far superior to my counterpart's.

XX I love you, Baby I'm not a Monster XX

XX Vote for Lawrentian, Fantastic Baby XX

Disclaimer's note: Super Junior is A GREAT, no AMAZING group that I love so much. However, as stated before, my only burden is that Big Bang is better, which I believe that I have fulfilled. I await my opponent's next argument.


TheBunnyAssassin forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
5 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 5 records.
Posted by TheBunnyAssassin 6 years ago
btw pro made an invalid comment, Suju's most popular video is not Sorry Sorry, it is Mr. Simple, which has 83+ million views, far surpassing Bad Boy.
Posted by dj1999 7 years ago
suju for the win!
although i <3 big bang's seungri". kyuhyun is best!
Posted by Lawrentian 7 years ago

Oh, Fantastic Baby.
Posted by TheBunnyAssassin 7 years ago
If you are going to vote, please base your vote upon convincing arguments, not upon which group you prefer. Thank you.
Posted by 46T.OP 7 years ago
Dude big bang is the best Fantastic baby/ tonight / love song Super not so much
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