The Instigator
Atypical
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
SomethingOrdinary
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points

Today's types of Feminism isn't needed

Do you like this debate?NoYes+1
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 0 votes the winner is...
It's a Tie!
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 10/20/2018 Category: People
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 691 times Debate No: 118632
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (0)
Votes (0)

 

Atypical

Pro

Todays feminism isn't needed, They have no rights that they need to fight for, And are establishing a bad name for feminism, As if when some of them think that all men should die and that sort. Women have the same rights as men do, So change my mind.
SomethingOrdinary

Con

I'll start by saying I'm not a feminist. Just someone who enjoys playing devils advocate.

Secondly I'd like to pull a definition of Feminism, "Feminism is a range of political movements, Ideologies, And social movements that share a common goal: to define, Establish, And achieve political, Economic, Personal, And social equality of sexes. This includes seeking to establish educational and professional opportunities for women that are equal to those for men. "

Now, I'd like to point out that in your title you said 'types' and in your argument you referred to feminism in general not being necessary and stating there is no inequality between Men and women anymore. I'm going to assume your argument takes precedence over the title.

With that being said I agree that Men and Women both are entitled to the same set of rights. I do think it's bold however to assume that no gender inequality exists despite Men and women being equally entitled to the same rights. While I for one am not in favor of any extremist ideology whether it be in the form of Man hating feminists, Pro-communist left wingers, Or Ku Klux Klan robe wearing alt-righters, I'm also not in favor of the dissolution of any group of people on the basis of their opinion being invalid, And especially so when I think that there are in fact valid points they're making, Like in the case of a woman's rights activist citing studies that show income gaps on a large scale for men and women in the same field.

I won't sit here and argue physiology or Biology with you, I'm aware that Men and Women have different body types and on average are better suited to different types of physical labor, But I've come across no reasonable evidence that men and women with the same occupation outside of physical/manual labor are predisposed to work more efficiently than one another based solely on their gender. Perhaps there is an argument to be had there, But again none that I've come across being irrefutable proof.

With that point in mind, There are multiple studies that show an albeit narrowing pay gap, But one that still exists. I referenced A department of Labor study and a payscale. Com study that show the overall pay gap between men and women at somewhere around 79 cents on the dollar in general, But more pertinent to my argument they showed a controlled pay gap study where the gap was 98 cents on the dollar, And widened to about 94 cents on the dollar for executive positions. Now the controlled pay gap study is better in my opinion in that it compares men in women in the exact same fields, And in the case of the Executive's being studied a job that requires essentially no physical strength or ability but rather use of ones mind and a prerequisite of having been educated, And mind you there is statistical evidence showing that now in recent years more women have been receiving degrees than men.

So, Presuming the data collected in these two studies I referenced and the many more that exist and can be easily found online there does still exists a gender pay gap, Though albeit one that is narrowing. But if one still exists on the basis of what can be concluded as discrimination based on gender when all other variables are controlled, Then the need for a feminist movement in favor of eliminating an in-equality like the one mentioned above does in fact still exist today.

Now looking at issues other than those pertaining to economics and job opportunities I'll cede to you that it is much harder to quantify and qualify data. It's like asking if racism still exists in America, Which then you can have a big philosophical debate as to what qualifies as racism and whether or not its ingrained in us to be predisposed a certain way given our upbringing etc. , Etc.

I don't want to delve to deep into that side of the debate in regards to women being socially oppressed as it's a more case by case scenario, Where you can observe different subsets of the population embracing rather old fashioned and misogynistic views and treatment of women, But I also feel that on the whole, Mainstream Western society has embraced more social equality for women.

Now that doesn't mean like I say certain subsets of the population still exist where women are treated unfairly, And it doesn't mean that in other parts of the world women aren't treated equally either, And because of those instances of social oppression of women still occurring, Again I don't think one can make the argument for feminism and its goal of eradicating social inequality for women being eradicated can be made.

In closing, While I agree that calling for the death of all Men and extreme feminism as with any other extremist viewpoint is typically not something to be deemed as productive for society but to make the argument that Feminism isn't necessary anymore implying that the social and economic inequality the movement strives to rid the world of has already been accomplished is altogether incorrect.

Pay-Gap Studies:

Department of Labor Report: https://www. Dol. Gov/wb/resources/Womens_Earnings_and_the_Wage_Gap_17. Pdf
Payscale. Com report: https://www. Payscale. Com/hr/gender-pay-gap

College Degree Gap in Favor of Women:

https://www. Aei. Org/publication/prediction-no-2017-graduation-speaker-will-mention-this-the-growing-gender-college-degree-gap-favoring-women/
Debate Round No. 1
Atypical

Pro

Now, With "types" of Feminism which was my argument title, I meant the difference from fighting inequality, To woman dominance. Presiding you brought up wage gap, Simply the statistics aren't as accurate as you think. With a man and women, You have to count overtime and undertime, Statistically women work more then men, But men work more overtime them women, Overtime presides more money then just regularly working, This would provide more waging for the person which is not statistically a male, To have a bigger salary, And when that isn't taken into account, "wage gap" becomes and explained problem which is a different standard.
SomethingOrdinary

Con

You said and I quote in full context

"Todays feminism isn't needed, They have no rights that they need to fight for, And are establishing a bad name for feminism, As if when some of them think that all men should die and that sort. Women have the same rights as men do, So change my mind. "

Your title says and I quote "Today's types of Feminism isn't needed"

As for your title you did in fact say "types", Plural, But then you said "isn't needed" which would be grammatically correct if referring to one type of feminism, But instead you were referencing multiple? Then in your argument as quoted above you went on to refer to feminism in general as one ideology. So perhaps I was just confused what your argument was given the grammatical inconsistencies.

In any case I conceded that the more broadly defined gender pay gap study showing women earning at approximately 79 cents on the dollar to Men wasn't an ideal to study when compared to the controlled pay gap study. The example I looked at in particular highlighted men and women working in the same Executive positions which are salary positions, Or in other words they receive a flat rate, Not an hourly wage and therefore eliminating the question of overtime being involved.

I would say that the pay gap does in fact exist but is somewhat justified on the broader scale given the fact that more men work in high demanding labor intensive jobs than women (like construction, Carpentry, Etc. ) which typically command higher hourly wages and more Overtime pay than an entry level office job or non-labor intensive position. This at least can explain why such a large gap exists in a reasonable manner. As for the controlled wage gap study though the same cannot be said.

So again looking at a snippet of your argument "They have no rights that they need to fight for" would be an incorrect statement given the nature of what the studies I cited show.
Debate Round No. 2
Atypical

Pro

I don't feel like arguing anymore, I'll tie it, But In my opinion so far you win I am tired and don't have extra time to debate this week so you win congrats.
SomethingOrdinary

Con

Alright. Thank you I suppose
Debate Round No. 3
Atypical

Pro

Atypical forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
Atypical

Pro

Atypical forfeited this round.
SomethingOrdinary

Con

SomethingOrdinary forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
No comments have been posted on this debate.
No votes have been placed for this debate.

By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use.