The Instigator
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The Contender
Con (against)

Transgenders cannot objectively be the gender they claim they are:

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 8/17/2016 Category: Society
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Debating Period
Viewed: 1,479 times Debate No: 94681
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (23)
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1. google docs are not a violation of conduct.

I will argue that transgenders cannot be objectively proven to be the gender they clai they are, and that transgenderism is entirely subjective, and has no relation to reality.


I accept this debate. Best of luck to my opponent.
Debate Round No. 1


Alright, here is the definition of objective:
"(of a person or their judgment) not influenced by personal feelings or opinions in considering and representing facts."
By definition, transgender cannot objectively be the gender they claim they are, sinthry claim to be this gender on that they feel as if they are that gender. And since objective is defined as not influenced by a persons feelings, but on facts, these transgenders are not objectively women, objectively, based on facts, they are men.
Here is a very simple way to demonstrate what I am saying, if a man walked into a room and said "I am a woman" then I can just tell him, "alright, prove it." And he cannot, but if I claim thast I am male, theoretically there is a way to prove it. You could test my chromosomes, or check my birthb erificate, or ask my mom, or check my skeletal structure, or just have a doctor do an "examination" a to verify, but you cascasnnot prove that a transgender is the gender he says he is.


I. Sex and gender aren't necessarily the same

First, let's look at the definitions of sex and gender to distinguish the difference between the two.

Sex - either of the two main categories (male and female) into which humans and many other living
things are divided on the basis of their reproductive functions. [1]

Gender- either the male or female division of a species, especially asdifferentiated by social and cultural
roles and behavior. [2]

With this, we can already see a clear difference between sex and gender; sex refers to your biological
traits, while gender doesn't.

Now let's bring in the scientific evidence to prove the difference. For example, gender identity and sexual
organs develop at different times during pregnancy, which can cause one to identify as the opposite sex
that they were born as.

"Testosterone production and the conversion of some testosterone to dihydrotestosterone between weeks
6 and 12 of pregnancy is critical for the initial development of male features, such as the penis, prostate
gland, and scrotum. (Bao) In the absence of these male hormones, female genitalia develop instead.
Brain development, however, does not occur in earnest until the second half of the pregnancy term, after
the genitals have been developed, and the continued presence of male hormones results in a brain which
has subtle, but critical physical differences from the female brain. (Bao)

"The fact that the brain and the genitals develop at different times in the womb mean that a misalignment
between the genitals and brain may develop, leading to either an intersex condition, or a transgender individual." [3]

With this, we can conclude that sex and gender aren't always synonymous.

II. Brain Structure

In this contention, I'll present two sources which prove that BST and white matter have been shown to prove the
existence of transgenderism.

"In summary, our observations suggest that the small size of the BSTc in male-to-female transsexuals cannot
be explained by differences in adult sex hormone levels, but is established during development by an organizing
action of sex hormones, an idea supported by the fact that neonatal gonadectomy of male rats and androgenization
of the female rats indeed induced significant changes in the number of neurons of the BST and suppressed its sexual

"Considered together with information from animals, then our study supports the hypothesis that gender identity
alterations may develop as a result of an altered interaction between the development of the brain and sex
hormones. The direct action of genetic factors should also be considered on the basis of animal experiments." [4]

To sum this up, this study used animal experimentation to show that gender identity can be determined by
"altered interaction between development of the brain and sex hormones". In turn, genetics do have a large
part in whether or not you'll identify as the opposite sex later in life.

"Antonio Guillamon‘s team at the National University of Distance Education in Madrid, Spain, think they have
found a better way to spot a transsexual brain. In a study due to be published next month, the team ran MRI
scans on the brains of 18 female-to-male transsexual people who’d had no treatment and compared them with
those of 24 males and 19 females.

"They found significant differences between male and female brains in four regions of white matter – and the
female-to-male transsexual people had white matter in these regions that resembled a male brain 'It’s the first
time it has been shown that the brains of female-to-male transsexual people are masculinised,' Guillamon says." [5]

In this study, white matter shows that transgenders have a brain that resembles the brain of their cisgender


In conclusion, we can clearly see with the evidence above that transgenderism is in fact valid due to the difference
between sex and gender and the various psychological aspects.

Thank you. I look forward to my opponent's rebuttal.

Debate Round No. 2


First of all, my opponent gave a definition to the word "objective". Personally, I believe that he should've done this in the first round and that he should've shown the source, but I digress. As I presented in my own arguments, transgender people are mentally the opposite sex assigned to them at birth. It isn't solely "personal feelings and opinions", though they do come into play whether you're cisgender or transgender.

Think of it like this: you have a lemon fruit. However, the lemon fruit is surrounded by the peel of an orange. Is it a lemon or an orange? Most people would probably say a lemon, as the fruit inside the orange peel is a lemon. Others would classify it as an orange, as it takes its physical appearance.

So again, we'll use the example of the lemon. Let me ask you this: just because something looks like a orange, does that automatically make it an orange? The exact same question could be asked with sex. (Just because someone looks like in a man physically, does that automatically make them a man?)

As for the example my opponent gave, you can prove with facts that you're the gender you identify as. This is talked about more in my arguments.


My opponent's arguments make it painfully clear that he can't differentiate gender identity and biological sex. With this, we can safely say that he hasn't made a proper argument in terms of content due to the lack of sources or facts in general.

Thank you. I look forward to my opponent's defense.
Debate Round No. 3


Transgenders believe themselves to be the other gender because they feel like it, tat's all this comes down to. Mentally they are not the other gender, there is no such thing as a brain-sex, unless by mental gender you meant what they think they are, in which case mentally I am a purple/green unicorn.

Your analogy of the lemon in an orange peel in fundamentally flawed because you can simply take the peel off of the lemon finding an orange, whereas you cannot skin bruce Junner to find out he is a woman wearing some poor mans skins. The most you could come up with is that they think like women or men, but this is also fundamentally flawed.

For example, my stepdad is black, someone once told him "you're not black, you don't talk black," when in reality there is no official form of speech associated with black people.

This round has not been posted yet.
Debate Round No. 4
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Debate Round No. 5
23 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by harrytruman 2 years ago
My claim is we have some very stupid people on this website who vote for the loser n the debate.
Posted by missbailey8 2 years ago
@ThinkBig Can do.
Posted by ThinkBig 2 years ago
@missbailey, please use regular font. I have a difficult time reading your round 2 arguments.
Posted by TheHitchslap 2 years ago
Your claim is literally everyone is conspiring against you.

That isn't the case. Even looking at your debate, you tried to change the rules mid way through, and the resolution does not claim anywhere where the new testimate is bunk.
Posted by harrytruman 2 years ago
I keep seeing this pattern where you try to insult me instead of being rational. If you want to see a joke look at this debate, which I won, but I also lost somehow. Don't ask.
My opponent didn't rebuttal a single argument of mine, yet she won. That's why my record is bad. In another debate my opponent forfeited 2 rounds then won.
Posted by TheHitchslap 2 years ago
Regardless. You're already losing points for grammar. You are at a disadvantage. If I cannot understand your argument because your grammar and spelling is so bad, then how are you going to convince voters you won? It's part of the reason why your record is such a joke.
Posted by bman7720 2 years ago
Harry, regardless of your format you should always reread your argument and work on your format. A well structured argument typically involves the model of a broad subject getting more specific. Academic language is also advised, as opposed to today's vernacular. These are all things that can influence the voters despite the content of your actual argument.
Posted by harrytruman 2 years ago
I was writing it with a device, which has terrible autocheck. I have to type very slowly,
Becausevothrrwuse it looks like this if using
Posted by TheHitchslap 2 years ago
Ladies and gentlemen.

Harrytruman is an intellectual. Just look at that first argument and his grammar/spelling. Absolutely superb! Just mind blowing! On a whole other level to the rest of us! You sir are a prodigy at such a young age! I mean my god! You totally didn't have a stroke writing that at all!!
Posted by TheBenC 2 years ago
I hope the world soon stops bowing down to those who are less than a tenth of a percent of the population. There is a bigger game going on though, a bid to control everything. It is playing out before our eyes and almost nobody can see it. We are blinded by emotion and that is the game.
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