The Instigator
omar2345
Pro (for)
Tied
7 Points
The Contender
bigdave
Con (against)
Tied
7 Points

Trump is a bad president

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
It's a Tie!
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 3/4/2019 Category: Politics
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,277 times Debate No: 120622
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (39)
Votes (2)

 

omar2345

Pro

This is the 2nd attempt since the first person bailed on me.
You can start in Round 1 if you don't want to then this can be considered the acceptance Round and I can start in Round 2.

My stance is Trump is a bad president my opponents stance will be Trump is a good president. I left it open so my opponent can decide what direction he/she wants take it.


bigdave

Con

I accept this debate, Not because of my personal opinion, But rather because I believe the public impression, For whatever reason is counter to the facts. I am arguing that Trump is not a "bad" President, By defining that as he is the 45th President, He merely has to be "better than average". That is to say, He needs only be better than 22 others or no "worse" than 22 others. I may further refine that measure by using a "bell curve" to say he may only need be better than the 10 "worst".

I will also be using certain "benchmark measures" from reliable sources such as employment vs unemployment, Real weekly earnings and home ownership.

Con will attempt to use empirical measures where possible, And avoid to the greatest extent to avoid opinion.

Con awaits the next move from Pro.
Debate Round No. 1
omar2345

Pro

"He needs only be better than 22 others or no "worse" than 22 others. I may further refine that measure by using a "bell curve" to say he may only need be better than the 10 "worst". "
I would have liked you to state who was the 10 worst from your perspective but you didn't so I am left to assume. I can't really know what you are thinking so I will now compare Trump to Obama because of your failure to state your side sufficiently.

I will argue for why Obama is better than Trump.

Employment rate
Obama started his presidency in January 20 2009 and left office in January 2017. Looking at the first source I have provided Obama when took office was the one who started the downwards trend of unemployment. If Trump had some significant impact of reducing unemployment then Con will be able to point to a law and the time frame when this law took place. Obama started off at a 10% unemployment rate which he reduced it by 2% when he was first elected. When he was elected again Obama was able to reduce the unemployment from 8% to around about 5%. These numbers are more impressive than Trump even. Currently Trump has reduced the unemployment rate by 1% which does not look like to be reduced by 2 which means Trump if I am correct would not have done better than Obama's first election cycle in office.

Honesty
Going by the third and fourth sources Trump has stated more mostly false, False and pants on fire statements compared to Obama. Even though Politifact was keeping data on Obama even before he was elected in 2009 somehow Trump manages to mislead the public more than Obama. This shows Trump is not capable of verifying what he is saying instead does not think before he says something. 24% of Obama's statements were mostly false, False or pants on fire whereas 69% of Trump's statements were mostly false, False or pants on fire and it is not even the end of his presidency while also taking into account Obama has been tracked by politifact for a much longer period.

I will leave it at that. I don't think I can be blamed with the approach I have taken in this debate because Con did not clearly state what he wanted. What I would have liked Con to do is tell me if we are comparing Trump to the 10 worst presidents while also telling me them or define bad so that I can know where this debate was headed.

Source 1: https://tradingeconomics. Com/united-states/unemployment-rate
Source 2: https://www. Politifact. Com/personalities/barack-obama/
Source 3: https://www. Politifact. Com/personalities/donald-trump/
This round has not been posted yet.
Debate Round No. 2
This round has not been posted yet.
This round has not been posted yet.
Debate Round No. 3
This round has not been posted yet.
bigdave

Con

bigdave forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
39 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by omar2345 3 years ago
omar2345
@FeelingsOverFacts

Bias doesn't mean wrong. You don't even know what bias actually means and you are lecturing me about evidence? Know your place child.
Posted by Our_Boat_is_Right 3 years ago
Our_Boat_is_Right
@antifa

Poltifact is bias. Use a better source. I could use a source on the conservative side that says Trump never lies and Obama always lies. U don't even know how to use a reliable source. Smh
Posted by Our_Boat_is_Right 3 years ago
Our_Boat_is_Right
@antifa

Poltifact is bias. Use a better source. I could use a source on the conservative side that says Trump never lies and Obama always lies. U don't even know how to use a reliable source. Smh
Posted by omar2345 3 years ago
omar2345
@FeelingsOverFacts

Guess facts that you don't like are wrong. Guess conservative tears are real. Come back to me when you have something more than I don't like someone presenting the facts therefore the facts are wrong.
Posted by Our_Boat_is_Right 3 years ago
Our_Boat_is_Right
omar is probably in antifa with all the other fascists
Posted by Our_Boat_is_Right 3 years ago
Our_Boat_is_Right
@dumbass

retardifact subjectively fact checks "lies" from a left-wing bias. This is an awful source to fact check lies.
Posted by omar2345 3 years ago
omar2345
Fact is fact.

Guess feelings over facts doesn't understand that.
Posted by Our_Boat_is_Right 3 years ago
Our_Boat_is_Right
@omar

I love how you use left wing politi-fact as your fact checking source---lmaooo
Posted by omar2345 3 years ago
omar2345
@bigdave

It is in the voting period and you and I both know we submitted our arguments. When that happened the debate entered the voting period. I don't see how anyone can move a debate in the voting period back to the debating period but somehow you can delete posts in voting period. Doesn't make sense.
Posted by bigdave 3 years ago
bigdave
How can voting be open when round 3 has not been posted. ( it was posted by both pro and con, But it is MISSING).
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by dsjpk5 3 years ago
dsjpk5
omar2345bigdaveTied
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Total points awarded:07 
Reasons for voting decision: Countering Michael's poor vote.
Vote Placed by backwardseden 3 years ago
backwardseden
omar2345bigdaveTied
Agreed with before the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
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Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
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Total points awarded:70 
Reasons for voting decision: "CON will now establish who the 10 worst President have been. Data will be drawn from a survey done in 2015." This proves what exactly as it doesn't prove why Trump is a good president. Con's entire 2nd RD was blown. "A...Trump took action in Afghanistan. B. Trump took action in Syria." So? So have other presidents before him. Wow! "Trump has not initiated a "war" on US soil." Naturally, Con did not back that statement up by saying who has. "Trump "shut down"the government." That's a very bad thing. Not a good thing.

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