The Instigator
screenjack
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
WW2GuyWhoLikesWW2
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points

pro choice

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 7/30/2018 Category: Politics
Updated: 2 months ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 646 times Debate No: 117000
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (16)
Votes (0)

 

screenjack

Con

I'm against the current laws on abortion. I believe a person should gain legal status before they are "born alive" as the law currently defines it. A zygote has it's own unique set of DNA. This unique DNA proves that it is human and individual. It also has precedent cause we use DNA to identify people in courts already. Therefore, I think a zygote should be protected as a person.
WW2GuyWhoLikesWW2

Pro

In the first couple of weeks, It's as much as a human as a frog is a human. It's a tiny little blind pink blob that can't think or know whats going on. If someone can not afford the baby then abortion is needed.
Debate Round No. 1
screenjack

Con

Well it's definitely human because it has human DNA. Killing a human because it makes your life easier is wrong because we're all people here.
WW2GuyWhoLikesWW2

Pro

Why put a life into existence that will grow up poor and sad. It isn't like the 60s, You can't just fire up a new job while the mom stays at home with the kids. We're in a recession right now. Abortion might be emotionally devastating to certain people but to others, It's a saving grace. If you want there to be no abortion. You should maybe get your lawmakers to work on giving the families you stopped from getting an abortion money. Accidents happen when 16-year-olds have sex. It's happening and it's what always will happen. If you cut off abortions, Others will go to different countries to get them done because of it that big of an issue for them.

Especially if someone was raped and they have to tell their child that their child was made of sexual violence against your own mother. Just because it has DNA of a human doesn't mean it can feel, Think, Or see. No one's arguing that it's not going to be a person if you left it alone. What they're arguing is, At what point is it considered squishing an ant vs a live baby. After 6 weeks. It's not any more human than it will be once it's grown fingertips and a working body and eyes. Don't you think those people who get abortions hate it, They hate every minute of it because they're removing a part of something that could've been their whole life. Something that could be everything for them, But they're doing the ultimate sacrifice be not having a baby now when they're unstable vs when they're able to. And what right does anyone have denying someone what they can do with a mixture of sperm and an egg at 3 weeks?

No one's going out and having a field day with an abortion, If you've ever been to an abortion clinic, You'll see sad grieving mothers and sad fathers who have to lose their child because they couldn't take care of it because they could barely take care of it themselves.
Debate Round No. 2
screenjack

Con

Someone's feelings aren't what make them human. If someone is buzzed off a drug or asleep and can't currently feel that doesn't make them less of a person. What the laws are meant to protect is people and if you're only defense is that they don't feel yet then you're not taking into account individuals rights. The parents aren't dying. The parents aren't saving the child from the woe's of the earth. The parents are terminating an individual. If being poor is so bad then there are a strange amount of people still choosing to live. No one truly believes being poor is so bad that it would be better to be dead; how dare you make that decision for someone. The reason people feel guilty about abortion is because the know sex is a responsibility they weren't able to handle it. That doesn't mean that their aren't plenty of other alternatives available to them. If a couple isn't able to take care of a child believe me the state will take over. Rape is obviously bad. It's important to remember that that zygote isn't their dad and shouldn't be held responsible for it's fathers crimes. Pretty much everybody's dad is messed up; that doesn't mean we shouldn't be here.
WW2GuyWhoLikesWW2

Pro

Your comment about not being able to feel almost had me agree. But you didn't take into account that the person whos unconscious from drugs are already living outside of a womb. In that case, Your morality is saying that as soon as the sperm makes contact with the egg, It is now a human being. Which is just factually incorrect, It's not even a mass of flesh yet at that point, It's just small cells the size of blood cells trying to congregate, And it's not a 100% shot on this you know, It's about a 20% chance. (https://www. Self. Com/story/best-chances-of-getting-pregnant-how-often-you-should-have-sex) Understanding that at the stage of such an early version of a baby. It can not Think, See, Hear, Or Even has a brain or a heart. If you are removing, A small mass of flesh which it is in between the start and about 3 weeks. It is the same as removing an egg from a woman or some sperm from a man.

Also, You're talking about being poor and alive keep in mind. You have been birthed already and have been alive for some time to live on your own in an apartment with your girlfriend of a year or so, As the Average American couple does. No one's saying that you should off yourself because you're poor. There's welfare for that, But why bring 3 kids into a place where you can barely even feed the two of you together. Never mind the tons and tons of money you'll have to spend on children with baby products and the bills of children. It's just not a smart move financially if you can't afford it. Now if you can and you're just getting pregnant and you're just dumping 12 embryos out every month then yeah that's abusing it and shouldn't happen because then it's not a money issue. As well as a level of maturity is important, Two 16-year-olds who accidentally get pregnant which is a large issue around the world. Are not going to be able to take care of that baby efficiently at all, It's torturous to even force someone to do that, We made that mistake by letting those in the 60s and 70s do that. The boomers came out emotionally unstable and either was in a massively poor area or they got everything they wanted because dad would go out and work for 12 hours and then come back drunk. It's just not a healthy environment to raise a kid in until you're safely in a good position.

As well as a woman seeing her child every day and seeing her rapists face in it is a nightmare I would never wish on anyone. Not everyone's dads are "messed up" the dad raped her. And you can't just let the state take care of it because its a drain on taxes and the kid will end up broken just like his household. Injecting yourself into another's life is strange for me, It's not my place. I'm right leaning and I believe in no illegals in my country, Why pay for their kids when they're not mine. The kids down the street aren't mine why pay.
Debate Round No. 3
16 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by mosc 2 months ago
mosc
I totally supported Ron Paul in 2008 and 12. I detest Faux Noise to this day for doing the fake news job that CNN did against Trump.

Morality defines the direction which a nation takes. Freedom and Human Rights, Based upon the Bill of Rights and the 13th Amendment defines the direction of the course which our Great River - the experiment of the American Republic - follows.

Abortion sucks b/c it makes as yet future born American citizens PROPERTY. Bunk on abortion.
Posted by screenjack 2 months ago
screenjack
well the roots of my argument come from a libertarian viewpoint. I don't identify as a libertarian anymore because the actually party is going a bit woo woo crazy. I mean I like a nuanced party stance which is why I liked Ron Paul and I enjoy Rands viewpoints but obviously not as much. I think there needs to be stronger members supporting him and not nut jobs who'll say anything anti government. Rand Paul is a doctor and I adopted much of my argument from him.
Posted by WW2GuyWhoLikesWW2 2 months ago
WW2GuyWhoLikesWW2
If you get your morals from Horton Hears a who I'm laughing. I'm just kidding of course. Where does this morality come from? Are you religious or is it just an idea that you have.
Posted by mosc 2 months ago
mosc
Its really humorous to read comments made by a living abortion. You want to play god, First put on your Nazi SS uniform.
Posted by mosc 2 months ago
mosc
You don't want your baby then put it up for adoption before leaving the hospital. In China they would put the new born upon a rock in an open field. Any person who wanted to raise that baby could take her. If not, Food for the jackals.
Posted by screenjack 2 months ago
screenjack
It is distinguishable between a rabbit and a deer. We already use DNA not just to define humans but specific individuals. The link you sent about some 20% nonsense doesn't even link to a page about the medical process. I fixed the link because their were random spaces in it and It links to fertility tips and how having sex 3 times a day won't increase the likelihood of pregnancy. Stop acting like because somethings small it isn't alive. Didn't you read Horton hears a who?
Posted by SkillerPenguin 2 months ago
SkillerPenguin
@mosc

Instead of preaching such hate (which I sure as hell hope you don't have a child that you spit such vile attitude upon), You need to realize that A) it's not even a being at that point and B) Raising a child that you can neither afford to have nor want, Very often leads to a horrible upbringing, Which leads to statistically proven increase of crime and violence, And further expands the loop of horrible treatment.
Posted by WW2GuyWhoLikesWW2 2 months ago
WW2GuyWhoLikesWW2
It's not a baby yet mosc, It's 1/10th of a pound of cells. What you call a baby is not distinguishable between a rabbit and a deer when theyre being made. As well as no brain activity until ones made. Are you the kind of person who would keep someone whos permanently a vegetable and can't move at all and the only reason theyre surviving is because they're on life support.
Posted by mosc 2 months ago
mosc
Killing babies a needed evil. Go burn in Dresden! If a woman has Constitutional Rights then her baby has Constitutional Rights. The Constitution gives no mandate for a parent to murder their children. The arrogance of playing God, Excuse me as i vomit. Yo puke for brains WW2GuyWhoLikesWW2 get a life.
Posted by WW2GuyWhoLikesWW2 2 months ago
WW2GuyWhoLikesWW2
My main points are these: Abortion isn't morally correct, But it's a needed evil. Reasons why are money, Environment, And family. Not enough money results in a bad environment. If the state takes the kids it's a bad environment, The state will not be able to handle taking and rehousing 650, 000 babies a year so I can't believe you on that. How can the state "handle it" when orphanages are filled to the brim right now. Why add more to the poverty crisis if you can just pay 200 dollars to wait to try again another time. It does way more damage than helps to fill up the morality high that people get from controlling other's lives.
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